Chest Workout with Shoulder Issues

[lucidblue]

lower incline bench-absolutly
bb declines- never liked those, db would be better; maybe even do pullovers instead
lucid, for extensions, were you using db or bb?

bulldog- very interesting on the cuff work. does it list the complex exercises used?

I was using db for the extensions.

 

[Scotsman]

Quick question... first you say stick with flat or incline and then you said don't do incline. Did you mean one of them to be decline?

Sorry typo I mean don't do declines.

Cheers,
Scotsman

 

[Becoming]

I don't have a link (right now, but I'll look for one).......

They want 20 bucks for one time viewing... I wish I could see more of the article/data "Results showed that the complex group significantly improved their muscular performance, but the isolated group did not, indicating that isolated exercises are only effective when the training goal is to strengthen the weaker muscle group, but they must be replaced by more complex and closed-kinetic exercises in order to obtain considerable improvement of the rotator cuff strength. The authors propose that a strengthening program should start with isolated movements for better stimulation of the weaker muscles and continue with complex exercise for more impressive strengthening."

I would like to see more of the excercises used, etc, experimental protocols can have a big effect... but it looks interesting none the less.... I like the idea of combining them for maximum effect...

(lucid- sorry, not trying to hijack)

 

[Bulldog_10]

lower incline bench-absolutly
bb declines- never liked those, db would be better; maybe even do pullovers instead
lucid, for extensions, were you using db or bb?

bulldog- very interesting on the cuff work. does it list the complex exercises used?

Oh, I forgot to mention...I agree with everyone who is saying to lower the incline. Most people go too high and bring the delts into it...good call guys.

d3...I'll check on the exercises used...although I don't remember them mentioning which exercises they were...odd. But I'll re-check it anyways and get back to you.

 

[Bulldog_10]

They want 20 bucks for one time viewing... I wish I could see more of the article/data "Results showed that the complex group significantly improved their muscular performance, but the isolated group did not, indicating that isolated exercises are only effective when the training goal is to strengthen the weaker muscle group, but they must be replaced by more complex and closed-kinetic exercises in order to obtain considerable improvement of the rotator cuff strength. The authors propose that a strengthening program should start with isolated movements for better stimulation of the weaker muscles and continue with complex exercise for more impressive strengthening."

I would like to see more of the excercises used, etc, experimental protocols can have a big effect... but it looks interesting none the less.... I like the idea of combining them for maximum effect...

(lucid- sorry, not trying to hijack)

Yeah...I left that last part out because I didn't really feel it pertained here...first off, it's subjective...second, I think they're talking if you're working from baseline...I assume lucid has been in the gym before, and thus can skip right to the complex movements.

 

[d3track]

I was using db for the extensions.

tricky manuver with your injury, i may throw that out
i'm trying to think of sumthin else and am drawing a blank at the moment

and 6 sets sounds a bit excessive, IMHO, thats deffinatly a Beast workout


you could maybe try doing the extensions on an incline, but if it hurts i would scrap it

 

[Becoming]

d3...I'll check on the exercises used...although I don't remember them mentioning which exercises they were...odd. But I'll re-check it anyways and get back to you.

cool man, thnx for the info - if you can get more, or post the whole thing off their e-journal that would be cool...

 

[Bulldog_10]

Found it...

They used pull-ups, overhead presses, reverse pull-ups, and push-ups for the complex group.

They used internal and external rotations for the isolation group.

They tested external and internal isokinetic peak torque on the weak and strong sides before and after training. Both methods strengthened the cuff...

It was shown that the isolation exercise group only improved performance significantly on the weak side. But the authors, and authors of other articles suggest that once the weak side is brought up, the isolation exercises should be replaced with complex movements. The complex group improved significantly on both sides.


If you have any more questions...just ask...I'm heading out the door right now...but I'll answer them when i can.

 

[Becoming]

They used pull-ups, overhead presses, reverse pull-ups, and push-ups for the complex group.
so basically - if you balance your movements correctly- you should have no problems then...?

...It was shown that the isolation exercise group only improved performance significantly on the weak side. But the authors, and authors of other articles suggest that once the weak side is brought up, the isolation exercises should be replaced with complex movements. The complex group improved significantly on both sides.
I think this means that if you do have an injury, the isolations can help to bring it up... but again, then how do you get an injury if you use a balanced routine?

I don't know how well this translates to PL type applications, or even someone in lucid's case... I think it seems to say isolation are great for rehab, but no neccessarily for maintenence strengthening.... Also in regards to the subject, did they just have a weakness, or an injury? Also what is their training history, etc? I think it is interesting to use pushups, pullups etc in conjunction with isolated movements to see how it goes....but I don't know exactly what the study discretely provides in regards to the best way to rehab such an injury...

 

[Lord_Suston]

A few suggestions

1) lower incline like many people stated and use a barbell since db's will cause your stabilizers to kick in hard core. (since it seems to be a weak point for your shoulder you might want to avoid straining those muscles)

2)try lying cable flyes on a cable machine. I suggest cables because of the constant tension rather than normal db flyes wehre the most tension is at parallel with the ground and most of the shearing force is place on the AC at lockout due to the weight force being directed straight toward the ground.

3)decline-never like them.

4) CG bench=good

5) find out what is wrong with shoulder on overhead movement, if it hurt on pressing overhead you have a problem if not then you might need to use a rope instead to allow more freedom in the shoulde joint