Hey Oak

[JKurz1]

I had an AMAZING w/o last night incorporating hammys and bis.......lasted over an hour, full blown intensity on every lift........I was thinking I'm going to hit BACK (emph. on width) and Tris today.........really nice to break up arms once in awhile......think I can get really LARGE from this routine?

 

[Dieharder]

probably not..........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................wiseass

 

[TheOak84]

i dont care, do what u want...........................................................................................................................................

 

[Debaser]

Intuition training is the key to failure.

Progressive loading is the key to growth.

 

[Dieharder]

Intuition training is the key to failure.

Progressive loading is the key to growth.

he still wont get it..............always trained volume.............

 

[TheOak84]

he still wont get it..............always trained volume.............

ya, hes one of those people who NEEEEEEEEDS tons of volume to respond to training and get huge, yet.. hes 6'3 175..

anyway, id never train biceps before back.. alot of peeps do that, but thye never train tris before chest.

 

[psychedout]

he still wont get it..............always trained volume.............

Don't be hating volume now.

As I always say, volume training works -- in fact it works great, but like all things it only works for so long and you need to switch things up.

 

[Dieharder]

yeah thats what i dont understand, why he NEEDS volume. Hes also done 4 cycles apparently, and is still 175

 

[InTraining]

Lmfao at another flame fest...

Volume training is stupid IMO...I have done it and here is why I think it is ineffective...

Let's say one is doing 4 movements for chest....REALISTICALLY how many of these movements are going to improve in weight weekly...1...maybe 2?....the other movements are just a waste of time and cut into recovery...

Progressive resistance will make you grow..not "hitting the muscle from all angles"

 

[TheOak84]

volume training to me is about 12 good sets. to some people its 25 sets... which i could never dream of doin. i like 6-9 good sets per muscle group. its usually 9, unless im really tired or short on time, and if im short on time, i cut down the rest to 30 seonds, and its a whole new world. so u can say i do a lil bit of instinct training too, which is always good

 

[psychedout]

Lmfao at another flame fest...

Volume training is stupid IMO...I have done it and here is why I think it is ineffective...

Let's say one is doing 4 movements for chest....REALISTICALLY how many of these movements are going to improve in weight weekly...1...maybe 2?....the other movements are just a waste of time and cut into recovery...

Progressive resistance will make you grow..not "hitting the muscle from all angles"

Volume training isn't about gaining massive strength. For example -- Arnolds heaviest set with bench press was with 315 and 275 on the incline. Anyone can do these numbers, but damn near zero people can look like he did.

How many sets you perform for a body part can affect how much it grows as well. If you can honestly say that doing more sets won't result in more muslce growth... then wow is all I have to say.

 

[TheOak84]

If you can honestly say that doing more sets won't result in more muslce growth... then wow is all I have to say.

i can... i have proof, the strongest guy i know, weighs 180, hes my training partner, he can bench 455, squat 495 and deadlift about 585. and does 20 sets for each muslce group.. hes been 180 for 4 years, and has lifted the same for 4 years. hes strong as an ox, but comlains he never grows, i say.. stop doin 20-25 sets a week, and try less volume, more frequent workout, he says no cuz he might lose his power. ... so, more is good.. for a while.. but will get u know where if u stay on it. most people have alot to learn about muslce growth but are stubborn cuz they think they know it all, but arnt getting anywhere

 

[psychedout]

Look -- I do HST, DC, my on thing, high volume etc. I go with one for like 10-12 weeks than switch it up. It has always worked for me.

And i'm not interested in strength, only size. And volume does = size (of course, the law of diminishing returns still exists here).

 

[InTraining]

Volume training isn't about gaining massive strength. For example -- Arnolds heaviest set with bench press was with 315 and 275 on the incline. Anyone can do these numbers, but damn near zero people can look like he did.

How many sets you perform for a body part can affect how much it grows as well. If you can honestly say that doing more sets won't result in more muslce growth... then wow is all I have to say.

I never said I didn't grow off of volume training...I just said it is ineffective compared to other methods

Personally I like training a muscle 2x a week and I still use a relatively high volume!! With Back I would say I average around 12-20 work sets a week...and I grow better that way....

Also if we are talking about a weight a ___sec negative\positive comes into play....for growth the weight is not so important if we are using slower negatives...

Please explain to me how more sets results in more growth? And obviously there has to be a cutoff point where doing more sets is simply overkill on the muscle....

Arnold used 30 sets and grew just fine...Mentzer used 1...Dorian Yates used a few(not 100% sure about that though)

 

[Dieharder]

the flame fest is because jkurz CONSTANTLY says he might be overtraining, that he isnt making progress, and according to his posts switches up everything constantly. Volume is great if it works for you, it apparently isnt working for him, and he even admits it, but wont change

 

[InTraining]

the flame fest is because jkurz CONSTANTLY says he might be overtraining, that he isnt making progress, and according to his posts switches up everything constantly. Volume is great if it works for you, it apparently isnt working for him, and he even admits it, but wont change

Yeh...I remember a long thread where he said "you know I might be wrong maybe I should take some advice from you guys I have done 4 cycles and I am still in 180's"....and then we see threads like this...that's why I thought it was funny

 

[psychedout]

Volume is great if it works for you, it apparently isnt working for him, and he even admits it, but wont change

Then houston, we have a problem.

 

[JKurz1]

I love it.....love how the one setters unite....it was a joke fellas.....DH and Debaser- yoyu both have sure done your studying up on me...hell - I think you know more about me than I do. Nice. I was 175 at my absoluted leanest, carrying sub 5% bodyfat, celaphane.......now, I'm about 192 and still completely shredded......honeslty embarrased to take my shirt off in front of people because I get the "what are you on?" and "what do I have to do to get like that: compliments, and that's not an egotisitcal remark. I'm benching around 315 for 3-4 in my last set....my squat and deads are increasing to where I would like them...militarty is around 185, so I'm pretty f-ing content with the efforts I have put forth.....SO, while I train with volume and you do a set, I'm sure you are in the same boats as I....you look like you train hard and heavy, right?

 

[guldukat]

Why is this thread still open? Can ANYTHING positive come of it?

 

[TheOak84]

Why is this thread still open? Can ANYTHING positive come of it?

i think a lil negativity is good... no board is perfect, and sometimes people need to fight and flame. fighting proves others wrong and makes people feel like idiots. which is good if ur jkurz

 

[TheOak84]

I love it.....love how the one setters unite....it was a joke fellas.....DH and Debaser- yoyu both have sure done your studying up on me...hell - I think you know more about me than I do. Nice. I was 175 at my absoluted leanest, carrying sub 5% bodyfat, celaphane.......now, I'm about 192 and still completely shredded......honeslty embarrased to take my shirt off in front of people because I get the "what are you on?" and "what do I have to do to get like that: compliments, and that's not an egotisitcal remark. I'm benching around 315 for 3-4 in my last set....my squat and deads are increasing to where I would like them...militarty is around 185, so I'm pretty f-ing content with the efforts I have put forth.....SO, while I train with volume and you do a set, I'm sure you are in the same boats as I....you look like you train hard and heavy, right?

wait this makes sense. if u only care about size, then it shouldnt matter how u train, as long as u get to the size u want. but id rather be huge, but back it up with strength. i know alot of guys who are big, but are shit on real lifts (hammer machines dont count).

 

[guldukat]

I know what you mean, Oak. Conflict does drive lots of important developments

This, though...I dunno that anything productive can come of this. It seems to be all about carrying a vendetta from one thread over to a new one. I do hope some good can come of it, but if it doesn't, and soon, I think it's best buried.

 

[TheOak84]

I know what you mean, Oak. Conflict does drive lots of important developments

This, though...I dunno that anything productive can come of this. It seems to be all about carrying a vendetta from one thread over to a new one. I do hope some good can come of it, but if it doesn't, and soon, I think it's best buried.

ya i think its pretty much finished

 

[JKurz1]

ok....done...what's next?

 

[Debaser]

Maybe replying to my offer?