Do I need an anti-aroma with this stack?

[Smokescreen]

I'm currently taking 125mgs of Test Cyp per week *HRT dose*. Alongside ONE HUNDRED Mg's of Proviron per day *Zero key doesn't work on my keyboard atm lol*

Also taking Two Hundred mg's of DHEA *again this is HRT related* per day *this brings my DHEA levels to the very top but NOT out of range*

Been on the Proviron already for 5 weeks. And as of now I'm starting to get a bit of gyno. It's more on one nipple than the other. The other is barely anything but I do feel a tiny micro bit of gyno starting to form. And this always happens to me a few weeks into proviron use. And I'm NOT the only one this happens too. I've read here on Elite of this happening to a few bros. Where they start to get gyno from proviron after a few weeks.

Always read that Proviron works as an anti-aroma. Inhibiting estrogen from forming. I call total BULLSHIT on this theory. I get blood work 2-3 times a year. And I'm a very frequent user of Proviron. And NEVER EVER once has proviron lowered my E levels. NOT ONCE!!! So I have NO idea why anyone says it works like an anti-aroma.

Anywhos! If that was the case. I woudn't be getting gyno like I am now. Now would I?

The only drugs that lower my E is anti-aromas like Adex, Aromasin and Letro. But usually when I take those drugs my mood tends to become flat and dull. So that is why I usually don't take anti-aromas unless I truly must! Like now would be a good time! LOL

I'm thinking on stopping the proviron for now. And moving onto Masteron at Two Hundred Mg's per week. Because the last time I tried masteron at FOUR hundred mg's per week. I couldn't sleep for shit that whole first week I was on the stuff! And also bumping up my Test Cyp dose from 125 mgs to Two Hundred per week divided into 2 weekly doses of ONE Hundred.

The question is.....

If I start taking Masteron. Do I still need to use an anti-aroma? Like I do now while I'm on Proviron? Or will Masteron be suffice enough to lower my E in order to stop this gyno from progressing any further? Or at least STOP any further E from forming or increasing?

 

[RickO'Shea]

Man I have no Idea on this one, but I'll do some research Carth. As far as the Proviron is concerned, maybe it's like having an allergy (not saying you do at all), but maybe it's like that....meaning maybe for you, It's actually quite sensitive to estrogen whereas with others it actually reduces it. Kinda like I don't get estrogen problems....but I have that super sensitivity to prolactin....maybe I'm way off base here, but who knows...

 

[moya]

possibly...
mast takes place of an AI for me on at least 350 test... but remember, everyone is different... there is no way you are going to know unless you try...

dropping the proviron may be a better option, then you can see if the gyno symptoms continue and work from there...

btw, if youre lazy like me you could still type out 100, just like this, 1OO...

 

[XMAN.]

possibly...
mast takes place of an AI for me on at least 350 test... but remember, everyone is different... there is no way you are going to know unless you try...

dropping the proviron may be a better option, then you can see if the gyno symptoms continue and work from there...

btw, if youre lazy like me you could still type out 100, just like this, 1OO...

agreed, u need to try things first to know, mast usually helps, and maybe ur prog. or prolac. r a bit high, maybe u need some dostinex instead or a small dose combo od dos. and arom. (u know i always take arom. at 12.5mg and dos. 0.25mg both twice a week for maintenance and never had a prob. , the real prob. is that ppl tend to imitate each other and start with high doses with ancillaries when they can benefit from a much lower dose specially the ones on hrt cuz it's already a low dose of test that need few to maintain a healthy balance.
and yes proviron don't do shit for gyno once it starts it mayb boost test on a cycle but never felt that much of estro. blocking, i always had to drop the test till i get an AI on hand same thing with deca and prolac tried proviron winny mast and all dht's and didn't do shit it was dostinex that helped only. that's me and everybody is different, so at the end it's ur own experience that will tell u, but always start with the lowest dose with everything and experiment things.

 

[RADAR]

Yes You do thats the purpose is to solidify gains so you don't loose them

 

[caribeman]

Proviron did nothing for me estrogen I still needed to take adex x 3 per week. It did increase the size of my loads for some reason.... but that was it.

 

[XMAN.]

Proviron did nothing for me estrogen I still needed to take adex x 3 per week. It did increase the size of my loads for some reason.... but that was it.

yeah that's the reason i like it other than it's libido boosting, but i always get acne from highly androgenic compounds.

 

[Para_Shoot]

Man, I think DHEA at that dose is causing water retention and gyno symptoms. I personally think taking it is bullshit. I was taking DHEA at 100mg a day and I notice water retention and excess estrogen sides. I stopped taking it and shed the water. Read the back of the label on the bottle. Causes estrogenic side effects. I am also with you on the proviron thing. My view on it was that since proviron frees up bound test, then you have all this free test that starts to aromatize.

 

[sony190]

i would have to agree with Xman and some of the bros here, from my experience (still going through it) the only thing that has made a difference has been letro and dostinex, if your concerned with the gyno (who wouldnt be) i would try low doses of those, i have ran high doses of Mast and other than leaning me out a bit and giving me acne i believe it is not strong enough as a stand alone aroma, also proviron is weak in this regard also, more of a precontest drying out compound but again a poor choice for aroma hope this helps

 

[sony190]

Test is Test and it aromatizes just the same even at low doses even on hrt

 

[Zyglamail]

125mg/wk should put you mid normal lab range so generally speaking I would lean toward an AI not being needed. Ideally labs showing your E would determine if and how you should take.

 

[Nelson Montana]

Using an anti aromatase in general isn't a bad idea for older guys, but usually a natty anti e like POST CYCLE is enough. If you're getting symptoms, some dex wouldn't hurt. I add 1/4 mg twice a week (along with some POST CYCLE) to my HRT.

 

[moya]

Man, I think DHEA at that dose is causing water retention and gyno symptoms. I personally think taking it is bullshit. I was taking DHEA at 100mg a day and I notice water retention and excess estrogen sides. I stopped taking it and shed the water. Read the back of the label on the bottle. Causes estrogenic side effects. I am also with you on the proviron thing. My view on it was that since proviron frees up bound test, then you have all this free test that starts to aromatize.

i was thinking this as well... just wasnt so sure of myself to post it... and too lazy to look it up lol...

 

[Smokescreen]

possibly...
mast takes place of an AI for me on at least 350 test... but remember, everyone is different... there is no way you are going to know unless you try...

dropping the proviron may be a better option, then you can see if the gyno symptoms continue and work from there...

btw, if youre lazy like me you could still type out 100, just like this, 1OO...

My god! You're right! I can type it out like that. 1OO

LOL...thanks bro! LOL

 

[Smokescreen]

Yes You do thats the purpose is to solidify gains so you don't loose them

So if I do...then Masteron really isn't an anti-E. Correct?

 

[Smokescreen]

Man, I think DHEA at that dose is causing water retention and gyno symptoms. I personally think taking it is bullshit. I was taking DHEA at 100mg a day and I notice water retention and excess estrogen sides. I stopped taking it and shed the water. Read the back of the label on the bottle. Causes estrogenic side effects. I am also with you on the proviron thing. My view on it was that since proviron frees up bound test, then you have all this free test that starts to aromatize.

Been taking the DHEA at that dose for many months now. And didn't have a problem. Not until I add Proviron. Then this shit happens a few weeks down the road.

You may be right with what you said. In that case...will Masteron do the same thing? Free up Test? If so...then me switching over now to Masteron is just going to do that SAME thing proviron is doing atm. And for that...I AM going to need a AI.

 

[Smokescreen]

Using an anti aromatase in general isn't a bad idea for older guys, but usually a natty anti e like POST CYCLE is enough. If you're getting symptoms, some dex wouldn't hurt. I add 1/4 mg twice a week (along with some POST CYCLE) to my HRT.

I kind of fear using an AI. Last time I used Aromasin and it brought my E levels right to the middle. I felt kind of dull, flat and boring. I lost joy and pleasure for things. And became unmotivated as well.

 

[C.K.]

It gave me acne and bloat but I contributed that to the uneven spikes since the half life of proviron is only a couple hours

 

[Nelson Montana]

I kind of fear using an AI. Last time I used Aromasin and it brought my E levels right to the middle. I felt kind of dull, flat and boring. I lost joy and pleasure for things. And became unmotivated as well.

You need to find the right dosage, that's all.

 

[Smokescreen]

You need to find the right dosage, that's all.

I was taking 25mgs per day of liquid research Aromasin. And after being on that dose (i'm sure that shit was underdosed) for 8 weeks. It dropped my E2 down from 72 to 30.

What went wrong?

The dose?

The E2 Level?

Or the Anti-aroma drug?



Can't be that the dose was wrong. Or else how would it have brought my E2 from 72 down 30? It's not like 30 was too low. It was right smack in the middle.

Or was it because I was using Aromasin over Adex?

 

[XMAN.]

You need to find the right dosage, that's all.

exactly, most of the time all i take is 12.5mg arom twice per week just one tab per week and it's enough for me even with 500mg test.

 

[Nelson Montana]

I was taking 25mgs per day of liquid research Aromasin. And after being on that dose (i'm sure that shit was underdosed) for 8 weeks. It dropped my E2 down from 72 to 30.

What went wrong?

The dose?

The E2 Level?

Or the Anti-aroma drug?



Can't be that the dose was wrong. Or else how would it have brought my E2 from 72 down 30? It's not like 30 was too low. It was right smack in the middle.

Or was it because I was using Aromasin over Adex?

Well, I'd never trust that liquid shit, but nevertheless, 30 is fine -- still a little high actually. Are you saying that having your e at 30 instead of 72 made you feel worse? That doesn't make sense. It had to be another side effect.

 

[Smokescreen]

exactly, most of the time all i take is 12.5mg arom twice per week just one tab per week and it's enough for me even with 500mg test.

I'm sure you are taking the real thing? Because when I had REAL Aromasin. All I needed on 300mgs of Test per week was 6.25mgs of Aromasin (quarter tab) PER DAY. And this brought my E down from 78 down to 47.

Since I'm using liquid research crap. And I know that stuff is underdosed or poor quality. And since I was going to get bloodwork in 2 months. I figure I just use the full dose of 25mgs per day. And then get myself tested out.

From 72 down 30 with 25mgs of liquid research crap. Im sure if I had the REAL thing. I probably would've wiped out my E.

 

[Smokescreen]

Well, I'd never trust that liquid shit, but nevertheless, 30 is fine -- still a little high actually. Are you saying that having your e at 30 instead of 72 made you feel worse? That doesn't make sense. It had to be another side effect.

Nope. I swear brother. It wasn't something else. One week into using Aromasin I noticed I became more calmer. Less energetic and amped up.

By week 2, I didn't want to play competitive online multiplayer matches on Xbox live.

By week 3, I became flat, dull and boring. Didn't care about playing video games. Watching TV. Going out to movies. Nothing! At the gym I became way less aggressive.

And it just stayed like that all the way until week 8. Then I got my blood work results back. Saw my E down to 30. Doc was very happy with my E levels being there and said that it was perfect being there.

But I didn't feel so great. So I stopped the Aromasin and within 1.5 weeks I began to feel better.

 

[Smokescreen]

Quote:
Originally Posted by B Hildebrandt
The hormone neurotransmitter connection is:

Testosterone increases dopamine.

Estrogen increases norepinephrine. When E2 levels get too high you can get anxiety and panic attacks. This is from the flight (fear) reaction of increased norepinephrine levels.

Progesterone increases serotonin. Men aren't in need of progesterone as often as women, which is also why serotonergic anti-depressants like SSRI's (Prozac) tend to not work very well on men.
you are correct by e2 also increases serotonin, gaba, and acetylcholine in the body.

 

[Smokescreen]

Hormones Cortisol DHEA Testosterone Progesterone Estrogen

 

[Nelson Montana]

Nope. I swear brother. It wasn't something else. One week into using Aromasin I noticed I became more calmer. Less energetic and amped up.

By week 2, I didn't want to play competitive online multiplayer matches on Xbox live.

By week 3, I became flat, dull and boring. Didn't care about playing video games. Watching TV. Going out to movies. Nothing! At the gym I became way less aggressive.

And it just stayed like that all the way until week 8. Then I got my blood work results back. Saw my E down to 30. Doc was very happy with my E levels being there and said that it was perfect being there.

But I didn't feel so great. So I stopped the Aromasin and within 1.5 weeks I began to feel better.

Then it obviously wasn't your e LEVEL. I'd still go with a low dose dex-- REAL dex, and a supplemental natty anti e.

 

[Smokescreen]

Then it obviously wasn't your e LEVEL. I'd still go with a low dose dex-- REAL dex, and a supplemental natty anti e.

Why a supplement natty anti-e for if I'll already be using Adex? Doesn't that just seem like money wasted?

 

[XMAN.]

i'm with nelson i don't think it was ur e2 drop that caused u that, i think the substance in ur liquid aromasin had something to do with that , it's not real exemestane maybe it's another substance that have an anti-e proprieties or some low dose exemestane mixed with something else and that's what caused u these sides.

 

[Smokescreen]

i'm with nelson i don't think it was ur e2 drop that caused u that, i think the substance in ur liquid aromasin had something to do with that , it's not real exemestane maybe it's another substance that have an anti-e proprieties or some low dose exemestane mixed with something else and that's what caused u these sides.

Shit! I totally forgot to mention the following. All this happened while I was on Aromasin from a place called promedications. (can I say this?)

I was using half a tab per day for 4 weeks. That is when I ran out (still feeling shitty). And switched over to liquid research aromasin. And decided to take 25mgs and not 12.5mgs. Because I know how much these places underdose their shit.

And then by the end of week 7 I get blood work done. By end of week 8 I get my results and see my E dropped from 70 to 30 (right smack in the middle). Doc praises me! Says that's the healthiest spot for where E should really be.

But I said TO HELL WITH THIS! I got off the Aromasin and began to feel better by 1.5 weeks.