Let's Stop Kidding Ourselves

[Tiervexx]

And whenever people would argue about how longer cycles are more effective -- yet freely admit that they don't hold on to their gains, it didn't make sense to me.

This confused me too.

 

[sk*]

I dunno about you guys but I have done a 4month long moderate dose cycle and loved it fat better than an 8week cycle. Kept more gains cause they came steady. Actually I didn't lose one single pound (within 3months after) and even gained some strength post cycle.

Maybe there is a set amount of muscle you can get, but it isn't something as strict as a 10 but rather something genetically dependant. One thing I have found out about myself is that I can gain weight, I can gain a lot of weight.

I can go right past 260lbs within a couple months if I take something, and I am only 235 or so now. It won't be all lean muscle but a good portion of it will. I think this is where what macro said comes into play, height matters in how much you can gain. Also some people can retain more water than others, and water retention will help gain more muscle. Now the water itself isn't real muscle, but since you are able to work overtime with the extra water it will give you some extra muscles.

I like your post, just not sure if I agree with all the aspects. One thing I learned though, it's better to take nice and lean gains over the bloated fat look. I like looking nice all year round, it's better for the ego and I have no plans to compete anytime soon, so I will much rather take slow and lean gains over the fat pig approach.

-sk

 

[twistedneck]

Thanks for a perspective changing post. Excellent responses, you guys are still influencing my first cycle. 33yrs. old. TW

 

[Swolenpecs]

Bravo...............

Good Good Good.

 

[jubei]

Sorry Nelson but your 30 years of "experience" does not make your opinions fact. There are so many variables to consider that making a 10 pounds of muscle per cycle rule is really very ignorant.

 

[Nathan]

Re: Re: Let's Stop Kidding Ourselves

agree, to a certain extent.

though your criticism of long cycles is unfounded.

by your line of thinking (the part that has merit) even better than 5lbs a month.. 2lbs a month for a year (thus by your own reasoning.. longer cycles are better)

longer slower more consistent gains

Macro is making sense to me. I agree that slow gains are best and I learned that after a cycle or two. If I gain and keep 10lbs on a cycle now, I'm ecstatic, frankly.
I also disagree with where Nelson was putting down things like the d-bol bridge. I tried it once, and started with real d-bol and finished with fake stuff (at least I'm pretty sure). It worked well for me. I'm going to try another d-bol bridge and I'm looking forward to see if it works for me again and allows my test to come back again, at least mostly. I have also learned that the answer is not to up the gear but rather to ave patience and first to play with training techniques and nutrition. We're in this for long haul since it does take a long time to get to an appreciable size.
i still have a tendency to get carried away at times but I've learned to pace myself and to have patience. I think it's really starting to pay off, frankly.
I would also like to add that being on a 16 week cycle now I have found that the gains can still keep coming steadily so long as the drugs and training are switched up periodically. Well, whatever. I wish I never had to increase my doses.

 

[Nelson Montana]

Sorry Nelson but your 30 years of "experience" does not make your opinions fact. There are so many variables to consider that making a 10 pounds of muscle per cycle rule is really very ignorant.

Why are you being such an ass? I said "around" or "about" 10 pounds. No claims that it was "rule." Before accusing someone of being ignorant for having an opposing opinion to your own, I suggest you understand what they're saying first. It would also be a good idea to know what you're talking about before mouthing off.

Now Nathan -- I don't even know what he's trying to say. And macros analogy that because slow gains are better then long cycles are better makes no sense to me either. In fact, it's completely senseless. If you can gain 5 pounds in a month with no supression and keep it. What's the point of staying on for 3 months to gain 20 pounds and lose 15 afterward? And be supressed.

And sorry macro, I don't believe you did a single long cycle and then nothing else for months and kept 25 pounds of muscle. You may have gained 25 pounds, but I'll bet it wasn't all muscle.

 

[sk*]

And sorry macro, I don't believe you did a single long cycle and then nothing else for months and kept 25 pounds of muscle. You may have gained 25 pounds, but I'll bet it wasn't all muscle.

I think he was refering to gretak911.

---

Regarding the first part of your post, I gain just fine throughout the cycle and recover fine. Maybe cause I am young, or maybe other factors come into play, but I do just fine with longer cycles ... MUCH better than the traditional 8-10week cycle.

-sk

 

[Goldprospector]

I have to be honest about not knowing a lot about cycles, but i think the negative and /or disagreeing post seem to be where people have read information into the original post. I took it a generalized info. I also took it as if you do one 12 week cycle and gained 30 pounds...then never did another cycle, then it would be difficult to keep more than about ten pounds because of natural test shut-down,,,but if you do a short cycle and gain 5 pounds...then your body is not shut down and the gains are easier to maintain.
Give credit where credit is due. the post is informative and the statement would seem true if you take them at face value and not read more information into..
Good post Nelson!

 

[gretak911]

Alright, I was typing at work earlier and trying not to get busted on this site so I didn't proof read my post. My first cycle (actually not my firs - my first was 4 wks of eq at 300mg wk long story but a freind and me got 50ml of ganabol and our source said that he was sending the other 50 ml bottle in a couple of days. It never arrived so we each had 4wks at 300mg/wk) So about 4 months later we hooked up with someone who got me 50 ml of some dutch deca 50ml/mg) I took 300mg for 8 weeks and during wich time I gained went from 180 to 210 and then about 3 months after the cycle I was down to 205. I definately lost some fat in my love handles during this cycle too. SInce that time I have done 2 more cycles. I have done 3 cycles (3 1/2 if you count the first screw up) I usually do one cycle every 8 months. My last one was over in January of 2003. I will be going back on around oct 1st. (Test, winny, tren and maybe some dbol to kick things off.) At my heaviest I was 260. I have been using eca and I've cut down to 240 now. I've been off since january and I just put 315 up on bench for the first time ever. Even when on the most I've ever put up was 285x3 but I never maxed out. (I usually work out alone). I have long skinny arms and legs. Actually my arms are 17.5" but they look really skinny.