My neverending pondering about rep schemes

[Allon]

Was wondering what you guys think about the following kind of workout:
(warm up sets) and then.
6 reps > 8 reps > 10 reps > 12 reps.
It seems to me that this way I would get the most out of the 6 rep range and gain the benefits of higher weights as well as higher reps...
However, by the time I get to the second and third exersize for that muscle group would I be to wacked to do that same routine? I know it looks kinda like 5x5 but instead of going heavy on one exersize and lighter on the rest, I would get all rep ranges on all.
Anyone ever tried this? Waddya think?

 

[Allon]

Bump

 

[curgeo]

I mean, you can try it if you like allon, but what are you trying to train for? Strength or size? They are 2 different things.

What I would do is warmup using some light weights.......and then get to your working set, do 2 or 3 sets with that weight and then move on to another exercise ommiting the warmup sets.

This is just a rough guide: When training for size, stick to 6-12 reps for upper body and 15-50 for lowerbody.

When training for strength it is usually lower than 6 reps.

The reason you train for size with slightly higher reps: When trying to grow, the muscles have to undergo a certain amount of tension in them for a certain amount of time. They also have to be worked in a range that is heavy enough to stimulate growth. So the 6-12 rep range is pretty close to that. You will want to use a weight that is from 65-80 percent of your 1 rep max. This will make sure that you get the proper time under tension to stimulate growth and a heavy enough weight.

Another thing, when you apply a force to a weight (after warmup), don't slowly lift the weight.....explode the weight up on all your lifts. Remember, force equals mass times acceleration.......if you apply 300lbs of pressure to a 200 lbs bar, your body can't tell how much you are lifting and it will respond like you have lifted 300lbs.

If this is too much or you need a better explanation, email me at [email protected]

 

[Allon]

Thanks for reply, So the 6-12 range rep will not cause that much growth in the lower body you are saying?
BTW, I am training for strength, size and endurence. Size is most important to me at the moment, but all 3 are important. Maybe I should focus on one at a time... but I feel like I want to focus on all slowly, something is nagging me inside saying that there has to be a way to work all aspect and not only one, I don't have to get to my limits in either aspect but more importantly to me is to progress in all...

 

[curgeo]

I really feel that legs respond better to higher reps....but that's just my own anecdotal evidence.

How many years have you been training? If less than a year or two, it is possible to do both. Your body will respond to anything you try. If more than that, it gets harder.

Have you ever heard of Periodization? Tudor Bompa wrote a pretty good book that you can get at amazon or a book store. What periodization basically is: You break your training into different cycles......Your year is called a mesocycle........

You break that year down into smaller cyles called macro cycles......These are periods in which you train a certain aspect like strength or size or endurance or cutting. By breaking it up, you can do it, but just not all at once.

Try this: Take the next 2 months and train for strength.......next 2 for size.......next 2 for endurance. This is the beginning of cycling your training.

Me, I'm just an idiot that likes to get stronger......I'm going to go stuff myself again now.

 

[Allon]

Thanks man, I thought of this but I really had this thought that focusing on one aspect per period would mean I lose gains I made while ignoring it on a different cycle.
I am guessing I would lose a bit of gains but that it would still be better to do it the way you suggested?
Anyone else have thoughts on this?

 

[curgeo]

Very astute point, but it is hard to get around this. What you are hoping for is a supercompensation effect to happen....ie. your starting point in the next big wave is higher than last time.

It's hard to do, but that is why I train using the conjugate method written about at www.elitefts.com. I am constantly doing max effort movements twice a week, but I alternate movements every week. By doing this, your cns doesn't shut you down. It you to also put on muscle with extra hypertrophy specific work.

Check out the articles by Dave Tate and Louis Simmons for more on the conjugate method.

 

[Deathbydefault]

in my opinion, you should work in whatever rep range you want to , as long as your increasing the weight it really doesn't matter.Heres my thoughts

bodybuilders ---> increase weight often ----> ripped
powerlifters ---> increase weight often -----> ripped

 

[curgeo]

Yes and no death......In order for muscular growth to occur, you need to have the muscle under tension for a certain amount of time.....too little or too much you will not stimulate the muscle.

Too little Time/Tension.....you will get strength gains from it, but not size due to the small amount of time the muscle is under tension

Too much Time/tension.......the weight you are using is not stimulating enough type 2 fibers...although you do get some endurance benifits from it through stimulation of Type 1 fibers.

A bodybuilder increasing weight is different than a powerlifter. BB need to have that time under tension, while a powerlifter on his max effort stuff just needs to get a muscular strain on their highest set.

If you need anything else, email me at [email protected]

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

I basicaly train low reps and multiple sets on the powerlifts and vary the rep and set schemes, and 6-12 on the assistance exercises. That way you get power, strength, and size.

For me personally, I tried a strict periodization scheme one time and followed it to a "T". By the time I was supposed to hit max weights and surpass my previous best I was weaker than before.

I would try conjugate periodization because that seems to make good sense to me. I sorta use it for deads.

I will not use a basic regular old powerlifting periodization scheme ever again.

Conjugate looks good though.

I find I have to train an exercises heavy consistently to keep getting stronger. Dropping to lighter weights and higher reps does nothing for me and I regress.

The way I avoid CNS burnout is I regulate the intensity at which I workout (don't go to failure), give myself plenty of rest between sets and exercises, and don't add weight on an exercises unless I can do my reps and sets 2-3 workouts in a row. So if I got my required reps on an exercise in a workout, then the next workout or 2 I will do the same reps as before, before I increase the weight. This gives the body a little break and a chance to adapt fully to the weight rather than rushing it every time I make my reps. Works great!

But, everyone responds differently to different stimuli.

 

[curgeo]

I agree.....so you are going less than 90 percent of 1rm on the next training session. Have you ever thought of just varying the exercise? It is a way to avoid cns burnout.

Check out prelipins chart if you haven't already. It talks about how many lifts you can do per workout at a certain percentage without a detraining effect. Do a google search for some background on it.......if you already arn't familiar with it.

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

I will check out prelipin.

I want to buy Super Training, periodization by tudor bompa and the science and practice of strength training in the near future.

I change exercises and the order I do them in all the time on back, triceps, biceps. and traps, but for legs, chest and shoulders I generally train the same most of the time.

For chest I'll do heavy bench and DB bench on monday, and speed bench and incline on thursday generally.

In the future I may switch to only 1 chest day a week and switch between a max effort set of bench, DB bench and incline every week bascially doing conjugate periodization.

 

[curgeo]

ghetto.....We just started training WSB a couple of months ago. Here is a post from anabolicfitness.net that chronicals my dabbling and then turning to WSB. Check it out if you feel like it.

http://anabolicfitness.infopop.net/2/OpenTopic?a=tpc&s=702093973&f=6013051876&m=623101012

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

I liked what I read.

+800lbs raw squat is what I'm talking about. YA BABY!

I like your guys' journal. It's informative and fairly fun to read.

Keep it up!

 

[curgeo]

Actually, that wasn't our training log. Check out my and my training partners log. I train with Monster and Joepalooka.

http://anabolicfitness.infopop.net/2/OpenTopic?a=frm&s=702093973&f=6013051876

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

What a putz. Give me the wrong link only to find the right link is gonna take a serious reading. Pfft!

I'll take a gander at it later when I'm prepared to devote a half hour to it lol.