An issue I have with Maslow's hierarchy of needs

[KillahBee]

The most basic need is Physiological - check.

The third need (since it is basically a relatively linear theory) is Love/Belonging - check.

The top need, the highest of the "growth" needs is self actualization - check.

Issue - The basic concept here is that the higher needs only come into focus once all the needs that are lower down in the pyramid are mainly or entirely satisfied. Well, why is self actualization not a more basic need? What happens to the few people who are circuited so that Love/Belonging is flip-flopped with Self Actualization? Is this not a "healthier" line of development??

 

[Lestat]

sigmund freud in da house

 

[hanselthecaretaker]

Maslow's thought process was too....well, physiological. Must've been nice to have had it so easy.

 

[theoak01]

its a theory dude,it doesnt have to be correct,its just an idea

 

[KillahBee]

its a theory dude,it doesnt have to be correct,its just an idea

and theories are meant to be analyzed, broken down, rebuilt, and broken down again.

 

[theoak01]

agreed,I just dont believe his is correct,has some potential though, maybe he means in the end to be completely happy all those things must be present.

I think one can be self actualized without the others being there

 

[Smurfy]

and theories are meant to be analyzed, broken down, rebuilt, and broken down again.

OMG just like women!

 

[KillahBee]

OMG just like women!

lmfao - spot on, doctor

 

[swole]

i think people with your flip-flop theory are the ones who find love generally later than their peers, since they have taken the time to trully understand who they are and what it is they want before filling the voids

in essence these people are supplementing their happiness and acceptance with love, rather than trying to be happy and accepted via "love"

 

[heatherrae]

Just because it may be healthier that way doesn't mean most of us are wired that way. My life would have been easier had I put self actualization in front of love, for sure. I guess most peeps would have it easier that way.

 

[the-short-one]

physiological is at the bottom - satisfying hunger, shelter, etc. this is the most basic need for all beings, and the most important. you can't put self-actualisation ahead of feeding yourself.

 

[digimon7068]

It's as bad as the food pyramid. . .

 

[KillahBee]

Just because it may be healthier that way doesn't mean most of us are wired that way. My life would have been easier had I put self actualization in front of love, for sure. I guess most peeps would have it easier that way.

Well, I agree that most people are not wired that way (hence, the phrase "the few" I used).

Saying most people would have it easier that way is only taking the end result into consideration, IMO, for those that have gone thru the flip-flop (as I put it in the original post) went through a lot of challenging times on the journey. One has to demonstrate an immense amount of self control and foresight to be able to flip-flop needs like that. So, the end is all good and dandy but the means are hell in a hand basket

 

[KillahBee]

physiological is at the bottom - satisfying hunger, shelter, etc. this is the most basic need for all beings, and the most important. you can't put self-actualisation ahead of feeding yourself.

lol, did you read my post at all?!!!

 

[thelion2005]

The most basic need is Physiological - check.

The third need (since it is basically a relatively linear theory) is Love/Belonging - check.

The top need, the highest of the "growth" needs is self actualization - check.

Issue - The basic concept here is that the higher needs only come into focus once all the needs that are lower down in the pyramid are mainly or entirely satisfied. Well, why is self actualization not a more basic need? What happens to the few people who are circuited so that Love/Belonging is flip-flopped with Self Actualization? Is this not a "healthier" line of development??

And then as you get older ....
You are happy to wake up alive and in one piece.

I'm not joking. There will be a day when being alive is the only need,
and you really begin to appreciate everything.

 

[Smurfy]

Id like for BikiniMom to come in here and say a lil something

 

[swole]

physiological is at the bottom - satisfying hunger, shelter, etc. this is the most basic need for all beings, and the most important. you can't put self-actualisation ahead of feeding yourself.

LMFAO

 

[Spartacus]

http://i2.tinypic.com/1180gnm.jpg

 

[KillahBee]

And then as you get older ....
You are happy to wake up alive and in one piece.

I'm not joking. There will be a day when being alive is the only need,
and you really begin to appreciate everything.

It's like they say - elderly and infants are one and the same.

So the pyramid flips upside down in the end....

 

[heatherrae]

Well, I agree that most people are not wired that way (hence, the phrase "the few" I used).

Saying most people would have it easier that way is only taking the end result into consideration, IMO, for those that have gone thru the flip-flop (as I put it in the original post) went through a lot of challenging times on the journey. One has to demonstrate an immense amount of self control and foresight to be able to flip-flop needs like that. So, the end is all good and dandy but the means are hell in a hand basket

Well, perhaps it is harder to hold off of love and work on the self actualization. I'm not sure it would be harder though. Shit, I'll take your word on it. I have probably really screwed up at times and put it before the food, shelter clothing...etc...lol. I'm a fool when in love.

 

[the-short-one]

lol, did you read my post at all?!!!

lolol. i was reciting them in my head and typing at the same time. sorry.



this one could be debated forever...which came first - the chicken or the egg kind of thing.

and can you really say that life would be easier if you had self actualization before love? who here has not been loved first - from the moment they were born? it doesn't refer only to love in a relationship.

 

[KillahBee]

Well, perhaps it is harder to hold off of love and work on the self actualization. I'm not sure it would be harder though. Shit, I'll take your word on it. I have probably really screwed up at times and put it before the food, shelter clothing...etc...lol. I'm a fool when in love.

I believe (from experience) that it is VERY difficult. You are swimming against the stream, most around you do not even come close to understanding you, constantly misunderstood, and always made to feel like you are not "doing it the right way", even though deep down you know you are

 

[KillahBee]

lolol. i was reciting them in my head and typing at the same time. sorry.



this one could be debated forever...which came first - the chicken or the egg kind of thing.

and can you really say that life would be easier if you had self actualization before love? who here has not been loved first - from the moment they were born? it doesn't refer only to love in a relationship.

lol, old hag.

I agree, somewhat. I am reading it more along the lines of belonging and love later in life - after you have received the parental love (not that it ever ceases). Thinking more along the lines of typical friendships, BF/GF relationships, join-the-crowd mentality, etc

 

[hanselthecaretaker]

His theory is correct for himself and other people who've grown up with few bumps in the road. Others who were forced to take a detour have seen and experienced things that more or less force them to look at it all from a different angle.

 

[the-short-one]

the highest need is self-transcendence, above self actualisation.

self-transcendence = to connect to something beyond the ego or to help others find self-fulfillment and realize their potential

 

[heatherrae]

I believe (from experience) that it is VERY difficult. You are swimming against the stream, most around you do not even come close to understanding you, constantly misunderstood, and always made to feel like you are not "doing it the right way", even though deep down you know you are

yes, I get what you are saying. There is an old Chinese proverb which says, "The nail that sticks up gets pounded down." I've experienced that lots in my life. I'm sure that your friends who have gone against the grain have experienced the same thing.

 

[the-short-one]

lol, old hag.

I agree, somewhat. I am reading it more along the lines of belonging and love later in life - after you have received the parental love (not that it ever ceases). Thinking more along the lines of typical friendships, BF/GF relationships, join-the-crowd mentality, etc

my belief is that it's in the right order. I only speak from self experience.

 

[heatherrae]

His theory is correct for himself and other people who've grown up with few bumps in the road. Others who were forced to take a detour have seen and experienced things that more or less force them to look at it all from a different angle.

I never thought of it that way, but I believe you make a really valid point.

 

[KillahBee]

my belief is that it's in the right order. I only speak from self experience.

Oh I am not saying there is a right or wrong. Just opening it up for discussion. And that is how I perceived it.

Also, I know about the self-transcendence level. Not sure if it was in the original theory though. But I like it. A LOT

 

[the-short-one]

Oh I am not saying there is a right or wrong. Just opening it up for discussion. And that is how I perceived it.

Also, I know about the self-transcendence level. Not sure if it was in the original theory though. But I like it. A LOT

I agree. I think it's something everyone should strive towards.

 

[Smurfy]

I think Maslow is referring to the most basic form of Love & Belonging that comes from those who nurture you as you grow, not that which we seek out once we are physically mature.

 

[hanselthecaretaker]

I never thought of it that way, but I believe you make a really valid point.

There are varying degrees of it all though too. It could be complicated to really pick this apart.

 

[Spartacus]

I used to sit in the window and tan myself during psych class
the professor was kinda hot too

 

[KillahBee]

I think Maslow is referring to the most basic form of Love & Belonging that comes from those who nurture you as you grow, not that which we seek out once we are physically mature.

It has always been taught that he is talking about that kind of love AND the need for belonging and inclusion. Social needs.

 

[hanselthecaretaker]

I used to sit in the window and tan myself during psych class
the professor was kinda hot too

A hot psych prof....my mind's racing.

 

[Smurfy]

It has always been taught that he is talking about that kind of love AND the need for belonging and inclusion. Social needs.

I totally skipped that day.

 

[Spartacus]

A hot psych prof....my mind's racing.

I rarely commented in that class
actually only once
she was discussing some experiment which involved somehow bringing the animals to the precipice of orgasm
and then stopping
it was then I pointed out how this tactic violated an earlier lecture claim that animals aren't harmed in experiments

 

[hanselthecaretaker]

I rarely commented in that class
actually only once
she was discussing some experiment which involved somehow bringing the animals to the precipice of orgasm
and then stopping
it was then I pointed out how this tactic violated an earlier lecture claim that animals aren't harmed in experiments

.....and that was when she bellowed out an evil Cruella DeVille-esque laugh?

 

[KillahBee]

also, LMAO:

 

[Smurfy]

It has always been taught that he is talking about that kind of love AND the need for belonging and inclusion. Social needs.

I know people with HIGH inclusion needs.

 

[Spartacus]

.....and that was when she bellowed out an evil Cruella DeVille-esque laugh?

no I got a couple of chcukles from my buds
and all heads turned
and I continued to bask in the sun

 

[KillahBee]

also, LMAO:

Damn, perhaps this was a freudian slip, but up until a second ago I thought that said "revenue". but upon further inspection, I think it says "revenge".

wtf

 

[Island Son]

From my POV Maslow is correct. If you don't have some sense of place to begin with, you can't estimate whether or not it fulfills your needs; from participation in the status quo may come dissatisfaction and the desire to better yourself. Then when your sense of self is solid, you're secure enough to be able to help others (without losing yourself).

it's a hierarchy, therefore you can't have one without the lower one.

 

[heatherrae]

I just can't believe we are discussing Maslow's hierarchy in here. Very cool!

 

[swole]

From my POV Maslow is correct. If you don't have some sense of place to begin with, you can't estimate whether or not it fulfills your needs; from participation in the status quo may come dissatisfaction and the desire to better yourself. Then when your sense of self is solid, you're secure enough to be able to help others (without losing yourself).

it's a hierarchy, therefore you can't have one without the lower one.

i see your point, nice

 

[KillahBee]

From my POV Maslow is correct. If you don't have some sense of place to begin with, you can't estimate whether or not it fulfills your needs; from participation in the status quo may come dissatisfaction and the desire to better yourself. Then when your sense of self is solid, you're secure enough to be able to help others (without losing yourself).

it's a hierarchy, therefore you can't have one without the lower one.

Well said.

 

[swole]

i'd like to say that venturing off the status-quo line to better oneself doesn't mean being different for the sake of attention, it means being different because it's the harder, yet right thing to do (for yourself and possibly others)

a sharpened sense of self-realization and purpose

 

[Smurfy]

I dont know about anyone else, but I can certainly tell who went to college here.

 

[Spartacus]

it's a hierarchy, therefore you can't have one without the lower one.

fine by me

 

[JayC9]

And then as you get older ....
You are happy to wake up alive and in one piece.

I'm not joking. There will be a day when being alive is the only need,
and you really begin to appreciate everything.

Lion, you remind me of my grandad, (no offence) he also used to cut through all the bullshit and come out with some golden words of wisdom.

"Think to yourself that every day is your last; the hour to which you do not look forward will come as a welcome surprise." - Horace

 

[Spartacus]

Lion, you remind me of my grandad, (no offence) he also used to cut through all the bullshit and come out with some golden words of wisdom.

"Think to yourself that every day is your last; the hour to which you do not look forward will come as a welcome surprise." - Horace

and I just spent the last 20 minutes consuming a bowl of lima beans

 

[JayC9]

and I just spent the last 20 minutes consuming a bowl of lima beans

Super! You'll be feeling buttery full then.

 

[Island Son]

Lion, you remind me of my grandad, (no offence) he also used to cut through all the bullshit and come out with some golden words of wisdom.

"Think to yourself that every day is your last; the hour to which you do not look forward will come as a welcome surprise." - Horace

My grandad used to say (on the need for new experiences)
"Boy, listen, you can't(ie shouldn't) eat rice every day. Some days you have chicken, another day pork, or maybe some peas. But you can't eat rice every day".

 

[Spartacus]

My grandad used to say (on the need for new experiences)
"Boy, listen, you can't(ie shouldn't) eat rice every day. Some days you have chicken, another day pork, or maybe some peas. But you can't eat rice every day".

your grandad was dumb
he didn't include beer in his formulae

 

[Spartacus]

I ate a raw potato once while starving under the influence of beer
but that was a few years ago

 

[KillahBee]

Where's fucking dial tone? wasn't he looking for better threads??

 

[Spartacus]

Id like for BikiniMom to come in here and say a lil something

her 4 daughters can make a middle tier alone
not sure if the pyramid would be too sound though

 

[PICK3]

I feel I accomplish all of Maslow's hierachy right before I bust a nut.

 

[bran987]

her 4 daughters can make a middle tier alone
not sure if the pyramid would be too sound though

lmaooooooooooooooooooo
I thought it could only be odd numbers lmaoooooooooo

 

[WODIN]

What about astetics in India seeking self actualization through fundamental subsistance?

 

[KillahBee]

bump

 

[PICK3]

The need for teh poon wood be on top of my pyramid

 

[HenryLewis37]

I disagree that they go one then the other. I think the lower level needs "burn" more when they are not met, but I think you work on fulfilling multiple levels at the same time.

 

[PICK3]

I disagree that they go one then the other. I think the lower level needs "burn" more when they are not met, but I think you work on fulfilling multiple levels at the same time.

You’re knot Dr. Phil fgt

 

[jackangel]

Bunch of fucksticks in here.