Clen, and high AST & ALT??? Liver...

[fitnessgrl8621]

Hi Everyone,

My boyfriend just had some blood work done and his AST and ALT came back extremely high! It's been a while since he's done an actual 'cycle' (June/July of 2005), but he has been taking Clen for the past few weeks, off and on.

I'm just wondering if any of you have had experience with this... and if the high levels of AST & ALT could possibly be caused by the Clen and/or EQ (I think that's all he took in June/July)that he has taken.

Worried,

Mandy

 

[nautica]

Yes, they can be. But, this isn't the place to ask about elevated liver enzymes. Especially, if they are extremely high. It could be from any number of things, none of which can or should be speculated about. Goto the DOC.

Good luck
Nautica

 

[Ulter]

I am going to assume, unlike nautica, that he's already been to the DOC or he wouldn't have had those test done in the first place.
Clen can do that. But so can just training hard. If the doc was concerned about his liver he'd have ordered a GGT test just to be sure it's not from overworked muscles. (If he knows what he's doing and he knows your bf's training)
I wouldn't get all worked up over it though.

 

[Big_Joe]

I am going to assume, unlike nautica, that he's already been to the DOC or he wouldn't have had those test done in the first place.
Clen can do that. But so can just training hard. If the doc was concerned about his liver he'd have ordered a GGT test just to be sure it's not from overworked muscles. (If he knows what he's doing and he knows your bf's training)
I wouldn't get all worked up over it though.

You'd be amazed at how many doctors never order a Gamma Glutamyl Transferase. They just rely on the ALT. It's especially true if you have an HMO. It costs more for the GGT test so it just doesn't get done. They say "You"re fine go home." If you die the HMO saved money by not having to treat you. This is how the been counters control the doctors by only clearing some lab tests and not others.

Either way he needs to get a full workup to see why he has an inflamed liver.

 

[maldorf]

You'd be amazed at how many doctors never order a Gamma Glutamyl Transferase. They just rely on the ALT. It's especially true if you have an HMO. It costs more for the GGT test so it just doesn't get done. They say "You"re fine go home." If you die the HMO saved money by not having to treat you. This is how the been counters control the doctors by only clearing some lab tests and not others.

Either way he needs to get a full workup to see why he has an inflamed liver.

Yeah, I had done some research on this because my liver enzymes came back elevated and my doc refused to order a test for the GGT levels. I asked him about how AST and ALT might get elevated from muscle damage due to weight training and he claimed that one of them cant be from muscle, forget which one. He insisted that either the AST or ALT, cant remember which one, is only from liver damage and that it is pointless to order the GGT. I need to drop this doc, just havent gotten around to it.

 

[nautica]

I didn't mean to run you off fitness girl. Did he goto the do? I know that when I used to cycle, I had a friend that was a chiropractor order blood work for me to keep an eye on mine. Is that what your boyfriend did or did the doc order the test? If so, how is he and what are his levels??? Does he drink? or any other rec drugs or pain pills?

nautica

 

[fitnessgrl8621]

Thanks everyone for your comments/suggestions .

Nautica, he had gone to a doctor to get blood work done to see where his Test levels were at? lol I don't know anything about steroids/test levels, etc... I think what he was wanting to do, was have the doctor PRESCRIBE him steroids if in fact his test levels came back low. He's going to go to another doctor sometime this next week. And yes, he does drink pretty frequently (not like full out drunk or anything, but he'll have a drink with dinner pretty much every night or every other).

Thanks again for your help, guys!

Mandy

 

[bilter]

fitness girl you said his levels came back extremely high. No you know what the values were? I've had a few go arounds with 2 of my old Dr's about liver enzyme levels (thats why they are no longer my Docs). Also 1 drink at night with dinner generaly will not elevate ASt ALt, I have a glass of wine every night, in fact the night before my last test & mine came back normal. First time in 12 years I was below the upper limit.

 

[fitnessgrl8621]

Well, I guess I don't know what constitutes as 'extremely' high ... But they were well over the normal range. For his AST, the reference range was 0-37, and his was at 95. For the ALT, the reference range was 0-40, and his was at 210!

 

[Ulter]

So his ALT was the one that was off the chart. That's what I thought.



Clin J Sport Med. 1999 Jan;9(1):34-9.

Anabolic steroid-induced hepatotoxicity: is it overstated?

Dickerman RD, Pertusi RM, Zachariah NY, Dufour DR, McConathy WJ.

The Department of Biomedical Science, University of North Texas Health Science Center, Fort Worth 76107-2699, USA.

OBJECTIVE: There have been numerous reports of hepatic dysfunction secondary to anabolic steroid use based on elevated levels of serum aminotransferases. This study was conducted to distinguish between serum aminotransaminase elevations secondary to intense resistance training and anabolic steroid-induced hepatotoxicity in elite bodybuilders. DESIGN: This was a case-control study of serum chemistry profiles from bodybuilders using and not using anabolic steroids with comparisons to a cohort of medical students and patients with hepatitis. PARTICIPANTS: The participants were bodybuilders taking self-directed regimens of anabolic steroids (n = 15) and bodybuilders not taking steroids (n = 10). Blood chemistry profiles from patients with viral hepatitis (n = 49) and exercising and nonexercising medical students (592) were used as controls. MAIN OUTCOME MEASURES: The focus in blood chemistry profiles was aspartate aminotransferase (AST), alanine aminotransferase (ALT), gamma-glutamyltranspeptidase (GGT), and creatine kinase (CK) levels. RESULTS: In both groups of bodybuilders, CK, AST, and ALT were elevated, whereas GGT remained in the normal range. In contrast, patients with hepatitis had elevations of all three enzymes: ALT, AST, and GGT. Creatine kinase (CK) was elevated in all exercising groups. Patients with hepatitis were the only group in which a correlation was found between aminotransferases and GGT. CONCLUSION: Prior reports of anabolic steroid-induced hepatotoxicity based on elevated aminotransferase levels may have been overstated, because no exercising subjects, including steroid users, demonstrated hepatic dysfunction based on GGT levels. Such reports may have misled the medical community to emphasize steroid-induced hepatotoxicity when interpreting elevated aminotransferase levels and disregard muscle damage. For these reasons, when evaluating hepatic function in cases of anabolic steroid therapy or abuse, CK and GGT levels should be considered in addition to ALT and AST levels as essential elements of the assessment.