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Siting here at church...

L

lartinos

Guest
First time here at a Roman catholic church in a very very long time.
My GF's brother is getting married.
I grew up as an alter boy so this is nothing new to me, but
This whole experience is creepy.
The priest singing (not like a blaque church)and people responding back with the same old sayings. The whole idea of people eating bread for someone's dead body is weird too.
For people who believe in this stuff that is fine.
I have nothing against them.
 
My first experience in a Roman Catholic church was the same way. I wasn't expecting the priest to ring that bell, scared the crap out of me. I've gotten used to it now.
 
I was in church for a wedding awhile back for a wedding too. I said a prayer because I have had a lot of bad luck lately. It didn't work, I am pretty sure God hates me. I think it's because I am allergic to cats.
 
Well I like going to Church but NOT Roman Catholic Church, and I went to Catholic shcool

they use to much guilt, and its too formal, and unrealistic of peoples ability to be people.

Eastern Orthodox Christianity is much more human and less dogmatic........
for example we gave Jews Fake Papers to not be taken by SS.
the Heart matters most in it.

southern Christianity has a bit more heart, but too much simplified thinking and belief


find the middle ground with HEART and Brains
 
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dammit cindy, don't make me look bad in public!!!!!!1

and, I never know what day it is. Downfall over working 6 days per week. :(
 
miplank said:
dammit cindy, don't make me look bad in public!!!!!!1

and, I never know what day it is. Downfall over working 6 days per week. :(
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sorry I shoulda known better!!!11 :heart: I know exactly when the weekend is here. I poured myself a drink right at 5 oclock even though I work at home :lmao: I do prolly need to work some more 2nite so I'll probably stop at that drink. I remember driving home from work on Friday nights feeling so excited for trouble!
 
I did it on the downlow plank... They did the whole service and not just the wedding part.
It can be done both ways, I used to get bigger tips for the whole service as an alter boy.
And I try to post real shit when I'm thinking it.
Same thing with the house music blog I started. Keepin' it real :)
Okay... Back to drinking
 
InGreatShape said:
whats wrong with eating the bread it is part of the mass ceremony...are you now questioning catholic believes??
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Most Americans consider cannibalism disconcerting...especially when they aren't starving. According to Catholic dogma you are literally consuming the body of your God....That might have something to do with it.
 
cindylou said:
lol are there any true idols?
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Sorry, I should refer to them as god referred to them, "graven images."

From the ten commandments (not the film) here is the second commandment:

"Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth." (Exodus 20:4)

But I can go into any christian church and find a graven image (in other words, find the church breaking the commandments).

"And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him." (I John 2:3-4)
 
lartinos said:
They honestly never said or did anything bad to me.
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It's ok bro, a lot of grown men have come forward long after the fact. You did nothing wrong. You were just a young boy and they took advantage of you. You have nothing to be ashamed about anymore.
 
ceo said:
you mean false idols?
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No, I mean painted statuary. I haven't been in that many Catholic churches, but the ones I have been in, were cluttered with all sorts of gaudy colorful objects such as painted statues of Jesus and the Virgin Mary. Compared to the austerity of a typical Methodist church, it was a bit of a shock.
 
Mr. dB said:
No, I mean painted statuary. I haven't been in that many Catholic churches, but the ones I have been in, were cluttered with all sorts of gaudy colorful objects such as painted statues of Jesus and the Virgin Mary. Compared to the austerity of a typical Methodist church, it was a bit of a shock.
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Catholic churches are beautiful. When I visit my nearby Catholic church I notice the beautiful windows and the church itself. Before you walk in everyone dips their fingers in holy water and they bow before a statue of Mary and do the sign of cross before they enter the pew. There are statues and pictures everywhere but to me its creepy. No one brings in a bible, they have pamphlets with specific readings from the bible that the whole church uses. So you can go to any Catholic church and get the same reading that week that you would get from another church. I see that as both a positive and a negative. When I was visiting nearby baptist churches in my area I would have to go back home and spend all week making sure he wasn't full of crap because anyone could preach anything. But yeah, it's definitely different than Protestant or non-denom churches. The church I finally decided on attending long term has nothing but a cross on the wall and thats it. No pretty stained glass windows, nothing fancy. No one wants to get married there lol.

Speaking of creepy...this was a framed picture that was in my grandparents house in the living room. A picture of the rapture

2itgeaq.jpg
 
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cindylou said:
Catholic churches are beautiful. When I visit my nearby Catholic church I notice the beautiful windows and the church itself. Before you walk in everyone dips their fingers in holy water and they bow before a statue of Mary and do the sign of cross before they enter the pew. There are statues and pictures everywhere but to me its creepy. No one brings in a bible, they have pamphlets with specific readings from the bible that the whole church uses. So you can go to any Catholic church and get the same reading that week that you would get from another church. I see that as both a positive and a negative. When I was visiting nearby baptist churches in my area I would have to go back home and spend all week making sure he wasn't full of crap because anyone could preach anything. But yeah, it's definitely different than Protestant or non-denom churches. The church I finally decided on attending long term has nothing but a cross on the wall and thats it. No pretty stained glass windows, nothing fancy. No one wants to get married there lol.

Speaking of creepy...this was a framed picture that was in my grandparents house in the living room

http://i51.tinypic.com/2itgeaq.jpg
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I think that is awesome. I once met a chick who told me that she listened to a priest because he was a priest and he must know more than her. She said she did not trust her self to find the truth in things. I really respect the fact that you seek it out.
 
just...v said:
I think that is awesome. I once met a chick who told me that she listened to a priest because he was a priest and he must know more than her. She said she did not trust her self to find the truth in things. I really respect the fact that you seek it out.
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lol Thanks. I didn't literally spend all week but you know what I mean :) I've never trusted pastors too much. I do trust the one at my current church. Pastor Pete. I feel like God talks to me through him. Although I won't rule out that I'm crazy. I don't agree with everything he says and I don't know if I agree with the whole church's end time theology....but whatev.. Thats not a surprising attitude from a Catholic, half my fam is Catholic. But, they seem happy enough :) Don't respect me too much, I'm no angel. I believe because I'm broken, always been
 
cindylou said:
lol Thanks. I didn't literally spend all week but you know what I mean :) I've never trusted pastors too much. I do trust the one at my current church. Pastor Pete. I feel like God talks to me through him. Although I won't rule out that I'm crazy. I don't agree with everything he says and I don't know if I agree with the whole church's end time theology....but whatev.. Thats not a surprising attitude from a Catholic, half my fam is Catholic. But, they seem happy enough :) Don't respect me too much, I'm no angel. I believe because I'm broken, always been
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You ever seen beach glass? It's glass from a broken bottle that, with time, the water and sand has worn down the jagged edges. So if you collect enough of these broken pieces, you can use it to make a mosaic, or put it at the bottom of a clear vase where you can keep flowers or maybe even a fish. There is nothing wrong with being flawed. I don't think I could get along with a perfect person because I would be worried that they would always be pointing out my mistakes. :)
 
Mr. dB said:
No, I mean painted statuary. I haven't been in that many Catholic churches, but the ones I have been in, were cluttered with all sorts of gaudy colorful objects such as painted statues of Jesus and the Virgin Mary. Compared to the austerity of a typical Methodist church, it was a bit of a shock.
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this is one of the many reasons why I dont go to any church, all those images, saints, statues, murals, whatever you wanna call em....
 
cindylou said:
Catholic churches are beautiful. When I visit my nearby Catholic church I notice the beautiful windows and the church itself. Before you walk in everyone dips their fingers in holy water and they bow before a statue of Mary and do the sign of cross before they enter the pew. There are statues and pictures everywhere but to me its creepy. No one brings in a bible, they have pamphlets with specific readings from the bible that the whole church uses. So you can go to any Catholic church and get the same reading that week that you would get from another church. I see that as both a positive and a negative. When I was visiting nearby baptist churches in my area I would have to go back home and spend all week making sure he wasn't full of crap because anyone could preach anything. But yeah, it's definitely different than Protestant or non-denom churches. The church I finally decided on attending long term has nothing but a cross on the wall and thats it. No pretty stained glass windows, nothing fancy. No one wants to get married there lol.

Speaking of creepy...this was a framed picture that was in my grandparents house in the living room. A picture of the rapture
Click to expand...

Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

(Exodus 20:3-5)

Those darn catholics...breaking all those commandments!
 
just...v said:
I don't think I could get along with a perfect person because I would be worried that they would always be pointing out my mistakes. :)
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Yeah, you'd hate me.
 
nangiggles said:
this is one of the many reasons why I dont go to any church, all those images, saints, statues, murals, whatever you wanna call em....
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graven images or idols or golden calves
 
ceo said:
Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

(Exodus 20:3-5)

Those darn catholics...breaking all those commandments!
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Did I miss first grade bible study last night? :lmao: :D :evil:
 
cindylou said:
lol Thanks. I didn't literally spend all week but you know what I mean :) I've never trusted pastors too much. I do trust the one at my current church. Pastor Pete. I feel like God talks to me through him. Although I won't rule out that I'm crazy. I don't agree with everything he says and I don't know if I agree with the whole church's end time theology....but whatev.. Thats not a surprising attitude from a Catholic, half my fam is Catholic. But, they seem happy enough :) Don't respect me too much, I'm no angel. I believe because I'm broken, always been
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I feel like God talks to me through my pastor. I don't always agree with him either, but there is so much sincerity in his words, such a genuine desire to lead people closer to God, that it's hard not to get sucked in. Even when I don't agree, I don't dismiss him either. He has that quality with a lot of people...which I guess is how he managed to start a church with 80 people and made that grow into 6000 in ten years. It gets a little dangerous though, I think a lot of people have an unhealthy love for the guy. Maybe not unhealthy per se, but definitely verging on false idol territory. He's a good guy though. Avid surfer who preaches in jeans and flip flops lolol. It's so different than what I grew up with, but it resonates in a way the episcopal church never did. My parents (episcopal priests) have gone to church with me there and absolutely loved it, though my mom thinks the music is a shade loud haha.

ceo - I'm curious, what's your deal? Athiest with theological curiosity? Raised in a christian home but turned away from it later? believer who has issues with the institution and abuses? You jump into religious discussions a lot, but unlike Java, I've never seen you put your own feelings out there.
 
Nef, I'm the opposite. I grew up in a megachurch and it was a horrible experience (towards the end), I stopped going at 15 and never stepped back in a church until my mid 20's. I am now going to a small church.
 
cindylou said:
Nef, I'm the opposite. I grew up in a megachurch and it was a horrible experience (towards the end), I stopped going at 15 and never stepped back in a church until my mid 20's. I am now going to a small church.
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I can see it being terrible if the message is wrong....I got really lucky with this group. It never feels that big to me, I have a good small group I go to on monday nights for more intimate fellowship, and the general message is loving and forgiving with an emphasis on active faith rather than passive faith. They have strong local ministry outreach programs that I really have enjoyed being part of, too, and while I like Mike over any of the other pastors who will preach, everyone working there is a top notch human being and really walking with God.
 
I could give a Rat's ass what they say. They are sucked into the BS than anyone. And what is their true intention on being up there preaching God's word, lol.
 
nefertiti said:
I can see it being terrible if the message is wrong....I got really lucky with this group. It never feels that big to me, I have a good small group I go to on monday nights for more intimate fellowship, and the general message is loving and forgiving with an emphasis on active faith rather than passive faith. They have strong local ministry outreach programs that I really have enjoyed being part of, too, and while I like Mike over any of the other pastors who will preach, everyone working there is a top notch human being and really walking with God.
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It probably wasn't the church's fault now that I think about it. lol
 
lartinos said:
I could give a Rat's ass what they say. They are sucked into the BS than anyone. And what is their true intention on being up there preaching God's word, lol.
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One of my good friends works full time at the church running one of the childrens ministries. She has told me that mike will sometimes get sick (ie: puke) from nerves before preaching a particularly difficult topic. Not because he is nervous for himself but because he is so concerned about giving the message in a way that serves God and helps guide his people.

You don't have to believe in anything, but I know both my parents gave up their lives in genuine service and if they exist (people who decide to serve god as pastors or priests for the "right reasons"), then others exist as well. it's not universal, plenty of power hungry folks or other bad reasons. But that's where shopping around for a good fit comes in handy.
 
cindylou said:
It probably wasn't the church's fault now that I think about it. lol
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Might just be that you like the smaller stuff. I guess my thing is, on Sundays it's kind of between God and Me. I like getting lost in the crowd and being able to open myself up to the word privately, so to speak. I'm used to sitting by myself because my parents were working lol, but I got really burnt out having to greet a couple hundred people after every service. On some level my faith and my walk with God is still a very very private thing. It's easier to have that privacy in the middle of a huge crowd. I've been suffering terribly the last nine or ten months, and sometimes church is the only place I let that hurt out. I wouldn't be comfortable doing that in a more intimate setting.
 
nefertiti said:
One of my good friends works full time at the church running one of the childrens ministries. She has told me that mike will sometimes get sick (ie: puke) from nerves before preaching a particularly difficult topic. Not because he is nervous for himself but because he is so concerned about giving the message in a way that serves God and helps guide his people.

You don't have to believe in anything, but I know both my parents gave up their lives in genuine service and if they exist (people who decide to serve god as pastors or priests for the "right reasons"), then others exist as well. it's not universal, plenty of power hungry folks or other bad reasons. But that's where shopping around for a good fit comes in handy.
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And you think that their best way of helping the community is by preaching at a church? I woould disagree and that they help the world in better ways if that is what they want. But if they are truly pulled into the fiction of it all I guess it is good in a way. Unfortunaley they are helping raise ignorant people by being a preacher. It is strange to me how there aren't any muslims like me. I was obviously born into the church prett much and now I expose it for the BS it is. Do they help poor people and such? Yes, they sure do. But this whole fairy tale part is not necessary. I am a man of logic and reason and cannot agree with what is going on. Kids are already taught enough crap they have to decipher through to the truth.
 
nefertiti said:
Might just be that you like the smaller stuff. I guess my thing is, on Sundays it's kind of between God and Me. I like getting lost in the crowd and being able to open myself up to the word privately, so to speak. I'm used to sitting by myself because my parents were working lol, but I got really burnt out having to greet a couple hundred people after every service. On some level my faith and my walk with God is still a very very private thing. It's easier to have that privacy in the middle of a huge crowd. I've been suffering terribly the last nine or ten months, and sometimes church is the only place I let that hurt out. I wouldn't be comfortable doing that in a more intimate setting.
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I'm so sorry Nef. :( I understand why you would like the larger church. I do think the smaller church fits me. I like that I am always close to the pastor when he speaks and sometimes he'll look in my eyes. I get to speak with him personally every time I go he makes an effort to approach me, which I like. I'm not friendly, I'm nice and warm, but not friendly. I don't reach out to people. I'm working on that lol but that is just who I am. :)
 
cindylou said:
...and I don't know if I agree with the whole church's end time theology...
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This bizarre fixation on Revelations and the supposed "end times" is a strange and purely American point of view that didn't emerge until the 19th century.
 
Mr. dB said:
This bizarre fixation on Revelations and the supposed "end times" is a strange and purely American point of view that didn't emerge until the 19th century.
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I know. I was rasied around dispensationalism and I think it was damaging to me as a kid. I've already warned my family not to talk about it around Abby ever. I really had to put my foot down on that one.
 
nangiggles said:
Nothing can get me into a church.... havent stepped into one for years....
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i go every sunday (and every holy day of obligation) with the wife and kids...we (wife and i) were both raised catholic...i'm not sure what i "believe" anymore...i've kinda felt like that for years...one thing i'm sure i believe in though, is making my wife happy and setting a good example for my kids...and that one gesture (attending mass) with my wife (and kids) makes her very happy...i love her (very much), it's the least i can do :)
 
lartinos said:
And you think that their best way of helping the community is by preaching at a church? I woould disagree and that they help the world in better ways if that is what they want. But if they are truly pulled into the fiction of it all I guess it is good in a way. Unfortunaley they are helping raise ignorant people by being a preacher. It is strange to me how there aren't any muslims like me. I was obviously born into the church prett much and now I expose it for the BS it is. Do they help poor people and such? Yes, they sure do. But this whole fairy tale part is not necessary. I am a man of logic and reason and cannot agree with what is going on. Kids are already taught enough crap they have to decipher through to the truth.
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lol....see the thing is, we don't believe it's a fairy tale.

And, my church probably does more for the community as far as volunteer ministries than any other local group.
 
lartinos said:
First time here at a Roman catholic church in a very very long time.
My GF's brother is getting married.
I grew up as an alter boy so this is nothing new to me, but
This whole experience is creepy.
The priest singing (not like a blaque church)and people responding back with the same old sayings. The whole idea of people eating bread for someone's dead body is weird too.
For people who believe in this stuff that is fine.
I have nothing against them.
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FYI. I am lartino's GF and it was my UNCLE who got married. I don't have a brother. Don't know where he got that from lol.
 
cindylou said:
I'm so sorry Nef. :( I understand why you would like the larger church. I do think the smaller church fits me. I like that I am always close to the pastor when he speaks and sometimes he'll look in my eyes. I get to speak with him personally every time I go he makes an effort to approach me, which I like. I'm not friendly, I'm nice and warm, but not friendly. I don't reach out to people. I'm working on that lol but that is just who I am. :)
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I'm kind of like that. Well....I'm friendly if someone reaches out to me, but it's really hard for me to take that first step. I'm really shy about initiating conversation, which ironically has led some people in the past to think I'm "aloof." I've spoken to my pastor a few times after church but I've always had to like psych myself up for it because it's so uncomfortable for me to reach out that way.

And, no worries....it's been a trial and it's far from over, but I'm in good hands (you know who :) )
 
nefertiti said:
ceo - I'm curious, what's your deal? Athiest with theological curiosity? Raised in a christian home but turned away from it later? believer who has issues with the institution and abuses? You jump into religious discussions a lot, but unlike Java, I've never seen you put your own feelings out there.
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well then you missed it I guess.

I think I laid it out fairly well in another thread recently.
 
ceo said:
well then you missed it I guess.

I think I laid it out fairly well in another thread recently.
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Do you remember the thread? I'm not above looking it up, but I'm not sifting through every single recent post of yours lol.
 
nefertiti said:
lol....see the thing is, we don't believe it's a fairy tale.

And, my church probably does more for the community as far as volunteer ministries than any other local group.
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Like I said I have nothing against the religous.
How such an intelligent person as yourself believes in fairy tales is mind blowing to me. What I am guessing is that you are not a creationist though. Either way I did not start this thread to sit here and bash people. That was just how I felt sitting in the church.
 
nefertiti said:
Do you remember the thread? I'm not above looking it up, but I'm not sifting through every single recent post of yours lol.
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I believe it was in that very recent "is it cheating to have an AFF acct?" thread that AV made.

Remember? You and me and cindybaby were all up in there too! :D
 
lartinos said:
Like I said I have nothing against the religous.
How such an intelligent person as yourself believes in fairy tales is mind blowing to me. What I am guessing is that you are not a creationist though. Either way I did not start this thread to sit here and bash people. That was just how I felt sitting in the church.
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I'm not a creationist, no.
 
nefertiti said:
Do you remember the thread? I'm not above looking it up, but I'm not sifting through every single recent post of yours lol.
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ceo said:
So how specific should one be concerning the Bible and what is felt as it's guidance? I know, I know, it's different for everyone really. Personally, I'm not specific to the bible at all. It's a bunch of good stories written by men, edited by more men, compiled into a book by men (leaving out and re-writing much along the way), taught to be the infallable word of god.

Believe me, I'm not taking a doctrine in any way, I am merely trying to understand the thinking/reasoning behind the way others take it.
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I believe this is it....
 
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nangiggles said:
I edited my CEO quote to the relevant part of what Nef wanted to know....
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that's actually not the post I was thinking of, but that's the thread. :)
 
cindylou said:
I have no idea what CEO believes, he's never told me? :whatever: I thought maybe it was in the pew study thread that javaguru made but I dunno? :confused:
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oh hey! Maybe it was that pew study thread!

lololo!!
 
lartinos said:
Like I said I have nothing against the religous.
How such an intelligent person as yourself believes in fairy tales is mind blowing to me. What I am guessing is that you are not a creationist though. Either way I did not start this thread to sit here and bash people. That was just how I felt sitting in the church.
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the bible uses mythical and poetic imagery and not everything should be taken literally. Besides, people who have not removed the ego from their faith would have abandoned it long ago. Most people assume Christians are idiots, no? Some just can't handle the blow and attacks on their faith deflate them, many times puff themselves back up by turning around and attacking people who are still Christians. Much like the bullied becomes the bully, they have to prove something in retaliation for being duped for so long I suppose.
 
cindylou said:
the bible uses mythical and poetic imagery and not everything should be taken literally. Besides, people who have not removed the ego from their faith would have abandoned it long ago. Most people assume Christians are idiots, no? Some just can't handle the blow and attacks on their faith deflate them, many times puff themselves back up by turning around and attacking people who are still Christians. Much like the bullied becomes the bully, they have to prove something in retaliation for being duped for so long I suppose.
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i assume most people are idiots...doesn't matter what altar they bow too...
 
for me its simple in why I believe in God

I am sentient and alive, you are sentient and alive.............its not that big of a leap at all to assume there is a "origen being"
One infinitely more complex then us.

Plus you can feel it..........., its hard to explain.....
 
Not believing in God is very liberating but I hate how people judge you and try to convert you, it also upsets me how people think that just because you have no faith you have no morals... I even follow some things from the bible,not because Ibelieve but because they sound corrrect (no stealing, no robbing, etc)
 
i dont hate any one that does not believe

I feel like they are missing out

Just as there are over religious people who are blinde, there are also non believers who are very vitriol with how they speak about God...
they are so full of Ego that they are Blinded....
 
nangiggles said:
Not believing in God is very liberating but I hate how people judge you and try to convert you, it also upsets me how people think that just because you have no faith you have no morals... I even follow some things from the bible,not because Ibelieve but because they sound corrrect (no stealing, no robbing, etc)
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My faith liberates me. God gives me freedom that the secular world never did.

I don't know many people who think if you don't believe in God that you are amoral or a bad person. That's a minor extremist view that's not representative of the whole. While a large portion of christians believe they are called to convert/help people know Jesus, they are coming from a totally different place, one without personal judgement or condemnation. It sounds like you've come accross more of the minority, which I'm regretful for.

I'm fine with talking to people who don't believe or believe other things. It gets nasty from my point of view when they try to act like I'm an idiot for believing. At the end of the day two people with conflicting ideas should be able to have a conversation without putting down the other person, no matter which way it's going.
 
nefertiti said:
My faith liberates me. God gives me freedom that the secular world never did.

I don't know many people who think if you don't believe in God that you are amoral or a bad person. That's a minor extremist view that's not representative of the whole. While a large portion of christians believe they are called to convert/help people know Jesus, they are coming from a totally different place, one without personal judgement or condemnation. It sounds like you've come accross more of the minority, which I'm regretful for.

I'm fine with talking to people who don't believe or believe other things. It gets nasty from my point of view when they try to act like I'm an idiot for believing. At the end of the day two people with conflicting ideas should be able to have a conversation without putting down the other person, no matter which way it's going.
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I agree! my best friend is VERY spiritual, she talks to me about God all the time how he helps her and she dreams with him and stuff like that, she feels comfortable telling me even though I dont believe because she knows I respect her and I believe she believes.

Most of the people I've found seem to think that if you dont have belief in a supreme power that watches you and may or may not punish you then you will run lose doing whatever because you have no fear of God or hell... then there's the others who judge you for not believing and start pushing you for answers on how the world was created and such.... personally I dont even care, what is the point of debating over something A. I dont know and B. I cant prove, makes no sense
 
at some point I wonder if I'm delusional? How dissapointed I'll be when I die and there's nothing, no one. Not that I would know, but something comforts me and gives me peace and I believe the bible is a book thats alive and holy and written by holy men and it can't be understood unless you know the author

 
melohh said:
FYI. I am lartino's GF and it was my UNCLE who got married. I don't have a brother. Don't know where he got that from lol.
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Honest mistake...he was obviously talking about his other GF.

Anyhoo, I personally am not a believer, but then again I refuse to look down on or judge those that are.* While I was raised Catholic and attended church at the request of my parents every Sunday for 18 years (and went to Catholic school all my childhood, followed by a Jesuit university) I havent been to church more than three times in the past 10 years, and those instances were usually to appease my in-laws, who attend church every day.

You can bet your bottom bitch, however, that when my wife and I have children we'll be bringing them to church during the first few years of their life. I aim to raise open minded kids, and I want to make sure they have the exposure to what are admittedly great examples and teachings of how to live your life and treat those around you if they decide to continue having some sort of faith as they grow older.



*Except for mooslims.
 
cindylou said:
at some point I wonder if I'm delusional? How dissapointed I'll be when I die and there's nothing, no one. Not that I would know, but something comforts me and gives me peace and I believe the bible is a book thats alive and holy and written by holy men and it can't be understood unless you know the author

Click to expand...

I believe there is nothing lost in faith that enriches your life. If it's something that is used for harm (judgement of others) or it harms you (a life filled with guilt and restraint), that's one thing. But if it's something that guides you and fulfills you, then who cares if you end up being wrong? You lived a full life.

But I don't think we're wrong. I still struggle with a lot of aspects of the christian faith and I have a lot of questions that one day I'm going to need answers for. But I do know I couldn't have gotten through the last year without that faith.

If it turns out I'm an idiot, than both lart and I will be dead and he is still denied the chance to say "I told you so" lol
 
75th said:
Honest mistake...he was obviously talking about his other GF.

Anyhoo, I personally am not a believer, but then again I refuse to look down on or judge those that are.* While I was raised Catholic and attended church at the request of my parents every Sunday for 18 years (and went to Catholic school all my childhood, followed by a Jesuit university) I havent been to church more than three times in the past 10 years, and those instances were usually to appease my in-laws, who attend church every day.

You can bet your bottom bitch, however, that when my wife and I have children we'll be bringing them to church during the first few years of their life. I aim to raise open minded kids, and I want to make sure they have the exposure to what are admittedly great examples and teachings of how to live your life and treat those around you if they decide to continue having some sort of faith as they grow older.



*Except for mooslims.
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That's a good point.Since I grew up in church (catholic school) I cannot think of raising kids without church for some reason. But then what? Tell them that it is a crock of shit as well and just take it for the positive things? Don't think I can do it.
There should be a secular meeting place for children who are raised on logic and reason to go too. A sort of Sunday school for th non-religous.
 
lartinos said:
That's a good point.Since I grew up in church (catholic school) I cannot think of raising kids without church for some reason. But then what? Tell them that it is a crock of shit as well and just take it for the positive things? Don't think I can do it.
There should be a secular meeting place for children who are raised on logic and reason to go too. A sort of Sunday school for th non-religous.
Click to expand...

Considering what my parents do for a living you might think I was raised in a setting where I was told "This is the way things are, period."

But believe it or not my parents, while they brought me to church and encouraged me to learn and participate, they left plenty of room for me to make up my own mind about things. I had discussions with my dad about other religions, and he was always willing to patiently offer his opinions without ever stating anything as fact.

For years I wanted nothing to do with the institution of religion. And if there was a God, then I wanted nothing to do with him either. They let me go this route with zero pressure.

You can raise your child in the church while still offering them how you feel about things at home. And then you can just let them make up their own mind.

Or not....just saying, it can be done. I think a good parent surrounds their child with as much information and opportunity for learning as possible, but lets them form their own opinions. At the end of the day it's your responsibility to guide your child, no matter what situations they are exposed to.

Look at ceo - I still don't know wtf his deal is haha, but he is clearly very well read and has had some exposure, either by upbringing or otherwise, to theology, and it didn't turn him into an idiot ;)
 
nefertiti said:
Considering what my parents do for a living you might think I was raised in a setting where I was told "This is the way things are, period."

But believe it or not my parents, while they brought me to church and encouraged me to learn and participate, they left plenty of room for me to make up my own mind about things. I had discussions with my dad about other religions, and he was always willing to patiently offer his opinions without ever stating anything as fact.

For years I wanted nothing to do with the institution of religion. And if there was a God, then I wanted nothing to do with him either. They let me go this route with zero pressure.

You can raise your child in the church while still offering them how you feel about things at home. And then you can just let them make up their own mind.

Or not....just saying, it can be done. I think a good parent surrounds their child with as much information and opportunity for learning as possible, but lets them form their own opinions. At the end of the day it's your responsibility to guide your child, no matter what situations they are exposed to.

Look at ceo - I still don't know wtf his deal is haha, but he is clearly very well read and has had some exposure, either by upbringing or otherwise, to theology, and it didn't turn him into an idiot ;)
Click to expand...

I understand your upbringing. If they decided church was the place for them it would not upset me. It would only upset me if they believed the whole hocus pocus part. I want my children to understand other religions just as well as christianity. After I teach them about all religions then they can make their own decisions about their life. I have had many a GF who was into religion and I told them I disagreed with their views but it never had any real effect on the relationship.
 
nefertiti said:
I still struggle with a lot of aspects of the christian faith and I have a lot of questions that one day I'm going to need answers for. But I do know I couldn't have gotten through the last year without that faith.
Click to expand...

I too had a lot of questions that I needed answers to. I just didn't wait for one day that may never come. The more I studied the bible, the more questions I had.

I found that the bible would sometimes contradict itself. I studied history and found information, that when putting the two together gave me more answers.

I'm not trying to bully anyone. I wasn't bullied for my beliefs. I'm not a jilted ex-lover of god or jesus.

But too many people follow something they really know absolutely nothing about. Some do it their whole lives.

To put it in a perspective a christian can (hopefully) relate to (most still choose not to relate and just ignore), the bible warns of "another Jesus."


Many pagan practices that have no scriptural basis have been perpetrated as the worship of God/Jesus. These practices have been accepted and are commonplace in the church today. These practices were introduced gradually over hundreds of years through the blending of roman paganism and christianity. They have been accepted along the way mostly through fear of persecution and death in the early years of the church. These now traditions have no scriptural basis. Christians were warned this would happen (false prophets and false teachers bringing heresies) in the very bible they read.

Jesus said, "This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me. But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men." (Matthew 15:8-9)

This statement has never been more true than now. The commandments of men (traditions practiced in the church today) have been successfully substituted for the worship prescribed.

After hearing that would you have questions? Would you want to know more? Do you love the truth? Will you study in order to find it? If you found it and knew would you have to make painfully difficult choices, would you chose to remain willfully ignorant? What if you decided that in order to continue a more righteous walk with god you would have to disassociate yourself with your favorite church, because you decided you could no longer participate in the traditions of men being taught as the true worship of god?

Most church going people that I knew, that called themselves christians, and professed a true love for god above all else chose to remain ignorant. According to the bible, they will be judged.
 
ceo, what "practices"? Whenever I find a contradiction in the word of God, it has always served as an arrow to a higher meaning. I don't think the truth lies in logic alone, but logic combined with the spiritual mind. The bible is a mirror, a spiritual book, not to be read like a history or science book. I don't do any "practices". Not one. The only thing I've ever done is admit in my belief that Jesus Christ is God in the flesh, more than a man and somone who cared enough for me to die for me and save me from my pitiful self so I could have a relationship with God, a relationship I have now. If THAT is not true, then you tell me...am I lying or am I crazy? I'll spit on the cross and stomp it under my feet

condradictions dont have to be a stumbling block, but they will if you are too shallow, proud or legalistic - not implying you are btw
 
lartinos said:
That's a good point.Since I grew up in church (catholic school) I cannot think of raising kids without church for some reason. But then what? Tell them that it is a crock of shit as well and just take it for the positive things? Don't think I can do it.
Click to expand...
Why not? I dont see anything wrong with using the church to teach your children how to behave in the world while at the same time making it clear to them that they arent being forced to adopt a full fledged lifestyle.
 
cindylou said:
ceo, what "practices"? Whenever I find a contradiction in the word of God, it has always served as an arrow to a higher meaning. I don't think the truth lies in logic alone, but logic combined with the spiritual mind. The bible is a mirror, a spiritual book, not to be read like a history or science book. I don't do any "practices". Not one. The only thing I've ever done is admit in my belief that Jesus Christ is God in the flesh, more than a man and somone who cared enough for me to die for me and save me from my pitiful self so I could have a relationship with God, a relationship I have now. If THAT is not true, then you tell me...am I lying or am I crazy? I'll spit on the cross and stomp it under my feet

condradictions dont have to be a stumbling block, but they will if you are too shallow, proud or legalistic - not implying you are btw
Click to expand...

Many. What about the breaking of commandments I mentioned earlier ITT? Graven images? Idolatry? I mean, we can start there.
 
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