question about front squats

[audiophyle]

I was reading an article about squatting that said tall people with long legs and short trunks tend to have problems with back squats and that front squats were recommended for people with that body type. Well i fit that description exactly so i tried front squats last night. I can keep my back alot straighter and because of that i can squat deeper. I also had no problems with my knees going too far forward. But i had a noticable drop in the amount of weight I could use, mainly because I couldnt get the weight to sit right on my shoulders and it kept trying to roll forward. Where exactly is the bar supposed to go? I've read that when you extend your arms straight forward that you're supposed to get a cut in your shoulders and thats where the bar should sit. Thats what I tried but it still kept trying to roll forward. I was using the cross arm grip so i dont know if that had anything to do with it... ronnie coleman squats like 800 with that grip. My shoulders were really sore after too, is that normal for a front squat newb or do i have the bar in the wrong place? thanks for your help

 

[Dave949]

I couldnt get the weight to sit right on my shoulders and it kept trying to roll forward.

Were you keeping your elbows (at the very least) level with the bar or very slightly raised above the plane of the bar ? If the elbows drop a lil bit the bar does have the potential to want to roll forward. Also, if the bar has a bend or slight bend to it, you have to make sure the bend is in the down position. (sometimes the bend is very slight and not noticable but if it is in the wrong position, the bar will naturally want to roll into the down position). Also, your stabilizer muscles are adjusting to this since you are just starting this lift. Most likely, (IMHO) if you are new to this lift, it will take a lil practice to get in the groove and get the feel for it. Personally, I cannot use the same weight with my front squats as I do with reg. squats. I have to go a lil lighter with the fronts. Some others may or can use equal weight with fronts and reg squats, but I cannot.

 

[audiophyle]

my elbows were about level, maybe a little lower. Thats probably the problem but when i put my arms up much higher the bar starts to choke me. I guess i just need to some more practice.
Is it easier to keep control of the bar using a clean grip?

 

[Dave949]

my elbows were about level, maybe a little lower. Thats probably the problem but when i put my arms up much higher the bar starts to choke me. IIs it easier to keep control of the bar using a clean grip?

O.K. you have to work a lil on finding the correct elbow position that neither chokes you or rolls forward. Try not keeping the elbows too high, just a (little) higher than the plane of the bar. Hence.... your new to this lift and will have to practice and experiment to see what works best for you. As far as the clean grip....I tried it and it felt alright, but I like the cross arms works better for me but others may disagree. It`s more or less a personal / instinctive thing. Since your new at this lift (IMHO)
you are forced to focus on many things, aka, keeping back straight, keeping your balance, foot placement, keeping the bar in place, getting used to feeling the weight on your shoulders, not leaning forward on the ascent, stabilizer muscle adjusting, so you have all these things dividing and demanding your focus but in time you will find the groove and the feel for the movement.
Its just not a movement like doing barbell curl which requires (relatively) much less focus. Start light and do it right and every workout add a lil weight. Good luck bro.....its definetly a worthwhile lift.

 

[JJFigure]

I prefer the clean grip; the crossed-arms thing just never worked for me.

And I'm a long legged one too - I absolutely love front squats. It's so much easier to go ATF with them than with a rear squat.

 

[casualbb]

Do you guys find it helps your quads out more than a regular back squat?

 

[Dave949]

Do you guys find it helps your quads out more than a regular back squat?

Both (reg and fronts) have their individual advantages.
I incorporate both in my leg workouts.

 

[Nonerz]

I prefer the clean grip; the crossed-arms thing just never worked for me.

Same here. I don't feel stable or balanced when crossing my arms. If you do use the clean grip, make sure you stretch out your wrists as the bar should be resting back on your fingers with an open hand (I love front squats but my wrists hate me for it). Elbows must be pointing forward...that'll help keep you in the corrcet upright position.

As far as hitting your quads more than a reg. back squat...it may depend on your stance. I tend to go wide with a back squat and "narrow" (actually shoulder-width, which is pretty narrow for me) for the front squat. So I suppose for me, that is true...but I still do both like Dave said.

 

[JJFigure]

As far as hitting your quads more than a reg. back squat...it may depend on your stance. I tend to go wide with a back squat and "narrow" (actually shoulder-width, which is pretty narrow for me) for the front squat. So I suppose for me, that is true...but I still do both like Dave said.

Ditto.

 

[d3track]

i use the cross-arm grip too
i also have my heels up on 10lb plates, really tears up that teardrop
i saw a pic of arnold doing them with a bar pad to help with the choking
and yes my wieght is lighter rigt now
reg squats=385*6
ront squats=275*5
but booth are going up

 

[Nonerz]

I've tried the bar pad thing too...unfortunately, it tends to slip when I use it!

d3, I don't really understand why you'd put plates under your heels...can you elaborate for me? I thought the idea was to have your foot somewhat "flat", hence all the Chuck Taylor's!

 

[Citruscide]

That's how I usually know I'm doing the front squats correctly (at least my positioning of the bar) -- I use cross arm... and if I have some trouble breathing... I'm usually on. -- On a side note, the choking gets noticeably greater as I get over weights of 225lbs or higher... lol

C-ditty

 

[Exodus]

I've tried the bar pad thing too...unfortunately, it tends to slip when I use it!

d3, I don't really understand why you'd put plates under your heels...can you elaborate for me? I thought the idea was to have your foot somewhat "flat", hence all the Chuck Taylor's!

your right nonerz, flat shoes is for powerlifitng.

he's referring to bodybuilding. when you squat in shoes like oly shoes, or tennis shoes, they have an arch heel to raise up your heel more, placing emphasis on quads, something powerlifter try to avoid.

same with the plates under heels, it puts more stress on the quad.

however, it also puts more stress on the knees.

the reason most people squat with block under thier heals originally was on back squats cause people wernt flexible enought for atf squats, then it made the quads burn more and bodybuilders just stuck with doing it on both back and front squats.

X

 

[Nonerz]

thanks Ex...I never did understand why they do that!

Do you think it would be more beneficial to improve your flexibilty and use your regular training shoes without the plate? Especially given the added stress put on the knees. Doesn't seem like a good trade off on the surface.

 

[Exodus]

thanks Ex...I never did understand why they do that!

Do you think it would be more beneficial to improve your flexibilty and use your regular training shoes without the plate? Especially given the added stress put on the knees. Doesn't seem like a good trade off on the surface.

well thats what powerlifters did, figured out a way to increase strength on each exercise.

but i think i would choose the safer option bb or powerlifter. but it does put more stress on the muscle, so im sure folks well keep doing it.

X

 

[JJFigure]

Actually, OLY lifters use heels for front squats as well - ever seen/used a pair of lifting shoes?

 

[Nonerz]

never used them myself but I did buy a pair for my man...what a good girlfriend, huh!

 

[d3track]

ex hit it on the head
i actually have less knee pain with heels elevated
but i rotate about 3 different types of squats, so i never do the same lift two workouts in a row
and i am not a powerlifter by any means, if you are going for max poundage, do NOT use the plates
everyone has differnt goals, try different movements and then use the ones that work best for you, power lifters and bodybuilders, for all the things that are equal, do still have two different main goals