Let's Stop Kidding Ourselves

[Dial_tone]

I will abstain from posting any comments...

Or is my abstaining ... actually... a comment? Hmm...

C-ditty

Silence can be deafening.

 

[drrman]

As many of you know, I advocate shorter, lower dosed, highly anabolc, mildly androgenic cycles. I don't want to start a discussion here as to their merit, nor is it necessary for anyone to disagree. Instead, let's just call a spade a spade.

I don't believe anyone who has been at this a while will dispute the fact that the actual amount of mucle that is permantently gained from a single cycle can not exceed much more than 10 pounds -- if that. I don't care how much gear you use or how long you use it. Once all is said and done and youre completely off, 2 months later, you won't have gained much more than 10 actual pounds of muscle -- if you're lucky. Chances are you won't keep it unless you really bust your balls in the gym. An odd approach I know. It seems these days guys think that maintaining muscle is a matter of using the right drugs afterward. Some even think that 3 weeks of AM d-bol or a month of 40 mgs of Var is the way to maintain gains and prevent muscle loss post cycle. Well, let me fill you in on a little secret. That isn't post-cycle therapy. That IS a cycle.

Muscle is best maintained if gained in a slow steady manner. Five pounds a month would be astounding! But that doesn't seem to be good enough for a lot of people and I could never understand that. And whenever people would argue about how longer cycles are more effective -- yet freely admit that they don't hold on to their gains, it didn't make sense to me.

But now it does. It's so simple.

The fact of the matter is, people like being on steroids. (duh) And why not? You feel strong. You feel euphoric. You have a fullness and vascularity that is never quite the same, just a week after going off. You have the psychological advantage of knowing you're enhanced. Hell, even injecting is a rush. You're Clark Kent turning into Superman. And it feels good.

But's let's not kid ourselves. Long cycles with anything over a gram a week has NOTHING to do with building muscle. It has to do with HAVING muscle. Now.

But once the parties over, you get these former suoermen whining that they can't keep their gains, or that they're getting smaller, or that they don't want to train. And just for a kicker, they can't get an erection. Back to Clark Kent, only worse.

For those of you who have chosen a life of commitment to steroids, this thread is not for you. But I believe it's imperative for those who are new to it to be aware of their choices.

Get too accustomed to steroid use and it's like any other addiction. When you're "on" the world is a better place. And that makes being "off" that much harder to handle.

Or...you can use steroids in the way they work best; as an enhancement -- a little punt to get you over the edge to the next level. As an aid. Not a crutch.

Think of it this way. If you learned how to drive a car before you learned how to walk, you'd go a lot farther and a lot faster than the guy struggling to use his own two legs. But after a while, you'll run out of gas and you won't be able to go anywhere. Your mode of transportation is gone. That's when you'll see the guy who learned how to walk getting closer, until he walks right by you. And you know what? He can always learn how to drive.

I know perspectives like this are short lived. But they need to be told every now and then.

Just trying to keep it real.

DEFINITELY the best post i've seen you made, and you used some good analogies there too

 

[Ulter]

I think that for most people cycles should be 8 weeks at a time and that the average joe doesn't need to do that more than 2-3 times a year to grow and stay growed.
Things are not the same as they were when Nelson was cycling on and off, so for the 80's and 90's he's correct. But that was then and this is now. We know much more about nutrition and using supplements, many of which are just drugs in disguise, to make sure a person can maintain what they gain for several months until their next cycle. And even if there is no next cycle you can still keep better than half of what you gain.

 

[Nelson Montana]

I think that for most people cycles should be 8 weeks at a time and that the average joe doesn't need to do that more than 2-3 times a year to grow and stay growed.
Things are not the same as they were when Nelson was cycling on and off, so for the 80's and 90's he's correct. But that was then and this is now. We know much more about nutrition and using supplements, many of which are just drugs in disguise, to make sure a person can maintain what they gain for several months until their next cycle. And even if there is no next cycle you can still keep better than half of what you gain.

First of all, please don't assume that I'm somehow "stuck in the 80's." I'm not sure wher that's coming from, other than I was around back then. That doesn't mean I've been asleep the last 20 years.

Actually, I do believe there have been some advancements in supplemenation that can ease the crash, protect your health and help maintain the gains. But the human body hasn't evolved all that much in the last 10 years...so the basic principles stand.

 

[gretak911]

Yeah, if you kept a 25 pounds of solid muscle from 300 mgs of deca in 8 weeks you are a true freak of nature. Maybe the added size helped you gain more weight (muscle and fat) afterward

I may be a freak of nature but I'm definately not a mesomorph. I was your classic ectomorph who had been training/overtraining for about 10 years before starting the AAS. I think that that first cycle was a catalysta that helped my body morph into a more efficient muscle building state. I don't want my post to detract from your excellent points. I agree with just about everything you post but I think that a severely overtrained/undertrained/malnourished/etc. individual can gain and keep over your 10lbs. Most vets who have a dialed in diet and training program will be lucky to keep 10lbs per cycle.

 

[macrophage69alpha]

25lbs
first cycle


most important fact

HEIGHT- 6'5"

very possible.

this brings up the error of perspective so common here.

 

[Stillgoing]

Re: Re: Let's Stop Kidding Ourselves

This is the point that most people don't get. You can't depend on the steroids to do everything for you. BB takes a life long commitment to training hard, having the right diet and educating yourself. That is the hard part that most people do not want to commit themselves to. They're always looking for the easy way out. Steroids are not a joke. This not the type of thing you want to be playing with. The sides effects can be very damaging to the biological systems of the body and, if excessively used, permanent. Rely more on youself more than the juice. That's where the real gains come from.

I agree with this post, however, steriods never did anything for me unless I was totally busting my ass in the gym and the kitchen. While I definitely got bigger and better than I could naturally, I consider every gain I made to be a fully earned gain and dues to be paid in full. Waiter, check please.......

 

[jasonstrong]

Possible,
I only lost 5lbs after the cycle and I definately lost some fat. I was 6'5" and 180lbs. Now I'm 240 and have been off since January. My bench went from 225 x2 to 275 x4 during that cycle too. That was only 3 years ago too.

I am confused-like this matters anyway, but-you say you gained 30 lbs but that only equals 210 I assume you gained another 30 naturally in three years, but then you state you were off since January of what year? and no disrespect but unless someone has an limiting injury gaining 50 lbs on yer bench when you gain 30 lbs of bodyweight is pitiful...I think you got a couple of typos in yer post.

 

[Stillgoing]

the average joe doesn't need to do that more than 2-3 times a year to grow and stay growed.

"to grow and stay growed"....classic quote bro!!....I love it....

 

[alanchiras]

All this is making me hungry to actually go to the gym and workout - with freeweights!