First Cycle__Need Advice

[ggozen]

After some research and talk with a friend in the gym I decided to start doing my first cycle;

For the last 12 years I have lifted regularly and run twice a week as a part of my daily rotine. I'm using Whey, creatine and sometimes BCAA.

I am 35 yrs old, 6'3, 227 lbs, not know exactly but 14% BF estimated.

I never decided to use until now, trained so many years without knowing what is going on on the other side. I dont wanna go away without trying and seeing the results of steroids. If I wont try I will never know my limits...

My friend suggested the following;

9 week cycle;

Sustanon: Starting with 500mg sust/week gradually increasing to 750mg/week and in the end 250mg/week,

Primabolan: Starting with 100mg primo/week gradually increasing to 300mg/week and in the end 100mg/week,

Dianabol: Starting with 15mg dball/week gradually increasing to 75mg/week and in the end 5mg/week,

Proviron: Again gradually increasing and decreasing but not sure the about the dosage at the moment,

Tamoxifen: Again gradually increasing and decreasing but not sure the about the dosage at the moment,

After 9 weeks, 2 weeks PCT.

Any and all advice is much appreciated.

Thanks

 

[looking to lean]

Im near the same boat as you. new to the AAS area. what I can say from being around here a few months is you are looking at too many compounds for your first cycle.

Most here will tell you to keep it simple on your first cycle. Test only at 500mg/ml weekly injections for 12 weeks. with PCT of course. PCT being the most important part.

-no need to ramp up, use whatever you are going to use at a specific dose right from the start.

-use too many compounds and you wont being able to figure out what AAS are working best for you. try one the first time (probably test), then worry about multiple compounds on your next cycle.

-2 weeks PCT is probably not enough. 3-4 is probably 'safer'. u dont want to lose what you have just gained right?

-Nolva as your only PCT may not be enough. what about an AI during your cycle?

-READ READ READ. and when you are doing reading... go to bed, think about everything you just learned. wake up and read more... repeat for months..... years even.... THEN consider what AAS to implement.

this is all from one newb to the next.... once you start reading the HUGE amount of info that EF has to offer, you will become addicted to the knowledge you are taking in. I know I have. I have all my AAS ready for me when my mind catches up to my eagerness to juice.

Best of luck.......... but dont let luck have anything to do with it.

 

[raam]

After some research and talk with a friend in the gym I decided to start doing my first cycle;

For the last 12 years I have lifted regularly and run twice a week as a part of my daily rotine. I'm using Whey, creatine and sometimes BCAA.

I am 35 yrs old, 6'3, 227 lbs, not know exactly but 14% BF estimated.

I never decided to use until now, trained so many years without knowing what is going on on the other side. I dont wanna go away without trying and seeing the results of steroids. If I wont try I will never know my limits...

My friend suggested the following;

9 week cycle;

Sustanon: Starting with 500mg sust/week gradually increasing to 750mg/week and in the end 250mg/week,

Primabolan: Starting with 100mg primo/week gradually increasing to 300mg/week and in the end 100mg/week,

Dianabol: Starting with 15mg dball/week gradually increasing to 75mg/week and in the end 5mg/week,

Proviron: Again gradually increasing and decreasing but not sure the about the dosage at the moment,

Tamoxifen: Again gradually increasing and decreasing but not sure the about the dosage at the moment,

After 9 weeks, 2 weeks PCT.

Any and all advice is much appreciated.

Thanks

You have a solid base to start from by training naturaly for so many years. My suggetion would be to change your cycle some.

If you must run sust, do 500mg. a week for 10-12 weeker with no taper. Shoot EOD. Drop the primo, it's expensive and 300mg. is the bare minimum. An oral for first cycle is iffy. Don't get to cocky with you lifts and injure yourself. 25-30 mg for 3-4 weeks. Drop the proviron, you need a better anabolic. Nolva for pct 3 weeks after last shot. 40mg. week1, 20mg. week 2-4.

Here's how I'd run it.

week 1-4 dbol 25mg.
week 1-12 sust 500mg (test E would be better)
week 1-12 EQ or deca 400mg.

week 15-19 nolva (like I said above)

that's it.

 

[bilter]

l2L called it right. Ramping (both up and down is a waste of time). 500mg pw sust, with 20mg pd of nolva during (some prefer adex as an AI during cycle). PCT of 40mg nolva PD for 1 week then 20mg PD for 3 more. start pct 2 weeks after last shot. Proviron is not necessary but will make the test a little bit more effective, plus it will tell you if you are prone to mpb ;-). I would never run dbol more than 4 weeks and then just to kick off a cycle, but again its not needed here for cycle #1

 

[drrman]

After some research and talk with a friend in the gym I decided to start doing my first cycle;

For the last 12 years I have lifted regularly and run twice a week as a part of my daily rotine. I'm using Whey, creatine and sometimes BCAA.

I am 35 yrs old, 6'3, 227 lbs, not know exactly but 14% BF estimated.

I never decided to use until now, trained so many years without knowing what is going on on the other side. I dont wanna go away without trying and seeing the results of steroids. If I wont try I will never know my limits...

My friend suggested the following;

9 week cycle;

Sustanon: Starting with 500mg sust/week gradually increasing to 750mg/week and in the end 250mg/week,

Primabolan: Starting with 100mg primo/week gradually increasing to 300mg/week and in the end 100mg/week,

Dianabol: Starting with 15mg dball/week gradually increasing to 75mg/week and in the end 5mg/week,

Proviron: Again gradually increasing and decreasing but not sure the about the dosage at the moment,

Tamoxifen: Again gradually increasing and decreasing but not sure the about the dosage at the moment,

After 9 weeks, 2 weeks PCT.

Any and all advice is much appreciated.

Thanks

well, just to get started, Do not taper off the test in the end....not a good idea

next, 100mg-300mg primo is a complete and utter waste of time and juice, either up it to at least 600mg all the way or don't use it, and do NOT taper it up and down like that

actually do NOT taper up the dball like that either, and do not taper it down......and 75mg/day is WAY too much for you to be taking in any given single day.

do this

750mg sust/week first two weeks
500mg sust/week last 8 weeks
35-40mg dball/day first 4 weeks

and you can take proviron at 50mg/day throughout, would NOT taper it up and down either, and for the nolvadex only take it if you need it

now you need to get an anti estrogen in there and run it the entire time also

 

[immortalis]

These guys are pointing you in the right direction bro.

Congrats btw on the solid natural base you've built. Youre gonna blow your mind about 7-8 weeks into this cycle

Enjoy and be safe

 

[littleb]

^^ i agree with what drrman said bro, only thing i would personally change is i would run the sust at 500mg a week for the whole 10 weeks.. for a first cycle should be real good gains if diet and training in line...

 

[ggozen]

Thank you all
So I get the point that I will not taper up and down and I should research more and give attention to PCT.

raam
It is almost impossible for me to find Equipose or Deca. They are not sold in the pharmacies in my country. Sust,primo and the others are cheap and easy to get.

drrman
If primo is better to use at doses 600mg/week I can add to the cycle anyway.What do you suggest?
As anti estrogen I will use Tamoxifen for the entire time without tapering.As a note, I think I should learn more about PCT.

 

[blut wump]

As the man said, Nolvadex (Tamoxifen) should only be used as needed for gyno effects. You need an aromatase inhibitor not a serm to control excess oestrogen on-cycle. Look into AIFM, aromasin, arimidex.

 

[drrman]

Thank you all
So I get the point that I will not taper up and down and I should research more and give attention to PCT.

raam
It is almost impossible for me to find Equipose or Deca. They are not sold in the pharmacies in my country. Sust,primo and the others are cheap and easy to get.

drrman
If primo is better to use at doses 600mg/week I can add to the cycle anyway.What do you suggest?
As anti estrogen I will use Tamoxifen for the entire time without tapering.As a note, I think I should learn more about PCT.

blut wump nailed it......nolvadex will jsut target the breast tissue

as for primo, i wouldn't even use it for a first cycle if it were me, its way too expensive, its very mild also, and can have a bad effect on the hairline

i'd go with deca or eq

 

[instant.muscle]

dude for ur first cycle take one compound 2 c if u like it or how u react, if u take sust primo dbol ur gonna have no idea which worked well for u and if u experience sides u wont know which gave it 2 u, just my opinion

 

[Wulfgar]

I said it once and Ill say it again. Deca only 200 mg a week...for 8 weeks..no PCT...just great deiting is all a AAs novice really needs to yield great results.
It is all about growth thresholds really, if right now your body is capable of absoribing and utizlizing a shot glass worth of AAS, why dump a gallons worth in it? obviously the shot glass will fill up but the rest is overkill and just manifests itself in terms of sides.

remember, muscle fiber built using AAS over time "gains" androgen receptor site affinity meaning that a muscle exposed to AS for longer periods can adapt and utilize more AAS than can a novice.
clincally Ive seen guys get EXACTLY the same if not better results with less or no sides using a deca only cycle thier first time out compared to using test and an oral. Problem is alot of nvices subscribe to the more is better philosophy and get so over eager to dump truckloads of chemicals in thier systems they end up blowing through several wonderful growth producing thresholds of Low dose AAS use.

good luck in whatever endeavor you undertake my friend... and welcome!!

 

[bilter]

Wulfgar, no PCT???? even that low dose of deca for 8 weeks will shut him down.......interesting recomendation. I do know you know what you are talking about so why no PCT? I would certainly keep the proviron on hand if he chose this route just in case the dreaded deca dick rears its ugly head..

I take nolva throughout cycles not soley for combating gyno but also because it has been shown to have a fovroable effect on lipid profiles. I realize I may seem somewhat obsessed with this subject but I also believe the affects AAS has on blood lipids is ignore far too often.

 

[littleguy]

Totally agree with Wulfgar, low doses to start in this game and jump them up in the future.
Way better in the long run for health and affinity.
200 mg deca per week will work on a newbie with favorable results.

 

[thelion2005]

Sent you a PM.
Keep it simple. One or two max.
Add an anti-e like amiridex.
PCT for 4 weeks.

 

[ggozen]

So much information and experience in the site. So what about the following as a first cycle;

week 1-8 deca 400mg/week,
week 1-8 sust 250mg/week,
week 10 nolva 40mg/day
week 11-13 nolva 20mg/day

I have one more question. What do you suggest? Using AI-aromatase inhibitor( Aromasin, arimidex) or nolva (20mg/day) during the cycle ? Or neither?

 

[blut wump]

Some suggest Nolva helps with lipid profiles, others suggest that it has inherent dangers of its own. Look at it as a gyno-prevention ancillary. If you don't have signs of gyno or impending gyno then don't use it on-cycle.

AIFM from the AF-store is becoming very popular here and is a good cost-effective solution. Arimidex is popular but does little for me and, it seems, for many others. Aromasin is also a good solution. AIFM and aromasin can also be used right through PCT.

 

[drrman]

So much information and experience in the site. So what about the following as a first cycle;

week 1-8 deca 400mg/week,
week 1-8 sust 250mg/week,
week 10 nolva 40mg/day
week 11-13 nolva 20mg/day

I have one more question. What do you suggest? Using AI-aromatase inhibitor( Aromasin, arimidex) or nolva (20mg/day) during the cycle ? Or neither?

yeh, i would use some anti estrogen..........and i can tell you this bro, a good rule of thumb is to use at least as much or a bit more test than deca.......i would seriously think about upping that test dosage to 500mg/wek for sure, if not drop the deca to 200, but i would up the test if it were me

and get some arimidex, 1mg/day to start with, or you may want to try the AIFM from teh AF store, hear good things about it

 

[ggozen]

yeh, i would use some anti estrogen..........and i can tell you this bro, a good rule of thumb is to use at least as much or a bit more test than deca.......i would seriously think about upping that test dosage to 500mg/wek for sure, if not drop the deca to 200, but i would up the test if it were me

and get some arimidex, 1mg/day to start with, or you may want to try the AIFM from teh AF store, hear good things about it

I never knew that should use at least as much or a bit more test than deca. So I go with sust 500mg/week along with 400 deca per week.

You mean 1mg/day arimidex (or aromasin) throughout all the 8 week cycle, right?

Some suggest Nolva helps with lipid profiles, others suggest that it has inherent dangers of its own. Look at it as a gyno-prevention ancillary. If you don't have signs of gyno or impending gyno then don't use it on-cycle.

AIFM from the AF-store is becoming very popular here and is a good cost-effective solution. Arimidex is popular but does little for me and, it seems, for many others. Aromasin is also a good solution. AIFM and aromasin can also be used right through PCT.

Do you mean using Aromasin through all the cycle and also through PCT.

 

[blut wump]

Aromasin and AIFM are each suitable for on-cycle and post-cycle. Nolva clashes with arimidex which effectively downregulates its effectiveness. I'm sure others can tell you more of the unsuitability of 'dex for PCT.

 

[drrman]

I never knew that should use at least as much or a bit more test than deca. So I go with sust 500mg/week along with 400 deca per week.

You mean 1mg/day arimidex (or aromasin) throughout all the 8 week cycle, right?



Do you mean using Aromasin through all the cycle and also through PCT.

500mg sust and 400mg deca was my first cycle exactly.....well i did add dball first four weeks......and i wouldn't go back and change anything with it........i recommend that to most anyone who i think is ready for it

 

[jagerbombme]

use AIFM bro, if you read here, it's become the most popular and imo the best. although i've only used it, alot of people on here have used adex and aromasin and say aifm is the shit. go with that.

my brother ran deca only cycle first cycle, no pct, no anti e or anti arom and got huge with no deca dick. but others have got it first time. second cycle he did he got horrific backne that left him with severe scarring, it's going away, but still.

which that info and the info i found here led me to the cycle i am on

test e 250mg ew 1-10
var 60mg ed week 1-5
aifm for gyno, bloat
hcg 5000iu over 2.5 weeks weeks 6,7,8


pct
hcg 5000iu over 2.5 weeks weeks 12,13,14
tribulus pills from nutrition store
aifm to control hcg estro sides


straight forward simple cycle, good luck with what you do

i like my test boners, all 20 of them a day

 

[Ulter]

The first advice you got was bad. As was pointed out, tapering is wrong and a very old school method of cycle. It has not been in use in many years. Not since Aromatase Inhibitors and Clomid hit the scene. (for those of you who are newbies or less than 10 years cycling, tapering was used instead of pct)

The other bad advice I see here is telling you to use Deca. You should use test based only AS your first time out. Test/eq is good for instance. Test and Deca are very different and so together they are great. But not the first time. If you get gyno symptoms you won't know which one it's from. So you have to go back and try each individually to find out. Using test only and no gyno would mean you're all clear to use test again. Then add Deca next time and see what happens.

You do need an Aromatase Inhibitor (AI) and I suggest as others here did, AIFM. Use it throughout the cycle and PCT.

 

[ggozen]

The first advice you got was bad. As was pointed out, tapering is wrong and a very old school method of cycle. It has not been in use in many years. Not since Aromatase Inhibitors and Clomid hit the scene. (for those of you who are newbies or less than 10 years cycling, tapering was used instead of pct)

The other bad advice I see here is telling you to use Deca. You should use test based only AS your first time out. Test/eq is good for instance. Test and Deca are very different and so together they are great. But not the first time. If you get gyno symptoms you won't know which one it's from. So you have to go back and try each individually to find out. Using test only and no gyno would mean you're all clear to use test again. Then add Deca next time and see what happens.

You do need an Aromatase Inhibitor (AI) and I suggest as others here did, AIFM. Use it throughout the cycle and PCT.

I got your concern. What about the doses?500 mg/week sust or eq.
Also one more question. There is 2 week interval between the cycle and the PCT. Shall I use Aromatase Inhibitor (AI) in that period too?

 

[drrman]

I got your concern. What about the doses?500 mg/week sust or eq.
Also one more question. There is 2 week interval between the cycle and the PCT. Shall I use Aromatase Inhibitor (AI) in that period too?

yes, you will need to use an AI all the way through your PCT

 

[Ulter]

I got your concern. What about the doses?500 mg/week sust or eq.
Also one more question. There is 2 week interval between the cycle and the PCT. Shall I use Aromatase Inhibitor (AI) in that period too?

500mg of test and 500mg of eq
Like he said, use your AI throughout the entire cycle and PCT.

 

[jagerbombme]

is it two weeks before start pct with sust?????? or should it be started a little earlier?

BUMP