School stabbing in Japan

[chesty]

Real quick like, I will elaborate more later.

This morning Japan time 8 school kids were stabbed to death by a Japenese man who worked for the school and had a prior record.

What this points out is the fallacy of gun control. As has been said by the NRA and others it is not the weapon that kills it is the person using the weapon.

A few points:

1. Knives are easier to conceal

2. Knives are more numerous

3. Knives are more lethal

(by lethal I mean that they can be used more readily, in a much more confined space, are harder to defend against, work in a full 360 degrees and in general are almost impossible to see until it is too late and there are basicallyl zero laws regulating the use and possession of a knife)

I will post more later.

Quick note I will not have this thread turned into a liberal/conservative venting. If we cannot have an intelligent conversation, I will pull the plug on this thread.

chesty

 

[WizzBang]

Real quick like, I will elaborate more later.

This morning Japan time 8 school kids were stabbed to death by a Japenese man who worked for the school and had a prior record.

What this points out is the fallacy of gun control. As has been said by the NRA and others it is not the weapon that kills it is the person using the weapon.

A few points:

1. Knives are easier to conceal

2. Knives are more numerous

3. Knives are more lethal

(by lethal I mean that they can be used more readily, in a much more confined space, are harder to defend against, work in a full 360 degrees and in general are almost impossible to see until it is too late and there are basicallyl zero laws regulating the use and possession of a knife)

I will post more later.

Quick note I will not have this thread turned into a liberal/conservative venting. If we cannot have an intelligent conversation, I will pull the plug on this thread.

chesty

chesty I have the same point of view you do on gun control it seems. because you asked not to get too heavily into any belief venting I won't, but it does seem as though there is another motive behind banning guns, not so much that people go postal and kids shoot up schools, as tragedy is always bound to happen in one form or another, but more so that the machine doesnt' want us to be able to protect ourselves. that small point being made, yes knives are certainly more deadly and abundant than guns, people will always find a method to get the job done if need be, im sorry to say it but guns will eventually become banned im positive of it, once this happens knives will be used more often. if they should happen to ban knives and the need arises, I would have no problem putting a hammer though someone's head

 

[Wfabrizio]

A lunatic will find any way to inflict harm on people. But just imagine if this freak did have an assault rifle or a high capacity magazine for a pistol. He would have killed a hell of a lot more kids.

I own firearms and I support ownership of firearms, but we do need stricter methods of acquiring them here in the US. I personally think that the concealed weapons approach (application process, training, background check) is the best way to go for everyone seeking ownership of a firearm.

There needs to be training and a thorough process. Currently, it's only an application and background process. I believe there should also be mandatory training.

Most firearm fatalities are due to accidents, not homicide.

 

[chesty]

I don't mean to not want views on gun control and such issues, I just don't want it to turn into a name calling your right I'm wrong discussion.

Some thngs to point out.

1. Japan has essentially a total ban on guns

2. the US does not

3. Whether or not there was or was not gun control would not have changed this situation.

4. Most gun shootouts and such happen within arms reach

5. There are exceptions to this, such as the two kids back east who used rifles or the man in CA who stood at the school fence

6. Knife attacks will always take place between 0 and 21 feet.

6. Rehabilitation does not work on everyone

7. Japan does not have the death penalty

8. As can be seen, the problems here are the same as elsewhere

9. People kill people, not guns/knives, etc

10. Knives can be used to derive pleasure just as a gun.

You can target practice, defend yourself, and inthe case of a knife create art through carvings and other lmeans.

And yes, if used in a certain way, they can be used to kill.

11. Knives are seen as "less" evil than guns. Why?

 

[plifter]

dude, I'm not quite sure where you got the idea that knives are harder to defend against than guns. I've never seen anyone block a bullet. BTW I like guns but I still think they are more deadly than knives

 

[chesty]

Wf, most deaths by guns are from homicides not accidents which are at an all time low in the US.

Most statest tha have concealed carry require training and learning of the basic laws of the state concerning the use of the weapon and self defense.

The point is not whether or not he could have killed more. In fact a man in CA with a semi automatic AK47 or sks don't remember, killed less kids than this guy and had full mags.

The point is that it happened at school, by a man with a record and using a knife. And he killed eight kids. How many were killed at Columbine? In CA? In the South East? The knife is silent, efficient and deadly. Every bit as much as a gun.

 

[chesty]

Dude, you are just wrong. Obviously you have not been in nor seen a knife fight or attack. Watch a movie called Surviving edged weapons. After being Deputy for 4 years, and having my supervisor killed while he and three other Deputies were within 2 feet of the killer, I submit to you that knives are much harder to defend against. Remember, they will go through a bullet proof vest, like a hot knife through butter, they work in 360 degrees and I garauntee you that if you had a gun and were within 21 feet of some one with a knife that half way knew how to use it you would more than likely be dead.

If you were within 10 feet of me or anyone else with a knife and you had a gun you would be dead.

You make the same false claim that if someone pulls a knife on you you will just shoot them. Wrong, it does not happen that way. I don't disagree that guns cause tremendous damage, but they only work in a straight line and you can seek cover from the attacker, with a knife you cannot. You must be able to defend yourself with your bare hands or you will die. At least with a gun I have chance to pull my gun possibly, find cover etc.

 

[Hugh Gellatts]

You have good points, but wasn't the gun vs. knife debate solved in one of the Indiana Jones movies?

 

[tomcat]

IKEDA, Japan (Reuters) - Eight children were killed and 15 people injured in Japan's worst school tragedy Friday when a middle-aged man with a history of mental illness went on a stabbing rampage at an elementary school in western Japan.

The injured were mostly 7 and 8-year-old students at the school in Ikeda, a suburb of the western city of Osaka. Seven of those killed were girls and one was a 6-year-old boy, Japanese media said.

Two teachers were also injured, police said, including one 28-year-old man who was in critical condition and underwent emergency surgery after the attack, considered unprecedented in traditionally safe Japan. Five children were also in critical condition, television reports said.

The tragedy began when the man, wielding an 11-inch knife, walked into a classroom in mid-morning and began to stab children in a rampage that media said lasted a little over 10 minutes.

"He came in holding a knife and started stabbing," a first grade girl said.


One sixth-grade girl told Reuters: "We were listening to an announcement over the loudspeaker, and then it was broken into by a scream and a noise like a desk falling down."

"Then I heard someone scream from below, 'Run!"'

Several children ran into a nearby supermarket yelling and crying for help, witnesses said.

"One of the boys, whose back was stained with red blood, fell in front of the cashier. He was pale and did not speak a word," a shop clerk told a television reporter.

Said one schoolboy: "I saw a person who had fallen down. I also saw blood."

Police were holding in custody a 37-year-old man who they said had previously undergone treatment for schizophrenia. "We have arrested a suspect," said a local police spokesman.

It was the worst mass-killing in Japan since the 1995 fatal sarin gas attack on crowded Tokyo subways by the Aum Shinrikyo (Aum Supreme Truth) cult which left 12 dead and thousands ill.

 

[chesty]

Indiana Jones was a movie. Real life is not like that. 23 dead or injured, that is a record even for here.