Cycle comments..

[Lestat]

12 weeks:
400mg/week EQ
300mg/week Test Enanth
300mg/week Primo

2nd cycle

6'2" 185lbs, single digit BF

Have been as much as 6'2" 215 with quite a bit more fat

I'm concerned that this may just be too much.. but at the same time I'd like to throw some var in there towards the end...

 

[Lawn Saver]

See reply on .com

 

[BIGJAKE]

if it were me bro i would have to say to bump that test dose up to 500mg
and the primo to 400mg and that would yield some good gains.and also do your pct.a-dex,nolva,clomid and hcg

 

[Apexx]

IMO running the eq and primo in the same cycle is overkill. I would drop the eq and run the primo 100mg eod along with bumping the test to 500mg / wk.

You should see nice gains and the primo will keep you nice and tight so you probably won't even need to add the var in at the end.

 

[mikebzt]

test should be higher than EQ so go with 500mg

 

[wnt2bBeast]

IMO running the eq and primo in the same cycle is overkill. I would drop the eq and run the primo 100mg eod along with bumping the test to 500mg / wk.

You should see nice gains and the primo will keep you nice and tight so you probably won't even need to add the var in at the end.

why run primo eod??its an enanth ester

 

[Apexx]

why run primo eod??its an enanth ester

OOPS, I meant e3d. my hands work faster than my brain sometimes.

It only has a half life of about 5 days. 100mg e3d will be a bit less than 300mg/wk, but it will keep the levels more consistant.

 

[Lestat]

Ok maybe I should start from scratch here.

The goal is to put on some quality mass.

I've fooled around with test before and my nipples got sore as hell and puffy I basically ran nolva 40mg ED because I was scared shitless.

The idea behind the cycle at first was almost just an EQ only.. but then I thought throw in low dose test to help with libido to to give it some more kick...

then I figured why not ad primo, everyone raves about it and its mild... same thought process for var.

Never tried deca but curious but the senstive nips with test got me worried.. i have no clue how i'd respond to deca and the ancillaries to preven deca induced gyno aren't as easy for me to get.

So I guess the question should be, what's a good bulk cycle for someone who knows they are prone to test induced gyno?

 

[wnt2bBeast]

running some adex with your test cycle will limit aromatase..nolva is good for blocking estro but does not stop its production..and your right if you know your prone to gyno and run test/deca in the same cycle you will not know where its coming from..ie estro or progesteron based..yes you can block deca gyno as well..i like test/primo but others say it is like putting a silk hat on a pig lol and i dont disagree..you could run a low dose of test with a higher amount of primo
250 mg test
600 mg primo
or a straight primo/var cycle...

 

[Razorguns]

dno't forget your finasteride, unless u want to lose hair.

 

[Lestat]

dno't forget your finasteride, unless u want to lose hair.

got it, I'll have all the ancillaries and PCT under control

 

[The_first_athlete]

I would do the test/eq for 12 weeks and primoB from week 9-15.

I actually did a test/eq cycle for 11 weeks and for 12-14 I did 300deca and 200primo and that change added an extra 6 pounds i think.

 

[UA_Iron]

You'd probably see better results with

Test E 500mg/week
Deca 400mg/week

run the Test weeks 1-12 the deca 1-11
throw in some var from weeks 10-14

Run .5mg adex eod, run dostinex .5mg e4d

Progesterone sides may be overrated, so who knows.

 

[gonelifting]

Lestat, I`m in the same boat as you with the gyno symptoms. I`m still on the first cycle but am feeling burning nips the whole way through after about a week or so with Test/D-bol. The Nolva and Armidex would work but seems to halt my progress or something. So when I come off the Nolv/Adex, they start burning again. lol

I may be looking into something like this when #2 starts for me.

 

[Optimus B]

i'd ditch the primo and run:

EQ 600mg/wk
test 500mg/wk

 

[slat1]

I don't think I would run EQ for mass. I think UA_Iron is onto something. I would probably switch to Deca. I would run about 300mg's a week with 500mg's a week of test ent. That is me though at 235.
When I was 195 I grew like a weed of just 250mg's a week of test.
Use your best judgement.
Good Luck

 

[Lestat]

Any thoughts on Deca only? I hear it kills your libido.

 

[mikebzt]

Different strokes for different folks. Most individuals will throw test in with it to guarentee a sustained libido

 

[hammertime30]

test should be higher than EQ so go with 500mg

Why should test be higher than EQ?

 

[Big Rick Rock]

we have different guys with different opinions about how you should run this cycle.

I'll add a couple of things, you can take as much as you want.


- Lestat, your cycle looks good... for a second cycle, 1,000mg per week is plenty.
If you are worried about Gyno this cycle is pretty safe.

- Running Deca just makes another way for Gyno to develop(progesterone)...

- Gonelifting, Lestat, and anybody that is really concerned with Gyno... Running Nolva at 20-40mg(ed) with Adex @ 0.25-0.5mg(eod) should be enough for a 500mg/750mg test cycle... At these dosages you should be able to keep Gyno away, and it shouldn't take away from your gains since you are not completely shutting down your Estrogen production. (this has worked for me, but we are all different. You have to know your own body)


-I hate to sound like an infomercial but, if you want to try another alternative for combating Gyno and still make good gains then this product might be worth taking a look at...
Got to: http://www.elitefitness.com/go/hmgear/products scroll down to "Aromabolan P.C.T" here is some of the text on that page:

Aromabolan P.C.T.™ really is an amazing compound that should be a part of EVERY cycle - not only for muscle gains and fat loss, but for longevity and health. It's one of the world's most potent aromatase inhibitors that is actually a prescription drug in other countries under the brand name of Lentaron I.M. Depot®.

The amazing part is Lentaron I.M. Depot® use to be available in the USA, but the government removed it because it was "too anabolic" and it put on muscle. H.M. Gear's Aromabolan P.C.T.™ is the EXACT compound found in Lentaron I.M. Depot® and we've attained it due to the current legal loopholes in America.

Its anabolic/androgen effects are similar to that of the steroid Primobolan Depot. It also increases IGF-1 levels by an amazing 26%. It also increases HPTA activity and testicular activity similar to a combination of HCG and Clomid!

Now you know why we recommend this to be a part of any and every cycle. Whether it's to keep your estrogen under control or to simply create an environment that is more anabolic and beneficial for muscular gains and fat loss.

 

[strongsmartsexy]

I can't find the thread, but I believe that drjmw recommends using 50mg EOD of injectible winny to avoid complications from Deca/NPP progesterone.

 

[Lestat]

I'm worried about the shutdown from deca as well though, DrJMW said it would probably shut me down far harder then test.

 

[lawnsaver]

I'm worried about the shutdown from deca as well though, DrJMW said it would probably shut me down far harder then test.

The good Doc is right.

Although there are some lucky guys out there, deca is EXTREMELY hard on the HPTA. Because of that, I will only use EQ.

Why not 500mg of test and 400mg of EQ for 10 to 12 weeks??

This cycle will allow you to control estrogen related side effects with one compound.

Have fun!

 

[strongsmartsexy]

I'm worried about the shutdown from deca as well though, DrJMW said it would probably shut me down far harder then test.

Deca will definately shut you down harder than test. You need to run test with deca to keep the libido in tact. Some will recommend you use proviron to help with the libido as well. Then you should run either dostinex or winny to help with the deca progesteron issue. Deca is a great mass builder over time which is why many use it for mass cycles. Deca gyno is progesterone related which is why winny or dostinex is important if gyno appears.

In a deca/test cycle you could get gyno from either one. Each requires a different treatment to get rid of the gyno.

Someone suggested you use EQ, but it's not nearly the mass builder tha deca is.

Also, if you do deca/test, think about adding 30mg/day of dbol for the first 4 weeks or so until the deca and test kick in. I added 50mg/day of winny for the last 5 weeks of my deca/test cycle. YUMMY

 

[gymratforlife]

Save yourself a heache and keep it simple and easy on the wallet go with 500mg test/500mg eq a week and you will love live.

 

[juicedbeachbum]

Up the test and EQ drop the primo

 

[georgie24]

test doseage is fine, dont listen to people when they say up the test

 

[Big Rick Rock]

Listen to georgie24 when he tells you not to listen to other people...


I think the Test is fine for this cycle too. I think your dosages are just fine.

 

[Lestat]

Listen to georgie24 when he tells you not to listen to other people...


I think the Test is fine for this cycle too. I think your dosages are just fine.

thanks man

 

[gymratforlife]

Listen to georgie24 when he tells you not to listen to other people...


I think the Test is fine for this cycle too. I think your dosages are just fine.

To each their own I guess I find it rather a waste of time if your gona shut your natural test down just to replace it with only 200mg more per week than is already available in a natural athlete.But then again to each their own.