Supreme Court case - legal to strip search 13 year old girl? [news item]

[samoth]

An assistant principal, enforcing the school’s antidrug policies, suspected her of having brought prescription-strength ibuprofen pills to school. One of the pills is as strong as two Advils.

The search by two female school employees was methodical and humiliating, Ms. Redding said. After she had stripped to her underwear, “they asked me to pull out my bra and move it from side to side,” she said. “They made me open my legs and pull out my underwear.”

Ms. Redding, an honors student, had no pills. But she had a furious mother and a lawyer, and now her case has reached the Supreme Court, which will hear arguments on April 21.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/24/us/24savana.html?pagewanted=1&hpw

 

[BlueBird]

If it were my child, I'd have shown up with more than a lawyer.

 

[jnevin]

I believe I'd whoop some azz if I was her dada.

 

[chris302001]

Ibuprofen? :shakes head:

 

[Cutiebaby]

The mother fucking school staff would show up to those court hearings with my feet so far lodged up each one of their asses they would not be able to walk let alone sit through it all!

Ibuprofen, give me a break! Oh no..Please not extra strength advils, say it isn't so! Kinda makes you wonder how they react when they think a student has an actual drug?

I hope that the courts (which prob wont) will eat them all (principal, and two teachers) for lunch. Those idiots should not have jobs left by the time that childs lawyer gets finished...Ugh stories like this set me off on a tangent for the day.

 

[Cutiebaby]

Ibuprofen? :shakes head:

I have a whole cabinet full of them. I guess they are great drugs man...Fuck, I am going to go eat two, then sit here and trip for the rest of the afternoon!

 

[rnch]

her college education was just paid for in advance.

 

[jaybois]

More drug war insanity.

 

[cindylou]

I remember getting 3 days out of school suspension for having caffiene pills at school.

I would be IRATE if my daughter was treated that way. She hadnt broken the law, why were her rights violated? Why did they think they could do that? Can schools strip search?

 

[samoth]

I remember getting 3 days out of school suspension for having caffiene pills at school.

Seriously? My friends and I would take stuff like caffeine and ephedrine all the time in high school. Did you go to a private school?

 

[needtogetarmy]

I support this. It was performed by two females. I have zero tolerance for kids bringing drugs to school. I know the local schools here have policies for prescription drugs. You turn them in and get them doled out when it is time to take your medicine or get permission to have them on your person.

On the other hand, if the search was totally unjustified and she was singled out for other reasons then it would be wrong to search her in that manner. The article didn't state that was the case.

60-75% of the kids in inner cities do not graduate from high school. Drugs and gangs are the main culprits. This is destroying our society. The only way to fix this is to have zero tolerance policies. There will always be an instance that sticks out, like this story, that will make people question the policies.

Imagine it was heroin, meth, or even oxy (which requires s script) and she was selling it to your children.

If she doesn't like the rules then she can find another school.

 

[Sub-Zero]

An assistant principal, enforcing the school’s antidrug policies, suspected her of having brought prescription-strength ibuprofen pills to school. One of the pills is as strong as two Advils.

The search by two female school employees was methodical and humiliating, Ms. Redding said. After she had stripped to her underwear, “they asked me to pull out my bra and move it from side to side,” she said. “They made me open my legs and pull out my underwear.”

Ms. Redding, an honors student, had no pills. But she had a furious mother and a lawyer, and now her case has reached the Supreme Court, which will hear arguments on April 21.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/24/us/24savana.html?pagewanted=1&hpw

i got a boner just reading this.

if the female school teachers did it, i dont really see it as that big a deal provided there was 100% privacy, and these were high ranking teachers/administration types.

i knew plenty of sluts who were 13 when i was in highschool. wouldnt surprised me if she stuffed it up her ass after getting cought blowing her bf and his friends in the faculty bathroom.

we need more background info on this girl, is what im saying.

if she was some innocent bookworm nerdy type, then its fucked up and probably traumatizing.

but if its the prior mentioned type, im sure girl will be fine

 

[samoth]

Why did they think they could do that? Can schools strip search?

It appears they can at public schools; the debate is over what a "resonable search" in such cases are. Can they check a student's backpack? Their pockets? Their underwear?

 

[cindylou]

I support this. It was performed by two females. I have zero tolerance for kids bringing drugs to school. I know the local schools here have policies for prescription drugs. You turn them in and get them doled out when it is time to take your medicine or get permission to have them on your person.

On the other hand, if the search was totally unjustified and she was singled out for other reasons then it would be wrong to search her in that manner. The article didn't state that was the case.

60-75% of the kids in inner cities do not graduate from high school. Drugs and gangs are the main culprits. This is destroying our society. The only way to fix this is to have zero tolerance policies. There will always be an instance that sticks out, like this story, that will make people question the policies.

Imagine it was heroin, meth, or even oxy (which requires s script) and she was selling it to your children.

If she doesn't like the rules then she can find another school.

She was suspected of having ibuprofen. You support them strip searching a girl (who ended up not having the drug btw) for ibuprofen?

Teenagers have rights too. Where is the common sense here?

 

[cindylou]

Seriously? My friends and I would take stuff like caffeine and ephedrine all the time in high school. Did you go to a private school?

No it was a public school - I still am comfused as to why I got into SO much trouble for that...

When I was gone they called an assembly on drugs and how bad they are.....it was no doze! It reminded me of the Saved by the Bell episode where Jessi gets all hopped up on caffene pills because she needed to study...lol...they just really overreacted.

 

[needtogetarmy]

She was suspected of having ibuprofen. You support them strip searching a girl (who ended up not having the drug btw) for ibuprofen?

Teenagers have rights too. Where is the common sense here?

The article states they were prescription drugs. It doesn't matter if it is Advil or oxy. If the school rules prohibit the possession of prescription meds then it is against the rules to possess them. Rules are rules.

Students do have 'rights' but not the same right as others. The Supreme Court has addressed student rights in other contexts. For example, freedom of speech. Just because a student has freedom of speech doesn't mean a student can just talk out loud in class and disrupt the teaching process. The students rights are limited in a class room setting. An 18 year old has the right to bear arms but that doesn't give the student a right to bring a glock to class. The Supreme Court has recognized in many instances that the rules schools establish trump rights. Otherwise there would be chaos.

Students do have a right against unreasonable searches and seizures. The threshold issue in this case is whether the search was unreasonable. That is debatable. I do not think it is unreasonable. I had a friend in school who ate quite a bit of acid tabs when they were going to search him. Just like Sub-Zero said, people hide stuff all the time. IF the school authorities had a reasonable belief that she possessed contraband, and they has a reasonable belief that it was hidden on her person, then it is reasonable that they conduct a strip search.

 

[beachhead06]

The mother fucking school staff would show up to those court hearings with my feet so far lodged up each one of their asses they would not be able to walk let alone sit through it all!

Ibuprofen, give me a break! Oh no..Please not extra strength advils, say it isn't so! Kinda makes you wonder how they react when they think a student has an actual drug?

I hope that the courts (which prob wont) will eat them all (principal, and two teachers) for lunch. Those idiots should not have jobs left by the time that childs lawyer gets finished...Ugh stories like this set me off on a tangent for the day.

+1
F*cking eh! What has the world come too? Ibuprofen are you kidding me???

 

[jnevin]

She was suspected of having ibuprofen. You support them strip searching a girl (who ended up not having the drug btw) for ibuprofen?

Teenagers have rights too. Where is the common sense here?

Well a zero tolerance policy is a zero tolerance policy. IB 800's are prescription drugs and if she brought them to school illegally it's the same as any controlled substance.

 

[1500]

Students do have a right against unreasonable searches and seizures. The threshold issue in this case is whether the search was unreasonable. That is debatable. I do not think it is unreasonable. I had a friend in school who ate quite a bit of acid tabs when they were going to search him. Just like Sub-Zero said, people hide stuff all the time. IF the school authorities had a reasonable belief that she possessed contraband, and they has a reasonable belief that it was hidden on her person, then it is reasonable that they conduct a strip search.

+1. my prediction.... SC rules in favor of the School system. If the police had been called and PC existed, the girl would have had to endure the same search. Unlike the police, school administrators only need RS, not PC.

 

[stosstruppe]

if the female school teachers did it, i dont really see it as that big a deal provided there was 100% privacy, and these were high ranking teachers/administration types.

I knew plenty of sluts who were 13 when i was in highschool. Wouldnt surprised me if she stuffed it up her ass after getting cought blowing her bf and his friends in the faculty bathroom.

We need more background info on this girl, is what im saying.

If she was some innocent bookworm nerdy type, then its fucked up and probably traumatizing.

But if its the prior mentioned type, im sure girl will be fine

+1

 

[KillahBee]

Dear Diary,

Jackpot.

KB

 

[jnevin]

Dear Diary,

Jackpot.

KB

LMAO

I actually thought of you when I first read the title.

 

[cindylou]

The article states they were prescription drugs. It doesn't matter if it is Advil or oxy. If the school rules prohibit the possession of prescription meds then it is against the rules to possess them. Rules are rules.

Students do have 'rights' but not the same right as others. The Supreme Court has addressed student rights in other contexts. For example, freedom of speech. Just because a student has freedom of speech doesn't mean a student can just talk out loud in class and disrupt the teaching process. The students rights are limited in a class room setting. An 18 year old has the right to bear arms but that doesn't give the student a right to bring a glock to class. The Supreme Court has recognized in many instances that the rules schools establish trump rights. Otherwise there would be chaos.

Students do have a right against unreasonable searches and seizures. The threshold issue in this case is whether the search was unreasonable. That is debatable. I do not think it is unreasonable. I had a friend in school who ate quite a bit of acid tabs when they were going to search him. Just like Sub-Zero said, people hide stuff all the time. IF the school authorities had a reasonable belief that she possessed contraband, and they has a reasonable belief that it was hidden on her person, then it is reasonable that they conduct a strip search.

lol @ your sig! hahaha

But she didnt HAVE the drugs..they were going off the accusation of another student... There is no reason to strip search for ibuprofen when all you have is another child accusing another of having the drug. They should have searched her locker, her purse and her pockets and belongings and sent her back to class. Thats it. Common sense. Also, this child had never gotten in trouble before and there was no reason to think that she would break the rules.

I would have ripped my kid right out of that school. This is totally unacceptable. She had to spread her legs open and pull her out her underwear! Is she in prision?? This is awful. Is this really what public school is coming to?

They should have called the parents first at least. At least. I hope the child that slandered her was expelled.

 

[needtogetarmy]

lol @ your sig! hahaha

But she didnt HAVE the drugs..they were going off the accusation of another student... There is no reason to strip search for ibuprofen when all you have is another child accusing another of having the drug. They should have searched her locker, her purse and her pockets and belongings and sent her back to class. Thats it. Common sense. Also, this child had never gotten in trouble before and there was no reason to think that she would break the rules.

I would have ripped my kid right out of that school. This is totally unacceptable. She had to spread her legs open and pull her out her underwear! Is she in prision?? This is awful. Is this really what public school is coming to?

They should have called the parents first at least. At least. I hope the child that slandered her was expelled.

I pretty much agree. The facts of each case determine what is a reasonable search. The article only covers a part of it so there may be other things going on.

 

[Sub-Zero]

lol @ your sig! hahaha

But she didnt HAVE the drugs..they were going off the accusation of another student... There is no reason to strip search for ibuprofen when all you have is another child accusing another of having the drug. They should have searched her locker, her purse and her pockets and belongings and sent her back to class. Thats it. Common sense. Also, this child had never gotten in trouble before and there was no reason to think that she would break the rules.

I would have ripped my kid right out of that school. This is totally unacceptable. She had to spread her legs open and pull her out her underwear! Is she in prision?? This is awful. Is this really what public school is coming to?

They should have called the parents first at least. At least. I hope the child that slandered her was expelled.

she ate em

 

[cindylou]

she ate em

She got rid of her headache

 

[needtogetarmy]

On another note.

This article is in the NY Times which is very biased and that article is geared towards supporting the student. It glosses over the facts.

So, recognizing it is a one sided story, I went and looked at the court briefs so I could get a good look at the actual facts argued in the case. You can read it too:

http://www.abanet.org/publiced/preview/briefs/pdfs/07-08/08-479_Petitioner.pdf

This girl is anything but a nice little girl that is being unfairly accused. Read the supporting facts. I think the school had the grounds to strip search her.

Don't believe everything you read in the press. They want to brainwash you. Don't believe me either. Read the petitioners brief.

 

[cindylou]

Thats totally different from the article. lol.

What a mess. I believe that principals can also get caught up in the "drama" too. They should have just suspended both girls on the spot. 10 days out of school suspension. That would have eased his conscience about drugs being sold on campus when the girls are not even on school grounds to sell or give out the pills.

It is what it is though, I can understand the strip search. (which was not spreading her legs like the article said just shaking the elastic in her underwear) Maybe in the future they should call the parents first.

 

[ceo]

Dear Diary,

Jackpot.

KB

Now if only they'd bring back spankings!

 

[needtogetarmy]

Thats totally different from the article. lol.

What a mess. I believe that principals can also get caught up in the "drama" too. They should have just suspended both girls on the spot. 10 days out of school suspension. That would have eased his conscience about drugs being sold on campus when the girls are not even on school grounds to sell or give out the pills.

It is what it is though, I can understand the strip search. (which was not spreading her legs like the article said just shaking the elastic in her underwear) Maybe in the future they should call the parents first.

I think they school needs clear guidelines and parents know about these guidelines. I can easily see how this strip search could get out of hand. When I was in the military we had clear guidelines for such things (even a manual for it!) so when something came up you literally followed the book, step-by-step. The same with urine tests. I didn't like everything I had to do, and when people bitched, I would always point to the manual and say "here are the rules - I gotta do it and you know the deal." I do not think the school has such policies and procedures in place. It does seem the strip search was a little ad hoc.

Anyway, I am curious as to how the Supreme Court will rule.

 

[Tiervexx]

Imagine it was heroin, meth, or even oxy (which requires s script) and she was selling it to your children.

With the way I see it my kid would first have to agree to buy it.

I don't believe sellers deserve any more, or even as much blame as the people who decide to use.

I also think it is the anti-education culture in many inner cities that cause people not to graduate because you can be kinda stupid and stoned out of your mind and still graduate high school if you just care a little bit about it.

As for drug use... Drug prohibition has been a total failure. Kids who want to use drugs can still buy them anywhere. There is a whole body of economic theory and numerous historical examples that show why prohibitions can't work without real totalitarianism. Educations programs are the only thing that even have a chance of working.

More to the point, I think strip searching people for a personal choice is just wrong.