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A Question on "Sin"...???

The Ranger

The Ranger

New member
Do you think there are levels of sin....In other words, is there such a thing as a small sin, and a big sin....do three small sins make up one large sin??

Or, is a sin a sin....No matter what it is, it's a sin just the same...??

Your thoughts.....?????

Ranger
 
personally i don't believe in mortal and venal and all the sins... i think sin is sin... bottom line however, what makes a sin a sin?
 
A sin is a sin.

How would you define it if there were different degrees of sin? Something one sees as a small sin, another person may see it as a big sin.
 
Plus every sin is forgiveable with the exception of blasphemy.

So in God's view, a sin is a sin or else you'd have to repent 5 times if you killed someone and maybe just 2 if you lied to someone. (hypothetically of course)
 
It depends on who you speak with, I believe that there are small sins, medium sins, and large sins

Small sin: Stealing
Medium sin: sodomizing your bed ridden grandfather
large sin: then killing you grandfather after you nutted in his clostomy bag

But then some people say masturbation is a sin, dirty thoughts are a sin. People say a sin is a sin, but how can they say masturbation and killing someone are the same because they are both sins.

I say if you feel remorse, you feel bad, or guilty, depending on the level that you feel thats how bad of a sin it was.

But everyone has a different perception of good and bad, but thats another story.
 
PoyeBoy said:
But then some people say masturbation is a sin, dirty thoughts are a sin. People say a sin is a sin, but how can they say masturbation and killing someone are the same because they are both sins.

I say if you feel remorse, you feel bad, or guilty, depending on the level that you feel thats how bad of a sin it was.
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I respect your view. IMO all sins are the same (in God's view). Now that's not to say that all sins are treated the same way. And what I mean by this is that murdering someone will have far greater consequences than having a lustful thought. We have the human law and punishment, emotional guilt, reaping what you sow, and infinate other consequences that goes along with committing the sin.
 
So, along this line of thinking, let's say....My wife walks out in an ugly dress, she is excited because she thinks it looks great, she asks me how it looks...I say GREAT...Now, I know I lied, but it was done to protect her feelings, therefore no malice intended....

Now, lets say the woman who drowned her five kids, just before she gets the chair asks for forgivness and is saved by our Lord....I however only told a small white lie....

therefore, I go to hell, and she goes to heaven....

Is this correct....???

Ranger
 
Another thought to ponder....Is a white lie a sin, if done without malice or personal gain..??

Is a white lie a sin if it is done for personal gain or favor....????

Ranger
 
Ranger:
Going to Heaven or Hell isn't dependent upon the good or bad a person does. Heard the saying "how do I know when I've been good enough (to make it into heaven).

A sin is wrong in the Lord's eyes. Wether it be killing five kids or telling a little white lie about a dress. EVERYONE SINS! We shouldn't judge others for their shortcomings (like killing 5 kids). If she is truly repentive/sorry and asks for forgiveness for the killings PLUS it is honestly in her heart to ask for forgiveness then yes, she will be forgiven. Just as you will if you ask forgiveness for your sins and work on bettering them/stopping.

Now, don't you think the woman that intentionally killed her kids will face great consequences....lost her freedom, living with the quilt (if she is ever truly regretful), lost any chance of a normal life, etc, etc.......
I don't think too great of consequences would come from you telling your wife the little white lie.
 
I think there is plenty of difference between stealing a candy bar and murdering someone.
 
I tend to agree Dr. M....Just curious as to what everyone else thinks...I know, all have sinned and come short of the glory of God....Just wondering if God has any Human instincts/qualities as he made us in his form...???

Ranger
 
The Ranger said:
Another thought to ponder....Is a white lie a sin, if done without malice or personal gain..??

Is a white lie a sin if it is done for personal gain or favor....????

Ranger
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Thou shall not lie. Thou shall not kill.
Both of theses are under the same thing, the 10 commandments. Now God didn't say 'thou shall not lie, but if you think it's for a good reason then go ahead....'

That's like a man sleeping with another man's wife, then saying "but her husband is a jerk to her" and thinks it's justified and alright to keep doing.
 
sorry, I don't believe that making love to someone before you are married is as bad as murdering 50 people. Just my view though
 
I agree my man, but...a small white lie is the same sin as comitting adultery....one is done without malice, and more along the lines of love, the other is done out of pure lust....

Ranger
 
We all come up short, because we are human. I have sinned plenty, and for that I am humble because I am far from perfect.
 
Sin, morality... right or wrong.

The universe is energy. Whatever energy you send out will be returned to you threefold.

If a lie is told and YOU KNOW it is a lie, right or wrong regardless of WHY it was told... it was a lie nonetheless.

Now one could say the same thing about murder. If I killed a man that I thought was going to kill/harm my child would the energy that I sent out be construed as negative or positive? A murder is STILL MURDER.... is it not?

But I did it to protect someone so then IT MUST BE RIGHT!

RIGHT?!

Life isn't always so cut and dry.... now IS IT?

For me is it about doing my best. If in the process of doing what I THOUGHT to be right, I find out that I FUCKED UP... then I sit and think about it, learn the lesson and

DO MY DAMNEDEST TO FIX WHATEVER IT IS THAT I FUCKED UP.

These are the standards that I live by because I know that I am human and regardless of how I try there are MANY TIMES that I make mistakes.

Sin, right, wrong, morality.... to ponder such things I think is expending precious energy in a frivolous fashion.


...just my .02
 
I never said that...

What I said was that it is all in YOUR PRECEPTION of YOUR BEHAVIOR as YOU WILL HAVE TO BE THE ONE TO LIVE WITH YOUR ACTIONS.

For example...

I read on another thread that a policeman took his own life after he learend that a bank robbery that he couldn't prevent (or something to that effect) resulted in the deaths of several others. The man left behind a wife and several children.

So now, SHE and HER CHILDREN will have to suffer for the rest of THIER LIVES because HE HAD ISSUE WITH HIS BEHAVIOR. IT HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH "RIGHT" OR 'WRONG".... but about HOW HE DEALT WITH IT IN HIS HEAD.

Again...

Only MY .02
 
i dont see how someone can see a sin as being the same around.
so stealling is just as bad as rappping some little girl or boy and murdering them?????
 
The Ranger said:
I agree my man, but...a small white lie is the same sin as comitting adultery....one is done without malice, and more along the lines of love, the other is done out of pure lust....

Ranger
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Ranger & Kali: There is a good point. I mean I feel that adultry is a terrible thing to do, and would never even come close to doing it. Same with murder. I have lied more times than D. Strawberry has snortted a line:D and that's a lot!

All are sins and only God can look into our hearts and see the true intentions behind our actions. Repentance and forgiveness are the only hope of escaping our sins which Jesus died for.

One thing I don't understand is when I've heard that there'll be different levels of heaven. I suppose for the number of good deads one does and how closely he/she follows Christ?????? I get confussed on that one.

DrM: I agree with you. Everyone sins and is far from perfect. Being humble and asking forgiveness is the only escape.
 
I dont see a problem in getting rid of murderers, but I know its debateable for alot of people, especially since innocent people are put to death still today. If someone is being so aggressive as to cause someone to be that afraid, again it is probably 'ok' at least IMO, but again not only is that debateable for others but you may have a tough time proving you felt that threatened, especially if your a guy.

If someone breaks into my home I think I should be able to shoot first instead of waiting for him to take my head off before I feel threatened, I think thats a bunch of BS.
 
The God that I worship is to us like we are to our children. My children know the rules. Some of the rules are more important than others and sometimes there are darn good reasons for breaking the rules. He also gave us a brain and a conscience which I think is a far better guide to right and wrong than a book that has been thru thousands of interpretations and translations many of which were motivated by the politics of the times. I think He trusted that he made us smart enough to know that some sins were worse than others and that there would be situations where the rules did not apply.
But that's just my .02
 
The Ranger said:
OK...So, if I can live with killing in a war, it's OK....??? Or am I wrong about your statement....???

Ranger
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Do you not understand what I am saying?

This isn't about ok or NOT OK... it is all about whether or not YOU PERSONALLY FEEL THE NEED TO CONTINUE TO TORTURE YOURSELF ABOUT YOUR OWN THOUGHTS AND DEEDS.

In a suicide bombing the assailant believes that their death will AUTOMATICALLY get them a ticket into heaven meanwhile countless innocent lives are lost. The assailant is dead and so are countless others, what will make this act right or wrong? The society that bred the assailant will hail their behavior as not only RIGHT and JUSTIFIED... BUT DIVINE AS WELL! The society who lost the countless innocent lives will condemn the act of violence as sinful and morally depraved.

WHO IS RIGHT AND WHO IS WRONG.

For me it is not that complex. I know that regardless of what my intentions are, there will be times when I will choose a path that will hurt others as well as myself. I can not prevent these circumstances REGARDLESS OF HOW HARD I TRY.

So, when these situations occur, I will try to learn the lesson the universe it teaching me, rectify whatever mistake I made and then MOVE ON.

It is when one lives with self-blame and self-torture that one is TRULY IN HELL.... So who cares about right or wrong/moral or immoral? If you are trapped in hell on earth, does it really matter?
 
The Ranger said:
OK...I can buy this....so, killing someone in a war is OK, but in the street is murder...???

Ranger
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As far as the Bible is concerned that's exactly right. The Bible is often misinterpreted, especially with respect to the commandment saying "Thou shalt not kill."

It actually says "Thou shalt not murder." There is a difference. In the Bible, God actually condones killing (as in war) on several occassions.
 
Ranger, I'm not even sure the Bible says telling a lie is a sin. The commandment says, "Thou shalt not bear false witness," which has been translating into "you are a sinner if you lie."

In my interpretation, it doesn't work like that. If you say that you saw one man kill his wife, when in realit it was another man, and you knew it, you are "bearing false witness."

If you tell someone thazt you like their new chicken recipe, when in reality you hate it, you are not "bearing false witness," you are actually doing a good deed.

I believe that God looks past the black and white, and goes down to our intentions in what we do.
 
bigguns7 said:
Ranger, I'm not even sure the Bible says telling a lie is a sin. The commandment says, "Thou shalt not bear false witness," which has been translating into "you are a sinner if you lie."

In my interpretation, it doesn't work like that. If you say that you saw one man kill his wife, when in realit it was another man, and you knew it, you are "bearing false witness."

If you tell someone thazt you like their new chicken recipe, when in reality you hate it, you are not "bearing false witness," you are actually doing a good deed.

I believe that God looks past the black and white, and goes down to our intentions in what we do.
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So you mean to tell me if I am a soldier and at the moment that I took the life of the enemy I was thinking, "Die YOU COMMIE BASTARD!" - taking the life of a father and husband who was only protecting the land that he was born on, then God would look past the fact that I just killed a scared young man who was only trying to defend his land from a foreign soldier that was only obeying HIS commanding officer who was only obeying HIS government that sent them thier to protect THIER political interest? Well, my intent WAS TO KILL HIM, so where does that leave me?
 
The Ranger said:
Temple....I like your answer the best so far.....

Ranger
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I agree Ranger. Good answer Temp.

I dont practive religion, so for me, I guess its about being a good person. We are ALL going to sin at some point in our lives, and if you are christian, you believe that Christ already died for these sins, right? I am sure that doesnt mean that you have a free pass to sin or anything, but we are human and its going to happen.

As far as war goes, that type of killing doesnt count. Any Christian that thinks it does needs to check history, becuase if it does, most Christian leaders will be going to hell.

As far as Rangers sins go, I hearby forgive you for any and all sins of your life my friend. You are one of the best friends I have and one of the greatest humans on the planet. The good you do for other people will wash away any petty sins that you have done throughout your life.

Ranger, you are a great person, famliy man and friend. *Now get back on your knees and show me you love me*;)
 
You already know the answers, God made you in the image of him/her/it's self. You have most if the traits. You sence of logic and common sence are part of it, as is the sence if humor but that is another thread.
 
Awwwwwwwwww Kronk...<sniff>...<sniff>......I luv ya man.......

Heh heh heh.......

Now, If I raped a woman with full intent of asking for forgivness, and was sincere in asking, would that negate the rape...???

Ranger
 
How could you ask such a question?

So you think that if you are sorry for something that you haven't done yet that autmotically negates your intentions?

Who could rape someone AFTER they were sorry for it BEFORE it was done?

The question itself PROVES that you are high at the moment.
 
The Ranger said:
Awwwwwwwwww Kronk...<sniff>...<sniff>......I luv ya man.......

Heh heh heh.......

Now, If I raped a woman with full intent of asking for forgivness, and was sincere in asking, would that negate the rape...???

Ranger
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I dunno...if your son set fire to your shed with full intent of asking your forgivness and was sincere when he asked would that negate the deed??? You are still without a shed..... some deeds cannot be undone, however, truly being sorry for an action normally leads to the person giving a greater contribution to the universe than the damage that they did. I do not believe that we will be judged on individual deeds but rather the sum total of our existence. Personally I would sooner or later forgive him if he was truly sorry and learned something from what he did but I would put the whoop to his sorry little behind first.
 
Temple01 said:


I dunno...if your son set fire to your shed with full intent of asking your forgivness and was sincere when he asked would that negate the deed??? You are still without a shed..... some deeds cannot be undone, however, truly being sorry for an action normally leads to the person giving a greater contribution to the universe than the damage that they did. I do not believe that we will be judged on individual deeds but rather the sum total of our existence. Personally I would sooner or later forgive him if he was truly sorry and learned something from what he did but I would put the whoop to his sorry little behind first.
Click to expand...

I wuv u T!
 
Bravo Bigguns7


Someone been reading the bible.........actaully the bible states alot about killing and whenand where.

A&E just did a whole series on it.
 
Good answer Temp.....So, I gather that God is understanding and looks not only at the sin, but what was in the heart at the time the sin was comitted....????

And no, I am not high, but I was last night when I thought of this question....heh heh heh, and also noticed that though I am right handed, I eat pizza with my left hand.....Go figure....

Ranger
 
I can't profess to having read the bible in any great depth, but common sense would suggest to me that being good to your fellow man would just about cover everything. Being good to your fellow man to me suggests that there are no 'degrees' of sin, that the bible doesn't distinguish between sins because it assumes that if we live by the word of the bible, that we do good unto each other anyway.

It is simply the law which has defined degree's of sin by apportioning different grades of punishment to different crimes. This then is filtered down and reflected by society in how we view and treat different sins, be it stealing, rape, murder, fraud, lying etc.
 
The Ranger said:
Good answer Temp.....So, I gather that God is understanding and looks not only at the sin, but what was in the heart at the time the sin was comitted....????

And no, I am not high, but I was last night when I thought of this question....heh heh heh, and also noticed that though I am right handed, I eat pizza with my left hand.....Go figure....

Ranger
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LOL you would be getting better answers out of me if I were high.
Yes, I believe he looks at that but and here is what most of us have trouble wrapping our brains around... He views it thru the eyes of an eternal being and views us in terms of our being eternal beings. Even our worst sin when viewed in the context of our eternal exisitence seems not to carry the same importance as it does when viewed in terms of a brief lifetime. IMO that is the answer to the question "How can a loving God allow bad things to happen". Anything that happens here is fleeting in terms of forever.
 
Rules for life, dont be a dick, be willing to learn from your mistakes, listen to others.
 
The Ranger said:
And no, I am not high, but I was last night when I thought of this question....heh heh heh, and also noticed that though I am right handed, I eat pizza with my left hand.....Go figure....

Ranger
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I know you TOO fucking well.

And Temple - I plea the fifth. :D
 
AHHHHHHHHHHMEN SISTA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:D



bikinimom said:
Sin, morality... right or wrong.

The universe is energy. Whatever energy you send out will be returned to you threefold.

If a lie is told and YOU KNOW it is a lie, right or wrong regardless of WHY it was told... it was a lie nonetheless.

Now one could say the same thing about murder. If I killed a man that I thought was going to kill/harm my child would the energy that I sent out be construed as negative or positive? A murder is STILL MURDER.... is it not?

But I did it to protect someone so then IT MUST BE RIGHT!

RIGHT?!

Life isn't always so cut and dry.... now IS IT?

For me is it about doing my best. If in the process of doing what I THOUGHT to be right, I find out that I FUCKED UP... then I sit and think about it, learn the lesson and

DO MY DAMNEDEST TO FIX WHATEVER IT IS THAT I FUCKED UP.

These are the standards that I live by because I know that I am human and regardless of how I try there are MANY TIMES that I make mistakes.

Sin, right, wrong, morality.... to ponder such things I think is expending precious energy in a frivolous fashion.


...just my .02
Click to expand...
 
bikinimom said:


So you mean to tell me if I am a soldier and at the moment that I took the life of the enemy I was thinking, "Die YOU COMMIE BASTARD!" - taking the life of a father and husband who was only protecting the land that he was born on, then God would look past the fact that I just killed a scared young man who was only trying to defend his land from a foreign soldier that was only obeying HIS commanding officer who was only obeying HIS government that sent them thier to protect THIER political interest? Well, my intent WAS TO KILL HIM, so where does that leave me?
Click to expand...

I'm just telling you what the Bible says. These questions really have too many sides for anyone to answer.
 
....if you have to wonder if you are/ have commited a sin - chances are you are or have.
 
nice quads corn buyt that pic always made me think you were about to curtsy
 
The real nut to bust is what sin leads to the pleathera of other sins or in other words, what is the root of evil?

Pride?
Lust?
Greed?
Envy?
Wraith?
Sloth?
Gluttony?

Which one leads to all others?
 
Wodin you simpleton... it isn't any one sin that is the root of all evil - MEN ARE! (And I ain' talkin' mankind neither... I am talking about the fellers w/pee-pees.)
 
Bikinimom you must be about to menstrate to come out with a statement like that. The root of all evil is a common thing shared by men and women. Surley you cannot say that your lust for a big rod to ride is the fault of some greedy man?
 
Have not read any replies, sorry if I am repeating an already posted answer, no one defines "sin" in the same fashion, there is difference in everything, even if it is a miniscule difference. Also, one must look at all that surrounded the sin, what was involved, who was involved, did the sin have any direct influence or was it impactless?
A sin is a sin, however, every sin is unique. peace
 
WODIN said:
Bikinimom you must be about to menstrate to come out with a statement like that. The root of all evil is a common thing shared by men and women. Surley you cannot say that your lust for a big rod to ride is the fault of some greedy man?
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Come on Wodin.... don't ya realize that I was yankin on your chains?! LOL

Just falling in line with the whole "All women are bitches and the root of all evil" theme that has been a REAL PLAYED OUT topic on the boards as of late.

As for me and menstruation, nope, don't got that affliction. Don't eat enough to bleed. :(
 
LOL!!! I know you well enough to know you were messing around. I was just playing girl. I am fascinated at the topic of this thread....

:)
 
The Ranger said:
So, in conclusion....Sin may be defined by humans, yet judged by God only....????

Ranger
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Sure, sin "may" be defined by humans, but it also is defined by God.
It would appear that in terms of salvation and related goals, God/The Force/The Energy is the judge. peace
 
The Ranger said:
So, in conclusion....Sin may be defined by humans, yet judged by God only....????

Ranger
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I don't think so. I think there is a good possibility that we will be given the ability to feel the full weight of our actions toward others and we will judge ourselves. The only purpose for our existence unless it is simply for the amusement of God would be learning and that learning somehow being applicable to a continued eternal existence. If that is the case then judging ourselves would make the most sense to me.
 
OK Temp, along those lines, by judging ourselves, can we put away our sin, abolish the filth that has built upon our souls in the eyes of God, and by doing so, will this have any effect on true forgivness...???

Ranger
 
Temple01 said:


The only purpose for our existence unless it is simply for the amusement of God would be learning and that learning somehow being applicable to a continued eternal existence.
Click to expand...

That is extremely profound and insightful.
 
The Ranger said:
OK Temp, along those lines, by judging ourselves, can we put away our sin, abolish the filth that has built upon our souls in the eyes of God, and by doing so, will this have any effect on true forgivness...???

Ranger
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You are basing your reasoning on the notion that there IS filth on our souls based on EARTHLY behavior....

A soul is divine and can not be sullied by anything that is of the earth. I truly believe this.

If we judge ourselves and do NOT allow ourselves forgiveness then it is my belief that what matters in the afterlife is of no consequence really as we are already trapped in hell.

If we recognize our shortcomings (sin, weakness or whatever you want to call it), reconcile and try to rectify the situations that were caused by this, and forgive ourselves for those shortcomings and the behavior that was a result of it AND WE LEARN... we WILL MOVE ON. THEN YES - THERE IS AN AFFECT ON TRUE FORGIVENESS. HOW CAN THERE NOT BE?

YOU HAVE LEARNED, TRY TO ACCOMPLISH SOMETHING POSITIVE AS A RESULT OF THIS KNOWLEDGE AND NOW YOU ARE MOVING AHEAD WITH LIFE MORE ENLIGHTENED THAN YOU WERE BEFORE THE "SIN".

It is really not very complicated at all.

Remember "beauty knows no pain".

Heaven and hell, rewards/punishment of the afterlife will really bear no singifigance on one's behavior if one realizes this.
 
The Ranger said:
OK Temp, along those lines, by judging ourselves, can we put away our sin, abolish the filth that has built upon our souls in the eyes of God, and by doing so, will this have any effect on true forgivness...???

Ranger
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The fact that your soul is capable of asking the question means that the answer is yes. Pose the same question with regard to things that your children do that are wrong. I never learned much from the good and right things that I did, now, the major screwups is a whole different story. I don't think God meant for us to waltz thru life without sin, without mistakes...what would be the purpose of our existence if that were the case? He designed us to be fallible....if you want to bring the bible into it...He knew that Adam was going to eat the apple, he is God after all and is all knowing. If he didn't want that to happen he would have designed us differenrtly.
 
Okay, I'm not really sure where this thread is going.....

but concerning different 'levels' of sin through a Christian view, here's your answer:

Thru God's eyes (and that is truly what matters) a sin is a sin, and all is forgivable with the exception of blasphemy:

Jesus said, "Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter; but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness" (Mark 3:28,29).

God DOES have regard for the suffering caused by great sin, but remember Christ endured the punishment for even the greatest cruelty. when he died on the cross.
 
bikinimom said:


You are basing your reasoning on the notion that there IS filth on our souls based on EARTHLY behavior....

A soul is divine and can not be sullied by anything that is of the earth. I truly believe this.

If we judge ourselves and do NOT allow ourselves forgiveness then it is my belief that what matters in the afterlife is of no consequence really as we are already trapped in hell.

If we recognize our shortcomings (sin, weakness or whatever you want to call it), reconcile and try to rectify the situations that were caused by this, and forgive ourselves for those shortcomings and the behavior that was a result of it AND WE LEARN... we WILL MOVE ON. THEN YES - THERE IS AN AFFECT ON TRUE FORGIVENESS. HOW CAN THERE NOT BE?

YOU HAVE LEARNED, TRY TO ACCOMPLISH SOMETHING POSITIVE AS A RESULT OF THIS KNOWLEDGE AND NOW YOU ARE MOVING AHEAD WITH LIFE MORE ENLIGHTENED THAN YOU WERE BEFORE THE "SIN".

It is really not very complicated at all.

Remember "beauty knows no pain".

Heaven and hell, rewards/punishment of the afterlife will really bear no singifigance on one's behavior if one realizes this.
Click to expand...

I don't entirely agree...there are some who refuse to learn, who's souls are covered in filth and do not care. This is where I do buy into the idea of reincarnation...a never ending series of do-overs until we get it...
 
alien amp pharm said:
Okay, I'm not really sure where this thread is going.....

but concerning different 'levels' of sin through a Christian view, here's your answer:

Thru God's eyes (and that is truly what matters) a sin is a sin, and all is forgivable with the exception of blasphemy:

Jesus said, "Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter; but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness" (Mark 3:28,29).

God DOES have regard for the suffering caused by great sin, but remember Christ endured the punishment for even the greatest cruelty. when he died on the cross.
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So, not all sins are forgivable then. If you were to blasphem towards God, you would never be forgiven, therefore why ponder the afterlife at all...??

Ranger
 
The Ranger said:


So, not all sins are forgivable then. If you were to blasphem towards God, you would never be forgiven, therefore why ponder the afterlife at all...??

Ranger
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LOL, I suppose so. According to the good book sad but true.:(
(blasphemy against the Holy Spirit)
 
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I don't know if they don't care or if they are just TOO WEAK to even TRY to remove the "filth" that would come off just about effortlessly,

IF THEY WEREN'T TOO AFRAID TO EVEN TRY.

In any event, I do believe in reincarnation and that we do keep getting sent back until we "get it".

I mean, regardless of whether our souls are shiny and new or covered in filth and grime of our own design... Does it REALLY MATTER IF WE ARE TO AFRAID TO EVEN SEE THE DIFFERENCE?!

I remember once I was too afraid to look deep within myself to see why it was that I was so consumed with the NEED to be unhappy. Why? Because I said, "What if I don't like what I find?" My wise friend told me, "Well then, you can just CHANGE IT."

So there was never REALLY and filth on my soul. I ASSUMED it was there from the time I was very young and was too fucking afraid to really look for myself and see. Why? Well, because what if I looked and it REALLY WAS FILTHY? Didn't that mean that for all my good intentions that I REALLY WAS A BAD PERSON and that I would AUTOMATICALLY GO TO HELL?!

I looked and guess what? Whatever filth that I carried all these years wasn't a big deal after all! There was NO PERMANENT DAMAGE of any sort.... whatever soil was there came off very easily and I realized for the first time since I was young that I am a good person and that I not only WANT to be happy, BUT DESERVE IT.

Now when I make mistakes (GOD! HOW I MAKE MISTAKES LOL!) I sit back, reflect and try to learn the lesson that was designed FOR ME, try to rectify the situation and MOVE ON. If I need to ask another party's forgiveness, I do. If I need to forgive myself - I DO.

Life is not about torture and punishment. It is about experiences, learning and happiness. Will their be suffering and pain along the way? Hell yes. How could one have joy if they do not know pain.

A wise friend once told me that those who were capable of the most good were also capable of the most evil. So if I accept this then I must also accept that there is a fair amount of evil WITHIN ME. This does not mean that I AM EVIL. It means that I need to think before I act and realize what motivations and intentions TRULY guide my thoughts and deeds. I am human. I WILL make mistakes. As long as I learn and move forward and hurt no one intentionally in the process then all is right in the universe.
 
The Ranger said:


So, not all sins are forgivable then. If you were to blasphem towards God, you would never be forgiven, therefore why ponder the afterlife at all...??

Ranger
Click to expand...

There is no such thing as an unforgivable sin.

I am sorry, but I just don't buy that.
 
bikinimom said:


There is no such thing as an unforgivable sin.

I am sorry, but I just don't buy that.
Click to expand...

Then who forgives YOUR sins?

(Sorry but I get kinda lost interperting some of your responses, no offense)

Do you believe that God forgives sin? Do you believe in the bible?
(again this is not negative, just a question)
 
The Ranger said:


So, not all sins are forgivable then. If you were to blasphem towards God, you would never be forgiven, therefore why ponder the afterlife at all...??

Ranger
Click to expand...

That's where you have to decide if you are going to take religious texts literally in their interpreted versions. If that is the case then some would consider much of what I have typed here as blasphemous so I guess I am toast. For me, one of the most freeing revelations was that we were all created equal, we each have the same ability to connect witht the divine, however we perceive it, that Moses, Abraham, Mathew, Mark, Buddha or Mohamad did. Their words are gifts to be considered and pondered but IMO they are really about their relationship with their God. WE don't need books or translators, all we need is a sincere desire to understand....
 
alien amp pharm said:


Then who forgives YOUR sins?

(Sorry but I get kinda lost interperting some of your responses, no offense)

Do you believe that God forgives sin? Do you believe in the bible?
(again this is not negative, just a question)
Click to expand...

There is NO SIN that is unforgiveable, if I am TRULY SORRY then I will be forgiven PERIOD. No ifs, ands or buts.

As for the bible. I did study it in catechism, four years of catholic high school and some in college. It is a text that has been translated GOBS of times by many different people, many with different "agendas". So I don't believe that much of it can be taken literally.... much like art or poetry.

I believe that it is only a guide and that we are ALL to be held accountable for our own happiness just as much as we are to be held accountable FOR OUR OWN BEHAVIOR.

It really isn't all that complicated.

"And do ye no harm"

"Whatever energy you send out into the universe will be returned to you threefold"

No hellfire or brimstone or day of reckoning. It is all about personal responsibility. Why would I TRY to do the right thing (remember, the road to hell is paved with good intentions)? Because I am afraid that I will be punished if I do not?

NO - because it WILL BENEFIT ME IN THAT I WILL BE HAPPY.

It isn't about the afterlife at all. I am more concerned with MY LIFE NOW...

I'll worry about the afterlife when I am dead and I don't intend to BE DEAD for a looooooooooooong time! :D
 
Ranger Darlin'...we've all done alot of blabbering on your thread.....so, how about you tell us what you think....
 
Bikinimom: Thanks for clarifying. I may disagree on most of it, but I respect your thoughts.:bigkiss:

Temple01 said:
Ranger Darlin'...we've all done alot of blabbering on your thread.....so, how about you tell us what you think....
Click to expand...

Wow, we all did blabber on and on didn't we? Oh well, I enjoyed it. Peace everyone.
 
bikinimom said:

As for the bible. I did study it in catechism, four years of catholic high school and some in college. It is a text that has been translated GOBS of times by many different people, many with different "agendas". So I don't believe that much of it can be taken literally.... much like art or poetry.
Click to expand...

I agree, not only do parts of the bible contradict itself (depending which diciple speaks), but its been burned and edited so many times who knows what of it you can believe anymore. Man has corrupted it IMO, so I go by seat of the pants for the most part nowdays.
 
Dr M, Alien Pharm Animal and all the others who shared their thoughts... that is what makes intelligent discourse so enjoyable. We have exchanged ideas, refined our own thoughts and perhaps became a bit enlilghtened.

I always respect the opinions of others and thier right to express them... and also agree to disagree!

How boring would the world be if we all thought the same?

I believe that new ideas are born out of conflict and debate. :)
 
I must agree, and when blazed I ponder certain things, among my favs, the Bible and Christanity....a few other thoughts I have pondered....

1. After the great flood, did Noah and his kin commit incest to re-populate the world, much as Adam and Eve perhaps did with their offspring.

2. Dinosaurs

3. Abraham's wife(Sarah) was barren, therefore he went among the slaves and concieved a child...was this not adultry?

4. Some of the recent discoveries of early man makes you wonder about Adam and Eve and the garden of Eden.

5. Mary and Joseph were married, yet they did not consumate the marraige on their wedding nite?

Again, this is thinking on the lines of mortal man....

Heh heh heh

Ranger
 
Pondering thoughts....Enjoy


Pilate's Dream

A church bell rings, a child dies
And no one even cares or cries
A church bell rings, a teacher burns
No one cares... and no one learns

The One was here but now is gone
On pilgrimage to hell
The darker ones had come for Him
He tried to stand but fell

A church bell rings, a leader dead
And no one cares what men he led
A church bell rings, a soul is sold
And no one feels the creeping cold.

The One is dragged down darker path
The dark ones take His soul
He bleeds and dies, the dark ones laugh
And throw Him in the hole.

A church bell rings, a shepherd murdered
And no one cares what sheep he herded
A church bell rings, a fisher drowned
And no one saw the pearls he found

The One falls in the lake of fire
And burns out in a flame
And no one ever hears him weep
as he cries his father's name

A church bell rings, and a savior is crucified.

Ranger
 
I love discussion, I hate fights, problem is many people are so threatened by hearing other ideas they end up getting pissy. While I may never agree on a point someone is speaking about, there is no reason to get pissy about it :D

Discussion is fun, arguments are lame, I just walk away most of the time.
 
The Ranger said:
I must agree, and when blazed I ponder certain things, among my favs, the Bible and Christanity....a few other thoughts I have pondered....

1. After the great flood, did Noah and his kin commit incest to re-populate the world, much as Adam and Eve perhaps did with their offspring.

2. Dinosaurs

3. Abraham's wife(Sarah) was barren, therefore he went among the slaves and concieved a child...was this not adultry?

4. Some of the recent discoveries of early man makes you wonder about Adam and Eve and the garden of Eden.

5. Mary and Joseph were married, yet they did not consumate the marraige on their wedding nite?

Again, this is thinking on the lines of mortal man....

Heh heh heh

Ranger
Click to expand...

We need to get high and hang out sometime ROFLMAO
 
Heh heh heh...It would definately be a blast babe...Another little question, I read last night where only two mortal men went from Earth, straight to Heaven....Can you name them???

And no, not Jesus....Heh heh heh

Ranger
 
The prophet Elijah was taken to heaven by angels in a flaming chariot without having died a mortal death.

Was the other not the Virgin Mary? Did she not also ascend into heaven without first having died?
 
OOPS! I goofed on the Mary thing. She first died and was ressurected, ascended to heaven where her body and spirit were reunited.

But, the Prophet Elijah - I KNOW FOR FACT I AM CORRECT.


Hey, what do you want? I was raised a protestant!

As for another guess as to who the other man was... would it have been one of the twelve apostles... perhaps Peter? I KNOW it could not have been Judas Iscariat - that fucking sellout LOL!
 
Enoch in the old testament (I think)

Jesus in the new testament (after the resurection).

In the Koran Mohammed ascended to heaven at the site of the mosque in Mecca.
 
Sometimes I ease drop in the books of Enoch, good stuff.

Reason for ascension is the 100% level of "in touchness" with the Universe, complete understanding.

Rise above!
 
The Ranger said:
I must agree, and when blazed I ponder certain things, among my favs, the Bible and Christanity....a few other thoughts I have pondered....

1. After the great flood, did Noah and his kin commit incest to re-populate the world, much as Adam and Eve perhaps did with their offspring.

2. Dinosaurs

3. Abraham's wife(Sarah) was barren, therefore he went among the slaves and concieved a child...was this not adultry?

4. Some of the recent discoveries of early man makes you wonder about Adam and Eve and the garden of Eden.

5. Mary and Joseph were married, yet they did not consumate the marraige on their wedding nite?

Again, this is thinking on the lines of mortal man....

Heh heh heh

Ranger
Click to expand...

I'd be interested to hear some thoughts on the answers to these questions especially 1 & 3. I am pretty sure that the dinasaur bones were put here by Satan in an attempt to lead us astray. I'll have another one for you to mull over later, I have to go look it up...
 
Wait a minute - Wodin and Havoc get and "OUTSTANDING" for Enoch and I get a "Yup" for Elijah?.... I even told ya how the fucker made the transition.

That hurts.

*sniff*



As for the answer to question number 3, the answer is NO. It was perfectly accetable for a man to keep "concubines" in addition to his wife. Sarah was barren and could not produce an heir so Abraham didn't really "go amongst the slaves", he chose Haagar to be his concubine.

Concubines were sort of like lower class wives. If the offspring that the wife produced was not able to succeed the father, as was the case w/Sarah and Abraham as she was barren, then any offspring the concubine produced (in this case Haagar bore I believe it was Ishmael) would be the rightful heir. You all can imagine how pissed off Haagar was when Sarah DID finally concieve and bear a son and vice versa how much Sarah was in a hurry to get rid of Haagar and her son! Haagar and her son were then entitle to NADA and Sarah made damned sure that HER SON was THE ONLY one around. I believe that she somehow got rid of them by sending them packing or something like that.

This is where the muslim religion splinters from Judaism.
 
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