18th Bday today, and training for future! any help appreciated :)

[super_rice]

Hi guys, if you haven't noticed I've been away for a while. Training in the past two weeks have been a bit sporatic, and haven't actually been in the gym since Monday. I decided I needed a little break, just to relieve all the stress that's been buiding up in my life. Prom night was thursday anyway In the past couple of days I haven't had much sleep, including a good 4 hour hockey game in the middle of the night. Visited my university, got drunk, partied, all the regular stuff.

ANyway, in about an hour or so I'm going to go do 1rep maxes on deads, squats, and bench. Hopefully I can get a 245 bench, 325+ squat, and 405 deadlift. I had hoped to do it all before my 18th birthday, but it's ok to do it on the day of, i guess

So regardless of how the next few hours turn out, I am excited about the summer coming, because it means lots of time to train! I am really torn between Korte's 3x3 and the Smolov.

Ideas?

I plan on trying out for Mac's volleyball team in September (and perhaps being the shortest player there), so I'd prefer to have a very low volume last 2-3 weeks of August so I can concentrate on plyo and specific skills for the game. Oh, and also to drop a bit of weight to play my position (setter/lib)

I hope y'all didn't miss me

 

[Sub-Zero]

ig given too much karma in the last 24 hours so ill save up and hit you when u post again about how you just destroyed your 1rm goals, and then some.

 

[dahamn]

HAPPY BIRTHDAY......Good Luck.


Dave

 

[big4life]

Welcome back and happy birthday!!!

 

[blut wump]

Happy Birthday.



Go destroy those old PRs.

 

[Tom Treutlein]

A little late, but happy birthday. Hopefully you enjoyed it.

I guarantee that if you blew out cnadles, your wish was to break your PRs.

 

[casualbb]

happy bday man! I couldn't give you k, apparently i did recently.

so instead i'll give you advice.

18 seems cool, but in reality it blows:
anything you can now buy (cigarettes, lottery tickets? i don't even know what else) you could have gotten anyway.
and now you can go to jail. So be good.

Oh yeah and those 16 year olds are now off limits. yeah i know, it hurts

j/k, sorta.

 

[super_rice]

hey guys. thanks for the words of encouragement.

i'd really like some input on how to proceed with the upcoming weeks though.


little update about what happened yesterday:

the PRs put a little damper on my birthday celebrations. it turns out i'm not anywhere as strong as i thought i was.

bp: 225 - this shot up, but i failed on 245 and 235

full squat: 295 - missed 315, i took two attempts. it felt sooooooooooooo light on my back like i could have thrown it through the roof but it's like i had no push or will to grind through or something. i tried to go deeper than usual though, just for the glory (i love deep deep squats), but that probably contributed to my loss of tension. i came up about half way both times and definately should have locked out... just didn't.

deadlift: 350 - missed 365. wtf, this is complete bullshit. again it was as if i touched a wall and then my muscles refused to grind through. i seem to have lost the ability to keep going once i get to the sticking point.

i'm very disappointed, all the weight felt completely light as hell in hand/on my back, but it's like my body would not respond. i failed on pussy weight. it's completely unacceptable, this is part of the reason why i want to run smolov this summer. i refuse to go to university being pinned down by three wheels. i do not think those weights, 245, 325, 405 are out of my reach. i think they are well within my capabilities and yet i would not perform. seems to be like a recurring nightmare in recent times. (shot put...)

btw, about shotput, my crap throw would have put me 10th in the province but i didn't didn't throw that at the qualifier. perhaps i was born to choke?

 

[Sub-Zero]

that sucks that you didnt get your goals, but thats still some pretty impressive weight bro...


i know what you mean by seemingly you can do it but that you just puss out and give up. i used to get scared and psych myself out before max attempts and just crash under easy weight. its for this reason i dont even bother with maxes anymore.

also, just a suggestion, you may already do it, but if yous tart to feel yourself get psyched out for a max, or any set, what i do is i find smething thats pissed me off recently, put on loud music, and just focus on it and grind my teeth and stair into my memories untill i literally cant see anymore, slam myself into position (lets say onto the bench) grab the weight as tight as i can and blind myself with rage and just lift it. half the time i dont even remember getting the weight up though, i just remember it going down and appearing back up

 

[curgeo]

Happy Bday. If I can be any help please feel free to ask.

 

[coolcolj]

the problem with smolov is that its not meant for drug free folks or anyone with a life

the shortned base cycle can work nicely leading into a strength speed phase. That's what I did to bump my fullsquat from about 275 to 345lbs in a couple of months
But I used bands, and it was 3+ weeks of hell just squatting, high volumes. My knees and hips didn't like it too much. Takes a lot of will power, sleep and food. I ended up getting fatter here, and I still haven't reversed it yet

In any case it's just a very intense loading cycle, and then I unlaoded with speed squats for a month.

 

[super_rice]

yes this is what i've heard about it too. when you read the cycle you'd think...can it be done without drugs?

i want to try it though just to see if it can be done. i've had only one or two training sessions in the last two weeks. do i need the initial two week microcycle to get my squat up to par? or should i just jump into it?

reference: http://www.ontariostrongman.ca/Resources/training/smolovsquatcycle.htm

also, will i be alright to just add in an additional exercise per day? ie: monday - bench, wednesday - deadlift, friday - chinup, etc? and then rep ranges like 3 sets of 5...

i think it can be done, if i put my life on hold for a little while. especially since the summer is coming up. if i dedicate july to the base volume cycle...

 

[Madcow2]

yes this is what i've heard about it too. when you read the cycle you'd think...can it be done without drugs?

i want to try it though just to see if it can be done. i've had only one or two training sessions in the last two weeks. do i need the initial two week microcycle to get my squat up to par? or should i just jump into it?

reference: http://www.ontariostrongman.ca/Resources/training/smolovsquatcycle.htm

also, will i be alright to just add in an additional exercise per day? ie: monday - bench, wednesday - deadlift, friday - chinup, etc? and then rep ranges like 3 sets of 5...

i think it can be done, if i put my life on hold for a little while. especially since the summer is coming up. if i dedicate july to the base volume cycle...

Happy Birthday! (belated, I don't know how I missed your thread - bummer on the lifts but that's what screwing around sporadically for a few weeks can do to you before attempting maxes, out of groove and a lot of "almost" and "I wonder why").

Anyway, In your situation I honestly think the 3x3 is a far better choice. Korte's program is damn hard all in it's own right and it will get your lifts up nicely. The Smolov is really intended for people with serious work capacity and even those are pushed to their limit (drugged or not). Save it for later or during the year when you want to hammer on the base for 4 weeks to get the feel of it. BTW - you should absolutely do the 2 week accomodation period beforehand. I think you'll get more out of your lifts by pushing the Smolov off for a while.

Believe me, I know how tempting challenges are but the volume is so high and so much of it at relatively high intensities that you are likely going to bury yourself very very quickly. The Starr 5x5 program is scaled down with pyramids and I've encouraged people to be conservative. Even with the lower volume a lot of people have been pushed very hard by that program when in reality they maybe had a single week of what I'd consider true loading in there. I don't put in percentages so that people can go by feel and so that it doesn't spiral out of control for less experienced lifters or be too easy for those with a bit more experience. The Smolov is explicit in the weights required (i.e. percentages), and it is designed for someone with A LOT of training experience and conditioning. It's the equivalent of high school vs. the pros and even the pros will be pushed to their limits.

The Korte program is hard enough (also with explicit percentages) - especially when the dead is one of your better lifts. Run that and work up over time. I don't want to be discouraging but I'd prefer to not see you waste your time or beat yourself up doing something that's not really appropriate yet. Believe me, I've run programs that were out of my league before and it's just a piss waste and you wind up burned/slashing volume all over the place trying to salvage it and essentially having to start all over again.

Then again, you learn by doing so maybe there is some merit. Either way, keep us posted and good luck.

 

[wnt2bBeast]

Happy Birthday..
if the 3 lifts are your main goal why not look inot a Westside based program?
its NOT a coincidence that they dominate powerlifting..

WSB can be done for a raw lifter

 

[super_rice]

Happy Birthday..
if the 3 lifts are your main goal why not look inot a Westside based program?
its NOT a coincidence that they dominate powerlifting..

WSB can be done for a raw lifter

soon, perhaps. i don't have access to equipment (cop out), and i am having trouble understanding how everything fits together in westside. too many people seem to fuck it up.

madcow, i agree with what you say. in korte's 3x3, in the volume phase i stay the whole time within 58%-64% range? honestly, this is not a lot of weight and i can't see myself making a lot of gains with it. maybe it has something to do with the fact that i don't lift very much to begin with? i have got to be reading this wrong somewhere..

then transitioning to the second phase, on the "non-maximal" exercises, you would just continue the weight progression from the first phase, while using 85-95% intensities for the maximal exercises?

if i am not reading this wrong, then how is it supposed to work with so little weight?

 

[lavi]

well the percentages are of your *projected* max, not current max

 

[coolcolj]

You need to do the base cycle, which in itself is all i used to boost my squat big time! But I did the junior version and modified it a bit, doing only 3 sessions a week with bands in the top half. 4 is way too much.
Man I think you really underestimate how damn hard it is!
One for sure the modified junior base cycle I did really upped my work capacity like nothing!

I have already posted many times what I did - here it is again

----------

I did a mini version of it, modified slightly, with light bands in the top half only for fullsquats about 9 workouts in total over 3 weeks from memory. So basicly just a 3 workouts a week version of the first phase. I spread out the workouts a bit

good gains - from memory I went from 255x4 (270 estimated 1RM) to 315 immediately after it, then to 345 a month of speed squats with 70% later - 5-8 sets of 3
75lbs for 2 months work is Ok by me

I was on holiday though, so all I was doing was squatting, some olys, and some upper body, and lots of food and sleep
Only bad thing was this put me on the road to gaining a lot of fat, which I haven't been able to reverse quite just yet

It is bloody hard though, the 4 set of 9 is a killer, if your not used to high reps. My pattella did not like me....

-----------

anyway update on the Smolov Squat program - just about halfway through the last and final week of the first mesocycle (don't think I'll do the full thing)

I've added 3/4 inch on my legs in 2.5 weeks and some 6-8 lbs in bodyweight and I'm natural!!! Legs went from 26.75 to 27.5 inches, bodyweight went from 192 to 196-199lbs. Most probbaly gained at least 25lbs on my Squat max too!

Legs are too big now for my needs - quads, glutes and hams
Added some mass to my torso, but none to my arms as far as. I can tell, slightly leaner as well. Then again I didn't do any arm work apart from the dips and chins

My Smolov is slightly modified however - the first week as per normal, then weeks 2 and 3 used 6x6, 7x5, 8x4, 10x3 for the sets and rep schemes. And only worked 3 times a week.
On Week 1 I used Light bands on the top half only, week 2 Average bands, and this week back to Lights.
I didn't use any bands on week 2's 4th workout, and boy did the bar feel light!



quoting myself
So I then maxed out at 315lbs on full olysquats a week later after this, and could have gotten 325lbs. Up from estimated max of 270lbs (from 255x4 previous best at the start of it)
Then I did a month of speed type squats with 5-8x3 waving around 70% and then hit 345lbs.
So I guess abit of loading/accumalation phase, and then a intensification into a peak etc

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[wnt2bBeast]

soon, perhaps. i don't have access to equipment (cop out), and i am having trouble understanding how everything fits together in westside. too many people seem to fuck it up.

madcow, i agree with what you say. in korte's 3x3, in the volume phase i stay the whole time within 58%-64% range? honestly, this is not a lot of weight and i can't see myself making a lot of gains with it. maybe it has something to do with the fact that i don't lift very much to begin with? i have got to be reading this wrong somewhere..

then transitioning to the second phase, on the "non-maximal" exercises, you would just continue the weight progression from the first phase, while using 85-95% intensities for the maximal exercises?

if i am not reading this wrong, then how is it supposed to work with so little weight?

no problem if and when you want help lemme know..ther really is no additinal equipment needed other than a good power rack a bar plates..maybe some chalk lol

Boards are extremely easy and cheap to make..chains/bands do not needed to be added for a long long time

RDL and Dimels can be done instead of GHR's and reverse hypers

 

[super_rice]

guys, i think i am going with korte's because i agree with madcow, that i should save smolov for more of a time of need.

anyway, can i get some more information on korte's?

as my questions from before... korte's doesn't use a lot of weight on it's non-maximal days, unless i am reading it wrong. so how does it work as effectively as say even, 5x5?

i want to start next week, as i haven't trained in two and a half weeks if this doesn't seem plausible, i'll just keep running 5x5. with more weigth of course

 

[Madcow2]

http://www.deepsquatter.com/strength/archives/index.htm
Click the link and look in the upper right corner.

It's A LOT of volume. Just think about the total reps in the squat. 5x5 working sets is 25 reps. 5-8x5 is anywhere from 25 reps to 40 reps. Also, there are no 1x5 or ramped/pyramided weight days. It's all constant set weight and 3x per week - you may never have deadlifted 3x per week but it wears on you and it comes last when you are already burned. I'd highly advise you opt for closer to the 5-6 range in sets than the 7-8. Think about how grueling the Wednesday workout becomes on the Starr program - now you have that and more every day.

I used to have a fully automated excel spreadsheet for Korte's program that would slam it all out based on your current maxes, even plot volume on graphs etc... I have no idea where this went and I'm a bit pissed I lost it because it took a bit to make.

Give it a go. It's a very hard program all in it's own right. Much harder IMO than the 5x5. Maybe that's just the deads but for those using the 1x5 days, it's going to be a hell of a shock, not to mention deadlifting 3x per week for volume. I can't wait to read your log.

 

[blut wump]

I've been looking at the Smolov and Korte on and off for a few months and keep coming to the same conclusion that I'm just nowhere near ready for the Smolov. The Korte does look very gruelling despite the apparently light weights but it looks 'doable'. I like also not having to judge whether you're loading hard enough: you just keep plugging away at the numbers as given.

I can't see anywhere that he specifies how to decide how many sets to do from 5-8. From what you've written, it's just a judgement call based on how well conditioned you are. Isn't there some consideration based on Prilepin's table that should apply here?

Varying the bench grip from workout to workout looks nasty.

 

[super_rice]

alright, this weekend i will take yet another week off from "real life" and work up spreadsheet on korte's, like i did for 5x5.

will post the entire plan by sunday, say. guys, please be around to give some insight into this, as my inexperience will most surely cause some serious loading
errors.

to tell you all the truth, the korte does not look very intimidating weight wise... there's a lot of volume, but at such weights i'm afraid that it will turn the sessions into this cardio-esque marathon. ie: 30-40 reps DL at 60% that would just cramp the shit out of my low back.

thanks for all the input already.