4 day split advice

[SoreArms]

Please dont move this to the training board, I'm gonna post it there too, but this way I get some quick answrs here and then let the training board ansewers trickle in.

So, I was previously doing a 3 day split, got a second job which sometimes only left time and energy for a 1 day or no day a week workout. I will soon have mon-thurs evenings off and want to switch to a 4 day split.

With the 3 day split I was doing the traditional chest and tris, back and bis, legs and shoulders routine. With a 4 day split I'm looking to decrease gym time per day (about 1 hour, instead of 1 1/2 or 2 hours per day) and give arms heir own day. Since all four days will be back to back, I fear that there is not enough time for my arms to recovers in between workouts.

How does this split look? Does that look like it will over train my arms (not enough recovery time)?

Mon-Back (Sine Monday seems to be international chest day)
Tues- Chest
Weds-Legs
Thurs- Arms and shoulders

 

[Dial_tone]

I used to do this:
Day 1 - Chest, delts
Day 2 - Back (with rear delts)
Day 3 - Arms, abs
Day 4 - Legs

I've always liked doing delts right after chest because they're already warmed up so I can go heavy.

 

[powerslave]

I like either of those two. I was going to suggest to keep leg day all to itself.

 

[SoreArms]

I used to do this:
Day 1 - Chest, delts
Day 2 - Back (with rear delts)
Day 3 - Arms, abs
Day 4 - Legs

I've always liked doing delts right after chest because they're already warmed up so I can go heavy.

Ever have problems with having your arm work out on day 3? It seems that it would not provide enough time for recovery from the stimulation they get on chest and back exercises, that's why I want to place legs in day 3 and arms day 4.

 

[Dial_tone]

I often skip arm day altogether or I just do 4-6 sets for them. I don't want them much bigger; it's killing my flexibility.

 

[gymtime]

The split looks fine to me. Can you get an off day in there somewhere?

 

[MAX 300]

I was gonna suggest to skip legs.





WHAT?

 

[Dial_tone]

This week i'm switching to:

chest, delts, triceps
cardio
back, biceps
cardio
legs
cardio

with a rest day whenever I need one. I really start to drag after 2-3 straight days of lifting.

 

[RottenWillow]

Please dont move this to the training board, I'm gonna post it there too, but this way I get some quick answrs here and then let the training board ansewers trickle in.

So, I was previously doing a 3 day split, got a second job which sometimes only left time and energy for a 1 day or no day a week workout. I will soon have mon-thurs evenings off and want to switch to a 4 day split.

With the 3 day split I was doing the traditional chest and tris, back and bis, legs and shoulders routine. With a 4 day split I'm looking to decrease gym time per day (about 1 hour, instead of 1 1/2 or 2 hours per day) and give arms heir own day. Since all four days will be back to back, I fear that there is not enough time for my arms to recovers in between workouts.

How does this split look? Does that look like it will over train my arms (not enough recovery time)?

Mon-Back (Sine Monday seems to be international chest day)
Tues- Chest
Weds-Legs
Thurs- Arms and shoulders

definitely work arms, delts, and pecs on the same day. That'll maximize recovery time for those groups, particularly arms.

 

[supersizeme]

this is my favorite 4 day split specificaly because i feel it gives me the best bang for my buck with arms

mon - chest, bis
tue - legs
thu - shoulders/tris
fri - back

ideally you'd want a day off in the middle of the four day split so that your tris and front delts are fresh for shoulder/tri day, not to mention your body will be pretty fried from pounding it four days in a row - especially a week in which you both squat and deadlift.

 

[SoreArms]

I would definately like to throw in a day off in between, but the way my schedule is going to pan out, I'd rather not. I'm gonna try it 4 days in a row for a week or two and see how it works out for me. If it seems a bit too much, then I'll throw an off day in between and use Saturday mornings as a workout day.

maybe
Mon. - Back
Tues- Legs
Thrus-Chest
Sat.- Arms

or something like that.

 

[SoreArms]

this is my favorite 4 day split specificaly because i feel it gives me the best bang for my buck with arms

mon - chest, bis
tue - legs
thu - shoulders/tris
fri - back

ideally you'd want a day off in the middle of the four day split so that your tris and front delts are fresh for shoulder/tri day, not to mention your body will be pretty fried from pounding it four days in a row - especially a week in which you both squat and deadlift.

why chest and bi's together, isn't it more traditional and logical to do chest and tris?

 

[SoreArms]

Also, I want to start doing deads on back day, but I squat on leg day. Should I alternate deads and squats, like this week do deads and no squats, next week do squats and no deads, etc..... I think doing both on the same week might be over kill, no? Somethign about certain muscle groups being over worked, maybe I'm just making it up.

 

[gymtime]

why chest and bi's together, isn't it more traditional and logical to do chest and tris?

There's no law that says you have to do chest and tris, back and bis all the time. I always switch them up after ten weeks or so.

 

[MrMuscle]

it looks good to me.
id work shoulder before arms though.
And i wouldnt do to much exercises on the arms. Maybe 2 for tri and 2 for bi.

 

[SoreArms]

There's no law that says you have to do chest and tris, back and bis all the time. I always switch them up after ten weeks or so.

understood but techincally, when you work your chest your tris get hit pretty hard too, so it makes sence to do tris after chest, same with back and bis. It just takes less to exhaust them.

it looks good to me.
id work shoulder before arms though.
And i wouldnt do to much exercises on the arms. Maybe 2 for tri and 2 for bi.

thanks bud, so you see no problem with the proximity of the workouts?

 

[supersizeme]

why chest and bi's together, isn't it more traditional and logical to do chest and tris?

I was a big believer in this traditional thinking until I tried a chest/bi split. I had always done bis after back, and by the time I started bis after my back routines were done, they were so shot from pulling that I never felt like I really nailed them. Doing them after chest means you start with the bis fresh and can hit curling movements with the maximum weight they are capable of. The same goes with hitting tris after shoulders instead of chest. The overhead pressing movement warms up the tris, but doesn't actually tax them to the extent that benching does. For me, I get the best results from hitting a muscle group with as much weight as possible. Hence why I always hit compound movements first when I'm fresh. I've never been a fan of pre-exhaustion for that reason.

This logic is why I won't do weighted pullups and bent over bb rows(the two kings of back exercises besides deads) after deadlifts. Deadlifts tax me too much and drain too much energy for me to be able to use a decent amount of weight on pullups and bb rows. Thus I deadlift every other week and use the off week to hit weighted pullups and bb rows with maximum effort.

 

[gymtime]

understood but techincally, when you work your chest your tris get hit pretty hard too, so it makes sence to do tris after chest, same with back and bis. It just takes less to exhaust them.

Agreed. But to me, avoiding rut and repetition is infinitely more important than the time it takes to exhaust a muscle group. So it takes you an extra set or two. That's nothing in comparison to the problems associated with doing the same workout for months on end.

 

[MrMuscle]

thanks bud, so you see no problem with the proximity of the workouts?

No, but i would maybe start my week off with chest instead of back, so that my front delts would get 2 whole days of rest before getting hit again.

 

[chewyxrage]

day 1 - shoulders/traps/abs/calves
day 2 - chest/back
day 3- bis/tris
day 4 - quads/forearms/calves

that is what I have been doing untill about the last 2 weeks, now I've switched to a 5-day split, and I use the extra day to break up chest/back (that was my longest and most exhausting day)
My hams get really sore from deads on back day, so i don't do any ham movement besides that.


I agree with what SSME said.....after benching there is no way I could hit Tri's effectively (especially being closed grip bench is my #1 tri movement) and the same for training biceps on back day.

 

[supersizeme]

Also, I want to start doing deads on back day, but I squat on leg day. Should I alternate deads and squats, like this week do deads and no squats, next week do squats and no deads, etc..... I think doing both on the same week might be over kill, no? Somethign about certain muscle groups being over worked, maybe I'm just making it up.

Squat every single week. Never have a leg day without squats. Skipping squats is like going to a titty bar and not getting a lap dance. You're left feeling empty. Unless you're Mr. Muscle and you're tired of getting runs in your hose each session and thus resign yourself to the leg press machine for the duration of your lifting career.

Deadlift every other week on your back day. I burned out pretty quickly from doing deads every single week, plus you can't get in decent pullups and rows after deads like I mentioned in my earlier post.

 

[chewyxrage]

Squat every single week. Never have a leg day without squats. Skipping squats is like going to a titty bar and not getting a lap dance. You're left feeling empty. Unless you're Mr. Muscle and you're tired of getting runs in your hose each session and thus resign yourself to the leg press machine for the duration of your lifting career.

Deadlift every other week on your back day. I burned out pretty quickly from doing deads every single week, plus you can't get in decent pullups and rows after deads like I mentioned in my earlier post.

I do all pulling movements first and then end with 5 sets of deads every week.

How many sets of deads and what rep scheme do you do?

 

[supersizeme]

while i was bulking, i was deadlifting every other week and alternating heavy and high rep sessions.

week 1(heavy): 4 sets of 5 increasing weight by 20lbs each set with the final set being maximum effort. it's a feat if i can pull off the 5th rep of that last set
week 2: no deads
week 3(high rep): 3 sets at 10,8,6 with 20lb increments. some people aren't fans of high rep deads due to form breakdown late in the set, but i do them. torturous though
week 4: no deads
back to week 1

these days i'm cutting and still do bi-monthly deads, but stick to the 4 sets of 5 reps scheme. due to cutting and having minimal carbs in me for workouts, i cut out high rep deads due to how taxing they are. they made a honkey almost faint the first time i tried them low-carb style.

you should give it a shot if you are growing bored with your current back routine

 

[chewyxrage]

interesting.

I just do 5 sets -

set 1 - 10 reps
set 2 - 8 reps
set 3 - 6 reps
set 4 and 5 - 5 reps (these two sets are basically worksets, the weight doesn't change but it is as heavy as I can possibly go) I guess sets 1,2,and 3 are basically warm up sets although 2 and 3 feel heavy as fuck.

 

[SoreArms]

sweet, thanks buds

now all I need is Dial Tone to meet me at the gym sometime and show me how to dead lift. Come on bor, I need a mentor.

 

[MrMuscle]

Unless you're Mr. Muscle and you're tired of getting runs in your hose each session and thus resign yourself to the leg press machine for the duration of your lifting career.

I hat you!
Thought I wouldnt see that huh?

 

[Dial_tone]

sweet, thanks buds

now all I need is Dial Tone to meet me at the gym sometime and show me how to dead lift. Come on bor, I need a mentor.

I'm still doing lunges with the pink dumbbells, mang. Gimme a few months to remember how to deadlift myself first.