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Bigger chest?
- Thread starter Eric1987
- Start date
might wanna try omegas chest routine stickied in the top of the forum throw that in 2wice a week with ur normal chest, its pretty good. trying to concentrate on the pec doing the lifting seems to be the key to it so maybe drop some weight up the reps and try to establish that mind to muscle connection
how do you setup, when your benching bro
hows your diet, how many calories you consuming? protien fats? diets probley where your messing up
Jocques Straap
New member
Do you feel like you are squeezing your shoulder blades together when you bench?
How wide is your grip?
I find that the secret to an aestheticly pleasing chest, is to spend more time training your back.
Poor scapular retraction and thoracic mobility, just poor shoulder/back posture over all. These things are so common in everyone and are just compounded by pressing. Pectorals are big, but tight and slumped. Shoulders turned in and chest sunk. -- Creates the illusion of a small chest.
Maybe this is you? I don't know. Pics would help.
How wide is your grip?
I find that the secret to an aestheticly pleasing chest, is to spend more time training your back.
Poor scapular retraction and thoracic mobility, just poor shoulder/back posture over all. These things are so common in everyone and are just compounded by pressing. Pectorals are big, but tight and slumped. Shoulders turned in and chest sunk. -- Creates the illusion of a small chest.
Maybe this is you? I don't know. Pics would help.
Do you hit failure at all in your 5X5?
Depending on how long you have been doing 5X5, it's time you switch it up to a HST workout. 5X5 is good for building a strong base and for a strength oriented goals. However, it is not the best routine for maximum muscle size.
and pics would help us get an idea of what you have right now.
Depending on how long you have been doing 5X5, it's time you switch it up to a HST workout. 5X5 is good for building a strong base and for a strength oriented goals. However, it is not the best routine for maximum muscle size.
and pics would help us get an idea of what you have right now.
No I dont fail at all. If I fail I wont go up in weight. Here is a picture but its kinda crappy. And I been doing the 5x5 for a while now.
ImageShack - Image Hosting :: 1240682350868.jpg
Do you mean in pressing weight, or in body weight?
Either way, that is incorrect. You SHOULD hit failure on your last set anyways with the 5X5. Rep 5 of set 5 should be your last rep you could possibly do in that set. If not, its too light. Why wouldn't you hit failure?
I am not a big 5x5 guy myself, so maybe you aren't suppose to hit failure, but that sounds like crap to me. For deadlifts, 5x5 is fantastic. For best chest development, it's garbage.
If you never do a set where you couldn't possibly to another repetition, you aren't pushing it hard enough bro. You can't even be getting that good of a pump either. Not that a pump is a huge determining factor in muscle growth, but still.
You've been doing it for a while? What does that mean? 6 weeks? 6 months?
Your chest doesn't look too bad. But if you want it to really pop out of your shirt, you do need some more size on there.
Again, 5X5 is more for strength than it is for hypertrophy(muscle growth) and development of the muscle size. If you want your chest to get bigger, switch it up and do some hypertrophy specific training. And, you will actually find that once you turn back to 5x5, you will have gotten much stronger anyways.
bigdave2628
New member
U need to keep shoulders back and down chest up and squeeze your chest to move the weight. If you can not do this, the weight is to much. So drop it down and find a weight you can do for 8-12 reps.
Well I will hit failure until I get strong enough to do it then I add 5 more pounds. So yeah I am going to failure or I up the weight. Whats some hypertrophy exercises? Specifically ones that you do.
Ceros
New member
I got a big chest and increased strength in my bench by down dumbbell presses and incline db presses. And when you do these, touch them together at the top and do sets like x15,x12,x10 and then also do cable flys or at the least db flys of some sort to get that real stretch in the chest contraction and retraction. I used to have a 36" chest now I'm at a 44" chest, and my waist is the same. So that's really what helped me. Also, don't stop benching keep it up, you just need to switch it up. Need to realized size isn't strength, but it sounds to me like you want size too, so do this.
skullcrushin22
New member
Flat bench to me is more for strength. I noticed size and definition after focusing on incline bench and different types of flyes with high reps.
Hypertrophy is more a matter of the quantity of repetitions than it is a specific excercise.
The same movements apply, but you have to do a higher rep range of 10+ reps per set, with a greater focus on the target muscle.
And you need to be hitting failure too. Not hitting failure means you aren't lifting with enough intensity.
Ceros
New member
Work shoulders, I find that incline press and shoulder press works well, and when you have wider shoulders, at least for me, I don't know what it is but I look way bigger in the chest, it might stretch it out, or draw more attention to the top or something like that. But, it works.
djeclipse
New member
No offense but you are completely wrong. You even contradict yourself in the same paragraph.
The pump has nothing to do with how good of a work out you had, it means absolutley nothing in terms of muscle growth. You even said so right after you hinted that he should be getting a "good pump". So which is it? I think you know from reading here that the "pump" has nothing to do with muscle gains, but you simply don't want to believe it, lol
And most importantly, training to failure means absolutely nothing. Training each week, adding weight to the bar, with planned progression, over reaching means EVERYTHING!
If you don't know anything about the program he is on why comment on it telling him he is doing it wrong? If you don't know about the program don't comment on it at all. That is one of the major downfalls of this board, you have people commenting, giving advice BAD to people when they have no clue what they are talking about. It's the blind leading the blind.
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djeclipse
New member
What 5 x 5 are you doing? That weight progression isn't proper for the true 5 x 5.
Are you doing weighted dips on Friday?
Basically you need to be eating more to put on some size. Your chest looks fine in the pic you posted, proper proportion etc. If you want your chest to grow (along with the rest of your body) you need to be eating enough to do so.
bblazer
Banned
When you are at the top and touch, are your palms facing each other, or, do you touch the ends of the DB together with a traditional grip?
B-
djeclipse
New member
From madcow's 5 x 5 site
Diet - Caloric Excess
What Is Caloric Excess?
Essentially caloric excess is what allows your body to grow and get bigger than it currently is now. How are you going to add another room on your house with only enough wood or concrete to make small maintenance repair on your existing structure?
How Can I Tell If Caloric Excess Is Present?
So given that some of these people are already lean (no caloric excess) and run their diets based at the margin of a calculation, these people can go through a good training program, get strong as hell raising their capacities in all the lifts and not gain any weight (or size). How is this possible? Very simple, no caloric excess.
All any good training program can do is get you better at the activity (this is true in any sport). If you eat more than you need you will gain weight. If you are a couch potato, that weight might be all fat. A good training program will ensure that a large portion is muscle. Either way, if caloric excess is present - one will not be the same weight and body composition by the very definition of caloric excess. Lift bigger, eat bigger, get bigger. Very easy.
Diet - Caloric Excess
What Is Caloric Excess?
Essentially caloric excess is what allows your body to grow and get bigger than it currently is now. How are you going to add another room on your house with only enough wood or concrete to make small maintenance repair on your existing structure?
How Can I Tell If Caloric Excess Is Present?
So given that some of these people are already lean (no caloric excess) and run their diets based at the margin of a calculation, these people can go through a good training program, get strong as hell raising their capacities in all the lifts and not gain any weight (or size). How is this possible? Very simple, no caloric excess.
All any good training program can do is get you better at the activity (this is true in any sport). If you eat more than you need you will gain weight. If you are a couch potato, that weight might be all fat. A good training program will ensure that a large portion is muscle. Either way, if caloric excess is present - one will not be the same weight and body composition by the very definition of caloric excess. Lift bigger, eat bigger, get bigger. Very easy.
djeclipse
New member
Really now...
Training to failure has nothing to do with training intensity, I would have hoped someone like you would know this already.
In any type of program there must be planned progression, you want the muscle to be subjected to higher work loads over a period of time. If this is not existent then it becomes a routine, and routines are just that - routine and no progression.
Training to failure programs are using intensity primarily (i.e. the weight being lifted) to increase capacity. They train to failure so they have a benchmark of their capacity and they try to improve it each session (i.e. add weight, work to get target reps, if successful add weight again - session to session). The main issues are that you have only a single variable to work with and training to failure has been shown not to result in excess gains yet can be excessively taxing to the CNS so you have to deal with a degree of possible wastefulness and the limitations that imposes on volume and frequency.
This is why with the 5 x 5 you don't train to fail, failure is just that - FAILURE. With a good program you train to progress, there is room to grow, the goal is to add weight to the bar and keep adding weight to the bar, get all your reps each week. Not to fail each week leaving no capacity to make any progress.
Please read regarding intensity
http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/5017744-post686.html
I would also suggest, being a moderator here your replies hold more weight to new members as they don't know any better. They may take your word as being correct as you are a moderator. Please before you comment on something you know little about, refrain from doing so until you have taken the time to learn what you are commenting about. Only so that you don't give out incorrect information like this again. As a moderator here you have a higher standard to "live" by when posting here.
You completey missed the fact that this guys goals are hypertrophy to get a bigger chest, and just wanted to debate your bed-buddy 5x5 program. Good for you. You didn't help the guy at all, and in turn, you only morph 1 minor suggestion into a plethora of comments about how I am wrong and don't know shit. WTF is that all about? Seriously, WTF is that all about?
I'll be over here helping him reach his goals while you attempt to send the thread down a side road debating the particulars of a program that is not suitable for his current goals, which merits everyone nothing.
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Bill Star and Madcow aren't God nor is their program the one divine way to bodybuilding salvation bro.
You may disagree with my opinion, but that doesn't mean I am wrong. You act as if 5x5 is the only way to go. It's not.
And, again if suggesting hitting failure on your last set is somehow just royally fucking up the 5x5(or any routine), then I'm guilty. But it's not. It was a very minor suggestion and you've blown this whole thing into a giant pissing debate over the tiniest of things. I'm really just not pleased with you giving me shit over a very minor suggestion and fucking up this guys thread.
I've done the 5x5 program before and it was good. I don't think it is a bad program, it's just fine. However, there are other ways to go about your lifting while still achieving progess every workout.
And if someone happens to want to do something other than the 5x5 or add minor modifications it isn't necessarrily an "incorrect" suggestion. And when you go spouting as if the most minor variation just fucks the whole thing up and you start telling people they don't know shit and are clueless, you have crossed the line. You do this to everyone and it's really a fucking nuisance.
Also, if you ever tell a mod what to do again, your ass is banned. I know what my damn job is and I've been doing it just fine.
djeclipse
New member
I answered his questions with proper info, I didn't guess at things for the sake of posting. I quoted specific references from people that have forgotten more about lifting than you and I know. I don't just come here and make stuff up or repeat misinformation I have heard elsewhere. My sources are from people that actually know what they are talking about.
It is clear you didn't read the rest of my replies, just focused on the fact that I called you out on you referring to the "pump" being a good indication of how good the work out is (which is certainly isn't).
Training to failure is not what he needs, training to failure means nothing as far as hypertrophy goes or even fiber recruitment for that matter.
lololololol
Yep, the minor suggestion of hitting failure means I don't know anything. Get a grip.
What he needs is a higher repetition program if his primary goal is hypertrophy in his chest. 5x5 is not the optimum program for this.
djeclipse
New member
He is 165, benching 260, he needs to eat more as I already posted.
How is your body supposed to grow if you don't give it enough fuel to do so? If there is no caloric excess you will not grow, no matter how good the training is.
That's very true. You can't grow without more calories.
What by my weight and bench press makes it seem I need to eat more? And I got the 5x5 routine from here back a long time ago.
djeclipse
New member
Please refer to my post here.
http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/w...ifting/bigger-chest-648524-3.html#post8781649
Your training is good, you are getting stronger, 260 is a good bench press for someone 165lbs. That tells us that the training is not the problem, the problem is you aren't feeding your body enough to grow.
Sound familiar?
To grow you need to eat more, it is that simple. If your training is good the weight you gain will be muscle, if you aren't training or the training is bad the weight you put on will be fat.
Have you ever figured out how many calories you eat and how many calories you burn in an average day?
Well, that's the problem.
1) You eat fast food. It will f'-ing kill you. It is not quality food, and is full of unnatural preservitive garbage that will give you cancer and all sorts of heart probelms, etc etc etc. America is as fat as crap because of fast food. It is not food for building a nice physique, period.
2) You eat randomly and don't pay attention.
3) You don't keep track of what you eat.
Yet, you can still say you eat "a lot, I really do" when you admit to not keeping track. Doesn't work bro.
Crappy diet = crappy results. Plain and simple bro.
You HAVE to have a solid diet and a plan. Otherwise you get, well, not very far.
Isn't buying bulk chicken breasts way cheaper than fast food anyways? I can get raw chicken breats for 1.89 per pound. That's a hell of a lot cheaper than fast food, and it's quality food.
Throw in a sweet potatoe, you have a $3 meal that's high quality, freh and packed full of nutrients and protein.
"Eating till your stuffed" doesn't really matter if you don't know how many calories are going down. I could eat jello till I am stuffed and only managed 100 calories. Or you could eat Big Macs til your stuffed, and the 1500 calories all goes to your gut.
point being, you need to eat healthy fresh foods. fruits, veggies, whole grains and lean meats. The occasional fast food is acceptable, but eating it consistently is NOT good for you anyway you cut it.
djeclipse
New member
This is one thing we can agree 110% on.
Eric1987, as dabuffguy already mentioned, you really have no idea how much you eat, but I can tell you that if you are not growing, and still at 165 you are not eating enough.
Fast food or good food, if you are eating enough you will grow, calories are claories as far as gaining weight goes.
But seriously, stay away form that fast food sh* t, there is so much preservatives and crap in that fast food it is poison.
Please watch this video of a 4 year old Mc Donalds burger and fries. It has so many preservatives in it, it looks like it was ordered yesterday. Even the bread is has no mold!
YouTube - McDonald's 4 Year Old Cheeseburger Video
Start keeping track of what you are eating, go to FitDay - Free Weight Loss and Diet Journal and keep track of the exact calories you are eating, let us know.
djeclipse
New member
What is your new goal?
This is one thing we can agree 110% on.
Eric1987, as dabuffguy already mentioned, you really have no idea how much you eat, but I can tell you that if you are not growing, and still at 165 you are not eating enough.
Fast food or good food, if you are eating enough you will grow, calories are claories as far as gaining weight goes.
But seriously, stay away form that fast food sh* t, there is so much preservatives and crap in that fast food it is poison.
Please watch this video of a 4 year old Mc Donalds burger and fries. It has so many preservatives in it, it looks like it was ordered yesterday. Even the bread is has no mold!
YouTube - McDonald's 4 Year Old Cheeseburger Video
Start keeping track of what you are eating, go to FitDay - Free Weight Loss and Diet Journal and keep track of the exact calories you are eating, let us know.
I've put on 25 pounds from the gym as it is. And my new goal is to bench 225 10 times. This is still one I want to achieve but after I get a lil further.
skullcrushin22
New member
3000 calories of whole foods is FAR greater than 5000 calories of garbage.PERIOD
I would start with 18-20 calories per lb. In your case 2970-3300 calories of whole foods(egg whites,oats,whole wheat bread,sweet potatoes,chicken,lean meats,fish,vegies)
Like I said in other threads. GO TO COSTCO. 10 lbs of chicken for like 18 bucks. 7 1/2 dozen eggs for like 11. Thats less that 30 bucks right there.
Anybody can make some gains on eating garbage but once you get to a higher level you will do nothing but go backwards.
I would start with 18-20 calories per lb. In your case 2970-3300 calories of whole foods(egg whites,oats,whole wheat bread,sweet potatoes,chicken,lean meats,fish,vegies)
Like I said in other threads. GO TO COSTCO. 10 lbs of chicken for like 18 bucks. 7 1/2 dozen eggs for like 11. Thats less that 30 bucks right there.
Anybody can make some gains on eating garbage but once you get to a higher level you will do nothing but go backwards.
djeclipse
New member
Unfortunately it seems Eric1987 may fall into the category of the typical "ask a question but don't listen to the answer" type poster here.
On a side note, you guys are lucky over there, here at cosco a 10lb box of chicken is almost 30.00.
I still eat healthy, it just costs more.
I'd move lol
My local meat market has boneless skinless chicken breast for $1.99 a pound always.
skullcrushin22
New member
30 bucks.damn thats a kick in the balls.
djeclipse
New member
It's Canada, everything cost more here, even in bulk.
djeclipse
New member
ha, true, but who is going to pluck it?
My GF would leave me if I came home with a chicken with a broken neck, plopped it on the counter and said "make this". lol
No not at all man I listen very closely I just need time to get everything sorted out I am going to be moving soon so this isnt the top priority but I'll definitely use this knowledge.
djeclipse
New member
Cool, keep us updated.
Ceros
New member
I usually go with Chicken but my dad and I are getting a Buffalo this weekend. 500lb, it's gonna be legit. Buffalo is really lean.
Nutrition Facts and Analysis for Game meat , bison, ground, raw [buffalo]
It has a little fat though...
Actually many other sources are telling me alot less fat...
http://www.thebuffaloguys.com/all_about_buffalo.asp
Nutrition Facts and Analysis for Game meat , bison, ground, raw [buffalo]
It has a little fat though...
Actually many other sources are telling me alot less fat...
http://www.thebuffaloguys.com/all_about_buffalo.asp
iron asylum
New member
I use to use a wide grip and ended up using alot of front delt instead of chest. I had to completely change up my grip and routine because my front delts had overdeveloped and were taking the workload away from my chest.
Oh for sure. I dont use a wide grip at all. Should I widen it to switch it up every now and then? Its MAYBE a bit bigger than shoulder width.
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