Lessons in Neurotransmitters - please add...

[velvett]

Neurotransmitters are the chemicals that allow communication to occur in the brain. Different neurotransmitters allow and/or produce different functions. We can link various thinking, feeling and behavioral actions and states to various transmitters.

Dopamine
Norepinephrine
Serotonin
GABA
Enkephalin

Dopamine
Dopamine Functions in:
Feelings of pleasure
Feelings of attachment/love
Sense of altruism (unselfish concern for the welfare of others)
Integration of thoughts and feelings

Dopamine Deficiencies result in:
Anhedonia (lack of pleasure)
Lack of ability to feel love, sense attachment to another
Lack of remorse about actions
Distractibility

Norepinephrine
Norepinephrine Functions in:
Arousal, energy, drive
Stimulation
Fight or Flight

Norepinephrine Deficiencies result in:
Lack of energy
Lack of motivation
Depression

Serotonin
Serotonin Functions in:
Emotional stability
Reduces aggression
Sensory input
Sleep cycle
Appetite control

Serotonin Deficiencies result in:
Irritability
Irrational emotions
Sudden unexplained tears
OCD
Sleep disturbances

GABA
GABA Functions in:
Control of anxiety
Helps control arousal
Controls convulsions
Keeps brain activity balanced

GABA Deficiencies result in:
Free-floating anxiety
Racing thoughts
Rapid heart
Inability to fall asleep
Constant fight or flight
Panic

Enkephalin
Enkephalin Functions in:
Internal calm
Sense of well being
Feelings of euphoria
Self-concept
Pain management

Enkephalin Deficiencies result in:
Internal turmoil
Lack of complete feeling
Sense of inadequacy
Poor pain control

 

[nycgirl]

What causes the deficiencies?

 

[velvett]

What causes the deficiencies?

Not sure yet - some of it is nutritional/vitamin/mineral.

I stumbled onto researching it b/c of migraines - migraines are often present when serotonin levels are low. So I though huh, lets look into this.

Thought I'd add as I learned and if anyone had something to add they could too.

Looks like this might be better in science though...

 

[samoth]

Excellent... this is what I'm researching right now. I'll add more as I have time. Any info on a supposed non-benzo CIV drug called "Neurontin"? I'm looking for benzodiazapam-like sedation of nerves (a specific nerve damaged by a tumor) and clonazepam is waaaaaaay to powerful and effects the entire organism when all I want is, basically, a site-injection kinda thing. In my brain. Kinda a problem, but we're in the process of figuring out what to do, lol.

Good post.

 

[beefcake28]

Excellent... this is what I'm researching right now. I'll add more as I have time. Any info on a supposed non-benzo CIV drug called "Neurontin"? I'm looking for benzodiazapam-like sedation of nerves (a specific nerve damaged by a tumor) and clonazepam is waaaaaaay to powerful and effects the entire organism when all I want is, basically, a site-injection kinda thing. In my brain. Kinda a problem, but we're in the process of figuring out what to do, lol.

Good post.

I copied the Physicians Desk Reference Info for Neurontin and published it to a website... The file was too big to upload here...

Here's the link: (I hope this works, you'll probably need to use Internet Explorer to see the pictures and diagrams)

http://home.comcast.net/wsb-cgi-bin...&GroupID=1088238&Owner=amj1976&SiteID=2734525

It doesn't mention anything about "site injection", though it does cover everything approved on the market so far....

I found 27 medical journal articles discussing this drug in just one database search. There are 25-30 more databases I could search.

Let me know if you need more info...

 

[nycgirl]

Excellent... this is what I'm researching right now. I'll add more as I have time. Any info on a supposed non-benzo CIV drug called "Neurontin"? I'm looking for benzodiazapam-like sedation of nerves (a specific nerve damaged by a tumor) and clonazepam is waaaaaaay to powerful and effects the entire organism when all I want is, basically, a site-injection kinda thing. In my brain. Kinda a problem, but we're in the process of figuring out what to do, lol.

Good post.

I'm definitely interested. Is there a way to deal with the deficiencies without using drugs?

 

[samoth]

I copied the Physicians Desk Reference Info for Neurontin and published it to a website... The file was too big to upload here...

Here's the link: (I hope this works, you'll probably need to use Internet Explorer to see the pictures and diagrams)

http://home.comcast.net/wsb-cgi-bin...&GroupID=1088238&Owner=amj1976&SiteID=2734525

It doesn't mention anything about "site injection", though it does cover everything approved on the market so far....

I found 27 medical journal articles discussing this drug in just one database search. There are 25-30 more databases I could search.

Let me know if you need more info...

I have the PDR and similarsuch. I need to buy the DSM-IV, but it's $70 I don't have, lol.

The site injections into the brain was kind of a joke, emphasizing that I do not like the narcotic effects the nerve-calming drugs produce on my entire body. I only have a problem with nerve damage in one specific area in a nerve where the tumor ruptured/ate through the mastoid. In order to calm that nerve, I'm taking a strong benzo (Clonazepam, generic clonapin) that has negative effects throughout the organism. I will be trying this new "Neurontin" as of Thursday, a non-benzodiazepam nerve agent that will hopefully work as well as the clonapin.

If you have a source for the full DSM-IV online, I would be very interested in that. The clonapin, while a tranquilizer, seems to exhibit different characteristics in me that would fall more under the manic-depresive area of pharmopsychology, moreso the manic part (which I have never in my life had any issue with whatsoever). So I'm looking for a non-narcotic drug that might help with that, as the typical stimulant ADHD medications have seemingly been neutralized by the clonapin -- over 60mg amphetamine does, literally, nothing. Oddly enough, 50mg ephedringe hydrochloride seems to have more of a stimulatory effect, althogh not negating the issused caused by the clonapin (which I'm on, per three different surgeons' recommendations, until further notice, at 2-5mg BID-TID). The Mayo Clinic stated that brain surgery to repair or even sever the nerve would not be an option in this case (I saw an ENT, not a neurologist), as there would be no way whatsoever to predict the outcome, and further complications caused by other damage would create a greater risk.

 

[samoth]

I'm definitely interested. Is there a way to deal with the deficiencies without using drugs?

There is significant research showing Omege-3 fatty acids having an effect in this area. I have not yet had a chance to look into it, but I figured I would throw this out in case you wanted to do a quick check or something.

This was coming from a doctor specializing in internal medicine, and I was quite surprised that she spoke so highly of Omega-3's. Definitely on my "To Do" list.

 

[beefcake28]

I have the PDR and similarsuch. I need to buy the DSM-IV, but it's $70 I don't have, lol.

The site injections into the brain was kind of a joke, emphasizing that I do not like the narcotic effects the nerve-calming drugs produce on my entire body. I only have a problem with nerve damage in one specific area in a nerve where the tumor ruptured/ate through the mastoid. In order to calm that nerve, I'm taking a strong benzo (Clonazepam, generic clonapin) that has negative effects throughout the organism. I will be trying this new "Neurontin" as of Thursday, a non-benzodiazepam nerve agent that will hopefully work as well as the clonapin.

If you have a source for the full DSM-IV online, I would be very interested in that. The clonapin, while a tranquilizer, seems to exhibit different characteristics in me that would fall more under the manic-depresive area of pharmopsychology, moreso the manic part (which I have never in my life had any issue with whatsoever). So I'm looking for a non-narcotic drug that might help with that, as the typical stimulant ADHD medications have seemingly been neutralized by the clonapin -- over 60mg amphetamine does, literally, nothing. Oddly enough, 50mg ephedringe hydrochloride seems to have more of a stimulatory effect, althogh not negating the issused caused by the clonapin (which I'm on, per three different surgeons' recommendations, until further notice, at 2-5mg BID-TID). The Mayo Clinic stated that brain surgery to repair or even sever the nerve would not be an option in this case (I saw an ENT, not a neurologist), as there would be no way whatsoever to predict the outcome, and further complications caused by other damage would create a greater risk.

I have unrestricted access to the DSM-IV Database online... Let me know what you need, I'll find what I can.

Here is some info from the DSM-IV Database for Neurontin:

Anticonvulsants

The analgesic effects of anticonvulsants for neuropathic pain have long been known. The older anticonvulsants—phenytoin, carbamazepine, and sodium valproate—were reported to provide pain relief (McQuay et al. 1995). Of the newer anticonvulsants, gabapentin (Neurontin) has been the one most studied as an analgesic (Backonja 2000) and has the advantage of a more benign side effect profile than the older ones. Although gabapentin appears be efficacious for neuropathic pain, there is no evidence that it is better than or even as good as the TCAs for this problem. Gabapentin may exert its analgesic effects through calcium or sodium channel blockade or through enhancement of -aminobutyric acid (GABA) levels in the brain produced by increasing GABA synthesis and release (Ross 2000). The usual starting dose is 100 mg three times a day with eventual increase up to 3,600 mg/day. Other newer anticonvulsants—most notably topiramate (Topamax), oxcarbazepine (Trileptal), and lamotrigine (Lamictal)—also appear to provide analgesia for neuropathic pain. With regard to other specific pain syndromes, carbamazepine continues to be considered the most effective medication in the treatment of trigeminal neuralgia, and sodium valproate is beneficial in prophylactic treatment of migraine headaches.

Benzodiazepines


The use of benzodiazepines for patients with chronic pain is controversial. Benzodiazepines appear to provide little benefit for patients with chronic pain or cancer-related pain, and it is generally recommended that benzodiazepines be avoided when these conditions are present. Because of their GABAergic effects, benzodiazepines may actually exacerbate pain rather than reduce it (Dellemijn and Fields 1994), and they can interfere with the analgesic effects of opioids (Gear et al. 1997). Despite this, King and Strain (1990) found that benzodiazepines are often employed in the management of chronic pain. They also observed that patients' most frequently cited reason for taking these medications was that they improve sleep. Because of the additional analgesic effects provided by the TCAs, it is recommended that they be used to treat the insomnia that may accompany pain. When pain is accompanied by anxiety, the use of a benzodiazepine alternative, such as one of the antidepressants or buspirone, should be considered.


Selected Other Medications Used as Analgesics


Because so many different medications have been employed for pain, it is impossible to provide a comprehensive list here. The following selected medications are included because of their special interest to psychiatrists.

In addition to the antidepressants, other psychotropic medications also appear to have analgesic effects. Several of the neuroleptics, including haloperidol and chlorpromazine, have been reported to provide analgesia, most notably for neuropathic pain. However, methotrimeprazine, a phenothiazine, is the only neuroleptic that has been found in controlled studies to have analgesic effects (Monks 1990).

Lithium has been shown to be beneficial in cases of acute and cluster headaches. Therapeutic dosage is usually similar to that required when this medication is used to treat bipolar disorder.

The triptans are a new class of compounds that act on various 5-HT receptors. These agents, which include sumatriptan (Imitrex), zolmitriptan (Zomig), rizatriptan (Maxalt), and naratriptan (Amerge), are used for abortive treatment of migraine headaches.

 

[win19]

There is significant research showing Omege-3 fatty acids having an effect in this area. I have not yet had a chance to look into it, but I figured I would throw this out in case you wanted to do a quick check or something.

This was coming from a doctor specializing in internal medicine, and I was quite surprised that she spoke so highly of Omega-3's. Definitely on my "To Do" list.

A good place to start:

n-3 FA impact neurotransmitter (especially dopamine) systems of the brain:

Proc Nutr Soc. 2002 Feb;61(1):61-9.
Dietary essential fatty acids and brain function: a developmental perspective on mechanisms.
Wainwright PE.

DHA (n-3 FA) plays a role in dopamine and serotonin metabolism:

Dev Neurosci. 2000 Sep-Dec;22(5-6):474-80.
The role of dietary n-6 and n-3 fatty acids in the developing brain.
Innis SM.


PGE1 (made from EFAs) is impaired in shizophrenia:

Prostaglandins Leukot Essent Fatty Acids. 1992 May;46(1):71-7.
The relationship between schizophrenia and essential fatty acid and eicosanoid metabolism.
Horrobin DF.


n-3 EFA beneficial for ADHD and shizophrenia, and likely depression in adults:

Chin Med J (Engl). 2003 Mar;116(3):453-8.
Omega-3 fatty acids and non-communicable diseases.
Li D.

etc.

 

[win19]

I'm definitely interested. Is there a way to deal with the deficiencies without using drugs?

Yes, and there is a book that may interest you. The Edge Effect by Eric Braverman (2004). Braverman categorizes personalities into neurotransmitter dysfunctions or deficiencies. For example, being deficient in the following transmitters: dopamine (the loner; the procrastinator); acetylcholine (the eccentric; perfectionist); GABA (unstable personality; drama queen), serotonin (self-absorbed; rule breaker) and mentions strategies aimed at those among other things. Aside mentioning drugs, also discussed are constructed diets aimed at increasing the neurotransmitters (e.g. tyrosine is a precursor to dopamine).

 

[Lao Tzu]

The book the edge effect covers excesses & deficiencies in serotonin, GABA, dopamine and acetylcholine. It could have useful info in it.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1402712057/102-9707324-1814560?v=glance&n=283155

 

[Lao Tzu]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neurotransmitter

 

[nycgirl]

WOW, thanks for recommending the book.

Is it possible to ever find the right balance? Can you take something (drug, supp)? Does genetics determine our deficiencies and we should just deal with that?

 

[MikeMartial]

WOW, thanks for recommending the book.

Is it possible to ever find the right balance? Can you take something (drug, supp)? Does genetics determine our deficiencies and we should just deal with that?

Depending on the cause, some deficiencies can be temporary; stress, poor nutrition and some prescription drugs can do this.

A few years back, I decided to go on Accutane for mild acne that wouldn't clear; I was in my late 20's. Long story short, a 2nd dosing regime of Accutane totally messed up my system, and I had an acute onset of depression. My doc put me on a pretty high dose of Effexor (an SNRI), in an attempt to kick-start my serotonin production again. After 9 months, I went off----and this was a year ago. I was 100% sure I'd never feel the same way I did pre-Accutane, but I now do, everyday. That Accuatne is a nasty, nasty rx drug---but that's another story altogether.

I've found a few studies on diet and neurotransmitters; one decribed the high efficacy of various B-complex vitamins and Omega-3 fatty acids (which I now take daily, of course. )

Interesting thread!

 

[win19]

WOW, thanks for recommending the book.

Is it possible to ever find the right balance? Can you take something (drug, supp)? Does genetics determine our deficiencies and we should just deal with that?

I would say that the "right balance" comprises of that state where someone who exhibits the symptoms and evidences of a transmitter deficiency, namely "feels better". Genetics - we all have them, they are an interaction between us and our environment.We can influence our genetics by lifestyle, behavior and of course what we consume. But anyways, an example where genetics plays an obvious role, is in phenylketonuria (PKU) there is a deficiency of an enzyme (phenylalanine 4-monooxygenase) that metabolizes phenylalanine to tyrosine, which if it is not paid attention to can progress to cause brain damage due to the excess build-up of the amino acid. Consequently, untreated PKU sufferers have shown lower tyrosine levels. The things we do also impacts our transmitter levels - deficient or excess: Exercise, sex, drugs, alcohol, food, music - all increase dopamine and endorphins. People who are hypersexual are high in dopamine (like some drugs cause in treatments for people suffering from Parkinson's disease, or people who just boink too much).

Depressed people have been found to have low serotonin (but it is not the sole factor), that's why there's the drugs used to treat depression, one type known as "selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors" (SSRIs) -- which allow a better use of serotonin. In schizophrenia there are excess levels of dopamine seen (whereas overstimulation of the dopamine receptors is a thought of etiology of schizophrenia, read: http://www.pnas.org/cgi/content/full/97/14/7673). I remember this Swiss guy I knew who was taking medication for his schizophrenia, yet here he was juggling three girlfriends (none of them knew about each other, I even saw one of them wrapped around a blanket once) and doing drugs. There is also a link between recreational drugs and schizophrenia, one of the drugs I know this guy was doing was cannabis, consequently long-term cannabis use (he was in his 30s) can increase the risk of schizophrenia: Chronic cannabis abuse raises nerve growth factor serum concentrations in drug-naive schizophrenic patients. J Psychopharmacol. 2003 Dec;17(4):439-45. Jockers-Scherubl MC, Matthies U, Danker-Hopfe H, Lang UE, Mahlberg R, Hellweg R. Excess stress is known to deplete neurotransmitters, we influence our mind, e.g.: "Not surprisingly, alterations of 5-HT receptor activity have been shown to occur in many psychiatric diseases including anxiety, depression, eating disorders, schizophrenia, personality disorders, and many drug-induced psychotic states." (Multiple serotonin receptors: clinical and experimental aspects. Ann Clin Psychiatry. 1994 Jun;6(2):67-78. Roth BL). Recreational drugs also affect neurotransmitters, like MDMA (ecstasy) which yields long-term serotonin reductions (Recreational use of "ecstasy" (MDMA) is associated with elevated impulsivity. Neuropsychopharmacology. 1998 Oct;19(4):252-64. Morgan MJ). Like already mentioned above, nutrients play a significant role, e.g. folic acid is used to produce serotonin and dopamine (you can read more on folic acid, nutrition and neurotransmitters here: Can nutrient supplements modify brain function? Am J Clin Nutr. 2000 Jun;71(6 Suppl):1669S-75S). People suffering from depression for example, have been found to have low folic acid. So deficiencies can certainly have a nutritional aspect.

You can take drugs, and although he does recommend them also, Braverman makes a good point in that book: "Learning to make better dietary choices based on your nature can help you maintain better, balanced health, but you won't see changes in a matter of minutes, as you do with medication, or in a matter of days, as is the case with hormones. Altering your nature through diet requires weeks. But diet is far gentler on your body, supports your body's natural mechanisms for neurotransmitter production, and results in a stable, long-term balance." (Ibid, p. 37). Additionally, drugs aren't necessarily much better than a more natural approach, for example, in a double-blind study comparing the SSRI fluvoxamine to 5-HTP (precursor to serotonin) in depressive patients there was found a significant and almost equal reduction in depression (A functional-dimensional approach to depression: serotonin deficiency as a target syndrome in a comparison of 5-hydroxytryptophan and fluvoxamine. Psychopathology. 1991;24(2):53-81. Poldinger W, Calanchini B, Schwarz W). Finally, as we see, genetics alone do not determine nor control our deficiencies or excesses. And a knowledge of the genes that do carry great potential predispositions, does us little good until we find those, the potentials get tested to see if they actually have them, and then apply the respective method of an available treatment strategy. Until then all things in moderation, don't fry your brain with drugs and alcohol, and feed yourself right.

 

[MikeMartial]

People who are hypersexual are high in dopamine...In schizophrenia there are excess levels of dopamine seen

MAN! No wonder all my crazy girlfriends were oddly enough the best in bed.

Science yields yet another perfect explanation.

 

[velvett]

The book the edge effect covers excesses & deficiencies in serotonin, GABA, dopamine and acetylcholine. It could have useful info in it.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1402712057/102-9707324-1814560?v=glance&n=283155

AWESOME!

 

[samoth]

AWESOME!

From the website about the book posted,

"Book Description

A proven program to reverse and prevent aging that will be a must-have for all “baby boomers,” by a leading figure in the medical field and a frequent guest on national TV."

Ummmmmmmmmmm..... bullshit.

You want to read a real book on neurology? Try Ropper and Brown's "Principles of Neurology", http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/00..._1/104-8419519-4841530?_encoding=UTF8&s=books.

That is what is called a real book, and not propaganda by those saying they have "A proven program to reverse and prevent aging".

HTH

 

[win19]

From the website about the book posted,

"Book Description

A proven program to reverse and prevent aging that will be a must-have for all “baby boomers,” by a leading figure in the medical field and a frequent guest on national TV."

Ummmmmmmmmmm..... bullshit.

You want to read a real book on neurology? Try Ropper and Brown's "Principles of Neurology", http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/00..._1/104-8419519-4841530?_encoding=UTF8&s=books.

That is what is called a real book, and not propaganda by those saying they have "A proven program to reverse and prevent aging".

HTH

Well, one difference between those two is that Principles of Neurology appears to delve into the more technical or theoretical aspects. The other book is aimed at a more basic audiance and does not give an in-depth analysis (one can even see that comparing the number of pages: 304 pgs. vs. 1384 pgs). However, since I haven't read Principles of Neurology I can't create a direct comparision of the two, but I'm almost sure it would be dissimilar. I'm sure that must be a good book. The cover of Edge Effect indeed claims to: "Reverse or prevent Alzheimer's, aging, memory loss, weight gain, sexual dysfunction and more". We know that is in fact, already possible, without any books. Maybe there can be found flaws in the book, but as far propaganda is concerned, I would be interested to see specifically what that propaganda is, unless that was a premature dismissal.

 

[samoth]

Well, one difference between those two is that Principles of Neurology appears to delve into the more technical or theoretical aspects. The other book is aimed at a more basic audiance and does not give an in-depth analysis (one can even see that comparing the number of pages: 304 pgs. vs. 1384 pgs). However, since I haven't read Principles of Neurology I can't create a direct comparision of the two, but I'm almost sure it would be dissimilar. I'm sure that must be a good book. The cover of Edge Effect indeed claims to: "Reverse or prevent Alzheimer's, aging, memory loss, weight gain, sexual dysfunction and more". We know that is in fact, already possible, without any books. Maybe there can be found flaws in the book, but as far propaganda is concerned, I would be interested to see specifically what that propaganda is, unless that was a premature dismissal.

From the book itself, "... A proven program to reverse and prevent aging...".

Now we already know that aging cannot be reversed.

Since the book purports to have a program to reverse aging (notice conjunction "and", not "or" in the above book quotation), and given that aging is a natural irreversible biological process, the natural conclusion would to be to call such a book propaganda. "Principles of Neurology", now on it's 8th edition, is a classic text in its field, and will be for decades to come.

I have a personal bias against all this 'new age' and what have you stuff that's been hitting the market over the past few years. They're about as reliable as the "Loose 20 pounds in two weeks without diet OR excercise!" books. But the american people eat this stuff up, always looking for an easy way out, thus the market for such material continues to propagate.

 

[win19]

From the book itself, "... A proven program to reverse and prevent aging...".

Now we already know that aging cannot be reversed.

Since the book purports to have a program to reverse aging (notice conjunction "and", not "or" in the above book quotation), and given that aging is a natural irreversible biological process, the natural conclusion would to be to call such a book propaganda. "Principles of Neurology", now on it's 8th edition, is a classic text in its field, and will be for decades to come.

I have a personal bias against all this 'new age' and what have you stuff that's been hitting the market over the past few years. They're about as reliable as the "Loose 20 pounds in two weeks without diet OR excercise!" books. But the american people eat this stuff up, always looking for an easy way out, thus the market for such material continues to propagate.

I see. You may have misunderstood what the book means by reverse or prevent, it is in the sense of slowing down that process, which is something one would know who has read it: "There's no way around it---you begin aging the moment you're born, and the process doesn't stop until you die. But the problems we associate with aging are in large part the result of declines in our body's production of hormones as we grow older, and the problems that these cause for our body's electrical signals..." (Ibid, p. 162). Especially note: "there's no way around it". So he is well aware of that well-known fact. You can partially reverse or prevent the aging process (or processes thereof) but only in the sense of slowing it down, but to eliminate it or annihilate it completley never was a claim made by this book. It is too linear to think that because the word 'reverse' occurs equates to a total reversal being meant. And "or" is used on the actual cover. And I am unaware of that cited quote ("and") appearing anywhere on the cover, backside, or near those, or in the book anywhere. So the claim seems to have been instigated by website. I can understand your skepticism towards books with claims of health that may seem simplistic, but there is useful knowledge that can be gathered here. I'm sure I can learn things in Edge Effect that I can't in Principles of Neurology and likewise! Guaranteed. Because I have done it over and over again, through thousands of science and medical articles, patents and hundreds of science and various books. These type of books are also here to excite people about positive changes that can impact their lives, not everyone likes papers of bibliographies and references. Some people don't have the time to read lengthy scientific texts, yes that might be sad, but whatever works. Although I certainly don't mind any of those. And for me it's good to get a break from those with books like these, while still being written by a professional (in this case a medical doctor with practical experience and knowledge, inside the cover is stated: "The programs described in this book are based on medical research and neuroscience, but are not a substitute for personalized medical care and advice").