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Sir Nelson Montana
- Thread starter chaquito
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Deleted member 33117
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Hmmm... it has more nadrolone per mg, due to a shorter chain ester, and is released at a faster rate. Logic should tell you that you would have the potential for more side effects, rather than less. I suspect (hope) Nelson will most likely have the same insite.
Well, if you took npp eod your blood levels would be more constant than deca 1/week. Also, side effects would be easier to controll, and you would see gains much faster. The fact that nandro decanoate shuts you down for so long is partially due to its slow rate of release.
Another positve thing about NPP is that it can be used to kickstart cycles in the same way as test prop, and then discontinued after 4-6 weeks. With the standard 10-12 week cycle, libido problems should be much less pronounced assuming that test is run for the full 10-12 weeks. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Another positve thing about NPP is that it can be used to kickstart cycles in the same way as test prop, and then discontinued after 4-6 weeks. With the standard 10-12 week cycle, libido problems should be much less pronounced assuming that test is run for the full 10-12 weeks. Correct me if I'm wrong.
stonecold54
New member
yes the good thing about fast acting substance is that if problems occur you can stop and be in the clear faster. so in that sense the sides will go away faster if you see them, but they are still the same sides.
stonecold54
New member
well i guess as far as being shut down maybe but I was talking more about the gyno issues which are the main concern with me. it would be an interesting experiment though to see the difference in recovery rates between the esters.thx9000 said:
silver_shadow
New member
having used deca and phen prop- i'd prefer the latter only bcoz of the fact that it is a shorter ester. however, i would imagine that nandrolone is nandrolone just like test is test. as far as i know npp does remain detectable for 12mths as against 18mths for deca. a big difference but still a long time. so i would imagine that it can have an influence much later just as deca. i haven't experienced deca dick thankfully.
Many of you would be surprised to find out how much of a difference an ester can make.
Deca is so terrible for some people mainly because they are sensitive to nandrolone, but also because Deca is so hard to get out of your system and it has a very pronounced cumulative effect.
Shooting 500mg of Deca a week, by the time it stabilises (w4-5) you have ~1300mg of actual nandrolone in your body
It took 4-5 weeks to reach stable blood levels and if you realise then that it's giving you too many problems, it takes a full 3-6 weeks to clear your system completely.
Most of us are limited to 200-300mg of Deca a week.
We say to newbies, do a 200mg of Deca a week. Good advice maybe, but the truth is, 200mg of deca shoot every week will build up quite a level of nandrolone in the body.
So 200-300mg of Deca a week is not a weak cycle. It's an inefficient, potent cycle, not comparable to 200-300mg of Test which is fairly weaker in terms of anabolism.
So what about NPP?
Almost a completely different drug, fast acting, you reach full level quickly and it clears quickly.
It allows you to bypass the waiting period and clearing period of deca (3-4 weeks at beginning and tail end of cycle) So you can get to the proper effective dose right away and you can control it since it is fast acting.
IMO, it's the best drug in terms of benefit/risk ratio I've ever used
Deca is so terrible for some people mainly because they are sensitive to nandrolone, but also because Deca is so hard to get out of your system and it has a very pronounced cumulative effect.
Shooting 500mg of Deca a week, by the time it stabilises (w4-5) you have ~1300mg of actual nandrolone in your body
It took 4-5 weeks to reach stable blood levels and if you realise then that it's giving you too many problems, it takes a full 3-6 weeks to clear your system completely.
Most of us are limited to 200-300mg of Deca a week.
We say to newbies, do a 200mg of Deca a week. Good advice maybe, but the truth is, 200mg of deca shoot every week will build up quite a level of nandrolone in the body.
So 200-300mg of Deca a week is not a weak cycle. It's an inefficient, potent cycle, not comparable to 200-300mg of Test which is fairly weaker in terms of anabolism.
So what about NPP?
Almost a completely different drug, fast acting, you reach full level quickly and it clears quickly.
It allows you to bypass the waiting period and clearing period of deca (3-4 weeks at beginning and tail end of cycle) So you can get to the proper effective dose right away and you can control it since it is fast acting.
IMO, it's the best drug in terms of benefit/risk ratio I've ever used
BigAndy69 said:
I agree with every post on this thread, except this one.
No flame bro. Just a difference of opinion.
Well, Deca is Deca. It's not unlike prop or cyp -- a short acting ester has advantages and disadvantages.
I disagree with Andy on several points.
First of all, the statement that it takes 4-5 weeks to "stabilize" is pure fantasy. There's no such thing.
Actually, I agree that 300 mgs of Deca is more anabolic than 300 ms of test.
NPP will clear more quickly, but enough metabolites can remain to test positive long afterward. (If that's a concern) I can't say for sure if it will be as long as decanoate. That's an interesting question. My guess is "probably not". At any rate, all the problems of Deca still exist.
The best risk/benefit ratio of any drug? I think it's one of the worst in regard to libido, which means everything to me, but apparently some guys have no problem sacrificing it. I don't get it. It used to be that guys got muscle so they can get MORE pussy. Now they get less pussy in order to get more muscle. When did everything go horribly wrong?
I disagree with Andy on several points.
First of all, the statement that it takes 4-5 weeks to "stabilize" is pure fantasy. There's no such thing.
Actually, I agree that 300 mgs of Deca is more anabolic than 300 ms of test.
NPP will clear more quickly, but enough metabolites can remain to test positive long afterward. (If that's a concern) I can't say for sure if it will be as long as decanoate. That's an interesting question. My guess is "probably not". At any rate, all the problems of Deca still exist.
The best risk/benefit ratio of any drug? I think it's one of the worst in regard to libido, which means everything to me, but apparently some guys have no problem sacrificing it. I don't get it. It used to be that guys got muscle so they can get MORE pussy. Now they get less pussy in order to get more muscle. When did everything go horribly wrong?
Nelson Montana said:
Nelson, it's a simple mathematic equation (actually not very simple).
If you do the math, assuming what we call the "halflife"(which is not the correct term) is 2 weeks. You will see that blood levels become consistent after 3-4 weeks. The longer the "halflife" the longer it takes to reach consistent blood levels.
How much Nandrolone is released after a 500mg deca shot in 1 week?
It's not 500mg, not even close.
" At any rate, all the problems of Deca still exist. "
I agree that some of the same problems associated with Deca are evident with NPP, but the Deconate ester creates a whole set of different problems.
Clearance of Deca is much longer than people think. Sometimes, it can be as much as 6 weeks (for higher doses). If you are using 600mg+ of deca, you should start clomid therapy 6 weeks after your last shot(you can use something in between)
Consequently, people using a significant amount of deca end up doing very long cycles.
Most guys will do PCT after 3-4 weeks but there is a still a significant amount of Nandrolone in there system so it goes to waste.
Their 12 week cycles could end up lasting a total of 16-18 weeks.
And in those 18 weeks, the first 3 and last 4-6 are a somewhat wasted. they are not taking full advantage of there cycles.
With NPP, you can bypass those dead zones and go straight into full cycle whithin the first week. You keep it at 5-8 weeks and recovery is quite easy, much easier than Deca.
Nandrolone plasma levels may stay in the blood for 12-18 months, but they are inactive. It's a similar concept to Marijuana being possible detected for up to 6 months. It's a big deal if you are being tested.
"The best risk/benefit ratio of any drug? I think it's one of the worst in regard to libido, which means everything to me, but apparently some guys have no problem sacrificing it."
I've tried every AAS excluding Tren and Anadrol (Tren will be in my upcoming cycle) and Test gives me the most problems even at 500mg a week. NPP is the best drug for ME, it saves my hair, not all that androgenic and it doesn't effect my sex drive or my mood. 700mg a week and never had problems bouncing back but I use it at the beginning of my cycle.
However, everybody is different.
Okay Andy. That makes more sense to me. i don't agree entirely, but I see where you're coming from. And yes, a short acting ester up front is preferable. What do you stack the Deca with?
chaquito: If you have a problem deca, it will be the same, but the duration may not be as severe
chaquito: If you have a problem deca, it will be the same, but the duration may not be as severe
Triple J
New member
Just to clarify for those who are confused by the terminology being used on this thread, the drugs being compared are nandrolone decanate with nandrolone phenylpropionate. Both are nandrolones but they have different esters, effecting the duration of release of the active component of the drug (nandrolone). As should now be obvious to everyone, Decanate has a much slower release than PP. The generic nandrolone decanate was originally branded as "deca-durabolin" thus it's common nickname "deca". However, "deca" refers to the ester and not the drug itself - other steroids sometimes utilize the decanate ester as well, I think there is even a testosterone available as a decanate ester. With any of those steroids which have the potential for serious side effects, short-acting drugs make more sense as one can easily stop the dosage and be assured that the drug will quickly clear the system. I agree with BA's points here entirely.
A
anabolicmd
Guest
Great discussion, but whats the answer?
Nelson Montana said:
My last cycle I stacked deca with EQ and low dose Test
200mg of Deca, 300mg of EQ and 100mg of Test every 5 days.
On paper Nelson, I would tend to agree with you about NPP vs Deca (side effect wise)
I'm kind of stuck because Androgens affect me severely. I just have trouble with these drugs.
For years, I stuck to 300mg of Deca a week because anymore and I would have problems. da big thinker was the one who introduced me to NPP. He was telling me how he ran it for 5 weeks and how it was the best drug he's ever used. He was using 525mg a wekk at the time and he bounced right back despite crashing hard with 200mg of Deca a week a few years back.
I thought it was basically the same thing until I tried it. Completely different drug, no deca dick...etc One of the best I've ever used.
Of course if you run it for 14-18 weeks, then you would have the same problems as with deca.
