Got Bloodwork back - Low Test

[tha_Waco_kid]

So I got some bloods done and my test came in at 223. Which from what I read, is below the standard range. I haven't done a cycle in about 10 years, and only 2 modest cycles were done in total. Right now I'm 32.

I haven't heard back from my doc yet but what can I expect for next steps? Will the put me on TRT?

Also - does low testosterone have anything to do with the ability to burn fat and lose weight? I have been doing multiple daily cardio sessions and dieting like a sumbitch for about 6 months and i've stalled at about 13-14%. Even with a sarms triple stack cycle...can't break that plateau.

ANyways, not sure if it has any correlation with weight loss but thought I'd check.

 

[dabuffguy]

So I got some bloods done and my test came in at 223. Which from what I read, is below the standard range. I haven't done a cycle in about 10 years, and only 2 modest cycles were done in total. Right now I'm 32.

I haven't heard back from my doc yet but what can I expect for next steps? Will the put me on TRT?

Also - does low testosterone have anything to do with the ability to burn fat and lose weight? I have been working out and dieting like a sumbitch for about 6 months and i've stalled at about 13-14%. Even with a sarms triple stack cycle...can't break that plateau.

ANyways, not sure if it has any correlation with weight loss but thought I'd check.

"Low test" is extremely subjective. Almost anyone can be diagnosed with low T from certain criteria.

Anyways, you might be put on TRT. 200 mg weekly is what I'd ask for. Typically they won't dose you higher than that.

Low testosterone definitely has an impact on the ability to get lean and lose/gain weight.

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

Low testosterone definitely has an impact on the ability to get lean and lose/gain weight.

Thanks, that makes me feel better and gives me some hope...I literally have been probably 1000 cals under maintenance per day for like 6 months straight....which is obviously not sustainable in the long run, and I am not even cutting up any further than my current BF%

Also I find my low test score interesting considering after my sarms cycle I did a pct of Unleashed/Post Cycle/Bridge, not to mention running HCGenerate throughout the whole 8 week cycle prior to PCT.

 

[njguy1]

yo bro

in a similar boat as you, Im getting my test bloodwork done on friday, then got an app to see my endo guy on nov 12. I have the HARDEST time losing fat, after losing 300lbs doing a very low cal diet (28yr old) in 2 years, im sure i've completely destroyed my test levels

My goal is to get trt at 200mg a week the "legal" way before i consider a cycle. I just can't go on living my life eating less then 1900cal a day and gaining weight... makes you miserable...

anway, i'm running the sarms triple stack now too, in a last ditch effort to drop fat before trt or aas

question for you - did you fast for your blood work? Did you not sleep? I hear the best way to get a "low" test result on your tests is not to sleep

however, what about fasting? woudl coffee w/ some sweet&low and 1 creamer during the night effect my bloodwork?

thanks for the help in advance!

 

[Trabireiter]

Thanks, that makes me feel better and gives me some hope...I literally have been probably 1000 cals under maintenance per day for like 6 months straight....which is obviously not sustainable in the long run, and I am not even cutting up any further than my current BF%

Also I find my low test score interesting considering after my sarms cycle I did a pct of Unleashed/Post Cycle/Bridge, not to mention running HCGenerate throughout the whole 8 week cycle prior to PCT.

thats just too little cals. no surprise your body goes into preservation mode and will do anything not to shed further fat.

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

thats just too little cals. no surprise your body goes into preservation mode and will do anything not to shed further fat.

Yeah I know it is too few of cals. I started at a more reasonable level and kept lowering it gradually as I stalled out. I don't think it is why my levels are low.

I have a feeling that my test levels have been low for years

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

Doc called this morning and I'm going in tomorrow for a second pulling of bloodwork to check levels. Apparently this is protocol before sending to Endo or any scripts are given.

we shall see........................

 

[RickRock13]

How long has it been since you ran the SARMS stack? If it was recent your test levels may be lower because of it. S4 and extended lengths of Ostarine can shut you down some. Did you PCT after the stack? Whatever your doc says, I would possibly try some natural ways to bring up your test before going on TRT. Unleashed, low dose clomid, and DAA might be a good way to bring them up then recheck levels.

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

How long has it been since you ran the SARMS stack? If it was recent your test levels may be lower because of it. S4 and extended lengths of Ostarine can shut you down some. Did you PCT after the stack? Whatever your doc says, I would possibly try some natural ways to bring up your test before going on TRT. Unleashed, low dose clomid, and DAA might be a good way to bring them up then recheck levels.

Hey RIck - it was about 2 months ago when my 8 week sarms stack finished. I stopped the S4 after week 5 because I didn't like the vision sides. FInished out the Osta and GW though for 8 weeks.

Ran PCT consisting of Unleashed/Post Cycle/Bridge....so its been about 3 or 4 weeks since i finished my PCT.

I am going to run through the Dr's protocol just so I can get a proper diagnoses (to make sure there isn't a serious condition or something). After I get a diagnoses, I'll probably try something myself before getting on HRT.

I can't get any unleashed so I was thinking of running Clomid - what does would you suggest? how long should I take it?

Also I have some HCGenerate which I was gonna run with the Unleashed or Clomid. Of course since I just ran the PCT stack and my test results came back low, I"m not exactly confident in unleashed at this point. thanks!

 

[callmejay]

Post your bloodwork

Sent from my PG86100 using EliteFitness

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

Post your bloodwork

Sent from my PG86100 using EliteFitness

Which values? All I got back was the basic panel (including cholesterol and CBC which were all in great shape)

Only test value I got back was the test total which was 223 ng/dl. I am back in the morning to get the more detailed suite of tests including free test and whatever else they pull in 'step 2' of the low test diagnoses protocol.

 

[Headholio]

SARMS 2 months prior to the test, and T is low. There's your answer. you are suppressed from SARMS. Don't jump into TRT for the rest of your life based on this test. If the doc doesn't know the facts, he will assume you just have a natural production problem, which is NOT the case. You are only 32. Wait 2-3 more months and retest, and I bet you bounce back.

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

SARMS 2 months prior to the test, and T is low. There's your answer. you are suppressed from SARMS. Don't jump into TRT for the rest of your life based on this test. If the doc doesn't know the facts, he will assume you just have a natural production problem, which is NOT the case. You are only 32. Wait 2-3 more months and retest, and I bet you bounce back.

Really? Ok, so maybe I didnt fully understand the Sarms suppression facts. I thought they were only 'mildly' suppressive.....I took HCGenerate through the whole cycle to keep that mild suppression at an even milder level, then ran the PCT recommended for Sarms. I guess I thought if it did suppress me I'd recover pretty dang fast. Perhaps I misunderstood.

Thank you for your reply!

 

[Aplopez8]

SARMS 2 months prior to the test, and T is low. There's your answer. you are suppressed from SARMS. Don't jump into TRT for the rest of your life based on this test. If the doc doesn't know the facts, he will assume you just have a natural production problem, which is NOT the case. You are only 32. Wait 2-3 more months and retest, and I bet you bounce back.

Yes and I wouldn't recommend clomid at this point it might be better just to stick to natural alternatives such as tribulus or unleashed while you wait these couple of months to see if test levels bounce back

 

[stevesmi]

whoa there buddy. at 32 years old you have better realize what you are getting yourself into.

1. you are gonna be on test for THE REST OF YOUR LIFE.. imagine yourself at 80 injecting yourself with test, i guess you will have to get the nurse at the nursing home to do it for you? be smarter than this... i guess for the next 50 years you are gonna inject yourself every week? thats a big decision.

2. you ran S4.. mildly suppressive? ummm.. yeah.. what difference does that make.. suppression is suppression. you are only 1 month out of it. you barely have had time to recover. i would say your levels are probably HIGH right now, not low. had you run something like deca your T levels would be in the double digits right now.

3.. your doc doesn't know you took SARMS and he has no idea what SARMS is. might want to tell him that.

4. going by total T levels is just plain ignorant. need to run a full hormone panel .. where is your LH? FSH? these numbers will give more color on your situation.

5. your pct was short and weak. thats fine for a SARM stack, but also don't come on here and say "unleashed doesn't work" .. unleashed doesn't magically boost your LH.. hcg and HMG will though. if you want to recover faster you should of ran those too.. unleashed boosts free test and makes you feel good.

6. you are still in the process of recovery. give it more time.. your doc won't tell you going on HRT is gonna be a lifetime decision

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHneA79Uyvk << watch this vid on HRT before you make a stupid decision

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

whoa there buddy. at 32 years old you have better realize what you are getting yourself into.

1. you are gonna be on test for THE REST OF YOUR LIFE.. imagine yourself at 80 injecting yourself with test, i guess you will have to get the nurse at the nursing home to do it for you? be smarter than this... i guess for the next 50 years you are gonna inject yourself every week? thats a big decision.

2. you ran S4.. mildly suppressive? ummm.. yeah.. what difference does that make.. suppression is suppression. you are only 1 month out of it. you barely have had time to recover. i would say your levels are probably HIGH right now, not low. had you run something like deca your T levels would be in the double digits right now.

3.. your doc doesn't know you took SARMS and he has no idea what SARMS is. might want to tell him that.

4. going by total T levels is just plain ignorant. need to run a full hormone panel .. where is your LH? FSH? these numbers will give more color on your situation.

5. your pct was short and weak. thats fine for a SARM stack, but also don't come on here and say "unleashed doesn't work" .. unleashed doesn't magically boost your LH.. hcg and HMG will though. if you want to recover faster you should of ran those too.. unleashed boosts free test and makes you feel good.

6. you are still in the process of recovery. give it more time.. your doc won't tell you going on HRT is gonna be a lifetime decision

HRT TRT and Reasons Why NOT - YouTube << watch this vid on HRT before you make a stupid decision

Hey Steve -

Thanks for the reply but you are putting a lot of words in my mouth here and I don't think the condescending tone is necessary.

I never said I decided to get replacement therapy...I simply said I got my levels checked and my test was low, and I was inquiring as to what that meant, what I can expect next, and what might have caused it. I am just gathering information here which is what the board is for, no? I am not just 'going on the total number'....that was the first trigger, I'm getting the full panel run tomorrow AM, as I stated in a previous post.

Never said unleashed doesn't work...I am just skeptical, as I am with all OTC products. I have taken tons of NTBM products and most I didn't get results from, but some I did. Never once came on here and said product X sucks. Everybody responds to things differently, I know that.

Not sure why you are calling my Sarms PCT 'weak and short' when it this the precise PCT I was advised to take on the mods from this board; to the letter.

I'm simply gathering information - trying to make an informed decision when the time comes. I am not some ignorant schmuck who will shove anything in his body so he gets huge and gets chicks.....please

Only reason the test level piqued my interest at all is because for several years I have felt the symptoms of what I know have learned can be traced to low test levels (way before I did any sarms this past year).....low libido, extremely hard to lose fat even on very low calories, general lethargy, etc. When I saw the low test level from my bloodwork it made some sense to me given what I had experienced in recent years.....

I'm curious as to what the cause of the low test is, and i'm going to see the process through to find the diagnoses. Maybe it is the Sarms I took, maybe it is something else....

Just assuming that my levels are weak because of a recent run of Sarms would be ignorant....it could be many things...it could be something serious...who knows....again, just following the process, and gathering all the info I can while I wait.

 

[stevesmi]

Hey Steve -

Thanks for the reply but you are putting a lot of words in my mouth here and I don't think the condescending tone is necessary.

sorry bro, didn't mean for it to come off that way. its a movie line i use on my friends in person and its more of a 'whoa buddy hold up a sec' type tone.. like fishing next to a friend about to toss his hook out and about to hook my neck.. meaning to take a breathe and give me a sec to move out of the way so you don't hook me.

I never said I decided to get replacement therapy...I simply said I got my levels checked and my test was low, and I was inquiring as to what that meant, what I can expect next, and what might have caused it. I am just gathering information here which is what the board is for, no? I am not just 'going on the total number'....that was the first trigger, I'm getting the full panel run tomorrow AM, as I stated in a previous post.

cool post it up man and we will get a better idea as to what is going on..


Never said unleashed doesn't work...I am just skeptical, as I am with all OTC products. I have taken tons of NTBM products and most I didn't get results from, but some I did. Never once came on here and said product X sucks. Everybody responds to things differently, I know that.

unleashed will effect SHBG/free test and make you feel good.. it won't make you recover from any suppressive cycle overnight.. its a great addiction to pct for that reason. but don't expect miracles from anything whether natural or not.

Not sure why you are calling my Sarms PCT 'weak and short' when it this the precise PCT I was advised to take on the mods from this board; to the letter.

the pct is fine for that type of cycle, you misunderstood what i was saying. if you ran a long suppressive deca/test type cycle you would need a bigger pct for sure. so in that aspect you ran a short and weak pct. but its totally fine for what you ran and it worked but you are still in recovery mode and a month isn't enough time to get back to 100%

I'm simply gathering information - trying to make an informed decision when the time comes. I am not some ignorant schmuck who will shove anything in his body so he gets huge and gets chicks.....please

i understand exactly what you are doing.. re-read my post again without taking it as being condescending and you will get valueable advice there. i think you took it the wrong way and blew it off entirely as an attack.. didn't mean for it to be that way at all i've got like 20 tabs open on here plus PM's coming in every 10 minutes on average so my posts are as direct and quick as possible so i can get to everyone.. it might come off as being insensitive but i promise it isn't

Only reason the test level piqued my interest at all is because for several years I have felt the symptoms of what I know have learned can be traced to low test levels (way before I did any sarms this past year).....low libido, extremely hard to lose fat even on very low calories, general lethargy, etc. When I saw the low test level from my bloodwork it made some sense to me given what I had experienced in recent years.....

I'm curious as to what the cause of the low test is, and i'm going to see the process through to find the diagnoses. Maybe it is the Sarms I took, maybe it is something else....
Just assuming that my levels are weak because of a recent run of Sarms would be ignorant....it could be many things...it could be something serious...who knows....again, just following the process, and gathering all the info I can while I wait.

well it could be genetic, it could be lifestyle choices.. stress.. diet, having a kid, lack of libido .. its a domino effect. lets eliminate the possibilities before making that decision to go HRT forever.. blood tests will give us more color but they don't nail down anything definatively, unless you continue to run several more bloods over the next couple months and see if your levels stabilize or not. if they keep inching up that is your body slowly recovering..

in bold

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

Yeah no worries Steve - I do appreciate your insight, thanks.

I will post what I learn from the blood work drawn tomorrow morning as it pertains to the other test levels pulled.

Thanks!

 

[callmejay]

whoa there buddy. at 32 years old you have better realize what you are getting yourself into.

1. you are gonna be on test for THE REST OF YOUR LIFE.. imagine yourself at 80 injecting yourself with test, i guess you will have to get the nurse at the nursing home to do it for you? be smarter than this... i guess for the next 50 years you are gonna inject yourself every week? thats a big decision.

2. you ran S4.. mildly suppressive? ummm.. yeah.. what difference does that make.. suppression is suppression. you are only 1 month out of it. you barely have had time to recover. i would say your levels are probably HIGH right now, not low. had you run something like deca your T levels would be in the double digits right now.

3.. your doc doesn't know you took SARMS and he has no idea what SARMS is. might want to tell him that.

4. going by total T levels is just plain ignorant. need to run a full hormone panel .. where is your LH? FSH? these numbers will give more color on your situation.

5. your pct was short and weak. thats fine for a SARM stack, but also don't come on here and say "unleashed doesn't work" .. unleashed doesn't magically boost your LH.. hcg and HMG will though. if you want to recover faster you should of ran those too.. unleashed boosts free test and makes you feel good.

6. you are still in the process of recovery. give it more time.. your doc won't tell you going on HRT is gonna be a lifetime decision

HRT TRT and Reasons Why NOT - YouTube << watch this vid on HRT before you make a stupid decision

this is gold.

The reason I asked for the full bloodwork was to see exactly what Steve mentioned - LH, FSH, e2. We will be able to help you a lot more once you have that. Looking forward to it.

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

this is gold.

The reason I asked for the full bloodwork was to see exactly what Steve mentioned - LH, FSH, e2. We will be able to help you a lot more once you have that. Looking forward to it.

Thanks - I was fully aware of the missing values I just don't have them yet. Will get them tomorrow. First blood work only included total test

 

[mrsocal]

So I got some bloods done and my test came in at 223. Which from what I read, is below the standard range. I haven't done a cycle in about 10 years, and only 2 modest cycles were done in total. Right now I'm 32.

I haven't heard back from my doc yet but what can I expect for next steps? Will the put me on TRT?

Also - does low testosterone have anything to do with the ability to burn fat and lose weight? I have been doing multiple daily cardio sessions and dieting like a sumbitch for about 6 months and i've stalled at about 13-14%. Even with a sarms triple stack cycle...can't break that plateau.

ANyways, not sure if it has any correlation with weight loss but thought I'd check.

yes low test is a problem with getting rid of fat.

try to also increase ur test naturally by doing squats or deep knee bends. u can do deep knee bends at work.

they stimulate the groin to produce more test naturally

also other ways to increase test naturally (WHILE U WAIT FOR THE DOC TO PRESCRIBE TEST TO U LEGALLY)...IS...

GET A DEEP-BURN SUN TAN

lay in a tub of very warm water/jacuzzi, for at least 15 minutes

but don't do the hot tub/jacuzzi thing if u have a bad heart cos it raises ur heart beat/blood pressure--i think

they both get the juices flowing in ur testes

 

[midevilironsmasher]

Haha best advise so far!

 

[stevesmi]

yes low test is a problem with getting rid of fat.

try to also increase ur test naturally by doing squats or deep knee bends. u can do deep knee bends at work.

they stimulate the groin to produce more test naturally

also other ways to increase test naturally (WHILE U WAIT FOR THE DOC TO PRESCRIBE TEST TO U LEGALLY)...IS...

GET A DEEP-BURN SUN TAN

lay in a tub of very warm water/jacuzzi, for at least 15 minutes

but don't do the hot tub/jacuzzi thing if u have a bad heart cos it raises ur heart beat/blood pressure--i think

they both get the juices flowing in ur testes

infrared sauna is much safer then getting a deep burn sun tan. i live on the beach and A LOT of people around here end up with cancer and other serious problems from sun burns.

infrared sauna you get the benefits of the sun WITHOUT the harmful UV rays.

lots of gyms have them, i pay an extra 10 bucks a month to use it all i want at my gym

never heard that it boosts T, but it does for sure boost vitamins and boost immune system.. which could indirectly boost T from an overall healthy body .. vitamin D is important and people who live in the higher latitudes have certain problems including lower T levels than people who evolved near the equator. (Africa vs. northern Europe/Asia)

 

[Big Rick Rock]

Post your full Testosterone bloodwork. If you are low then I will get the sponsors to fork over a whole PCT program for you, providing you agree to get bloodwork done every two weeks through the whole thing. You would need about 90-day PCT without using Stteroids or SARMS.

Let me know if you are down.

 

[Ftsk]

Post your full Testosterone bloodwork. If you are low then I will get the sponsors to fork over a whole PCT program for you, providing you agree to get bloodwork done every two weeks through the whole thing. You would need about 90-day PCT without using Stteroids or SARMS.

Let me know if you are down.

Dam wish I posted about my encounter with low test

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

Took the second round of Bloods today for the test panel...here's the result:

Total Test: 203 (was 223 two days ago)

LH: 1.7
FSH: 3.9
Prolactin: 3.9


I haven't done any research on these levels yet I just posted them here, so I'm not sure where these fall on the 'normal' curve. ALthough they seem on the low end off the top of my head.


what do these levels tell you guys?


Thanks bros

 

[stevesmi]

^^^ good news is your body is alive. your LH isn't at 0. the bad news is it still has work to do.. your FSH level is much better though. your LH should start creeping up over the next few weeks and your total T will follow. you are still in recovery mode.

did you run bloods in between your last 2 cycles? if so what were the results?

i can only assume you did not go into this last cycle suppressed, so i can make an educate guess that sticking with natural test boosters is your best option right now and giving it more time.

i bet 85% of guys on here if they ran bloods after any cycle will get scared at their results, people do not give themselves enough time to recover in between cycles (i am guilty of this too as is 99% of us on here), and people also do not stretch their pct's long enough to cover that recovery time they need. i call it running 'naked pct's'

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

^^^ good news is your body is alive. your LH isn't at 0. the bad news is it still has work to do.. your FSH level is much better though. your LH should start creeping up over the next few weeks and your total T will follow. you are still in recovery mode.

did you run bloods in between your last 2 cycles? if so what were the results?

i can only assume you did not go into this last cycle suppressed, so i can make an educate guess that sticking with natural test boosters is your best option right now and giving it more time.

i bet 85% of guys on here if they ran bloods after any cycle will get scared at their results, people do not give themselves enough time to recover in between cycles (i am guilty of this too as is 99% of us on here), and people also do not stretch their pct's long enough to cover that recovery time they need. i call it running 'naked pct's'

Definitely wasn't suppressed going into Sarms cycle....well, at least not from any gear...I haven't touched an anabolic in over a decade. It is possible I had low test going in however, as looking back I can relate to some of the symptoms of having a low test.

I did not know that a sarms cycle could completely shut you down....that is an eye opener for me....I did run the 'mini' pct protocol that Dylan and others have recommended here. Maybe a stronger PCT is needed for Sarms - or, maybe I have something else going on here.....I haven't heard back from the doc yet, so we'll see what he has to say.

Thanks

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

Post your full Testosterone bloodwork. If you are low then I will get the sponsors to fork over a whole PCT program for you, providing you agree to get bloodwork done every two weeks through the whole thing. You would need about 90-day PCT without using Stteroids or SARMS.

Let me know if you are down.

Wow thanks for the offer bro - PM sent

 

[stevesmi]

Definitely wasn't suppressed going into Sarms cycle....well, at least not from any gear...I haven't touched an anabolic in over a decade. It is possible I had low test going in however, as looking back I can relate to some of the symptoms of having a low test.

I did not know that a sarms cycle could completely shut you down....that is an eye opener for me....I did run the 'mini' pct protocol that Dylan and others have recommended here. Maybe a stronger PCT is needed for Sarms - or, maybe I have something else going on here.....I haven't heard back from the doc yet, so we'll see what he has to say.

Thanks

you aren't shut down at all. if your LH was at 0 you would be shut down.

you still do not understand what I am saying. your LH doesn't go from 0 to 5 overnight... its a process and takes time.. the bottom line in plain english is you haven't given yourself enough time to recover. take BRR's offer to run a natural PCT from here and you will feel much better. just don't touch anything suppressive until your get fully recovered....

the doc isn't gonna tell you anything that i would consider good advice, unless he himself is an experienced cycler of steroids.. docs just don't know this stuff and i doubt he has ever heard of SARMS

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

True - but I'm 8 weeks out with pct mixed in. So it probably has come back some already from how low it was during and immediately after the cycle. I didn't mean completely shut down, like down to zero. Sorry, I misspoke there. But I am/was suppressed more than I would have expected from a run of sarms. That's all I meant, I understand completely what you are saying, thanks again I appreciate the replies.

 

[stevesmi]

^^^ yeah i know but in case someone reads this I don't want them to think a sarms stack shuts down their rats that bad. from my own experience my rat dealt with suppression, but nothing compared with running a 12 week hormone cycle.

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

10-4 bro, thanks

 

[needtogetaas]

I will set you up with a pct right now.. This pct will be super easy and simple too.

weeks
1-6 forma-stanzol 5 pumps am and pm every day for the first 4 weeks, drop down to 3 and 3 the last 2 weeks
1-4 phytoserm-347 1 cap am and 1 cap pm
2-8 N2BM-DAA 1 full serving every morning.
4-8 Bridge 1 cap 3 times a day Morning noon and night..
I will work with rick to get you everything needed to do the pct and work with you so you can get the blood test. I will cover all the products but you must cover the blood test.. I will need your name and number so I can call you and work with you on this... Following up now with the pm you and rick sent me

 

[notjake11]

The fact that you guys are doing this to help the guy is amazing and makes me feel that much happier that I found this place. Yes I get that you benefit from the experience (makes a good spokesperson/model when the process is done), but you have plenty of those already from people that paid for their products. This guy will benefit far more.

So thanks for outtimg together such a great site and for helping so many of us get the information and access to supplies we need.

Sent from my Desire HD using EliteFitness

 

[needtogetaas]

The fact that you guys are doing this to help the guy is amazing and makes me feel that much happier that I found this place. Yes I get that you benefit from the experience (makes a good spokesperson/model when the process is done), but you have plenty of those already from people that paid for their products. This guy will benefit far more.

So thanks for outtimg together such a great site and for helping so many of us get the information and access to supplies we need.

Sent from my Desire HD using EliteFitness

we take care of each other here on Elite man..