How Do You Train?

[JustJacked]

when I go to the gym I feel like an animal. Its like Im not normal. When Im doing a set I give it everything Ive got. people stare at me cause of the noises i make when i train. I always push myself past my limits. if i can only get 5 reps i will get 6 or 7. when Im done my set i can barely stand straight and my eyes feel like their in the back of my head. I love the intensity! Its a fucking huge rush. I feel like Im gonna pass out after every set. I never used to train like this and I had very little gains. Now that Ive been training with crazy intensity ive noticed huge gains in strenght and size. in 2.5 months ive put on over 40 lbs of lean mass and doubled(or more) all my lifts. and im not on the sauce, yet(start cycle any day now). the only problem is I cant find a training partner who can keep up with me. they just dont give it all they got.

How do you guys train? How intense are you?

 

[LeanMeanHockeyMachine]

Depends on what I'm training. I love training legs (8/10 on the scale), I just give 'er, and also attract a few stares along the way. Chest and Back (except deadlifts) are a little less intense (6 or 7/10) and finally arms have to be a 4 or 5/10, I hate arms...

 

[JustJacked]

Depends on what I'm training. I love training legs (8/10 on the scale), I just give 'er, and also attract a few stares along the way. Chest and Back (except deadlifts) are a little less intense (6 or 7/10) and finally arms have to be a 4 or 5/10, I hate arms...

I love training arms. I go crazy on them. I use supersets and drop sets. It gets pretty intense

 

[Madcow2]

Not to be purposely contrarian but many training programs are periodized. Generally waves where one is loading and unloading volume. Volume and intensity (as measured by %1RM) are regulated. This leaves periods, albeit not lengthy ones, where achieving the goal is not difficult at all. In contrast, some periods are very taxing and require digging very deep to push beyond limits. The idea is that the progressive loading on the body creates a recovery deficit signaling the body that there is a sustained and absolute need for adaptation. During the deloading, the body is allowed to catch back up on the deficit to a point and adaption occurs. This is the way the majority of high level athletes are trained. The term is dual factor training.

What I'm getting at is that, pushing yourself to the max at all times doesn't fit with these programs and I'm not exagerating when I say that the overwhelming majority of the world's best strength coaches and researchers use this method. That being said, emotional arousal itself is a limited resource and taxing on the body in a significant form of stress. You shouldn't not use it but as with any limited resource the goal is to allocate it appropriately placing it where it is needed and not squandering it when unnecessary (potentially impacting the body's ability to recover or efficiently call upon its resources in a critical moment).

This is a pertinent snip out of the link here. The entire link is excellent reading and covers a variety of topics including dual factor theory (topic 3) and some sample programs (topics 1/2). The source is one of the best coaches in the US and likely the world. http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/showthread.php?t=12

TOPIC 12: INTENSITY

intensity one thing i have noticed over the years is that some lifters need much more emotional arousal to lift top weights than others. i have also noticed that it is the emotional arousal itself, not the lifts, that brings on fatigue, and possibly overtraining. consider this. in lifters who can lift 95-100% weights without getting "psyched up", there is usually the ability to lift these top weights very often, sometimes daily, without undue fatigue. however, with lifters who need considerable emotional arousal to lift these weights, they CANNOT be lifted often, certainly not more than once a week. this obviously leads one to the conclusion that the emotional arousal itself, not the weights lifted, is the mechanism leading to fatigue. before anyone flys off the handle, ill admit that one can overtrain without getting psyched up if they try, and the physical stress of lifting obviously plays a part, i am only saying that the EMOTIONAL arousal plays a bigger part than most would consider. now, i consider it a truism that it is not sensible to let your ability to lift with or without emotional arousal determine your lifting frequency or volume. in other words, psyching yourself out of your mind every time you squat to get your best possible poundage, then simply accepting the fact that you can only squat once every 10 days is not sensible. personally, i limit pssyching up in training. true, i support a businesslike atmosphere, and yell and scream at liftes daily. but i DO NOT let lifters pace for 3 minutes working themselves into a frenzy before a lift. just go up to the bar and lift it is in my opinion the best training strategy. what does this have to do with all of you? well i know that some of you feel unable to train very often. i know that "overtraining", loss of motivation, etc, are subjects discussed somewhat regularly on this board and by lifters everywhere. my suggestion if you have experienced this or are experiencing it, is to not only look at your workouts, but look at your attitudes and arousal during your workouts. try to do 2 or 3 weeks of training where you DO NOT psych yourself up prior to sets. you may find several things. you might find that you just plain feel better out of the gym, not so "drained" and tired as usuall. you might find that you are able to handle more training volume. and finally, you will almost surely find that in time you will increase your ability to lift heavy weithts without psyching yourself up, it is in fact a learned ability. and when this happens, youll find you have the best of both worlds, youll be lifting as heavy as possible, without draining yourself emoutionally. youll feel better, youll lift better and be albe to lift more and more often... and youll find that your mental state in everyday life is just plain better. and finally, PLAN your all out, crazy, psyche up and frothing at the mouth workouts. itll be a pleasant change of pace every couple of weeks! itll be something to look forward to, not just the daily grind

 

[JustJacked]

bro, what the hell are you talking about? lol nobody's talking about pacing for 3 minutes and psyching yourself up before a set. I dont even take more than 30 seconds between sets. Im talking about how hard do you train. how intense are you during your set. do you give it all you got? do you go to complete failure?or do you stop when it hurts too much? are you scared of injuries? do you push yourself to your maximum potential? when you set a goal do you achieve that goal? or do you over-achieve that goal?

Im asking these questions because when I go to the gym i see so many people training at half their potential. they dont even break sweat. as soon as they start to struggle they put the bar on the rack. it doesnt matter what happends before oor after your set, its during your set that counts. when Im doing a set I give it all Ive got and then some. lifting weights is like everything else, if you do it half-assed then your gonna get half-assed results.

if it doesnt hurt, it doesnt work

 

[wootoom]

i get dizzy alot

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

JustJacked, SHUT THE FUCK UP.

"Now that Ive been training with crazy intensity ive noticed huge gains in strenght and size. in 2.5 months ive put on over 40 lbs of lean mass and doubled(or more) all my lifts. and im not on the sauce, yet(start cycle any day now)."

UM, 1 word.........................BULLSHIT.

 

[Madcow2]

bro, what the hell are you talking about? lol nobody's talking about pacing for 3 minutes and psyching yourself up before a set. I dont even take more than 30 seconds between sets. Im talking about how hard do you train. how intense are you during your set. do you give it all you got? do you go to complete failure?or do you stop when it hurts too much? are you scared of injuries? do you push yourself to your maximum potential? when you set a goal do you achieve that goal? or do you over-achieve that goal?

Im asking these questions because when I go to the gym i see so many people training at half their potential. they dont even break sweat. as soon as they start to struggle they put the bar on the rack. it doesnt matter what happends before oor after your set, its during your set that counts. when Im doing a set I give it all Ive got and then some. lifting weights is like everything else, if you do it half-assed then your gonna get half-assed results.

if it doesnt hurt, it doesnt work

The 3 minute pacing thing is an exageration on his part but some people do something like that before major lifts. What I'm saying is that most of these programs rarely have people training to failure whether that be psyched or unpsyched (from your description in the first post, I take that to mean psyched/emotional arrousal). During specific weeks failure on an exercise may happen but even then failure in itself is not the goal. I work as hard as I must to meet the goal, in some periods where I am reaching past a previous best that may mean everything I have - in others I move at a smooth clip, sometimes I might barely break a sweat (and I'm greatful for these week because generally they happen after 2 weeks of hell and that means I'm going to be reaping the rewards from that ordeal immenently).

There is working hard and working smart. Ideally the two coincide but in the gym there are plenty of guys absolutely busting their ass to move 3 steps left and 2 forward. When I bust my ass, I move 5 forward. Hell, I could work like a slacker at 40% and still move 2 forward.

I'm not kidding when I say dual factor theory is the way the world trains its athletes. Olympic, Div1, Pro- all of them. There's tons of empirical evidence and it's been in widespread use for decades. Single factory theory which relies exclusively on workout to workout supercompensation, from which training to failure on a consistent basis arrises in the belief that the quality of the supercompensative stimulus is in achieving 100% muscular failure, is a lonely camp and it's very nearlly 100% BBers and fitness enthusiasts. For an experienced lifter training to failure on a consistent basis is widely regarded as the best way to not make gains. I'm really not kidding when I tell you this. One of the reasons why people are having good results with HST is because it is the first dual factor based program to make its way into the BBing community. It's nothing revolutionary, just some basic principles have finally begun to make inroads.

Here is an article and another explanation - you might give it a try, there's a reason why the worlds best use programs based on it. I've trained both ways in my life - worked like an absolute dog at times trying to eek out some extra gain. I could have saved years and a ton of wasted effort that went to taking away from my progress if I would have known this stuff then. At a minimum it's worth taking the time to understand what's behind it.

http://www.readthecore.com/200412/reynolds-dual-factor-training.htm
http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/showpost.php?p=48&postcount=3

 

[JustJacked]

JustJacked, SHUT THE FUCK UP.

"Now that Ive been training with crazy intensity ive noticed huge gains in strenght and size. in 2.5 months ive put on over 40 lbs of lean mass and doubled(or more) all my lifts. and im not on the sauce, yet(start cycle any day now)."

UM, 1 word.........................BULLSHIT.

ok. we have an internet tough guy. because your a skinny little bum who sits in front of his parents computer all day and cant achieve any of his goals cause your a fall down doesnt mean other people cant. its low life punks like you, with no self respect who come on here and trash people because it makes you feel better. the funny part is, in real life your just a coward. your hatred is spawnd by jealosy. fucking pathetic. your probably some pencil necked little geek kid with no friends. how the fuck do you know if this is bull shit? unlike you, i dont come on here talking trash. 2.5 months ago i could bench 135 for reps. now im doing 275 for reps. 2.5 months ago i curled 25lb db now i curl 45's. 2.5 months ago i could not do 1 pull up, now i cam do 20. the list goes on. do the fucking fucking math asshole.

I cant stand big mouth punks like you. get a life.

 

[JustJacked]

Madcow2- I dont train to complete failure all the time. because then i would definately overtrain. for 6 weeks ill train to complete failure and go all out. then ill take a break for 5-7 days. then ill switch up my routine. ive trained for 6 years and ive never made any big gains. so I studied it for awile and put what i thought would work best for me into my routine. now ive put myself to my maximum potential and ive achieved what i should have achieved a long time ago. but this is what works for me. the way i train might not work for you. most people dont use their maximum potential. some people will put on 5 pounds in 6 months and be happy, so they will keep that routine. but really they could have put on 20+lbs but they will never know cause they will keep that routine. most people make what we call "realistic" goals. they say "i want to put on ten pounds in the next 6 months" so they train like their gonna put on ten pounds in the next 6 months. and they put on these 10lbs and their happy. when I make a goal, I say "im gonna put on 100 lbs in 6 months. so I train like Im gonna put on 100lbs in 6 months. I most likely will not put on 100lbs of muscle in 6 months but I might put on 20. and 20 is alot better than 10. but had i set my goals at 10 i would have been happy at 10 and that would have been it. if you make "realistic" goals than you probably will achieve those goals. but if you set your goals higher you might now make it there but you have a better chance than if you didnt. here is an example: if it takes you 2 hours to get somewhere then you will drive like it take 2 hours. but if you want to get there in 1 hour than you will drive like it takes you 1 hour. same as training. if your going for 10 you will get 10, but if your going for 20 you probably wont get 20 but you might get 15. see what im getting at?

 

[bignate73]

wow, that was convoluted...

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

I'm not an internet tough guy lol.

I'm just calling it like I see it.

You say you've been training for 6 years and never made any gains. Sounds like you don't know what you're doing, let alone talk about it.

Then you say you put on "40", count em "40" pounds of lean body mass in 2.5 months. Um, yes, that is BULLSHIT!

Even on steroids, which you so clearly say you weren't on you couldn't put on that much lean body mass most likely in that time frame. Maybe with GH and slin you could, but based on your 6 years of zero progress I doubt even on those you could make those gains as you so clearly don't know what you're doing.

I'm not the guy who's got less than 100 posts making outlandish claims, TOUGH GUY.

You say after 6 years of suckass training that you've now stumbled onto the holy grail of "training balls out and using stuff you think works" and have doubled your lifts in 2.5 months time? What's wrong with this picture? Did Mike Mentzer come back from the dead and give you the inner secrets of Heavy Duty!? No disrespect to Mike, R.I.P.

"2.5 months ago i could bench 135 for reps. now im doing 275 for reps. 2.5 months ago i curled 25lb db now i curl 45's. 2.5 months ago i could not do 1 pull up, now i cam do 20. the list goes on. do the fucking fucking math asshole."

So after 6 years of training you were benching a pathetic 135 for reps? I could bench that my first week of training. And after 6 years you suddenly had a MEGA growth spurt and magically doubled that weight for reps in 2.5 months and gained 40, count em, 40 pounds of LEAN BODY MASS in 2.5 months? You magically increased your pullups from zippo, zilch, nadda, "0" to 20 reps even though at the same time you gained 40lbs of added bodyweight, albeit supposed muscle in 2.5 months?

Damn boy, you must really eat your frickin Wheaties or something. Sure you aren't eating the Breakfast of Champions in large quantities? Shit, when did you start training, when you were 10 years old? You see that I could believe because then the HYOOGE increase in strength and bodyweight could be attributed to a teenage growth spurt over the summer haha.

I've done the fucking math, and you sir, are a LIAR, ASSHOLE. and BTW, I don't put people down, just lying assclowns like "you"...

 

[musclebosun]

I got to go with ghetto on this one bro. You can't just jump on this site and slam people the way you did bro. That sort of shit gonna get you bombed hardcore. lighten the fuck up and learn your place.

 

[musclebosun]

oh and by the way, with that temper you might want to think twice before jumpin on the gear. Hate to see you gettin ass raped in prison cause you couldn't control yourself.

 

[blut wump]

I don't like these questions. They suggest that training with moderate to high weight with low reps equates to a shitty low-intensity workout. I very rarely go over 8 reps and almost never go over 10 except on a warmup, typically aiming for about 5 or 6 reps. If I keep my rests short I can work up a decent sweat with that. I think it works for me: I gained around 10 or 11 Kilos in my second year of regular lifting with no noticable change in waistline and no sauce. I guess it must have been the creatine.

 

[JustJacked]

ghettostudmufin- if you would asked questions or even checked my profile before you started shootin your gate off, you would have found out that i was in prison for 11 months. I was in solitary confinement for 8.5 months. when i came out 2.5 months ago i was in the worst shape of my life. 170lbs and 20-21% bf. Now I am 190-195 with about 10-12 % bf. these are the gains ive made since ive been out. I couldnt even bench 45lb db when i came out. If you disagree with me fine, but you could have been alot more polite about it. Its punks like you who put me in prison. learn some fucking respect.

blut wump- Im not suggesting that training with low reps is a shitty low intensity workout. I never go over 8-9 reps on my working sets. maxing out on lower reps is alot more intense than high reps. I like the way you train. low reps with high intensity and short rest between sets. i train like this too. I only rest 20-30 seconds between sets. I find this is the best way for me. 11kg is decent gains for your second year of training! Keep up the good work bro!

 

[blut wump]

Cheers bro but I still can't pick a category to vote in.
Welcome back to the real world.

 

[velvett]

LOL


I've nearly tossed my cookies twice this month.
I mean really euw.

Nothing like chunks floating in your mouth.

 

[WalkingBeast]

KILL THAT SHIT style!!

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

You're the punk, and if you're gonna lie, at least keep your story accurate. It's punk's like yourself that are stupid enough to get thrown in prison, and btw, I would spank your ass.

I know BULLSHIT when I see it.

I also know math assclown so let me go over some of it with "YOU".

In 2.5 months time you say you put on 40lbs of lean bodymass, going from 170lbs and 20-21% BF to 190-195lbs and 10-12% BF.

Let's do the math shall we.

170lbs x20% bodyfat= 34 pounds of fat mass which leaves you with 136 lean body mass.

Then, 2.5 months later after you're released from solitary confinement you badass you, with your new ballZ-out training methods...after having spent 6 years previously making ZERO gains and barely benching 135lbs for reps you discover the holy grail of training SUPER HIGH-INTENSITY!

190lbs x10% bodyfat= 19 pounds of fat free mass and 169 pounds lean body mass.

169-136= 33lbs lean bodymass supposedly gained, but you say over 40, so even if I used 195lbs instead of 190, you would come up with a max possible gain of 39.5lbs so long as you really are 10% BF.

So what you are really saying is that you lost roughly 15lbs of fat in 2.5 months while gaining 33lbs of lean body mass. That's an AMAZING feat. So you dropped 1.5lbs of fat a week, while eating a caloric surplus to build new muscle(anyone see the contradiction) and gained roughly 3.3lbs of lean body mass a week.

WOW.

I'm speechless.

I might have believed it if you had previously been VERY strong and built, as well as had good genetics and were using steroids as soon as you got out and started training, but even then that amount of real lean bodymass gain with an equally impressive drop in bodyfat is VERY hard to believe and I have known some "VERY" genetically gifted people that can't claim gains like that, even when coming back from a long layoff. The fact that you say you had lifted for 6 years before and never gained much and barely could rep 135lbs on the bench press does not instill alot of faith when it comes to believing the gains you say you made when you got out of lock-down you toughie.

I've done the math, the math don't lie, you do you poo-poo...ok, bye bye now.

 

[JustJacked]

Are you jealous? I think so. and there you go again shootin your gate off. I got nothing to prove to you. your not on my level as i can see from your disrespectful posts. did you get slaped around alot when you were in middle school? and now you hate everyone whos better than you? your a hater. thats a bad attitude to have my friend.

oh yeah, I weighed myself yesterday at the gym. 192 lbs with a 31.5 inch waist. If my bodyfat calculator is correct that would be about 9% bodyfat! thats half your bodyfat. are you jealous? well we will find out when you trash my post and call me a liar. get a life. stop hating

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

Jealous, nope. Jealous of what? Your bodyfat, ooooohhhh, special.

I know math, and there's NO WAY you lost 15lbs of fat in 2.5 months while at the same time gaining 33 pounds of muscle naturally, especially considering your previous lifting history.

I am done with you.

 

[JustJacked]

Jealous, nope. Jealous of what? Your bodyfat, ooooohhhh, special.

I know math, and there's NO WAY you lost 15lbs of fat in 2.5 months while at the same time gaining 33 pounds of muscle naturally, especially considering your previous lifting history.

I am done with you.

well its pretty obvious your jealous otherwise you wouldnt be trashing me. but its ok. I hear it all the time. 'oh, hes on steroids' or 'he was born like that'. not very people like to give credit for hard work. there like you, they get jealous and start hating. they snicker behind your back but they wont dare say anything to your face. people like you make me sick. you pathetic little haters. grow the fuck up.

Oh yeah, I forgot to tell you something. I dont even do cardio. none. I go for a walk once a week and thats it!

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

LOL.

I'm not jealous.

Live with that fact, ok?

Just answer me a few questions.

You said you trained for 6 years with little results and could barely rep 135 on the bench. Then you got locked up, but when you got out you started lifting and your bench went from ?(135 or less) to 275 for reps in 2.5 months and you gained 33lbs of muscle while losing 15lbs of fat.

So how is that possible? I'm just asking because based off those previous 6 years I don't see how all of the sudden just working out really hard would give you those results. Call me a sceptic, not jealous.

Can you answer that with a logical response?

I mean sorry if I'm being a dick cuz if you really did that then great for you, but based off those previous 6 years it sounds like you don't have the greatest genetics so how did you gain 3.3lbs of muscle a week while being in a caloric deficit so you could also lose 15lbs at the same time?

It just seems a little far-fetched based on what you said your past training experiences were. I've never seen anyone make progress that fast and for no apparent reason because your genetics can't be that great to lift for 6 years and barely rep 135, but then get out of prison or jail and then explode with amazing growth and strength increases in RECORD time.

Can you explain that to me?

I'm a personal trainer and I train with competitive powerlifters and I know several pro bodybuilders and I've never met anyone that gained that fast, at least without the use of copious amounts of steroids and GREAT genetics that were obvious from the get-go. I've met some REAL genetic freaks and none ever gained that fast while losing like somewhere from 8-11% bodyfat in the same time frame.

Like I said before, if you had previously been your current size and strength or more or close to it, I might believe you could have made progress that fast, but even then it would be stretching it.

Can you answer my questions?

 

[JustJacked]

before I went in I weighed close to 200 pounds. but I was probably close to 18% bf or more. I could bench 225 for a couple reps. my strength was weak because I was partying all the time. I was eating like shit. alot , but shit food like fast food and way to much pizza. I was in the club every night getting smashed. I would work out hung over. I was barely taking any supplements. I would miss my shakes all the time. I didnt really know how to train. I thought that if I just lifted the weights I would get big! well, when I went inside I started to study and read as much as I could on health and fitness and I realized that I was doing it all wrong. so when I got out I quit drinking every night, quit smoking, no more drugs and started to eat lots of healthy foods. spent 600$ on supplements and away I went. when I first got out I was benching 115 and my arms felt like they were going to shatter! within 3-4 weeks with the help of V12 and other supp I was benching 235 for 3 reps and 3 more forced. and then gradually over the next 2 month I added another 40lbs to my bench. Its actually quite amazing the strength you wil gain when you are healthy and not poluting your body with cigaretes and booze.

 

[WalkingBeast]

No more flaming! Take it up in PM if theres a problem

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

I wasn't flaming!

I was simply trying to get to the bottom of what sounded like hyper-bole.

Justjacked, you answered my questions. The way you talked before made it sound improbable the kind of gains you made, but now it sounds reasonable based on your further elaboration.

Good job on the progress. I was only callin ya out because the way you first explained it sounded a little off, but now it makes sense to me. It's all in how you say it.

 

[JustJacked]

well maybe next time you should ask questions first before making acusations. Im not gonna sit here and type my life story to ya. so if you want to know the details you have to ask. ya know?

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

Fair enough. It wasn't me, it was the devil, red 666.

 

[blut wump]

Ok, guys, already, get a room.