Desperatly Seeking Muscle!

[dizzygrinch]

Hello, Im new here, and upfront I want to apologize if I post in the wrong section, or perhaps ask questions that may have been asked many times before. First, my main goal is to gain muscles. I am small framed, only 5 ft. tall, but I have a pretty high bodyfat percentage, I think. I am 35 yrs old, have had 3 kids, and I think my metabolism has slowed way down. I have been lifting, not competitive or anything like that, several years ago. I have started up again about 6 months ago, but just not gaining muscles. I do have a hard time eating enough, so I do have to rely on a whey protien 2 or 3 times a day. I supplement with creatine and glutemine, but I am looking for other supplements to perhaps boost things along. Im not ready for steriods yet, would like to try all options first. Oh, and I started taking DHEA, but was wondering what other supplements would help me along. Thanks so much for any help!!

 

[RADAR]

Hello, Im new here, and upfront I want to apologize if I post in the wrong section, or perhaps ask questions that may have been asked many times before. First, my main goal is to gain muscles. I am small framed, only 5 ft. tall, but I have a pretty high bodyfat percentage, I think. I am 35 yrs old, have had 3 kids, and I think my metabolism has slowed way down. I have been lifting, not competitive or anything like that, several years ago. I have started up again about 6 months ago, but just not gaining muscles. I do have a hard time eating enough, so I do have to rely on a whey protien 2 or 3 times a day. I supplement with creatine and glutemine, but I am looking for other supplements to perhaps boost things along. Im not ready for steriods yet, would like to try all options first. Oh, and I started taking DHEA, but was wondering what other supplements would help me along. Thanks so much for any help!!

first of all you need to learn to eat the right foods, and do cardio to get that body fat percentage down,fat hides muscle an excellent supplement would be cardio breeze or thermorexin from the af store

https://www.anafit.com/shop/


RADAR

 

[Daisy_Girl]

Welcome.

Post up your SPECIFIC diet and training program. All the supplements in the world will not do anything if these two things are not 100% on target. Supplements - glutamine, creatine, etc - are simply that .... SUPPLEMENTS to a good diet and training program. They do not take the place of, nor do they counteract a poor diet or training.

If you post EXACTLY what you eat everyday and what you do for training, we can tweak it and give suggestions on what you could be doing differently.

 

[Sassy69]

Hey dg - welcome to the boards! Yes! Definitely post up your diet so we can talk about some specific things that will get you started. DIET is 80% of your ability to reach a fitness goal. It seems like there should be pills you can take to help things, but there really aren't. Trust me, I've tried them ALL. Supplements are nothing more than SUPPLEMENTS to an already well-established diet & training regimen. It does take a bit of time to get things goign to see significant change, but it all needs to be tight and consistent, with DIET being your number one focus, training next and cardio as appropriate to your goals & body. I can attest to this - I have been lifting since I was 16 - I'm 40 now. But I didnt' actually get the whole diet & training thing to work until I started competition in 2000 and put the two together on a focused and tight program. I'm not saying you need to go into competition mode to accomplish anythng, but the concept is the same - takes DIET and TRAINING to accomplish your goals. Of the two, DIET is the MUST. To illustrate, if you aren't eating enough, particularly protein, you aren't providing the ingredients to build muscle. If you aren't eating enough carb then you aren't providing your body the fuel it needs for energy and it may be looking to your existing muscle to burn energy. Any of these and any combination of these will defeat the whole purpose of training if you don't eat right for what you are trying to accomplish. And contrary to popular belief, you have to EAT to LOSE BODYFAT.

RE: Steroids -- if someone tells you that X steroid or Y drug will make you lose bodyfat and lean out, tell them to go fuck themselves. (Or I will do this at your request.) This is often the shortcut recommendation guys will give to a lady who is walking around the gym looking for some way to start losing weight. THEY DON"T WORK THE SAME FOR WOMEN AS FOR MEN. And also, because you are totally new to this, have not established a tight diet & training regimen and are higher bodyfat, steroids are not anything to even bother considering.

 

[musclemom]

Oh, and I started taking DHEA, but was wondering what other supplements would help me along. Thanks so much for any help!!

I'm not crazy about a relatively young, assumedly premenopausal woman taking DHEA ... it's not going to do much for you, honestly. Listen to these smart, savvy folks here! I'm a newbie putz myself when it comes to training and diet, but supplements I know a bit. You really have to bear in mind, just because it's available over the counter in health food stores does not make it harmless; DHEA can have some very major, permanent sides.

Diet is such a major, major factor. It's almost like you don't believe it until you see it in action, though (been there, done that). The quality of the food, the proportion of carbs to protein, it makes all the difference in the world.

Just a thought to keep in mind with regards to training, particularly to gain muscle, don't dismiss the value of classic compound moves done heavy, i.e., bench, squat, deadlifts, pushups, pullups, pulldowns. They're hard, they work. I've heard about it, and seen it happen in my own body, you can be doing things like curls and so forth and not really seeing growth, but once you add in compound moves, bam, your whole body starts shifting.

 

[dizzygrinch]

Hello, thanks so much for the replies. It seems obvious to me now that I really need to work on my diet. I can tell you right now, I dont eat enough. I think my thinking is wrong, because I was trying to eat less to lose weight. I have a lot of food sensitivities, so I dont have much to choose from. For example, today I ate:

whey protein drink upon waking, cup of coffee

couple of hours later, 1 piece of chicken, peas, baked potatoe

then all hell broke loose, my dog died, didnt have much of an appetite, but did eat cottage cheese couple of hours ago.
So today was a really fucked up day, pardon my french. My usual day is:

protien drink and coffee in the am upon wakeing, Im allergic to eggs and oats, and extremely sensitive to wheat. Breakfast is hard to choose from. couple of hours later I try to eat peanut butter, sometimes if Im staying home and not going out, Ill have it on wheat bread, then couple of hours later another whey protien drink, then dinner Ill usually have a steak, or , you know it just dawned on me as I am typing (it really puts it into pespective) I dont eat enough! I eat fruit only couple times a week, if even that much, veggies and salad, about the same! I live off of peanut butter, cottage cheese, and whey drinks. oh, I do snack on cashews, I share them with my bird! someone needs to kick my butt, I cant believe my family and I are alive, I dont cook hardly enough. Thank god for school lunches lol! My training is now 4 days a week, I do try to lift as heavy as I can, but I find I get tired to quick, so I end up slacking in the end. I run out of energy. Well, I think I answered my own questions here a bit, so I guess I should really put some effort into my diet. Man, I suck. But, Im gonna change!!

 

[Sassy69]

Yep looks like you are answering your own questions. To help you get started on the right track start at the "Are you new to EF Ladies Board - START HERE" sticky at the top of the board.

To help keep your thinking clear, as you 've seen by listing out what you eat (i.e. your habits), you should do the exercise of entering what you eat into a food counts program like www.fitday.com (free account online) and see what you are really eating (or not eating).

Obviously you aren't even eating enough to fuel your 4 days workout routine, so you are actually putting yourself further at deficit because your body is going to turn to your muscle for energy when it isn't getting enough to fuel its activities ---> skinny fat and losing strength in muscles.

Let me give you an example of what happens when you don't eat enough --- my mom. She's 5'5" about 140-150 lb and was 40% bodyfat. She walks 5 miles / day EVERY DAY OF THE YEAR (regardless of weather & lives in N. Minnesota), does a step aerobics class at least 3 x/ week and has recently started doing some resistance training. She's 64 this yr and geneally in killer shape. HOWEVER, she doesn't eat enough protein. She & my dad are real big on fruit & stuff, but I'd bet she eats 2-3 servings of chicken/day. Guess what - her knees pop out of joint. Why? Cuz she doesn't have enough muscle to hold them in place. How weird is that.

But she can't figure out why she's 40% bf w/ all teh stuff she does. She doesnt' eat enough protein to preserve her muscle and she only very recently started doing resistance training to do the process of muscle tear down & build up. She's basically a cardio bunny. And she yells at ME for eating so much protein. Which of us has a 15" bicep??

So read that sticky very closely. THe Shadow's Project is a great diet to follow, or you can also take a look at the "Body for Life" book by Bill Phillips. You don't have to follow the trainign, but the diet is a great intro to the fundamentals of nutrition that I think is your biggest issue. There are ways to work around your food sensitivities -- I don't eat carbs other than potatos (so no wheat issues). My protein sources are chicken, turkey, eggs, steak, bison, tilapia, cod, orange roughy. YOu can skip the eggs easily. I use absolutely no dairy because I have no lactose tolerance from following competition diet for the last 9 months. You can look to some of the soy & tofu products possibly for cheese, etc.

I also think its important for you to get some good starchy carbs in you for energy. It looks like you follow somethign close to the Atkins diet (i.e. high fat, low carb) - which can be great for a while, but it absolutely sucks as a long term diet.

 

[velvett]

Hello, thanks so much for the replies. It seems obvious to me now that I really need to work on my diet. I can tell you right now, I dont eat enough. I think my thinking is wrong, because I was trying to eat less to lose weight. I have a lot of food sensitivities, so I dont have much to choose from.

protien drink and coffee in the am upon wakeing, Im allergic to eggs and oats, and extremely sensitive to wheat.

How are you with dairy?

 

[musclemom]

... protien drink and coffee in the am upon wakeing, Im allergic to eggs and oats, and extremely sensitive to wheat... Breakfast is hard to choose from. couple of hours later I try to eat peanut butter, sometimes if Im staying home and not going out, Ill have it on wheat bread,

First off, I'm so terribly sorry you lost your dog My pets are my furry kids, my sympathies so don't be too hard on yourself for a few days!

Now, when things have settled ... speaking as a celiac (intolerant of gluten) for over five years, if you already KNOW you're sensitive to wheat, stay away from it, seriously. You aren't doing yourself a favor by frequently eating something you have some problems with. Save eating it for really special occasions. I'd kill to be able to have a chocolate chip cookie just once a year.

Okay, there are a lot of other breakfast cereal grains that substitute for oatmeal and are wheat free: buckwheat comes to mind immediately. There is a slow cooking variety called groats and now a quick cooking variety that reminds me quite a bit of cream of wheat. Rice is good substitute and there are a lot of varieties (if you go into a health food store), that are higher protein and more satisfying than plain old white Minute Rice. A quick, easy high protein breakfast: add about 3 ounces of cooked white chicken to a half cup of cooked brown rice, about +/- 300 calories, just under 30 grams of protein, 22 carbs (numbers depend on the rice you use). You could add some broccoli or other veggies you have lying around.

Breakfast doesn't HAVE to be oatmeal or eggs, and those of us with food issues are forced to be creative.

A word about peanut butter ... man I love the stuff, I'm a total freak for it, but I just can't get around the fact that it's really not all THAT high protein for the calories (1/4 c. of 1% Friendship cottage cheese = 45 calories, 8 gm protein, 1 gm fat; 1 T. of natural peanut butter = 90 calories, 3+/- gm protein, 8 gm fat).

... My training is now 4 days a week, I do try to lift as heavy as I can, but I find I get tired to quick, so I end up slacking in the end. I run out of energy. Well, I think I answered my own questions here a bit, so I guess I should really put some effort into my diet.

I can honestly tell you, running out of energy like that is a direct result of diet, because it happens to me. I will totally wilt if I don't eat properly (for me, that means paying particular attention to protein intake) on weight days, it's particularly noticeable for me with my deadlifts.

 

[Sassy69]

Good advice! (That's why its the EF Ladies board...!)

 

[dizzygrinch]

thanks ladies soo much. I was talking to my husband last night, and he is 100% with me in trying to fix our diets, to eat healthy. He needs to too. Im 35 now, and my mom was the oldest female, out of grandmothers, sisters, aunts, and she died at 52. My dad had a stroke when he was 42, so I need to do something now! We are going to look for a health food store, Im going to look for the foods that I can use to subsitute the things Im allergic too. I forgot to mention I am allergic to rice as well, but I love sweet potatoes,, so I am glad I can eat those! I was thinking, do you guys think it would be a good idea, to maybe just buy a couple days worth of food at a time? I am trying to think of what to write down in a list for like a week worth of food, I am becoming overwhelmed! I was thinking I should really make sure my protien intake is up there, and I think the whey drinks help a lot. How much protein can I have at one sitting? Oh, I am lactose intolerant, but if I take the lactaid pills with it, Im usually ok. I stick to fat free milk, lowfat cottage cheese and yogurt. Should I get more of those? thanks so much again. I am so glad I stumbled upon this website and forum!

 

[velvett]

If your lactose intolerant you really should not eat whey, milk & milk products, cottage cheese or yogurt.

I think you would be better off dropping those type of items and the lactaid pills.

For a protein drink you can use egg white protein (I use some from Protein Factory and I am quite happy with it.)

I'm just mentioning this because I have quite a few food allergies myself so I know a bit about it.

 

[musclemom]

Oh, I am lactose intolerant, but if I take the lactaid pills with it, Im usually ok. I stick to fat free milk, lowfat cottage cheese and yogurt.

Regarding lactose intolerance, do you have problem with goat's milk/goat milk products? Some people do, some don't.

For protein supplementation, okay, got one for you (since you're going to a health food store in the future), HEMP protein, here's a site:

http://www.livingharvest.com/

It's a good site, really educational. And don't freak, industrial hemp is totally different from it's party hardy cousin. I use hemp products, love the stuff and have been using it for months, it's actually cleared up some skin problems I had, believe it or not. Has natural EFAs, good stuff. 7 gm protein in 60 calories -- in the protein powder -- which is about equivalent to an egg, but with a MUCH better nutrient profile. Calcium, magnesium, a very healthy food.

Grinch, have you always had all these food allergies/intolerances, or have they cropped up since adulthood??? Because I have to tell you rice allergy is extremely rare.

 

[dizzygrinch]

Hi, I am going to look for the Hemp at the store. It should be an interesting experience for me going to a health food store, Im not gonna know half the stuff in there! I have never tried any goats milk products, maybe I should try it. I actually went to an allergist, and had the skin tests done, It came up that I was allergic to rice, even bananas! maybe the doc is a quack. anyway, I do realize that nutrition is my major problem. should I consider a supplement for energy prior to lifting? I have heard of growth hormones as well, I was just wondering....

 

[velvett]

I do realize that nutrition is my major problem. should I consider a supplement for energy prior to lifting? I have heard of growth hormones as well, I was just wondering....

You need to stop focusing on supplements and focus more on eating the right food to fuel your body. And don't even mention the word steriod - if you eat and train properly you don't even have to go that route.

But you have to eat real food like animal flesh, greens (and green veggies - green been, broccoli, lettuce, spinach, etc - peppper even) and in your case sweet potato - you should not be relying on whey protein drinks as your source of healthy fuel.

Seriously lose the dairy if you are lactose intolerent you don't need it.

 

[musclemom]

You need to stop focusing on supplements and focus more on eating the right food to fuel your body. And don't even mention the word steriod - if you eat and train properly you don't even have to go that route.

But you have to eat real food like animal flesh, greens (and green veggies - green been, broccoli, lettuce, spinach, etc - peppper even) and in your case sweet potato - you should not be relying on whey protein drinks as your source of healthy fuel.

Seriously lose the dairy if you are lactose intolerent you don't need it.

Grinch, Velvett is absolutely right ... whole foods are the key and you can't keep eating foods that you have tested as allergic to ...

Velvett, don't be angry at me, hemp protein is a remarkably healthy food. Calcium, magnesium, a healthy balance of EFAs. I'd had a stubborn patch of eczema on my right arm for over a year -- it wouldn't clear up for nothing -- when I started using hemp protein it cleared it up within two weeks and you can't even see a scar on my arm, completely cleared with NO other treatment, which blew my mind. It's a supplement but also a really wholesome whole food.

I'm just happy Grinch is heading into a health food store If you talk to some of the employees there, tell them your allergies, they might be able to point you toward food products that are gluten free, egg free, lactose free, rice free.

Unfortunately, when one suffers from numerous food allergies (and I learned this the hard way) you need to learn to rotate your diet -- even though the inclination is to stick to the same foods for simplicity sake. But what happens when you do that, if you don't vary your diet, you can become sensitized to the foods that you're currently able to eat! So, Grinch, ya gotta learn how to cook a little, honey!!!

 

[Daisy_Girl]

MM - I think the supplements Vel was referring to the growth hormone, not a protein supplement.

Also, if anyone else knows about food allergies, it is Vel. She is also allergic to a lot of foods - she knows her shit about that products are in what foods because of this.

 

[Sassy69]

So many people don't realize that the things that make them miserable are really allergies to food they eat. These things should just be removed from your diet, period. Trying to work w/ stuff to continue eating this stuff but ease the symptoms doesnt' make your life easier.

I pretty much have an iron stomach, however when I'm on the ol' perpetual comp diet, I have zero lactose tolerance. I also can't handle alot of starchy carb all at one time and have a tough time w/ too much fat (i.e. a pile of ANPB). I pay big time when I aggravate any of these things. And it just sucks. It can all be managed w/ diet. But its sort of like when u hit your thumb w/ a hammer. If you don't want it to hurt, don't hit your thumb w/ a hammer. If you are into pain, go for it!

 

[velvett]

Velvett, don't be angry at me, hemp protein is a remarkably healthy food. Calcium, magnesium, a healthy balance of EFAs. I'd had a stubborn patch of eczema on my right arm for over a year -- it wouldn't clear up for nothing -- when I started using hemp protein it cleared it up within two weeks and you can't even see a scar on my arm, completely cleared with NO other treatment, which blew my mind. It's a supplement but also a really wholesome whole food.

Why in the world would I be mad?

I've never had hemp protein - sounds brilliant.
Is it a powder? Is it a pure protein or is it cut with something?
What are the ratios? (LOL I guess I could just google huh)
Health food store type deal?


Allergies SUCK big time.
I ate cheese today - Oh I will be paying for that tomorrow.

*******************************************************

When I mentioned supps I was leaning toward DHEA, Groth Hormone, AS as a no, and stacks as something to do after the diet is solid. As far as protein powder I think it's great (same w/ creat/glut)- I drink one-two shakes w/ water a day for the cals and the extra protein (the 2nd is a post w/o type thing which I don't consider a meal).

Well, everyone is different so you have to see what works for you but from personal experience there is no loss in losing dairy products when you are sensitive to them and calicum can be supplemented.

 

[Sassy69]

OMG. Do you know of all the stuff that hurts me the worst right now, it is lactose. About a month ago I was caught w/o food & starving so did the drive thru at Wendy's for a chicken / salad that had some feta cheese on it. I picked most of it off, but got a bit and OMG. O. M. G.

 

[dizzygrinch]

well, I am gonna lose the dairy. I will just get a calcium supplement. I really dont mind that idea. I bet my stomach will feel a lot better. well, I want to thank you ladies again for all the wonderful advice. Im gonna Google search for some more info on foods, and tomorrow trip to the health food store! Should be fun..... thanks again!!!!

 

[velvett]

well, I am gonna lose the dairy. I will just get a calcium supplement. I really dont mind that idea. I bet my stomach will feel a lot better. well, I want to thank you ladies again for all the wonderful advice. Im gonna Google search for some more info on foods, and tomorrow trip to the health food store! Should be fun..... thanks again!!!!

YAY!!!

Your body will thank you.

That hemp protein that Musclemom mentioned looks interesting.
I found this last night - you might what to check with her if it's the same but they offer a sample size which is nice so you can try it without commitment.

http://organicpharmacy.org/products...ck?PHPSESSID=42a604372975276f1779806e736cc7f9

 

[musclemom]

I definitely say check out Living Harvest's website, interesting stuff. The protein powder is a greenish, slightly sandy powder that you can add to oatmeal, or mix into any beverage. Just like flaxseed oil or whey, you can't cook with the oil or protein powder because it oxidizes the EFAs.

http://www.livingharvest.com/index.cfm

I couldn't get the nutrient profile to print on the protein powder, but here's an excerpt off the website:

"To attain optimum health we must eat foods that contain live enzymes, active phytonutrients, vitamins, minerals, essential amino acids, and essential fatty acids. These elements are termed “essential” because the human body does not produce them. They must come from the food we eat. Hemp seed is one of the plant kingdom’s most concentrated, complete and balanced sources of essential amino acids (EAA’s) and essential fatty acids (EFA’s). Hemp seeds are high in essential nutrients including chlorophyll, magnesium, potassium, sulfur, phytosterols, ascorbic acid, beta-carotene, calcium, fiber, histidine, iron, potassium, phosphorus, riboflavin, niacin and thiamin.

Hemp seed contains all 10 essential amino acids, the building blocks of protein. Hemp seeds contain 33% pure digestible protein, providing readily available amino acids for building and repairing tissue. Hemp seed protein is comprised of 65% high-quality edestin protein, the most potent protein of any plant source, 35% albumin protein and glutamic acid. The globulin edestin in hemp seed closely resembles the globulin in blood plasma, and is compatible with the human digestive system. It is vital to the maintance of a healthy immune system and is also used to manufacture antibodies. Albumin is a protein manufactured by the liver that is supportive of liver and kidney health."

I didn't mean to misunderstand anyone, when I hear the word supplements I think of vitamins, minerals, herbs and nutraceuticals, I never really think of steroids and growth hormone when I hear that word, isn't that odd?