Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below I just wanted to share that my girlfriend took the recomended dosage yesterday and went to work out right after as it says to do on the bottle. In the middle of her work out she colapsed and looked like she was going to go into cadiac failure. i just cant believe that this stuff is out on the market.
Xenedrine...scrary stuff
- Thread starter Elvis P.
- Start date
gymtime
New member
Xenadrine and other eca product have had these kinds of effects on some people, but very few compared to how many actually use it.
My guess is, and I'm no doctor, that she either took more than she should have or she simply has a very low tolerance for stimulants. Some people are like that.
What dosage does the bottle recommend?
My guess is, and I'm no doctor, that she either took more than she should have or she simply has a very low tolerance for stimulants. Some people are like that.
What dosage does the bottle recommend?
ShadowKnight
New member
I believe you left out a few points . . .
1) Had she eaten anything that morning, and the night before
2) Had she been drinking plenty of water
3) Was she on any other medication that would be classified as a stimulant or an upper
4) Had she been sleeping properly
I also have known people to have some difficulties when taking this stuff . . . but I find a close link between their lack of water/food intake and their occurence of reactions.
I'm sure there is a missing peice of info in your situation that will present the answer.
SK
1) Had she eaten anything that morning, and the night before
2) Had she been drinking plenty of water
3) Was she on any other medication that would be classified as a stimulant or an upper
4) Had she been sleeping properly
I also have known people to have some difficulties when taking this stuff . . . but I find a close link between their lack of water/food intake and their occurence of reactions.
I'm sure there is a missing peice of info in your situation that will present the answer.
SK
Audacious1
New member
Now i am not certain, but from what i remember, the bottle states a dosage, but then says to start out on half the recommended dosage to know your tolerance. Ephedra is scary stuff when not taken correctly and even worse when mixed with other medications. I know I can't take any ephedra containing products b/c i get major chest pains and my heart races like crazy. If she wants to try something else...which i am sure she probably won't, have her try Adipokinetics...it doesn't have the crazy sides like Xenadrine or Hydroxycut and it helps greatly with fat loss in the lower body...i have taken it for two weeks now without any problems...just make sure she takes one pill at a time. And that she drinks plenty of water and doesn't over exert herself if she is doing cardio. Another one to try is Ephedra free Ripped Fuel. Just make sure that if she wants to try something else that it does NOT contain ephedra
Stryc-9
New member
Ditto to ShadowKnight....
For every horror story you hear about the dangers of e/c/a there is a corresponding success story...
Personally, I've used Xenadrine before with no adverse effects....and I'm certainly far from convinced that this product is the only reason for the unfortunate experience your girlfriend had.
For every horror story you hear about the dangers of e/c/a there is a corresponding success story...
Personally, I've used Xenadrine before with no adverse effects....and I'm certainly far from convinced that this product is the only reason for the unfortunate experience your girlfriend had.
gymtime
New member
Stryc-9 said:
I'd even go so far as to say that for every horror story, there are several success stories. I've used eca products for years and never had a problem. But I also know my limits with it. I'm 6'1", 220 and I will NEVER take more than two at a time. And thats pre-workout, full stomach only.
ShadowKnight
New member
some info for you and your g/f
Ephedrine is a drug derived from plants of the genus Ephedra, most commonly used to prevent mild or moderate attacks of bronchial asthma. Unlike epinephrine, to which it is chemically similar, ephedrine is slow to take effect and of mild potency and long duration. A bronchodilator and decongestant, ephedrine is used to relieve nasal congestion originating from allergic conditions, e.g., hay fever, or from bacterial or viral infection of the upper respiratory tract. It is also used to raise blood pressure. Ephedrine is the active constituent of ma huang, a desert herb used medically in China for thousands of years. It is used in the production of methamphetamine (see amphetamine desc.) and is also the active ingredient in ephedra, or herbal ecstasy. Ephedra may cause such side effects as insomnia, restlessness, euphoria, palpitations, and high blood pressure; there have been reports of deaths associated with its use as a "natural recreational drug.
Amphetamine is any one of a group of drugs that are powerful central nervous system stimulants. Amphetamines have stimulating effects opposite to the effects of depressants such as alcohol, narcotics, and barbiturates. They raise the blood pressure by causing the body to release epinephrine, postpone the need for sleep, and can reverse, partially and temporarily, the effects of fatigue. Amphetamines enhance mental alertness and the ability to concentrate, and also cause wakefulness, euphoria, and talkativeness. Benzedrine is the trade name for the drug amphetamine; dextroamphetamine is marketed as Dexedrine. Methamphetamine, a potent stimulant marketed as Desoxyn, is the most rapidly acting amphetamine.
Hope this can help you find an answer. Also, I hope she gets to feeling better as well.
SK
Ephedrine is a drug derived from plants of the genus Ephedra, most commonly used to prevent mild or moderate attacks of bronchial asthma. Unlike epinephrine, to which it is chemically similar, ephedrine is slow to take effect and of mild potency and long duration. A bronchodilator and decongestant, ephedrine is used to relieve nasal congestion originating from allergic conditions, e.g., hay fever, or from bacterial or viral infection of the upper respiratory tract. It is also used to raise blood pressure. Ephedrine is the active constituent of ma huang, a desert herb used medically in China for thousands of years. It is used in the production of methamphetamine (see amphetamine desc.) and is also the active ingredient in ephedra, or herbal ecstasy. Ephedra may cause such side effects as insomnia, restlessness, euphoria, palpitations, and high blood pressure; there have been reports of deaths associated with its use as a "natural recreational drug.
Amphetamine is any one of a group of drugs that are powerful central nervous system stimulants. Amphetamines have stimulating effects opposite to the effects of depressants such as alcohol, narcotics, and barbiturates. They raise the blood pressure by causing the body to release epinephrine, postpone the need for sleep, and can reverse, partially and temporarily, the effects of fatigue. Amphetamines enhance mental alertness and the ability to concentrate, and also cause wakefulness, euphoria, and talkativeness. Benzedrine is the trade name for the drug amphetamine; dextroamphetamine is marketed as Dexedrine. Methamphetamine, a potent stimulant marketed as Desoxyn, is the most rapidly acting amphetamine.
Hope this can help you find an answer. Also, I hope she gets to feeling better as well.
SK
B
buksoon
Guest
I'm with Elvis on this one
(and who knows more about recreational drugs than "Elvis"?)
Stryc and others: Definitely agreed that there are success stories. Why else would it be so popular?
But the hazards are way too real. So many student athletes acquire serious and permanent problems. So many women with body dysmorphia and what have you just die.
I took it ephedra once. Not as an appetite suppressant, but for the pre-workout energy it promised.
I was in absolute disbelief that the stuff was legal! I was shaking like a jello cube on a fault line all day. Strangers were asking me if I was okay.
Then I took a friend's hydroxycut (or xenadrine or some shit like that). (This was years later. Guess I was feeling cocky.) I took it around 10 a.m. 12 hours later I started heaving--my whole body wanted the vestiges of it OUT. I slept on the linoleum floor in front of the toilet that night. I was sweating... it was awful.
Normally I'm this total libertarian about such things. "Hey, do what you want" is my attitude. Not in this case. I would love to see it made illegal.
(and who knows more about recreational drugs than "Elvis"?)
Stryc and others: Definitely agreed that there are success stories. Why else would it be so popular?
But the hazards are way too real. So many student athletes acquire serious and permanent problems. So many women with body dysmorphia and what have you just die.
I took it ephedra once. Not as an appetite suppressant, but for the pre-workout energy it promised.
I was in absolute disbelief that the stuff was legal! I was shaking like a jello cube on a fault line all day. Strangers were asking me if I was okay.
Then I took a friend's hydroxycut (or xenadrine or some shit like that). (This was years later. Guess I was feeling cocky.) I took it around 10 a.m. 12 hours later I started heaving--my whole body wanted the vestiges of it OUT. I slept on the linoleum floor in front of the toilet that night. I was sweating... it was awful.
Normally I'm this total libertarian about such things. "Hey, do what you want" is my attitude. Not in this case. I would love to see it made illegal.
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In the past I have taken Xenadrine, Hydroxy Cut, and Ripped Fuel. I have never had any side effects other than sweating, some jitters, and awesome workouts. My girlfriend takes HydroxyCut, and she loves it.
Currently, I take 2pills of Xenadrine only before my workout, it gives me the extra energy I need to throw the weights around.
These stories are freaky, but I am like the other guys that think there is more to the story of these strange reactions.
Currently, I take 2pills of Xenadrine only before my workout, it gives me the extra energy I need to throw the weights around.
These stories are freaky, but I am like the other guys that think there is more to the story of these strange reactions.
Audacious1
New member
Personally i don't think it should be banned, the people who misuse it should be the ones banned from taking it. 95% of the time when people die or get seriously ill from the stuff are the ones who have abused it or who haven't read the warnings about mixing it with other drugs or taking it while having certain conditions. Sure there are some cases where someone hasn't abused it and still have very negative sides...but maybe they had an underlying condition which interacted with the ephedrine. In any case, people who are seriously considering using this type of stuff should be well educated on it and it's effects on other conditions and mixing it with certain meds or conditions
ShadowKnight
New member
gymtime said:
That would be similar to banning sleeping pills. If you don't use it properly, you will get a negative bodily reaction. Just as in this case with the Xenadrine - it apparently wasn't used properly.
Obviously, people consume these products without knowing what it can and will do to one's body. It comes as no surprise that those who experience negative effects from these drugs are also the same persons who just assume that something over the counter that is for sale must be safe. I believe there have been other products that have received bad reputations because of ignorant misuse - Dexatrim, No Doz, etc.
Why make these things illegal to everyone just because a small group of people get bent out of shape because they didn't do their homework on a pill they were about to swallow? The problem is not in the pill, but the blinded consumer who does not know the limits of their own bodies and what they put into them
SK.
B
buksoon
Guest
ShadowKnight said:
Not even remotely similar. Like I said, I'm libertarian about most things. Adults can make their own decisions. For that reason, I think suing "Big Tobacco" is groundless. Et cetera.
But, in my own situation, I took the recommended dosage. Not on an empty stomach. And I had the reaction I described.
If I was a kid--under enormous pressure to, for example--make a weight class in wrestling, or fit into a size 0 dress--I might not let the above reaction deter me. And I might take it again.
And I might--again, this is hypothetical--fuck myself up for a good long time. Well after I stopped taking the stuff.
I agree with your arguments, I really do. (The libertarian in me....) But once you have that physiological reaction yourself, all bets are off. And you are appalled that this stuff is out there, pretty much unregulated.
I took Xenadrine for an entire summer, and it helped a lot. I never took more than two at a time. But it helped me a lot, I lost 30 pounds. But some guys I know can't take it, their stomach's just wont do it, but I know that if you took it on an empty stomach it just killed me. Maybe that is the problem.
B
buksoon
Guest
gymtime said:
I guess "small number of bad reactions" is subjective. I personally would say: "very large number of horrific reactions" but tomato, tomahto.
To answer your question: No, I guess I wouldn't ban it. That's just not my politics. Maybe I would make it by prescription, for folks whose excess weight poses a danger?
Actually, I would just like to put that obstacle in place for the sake of there being an obstacle. So people wouldn't just take it on a whim, because it's there.
gymtime
New member
Well, when I say "small number...", I'm just talking in terms of ratios. And I of course don't have exact numbers. But I have to believe based on my experience that the number of negative reactions compared to the number of tablets sold has got to be pretty damn small. Especially when you consider the dumbasses who took too much of it. I'd think the number of bad reactions by people who actually stuck to the recommended dose would be even smaller, again, by comparison.
Either way, I think it's a good product. However, I think there should be some kind of warning on the bottle itself.
Either way, I think it's a good product. However, I think there should be some kind of warning on the bottle itself.
Distortion
New member
it can have that effect on some people. u gota be careful, just because thats the recommended dosage doesn't mean you HAVE to use that. You should always start lower and work your way up. I've used xen and i started with 1 pill, i could pop 3 and just be a bit light headed, it all depends, just be careful
Super Girl 22
New member
Audacious1 said:
I think the Adipo Kinetix is alot more harsh on your body. I had taken Xenadrine for a month, lost 12lbs but the side effects diminished after 2-3 wks. I have been taking Adipo for now the 3rd week and these pills are nuts. i can only take 1 a day and i lost 5lbs in 1 wk. they are great for working out but i have gotten sick on them by doing cardio b/c i can't get my heart rate down to normal quick enough. my heart races for an extended period of time on Adipo.......but i do live by the stuff and i have tried to get some people to make the switch from Xenadrine/Hydroxycut/Stackers to Adipo Kinetix. I guess it all depends on your body and what you can stand.
Audacious1
New member
Really...you are the first i heard of so far to have any weird side effects with Adipo. I love it, but i haven't lost 5lbs in one week. I am on a loss of about 2-3lbs a week. Do you do heavy cardio when on it...my cardio only consists of fast incline walking...i heard that fast walking is more effective for fat burning than running. You may have a reaction to the Yohimbie in it...i know some people who don't react well to Yohimbie. Also from what i read, if you are taking any yohimbie, you should avoid any type of cheese and red wine...i guess it causes some sort of weird side effects.
You serioulsy can't mess around with that stuff. Even the recommended dosage can be too much for some. Not all bodies react the same. The 1st time I took an ECA (Thermadrene) for pre-workout was on an empty stomach man my heart was racing, sweating like a mad man & jittery but I ended up having a great workout. The next day I took it on a full stomach it was cool it kept me going & lifting the iron.
chillin408
New member
Elvis, I'm sorry to hear about what happened to your girlfriend. I wish her the best recovery and hope that no bad or permanent damage has been done.
I don't know the whole story of what happened with her ephedra usage, no one but your girlfriend,her family, and yourself probably really know what the status of her health was the day she collapsed.
Assuming that a routine check out would have labeled her completely healthy the day she collapsed and she did not ignore the label, that really sucks, but shit happens. People die or run into health problems all the time because of the legality of swimming pools, cars, knives,aspirin,box cutters, sports, alcohol, smoking,etc. Imagine how many healthy people there would be if processed foods were outlawed.
Anyway, regarding ephedra products,There are many warnings on the label. I believe that xenadrine even says that the product may cause heart attack and strokes. I'm also assuming she knew that ephedra has a bad rap since your her boyfriend and you hang around these boards and also either of you probably heard about ephedra on the news?
So why do you want ephedra to be banned after it has helped countless numbers of people? If it is banned, then acquiring it would probably be a crime. Doctors will not prescribe it to 95% of the people who ask, just like they don't prescribe PPA or phentermine who request. The end result will be more ruined lives, more criminals,people acquiring blackmarket powders taking unknown doses, possible contimination, possible increased crime due to blackmarket business transactions, more hatred toward the US gov't. I even hear that somewhere they are even requiring the labels to print a 1800 number to report side effects. So most people, if not all, know they are not fucking with placebo powder.
I don't know the whole story of what happened with her ephedra usage, no one but your girlfriend,her family, and yourself probably really know what the status of her health was the day she collapsed.
Assuming that a routine check out would have labeled her completely healthy the day she collapsed and she did not ignore the label, that really sucks, but shit happens. People die or run into health problems all the time because of the legality of swimming pools, cars, knives,aspirin,box cutters, sports, alcohol, smoking,etc. Imagine how many healthy people there would be if processed foods were outlawed.
Anyway, regarding ephedra products,There are many warnings on the label. I believe that xenadrine even says that the product may cause heart attack and strokes. I'm also assuming she knew that ephedra has a bad rap since your her boyfriend and you hang around these boards and also either of you probably heard about ephedra on the news?
So why do you want ephedra to be banned after it has helped countless numbers of people? If it is banned, then acquiring it would probably be a crime. Doctors will not prescribe it to 95% of the people who ask, just like they don't prescribe PPA or phentermine who request. The end result will be more ruined lives, more criminals,people acquiring blackmarket powders taking unknown doses, possible contimination, possible increased crime due to blackmarket business transactions, more hatred toward the US gov't. I even hear that somewhere they are even requiring the labels to print a 1800 number to report side effects. So most people, if not all, know they are not fucking with placebo powder.
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DanielBishop
New member
I took some Thermadrene 13 hours ago, and I still can't sleep.... I've tried to sleep 3 times now, for an hour each time.... I just lay there. Then when I get up, I feel dizzy like I'm drunk.
I'm not sure if this stuff is good for me. I have to go to work in 5 hours.... and I haven't had any sleep.
I JUST WANNA SLEEP!!
I'm not sure if this stuff is good for me. I have to go to work in 5 hours.... and I haven't had any sleep.
I JUST WANNA SLEEP!!
B
booger
Guest
Elvis P. said:
Is that the stuff you were taking when you conked out on the crapper back in the late 70's?
I've taken Ephedra products and had the same bad reaction - heart racing, lightheaded, I had tingling in my fingers and toes. Makes it really hard to work out. I did much better on half one pill. Tastes gross, I had to open the capsule and dump half into something like juice or yogourt, tastes like dirt, literally. But certainly can help with a nice energy boost when you need it, and that amount didn't have any adverse effects on me.
Audacious1
New member
Yeah, adipo is legal, i got mine from a local health food store, or you can order it online...just put Adipokinetix in a search engine and you can find a site that sells it
I have only ever used Stackers or Stack II as they are now called, Because i always thought the other e/c/a's were too strong. I have had great succes with stack II but i found that on an empty stomach i could get the jitters and feel very light headed. 
Are the other e/c/a's much more potent ie (Xenadrine or Hydoxycut). And what do you guys think of ripped fuel as a safer option. I want soemthing that works but i don't want to screw up my health in he prosses.
Are the other e/c/a's much more potent ie (Xenadrine or Hydoxycut). And what do you guys think of ripped fuel as a safer option. I want soemthing that works but i don't want to screw up my health in he prosses.ShadowKnight
New member
DanielBishop said:
I read your post early this morning and I thought you said you took Thermadrene 13 years ago, and you still couldn't sleep . . .
I felt so bad for you all day at work, and then I checked it out again a few seconds ago. Whew! Glad to know you've slept for the past 13 years!
Damn I'm an idiot.
SK
I have been taking Xenadrine for about 6 weeks, I take 2 pills when i wake up and 2 pills about 30mins before i workout. (just like the bottle says to do)
I have taken Xenadrine on an empty stomach and have felt no bad affects. I am planing on taking it for about 4-6 more weeks.
I have lost about 20-25 pounds, I feel great, I look great and i just want to workout more.
I was 250, now i am about 230, 225 after workout.
I used to be 280 when i was in peak football weight. But i found after i stopped playing football i really didn't need the weight. This product has really helped me and i hav felt no bad side effects from it as to date.
-pemdas
I have taken Xenadrine on an empty stomach and have felt no bad affects. I am planing on taking it for about 4-6 more weeks.
I have lost about 20-25 pounds, I feel great, I look great and i just want to workout more.
I was 250, now i am about 230, 225 after workout.
I used to be 280 when i was in peak football weight. But i found after i stopped playing football i really didn't need the weight. This product has really helped me and i hav felt no bad side effects from it as to date.
-pemdas
Well, personally, I don't think it's that bad. I'm using Xenedrine right now and I have no problems. 6 pills a day. Nothing. As for ephedrine being so bad, I completely disagree. Maybe I'm different than a lot of people, but I've eaten 300 mgs at a time before. Aside from being hepped up(which was the point of doing it) nothing bad happened.
VooDoo Lady
New member
I've been reading a lot of controversy about Ephedra recently, I saw a couple of excellent pieces on TV recently as well.
I have taken an ECA (one Ephedrine, 2 caffeine, 1 aspirin) stack 3x a day on and off for a couple of years. At first I was extremely jittery but my body always adjusts.
I just finished a bottle of Hydroxycut, I was taking 2 pills 3x a day with no adverse side effects at all. In addition to that I take 1 or 2 Ephedrine pills b4 my workout.
Bottom line is that people should be VERY careful with what they put in their body, whether it be OTC, gear, or prescription. It seems that Ephedrine has had a detrimental effect on people who:
1) Have an underlying medical condition such as asthma or a heart condition
2) Low tolerance for Ephedra
I DO NOT believe this product should be banned simply it poses a health risk for a small portion of the population. My husband is always VERY quick to point out how dangerous regular old aspirin is…there isn’t any public outcry about banning that though…….
My $.02
VDL
I have taken an ECA (one Ephedrine, 2 caffeine, 1 aspirin) stack 3x a day on and off for a couple of years. At first I was extremely jittery but my body always adjusts.
I just finished a bottle of Hydroxycut, I was taking 2 pills 3x a day with no adverse side effects at all. In addition to that I take 1 or 2 Ephedrine pills b4 my workout.
Bottom line is that people should be VERY careful with what they put in their body, whether it be OTC, gear, or prescription. It seems that Ephedrine has had a detrimental effect on people who:
1) Have an underlying medical condition such as asthma or a heart condition
2) Low tolerance for Ephedra
I DO NOT believe this product should be banned simply it poses a health risk for a small portion of the population. My husband is always VERY quick to point out how dangerous regular old aspirin is…there isn’t any public outcry about banning that though…….
My $.02
VDL
11/2in22g5ccfilled
New member
xen
ex nutrition store owner xen was pulled for counterfeiting yes
i said it counterfeiting who knows what the hell was in it
ex nutrition store owner xen was pulled for counterfeiting yes
i said it counterfeiting who knows what the hell was in it
you must read those warning labels very carefully......... but you should still consult your doctor before taking anything.
i cant take 1.5 times the dossage..... or i can take the dossage and take Animal Cuts at the same time..... im just smart and implement this very slowly, building up to it...... i try to be very safe and monitor my heart rate and pulse..... i also only take it when dieting for a show
X
i cant take 1.5 times the dossage..... or i can take the dossage and take Animal Cuts at the same time..... im just smart and implement this very slowly, building up to it...... i try to be very safe and monitor my heart rate and pulse..... i also only take it when dieting for a show
X
I can definatly say that taking on an empty stomach has a massive effect. I take 2 in the morning and 2 before workout after breakfast. Monday I was l8 for work and decided to eat once I got into work but I took my 2 Xen before i left the house. About 15 mins into my train journey I felt like I was gonna have a heart attack. Anxiety sent in, i was shaking and my heart was pumping like crazy. Sweating bulletts to... this lasted my entire 2 hour train jounrey and for a few hours at work... It suppressed my appetite so I didnt eat the breakfast and didnt feel like eating till 7:30 on the nite which pissed me off no end. I just felt like id spew if I ate anything.
So never take on an emtpy stomach. This is the 2nd time of done xen and ive alsmost finished this 2nd run and this is the only time ive felt like this.
STUBS
So never take on an emtpy stomach. This is the 2nd time of done xen and ive alsmost finished this 2nd run and this is the only time ive felt like this.
STUBS
F
Frackal
Guest
For those of you who had adverse reactions, did you heed the directions of taking 1/2 the recommended dosage the first time to asses your tolerance?
Buksoon, here you go again.
You say that suing big tobacco is groundless, yet you suggest banning ephedrine because you got shaky from it? Are you that egotistical?
Interesting you say that suing big tobacco is groundless, when cigarrettes kill more people by a huge margin than any other product on the market, used just as they are intended, to be lit, inhaled, and blown out, yet you say that ephedrine should be illegal because you followed directions and had a 'reaction.' (probably a panic attack or hypersensitivity to stimulants, did you take 1/2 the recommended dosage to test your tolerance?)
Buksoon, here you go again.
You say that suing big tobacco is groundless, yet you suggest banning ephedrine because you got shaky from it? Are you that egotistical?
Interesting you say that suing big tobacco is groundless, when cigarrettes kill more people by a huge margin than any other product on the market, used just as they are intended, to be lit, inhaled, and blown out, yet you say that ephedrine should be illegal because you followed directions and had a 'reaction.' (probably a panic attack or hypersensitivity to stimulants, did you take 1/2 the recommended dosage to test your tolerance?)
For every horror story you hear about the dangers of ECA, there tends to be an idiot.
"But the hazards are way too real. So many student athletes acquire serious and permanent problems. So many women with body dysmorphia and what have you just die. "
"SO MANY...", can you quantify this, or it is just your perception of media hype?
"I took it ephedra once. Not as an appetite suppressant, but for the pre-workout energy it promised.
I was in absolute disbelief that the stuff was legal!....."
"Normally I'm this total libertarian about such things. "Hey, do what you want" is my attitude. Not in this case. I would love to see it made illegal."
Sounds like you could switch to Democrat anyday.
"But the hazards are way too real. So many student athletes acquire serious and permanent problems. So many women with body dysmorphia and what have you just die. "
"SO MANY...", can you quantify this, or it is just your perception of media hype?
"I took it ephedra once. Not as an appetite suppressant, but for the pre-workout energy it promised.
I was in absolute disbelief that the stuff was legal!....."
"Normally I'm this total libertarian about such things. "Hey, do what you want" is my attitude. Not in this case. I would love to see it made illegal."
Sounds like you could switch to Democrat anyday.
Hmmmm should it be banned......put it in perspective. 100,000 Americans will go into hospital this year with serious life threatening gastrintestinal bleeding from taking commonly available anti inflammatories. Many of these people will bleed to death. A fifth of all elederly patients die from adverse drug reactions. Adverse drug reactions are now the 4th leading cause of ALL deaths in America. Many of these drugs are OTC, many of these drugs will be taken on prescription from a physician. So maybe the safest bet would be to just ban drugs. All drugs are dangerous if taken by the wrong person, or in the wrong way, or in combo with other drugs/underlying medical problems. Even aspirin.
Bikini Mod
New member
I personally, practically LIVE on a product called Dymetidrine Xtreme (ECA stack). I do not take it as a fat burner per say, but as a stimulant to keep me functioning throughout the day... If I take two before a workout - I NEVER BOTTOM OUT.
Do I abuse the product? Some may say, "Yes"... but I NEVER exceed the recommended dosage and only take it when I NEED it... take one first thing in the am then maybe two more throught the day if I NEED it...if I have to work late or have a loooooooong drive.
Bottom line is: it is my body, I can read labels, I can tell when I am "pushing it" and if I drop dead then IT IS ON ME.
Yes, I know that I should sleep more, unfortunately with all that is going on in my life sleep is a precious commodity indeed .....even when I DO not have to rise early or stay up late their is some task (more laundry or a bit of insomnia due to worry about stuff, etc) or my damned cat jumps on me at 5AM and demands I play w/her.... or, of course, the kiddies decide to get up EVEN THOUGH I TELL THEM WE CAN SLEEP IN! hehehheee
My point being that just because a few people have had a "reaction" (which I am TRULY sorry they did and hope that they will be OK) that does not mean that a substance should be banned. I am lactose intolerant does that mean that ice-cream should be banned?!
Most (if not all) of these products advise that one should begin slowly taking HALF of the recommended dosage to determine their sensitivity (if any) to the product. If you take something once and have and adverse reaction, then continue to take it "just because" well I think you know what my opinion will be -
YOU DID IT TO YOURSELF.
Do I abuse the product? Some may say, "Yes"... but I NEVER exceed the recommended dosage and only take it when I NEED it... take one first thing in the am then maybe two more throught the day if I NEED it...if I have to work late or have a loooooooong drive.
Bottom line is: it is my body, I can read labels, I can tell when I am "pushing it" and if I drop dead then IT IS ON ME.
Yes, I know that I should sleep more, unfortunately with all that is going on in my life sleep is a precious commodity indeed .....even when I DO not have to rise early or stay up late their is some task (more laundry or a bit of insomnia due to worry about stuff, etc) or my damned cat jumps on me at 5AM and demands I play w/her.... or, of course, the kiddies decide to get up EVEN THOUGH I TELL THEM WE CAN SLEEP IN! hehehheee
My point being that just because a few people have had a "reaction" (which I am TRULY sorry they did and hope that they will be OK) that does not mean that a substance should be banned. I am lactose intolerant does that mean that ice-cream should be banned?!
Most (if not all) of these products advise that one should begin slowly taking HALF of the recommended dosage to determine their sensitivity (if any) to the product. If you take something once and have and adverse reaction, then continue to take it "just because" well I think you know what my opinion will be -
YOU DID IT TO YOURSELF.
I think the only drugs that should be banned are those that are notoriuos for causing harm to people that haven't even taken the drug. Alcohol and tobacco come to mind.........As long as the label warnings are clear and no one else will likely be harmed, I can't see any justification for banning a drug. But I do think the general public needs to be more educated about possible drug interactions so they don't go mixing their ephedrine with their MAOIs or underlying cardiac disease (the labels say to check with your Dr. before using for a very good reason), so they don't take their St John's Wort with a glass of grapefruit juice, or worse yet with their Prozac, or their aspirin with their Warfarin, or their Warfarin with their grapefruit juice for that matter.
Hey, I agree that what you put in your body is your own business. I dont think drugs should be illegal. More people die trying to control drugs than anyone using. I think drug use would lose some of its appeal if it were legal too. However, the thermogenics that contain ECA are pretty potent. Most people dont have a problem with them, that is true, but most people dont have short term problems with speed, and cocaine either. I use thermogenics, so I am not saying they are bad, but I really cant believe our over-protective government hasnt banned them yet.
Canadian Viking
New member
to ban or not to ban!!!!!
I think the real question here is since it is a natural herb it will be found plentiful banned or not, what has a more severe effect, not using such a problem oriented drug, keeping on the weight, and the health risks associated with the weight or use the herb and take the risks there. If used correctly the number of people that benifit far outweigh the others. I've used RipFuel, Exen, Hydrox, and a mix of A.S.A.- Ephedrine-Caffine on more that one occassion and followed the directions to a T and only positive results, I did get carried away with the three way mix though and got off it after I lost 20Lbs in one weekend but oh I felt good. That was when I was young and stupid, I've since read up tons on the net and consulted docs and dieticians and have gone to the more regulated mixes like rip, hydro, and ex. Still workin great but only a month at a time then I take a break to not allow my body to get used to the herb. I started with the self regulated mix and wouldn't go back down that road. The pre mix rocks.
I think the real question here is since it is a natural herb it will be found plentiful banned or not, what has a more severe effect, not using such a problem oriented drug, keeping on the weight, and the health risks associated with the weight or use the herb and take the risks there. If used correctly the number of people that benifit far outweigh the others. I've used RipFuel, Exen, Hydrox, and a mix of A.S.A.- Ephedrine-Caffine on more that one occassion and followed the directions to a T and only positive results, I did get carried away with the three way mix though and got off it after I lost 20Lbs in one weekend but oh I felt good. That was when I was young and stupid, I've since read up tons on the net and consulted docs and dieticians and have gone to the more regulated mixes like rip, hydro, and ex. Still workin great but only a month at a time then I take a break to not allow my body to get used to the herb. I started with the self regulated mix and wouldn't go back down that road. The pre mix rocks.
Blackalpha
New member
I support the idea that EC diet pills can enhance weight loss but I have some proofs that it doesn't worth taking the risk.. eventhough I had used this product quite a few times in the past.
It is easy to lose weight, but keeping it off is the challenge. How can ephedra and caffeine be a solution for weight loss?
A person’s body gets use to the substances ingested each day, especially something addicting like ehperda and caffeine,so discontinuing the use of the pills could also leave the person feeling weak,tired and fatigued easily.
If a person uses ehpedra and caffeine as a temporary appetite suppressor, the lost weight would be easy to gain back.
Larger doses of ephedrine and caffeine or other stimulants may have slightly enhance weight loss in individuals that exercise and maintain a low fat diet but the adverse effects are far greater than the small enhancement of weight loss.
Caffeine does stimulate the nervous system,which then increases heart rate but it does not increase metabolic rate or the ability for the body to burn more calories than usual.
The dosage in the EC pills is said to be equal to 6 cups of coffee a day.This high level of caffeine will cause “jitters,irritability, insomnia and elevated blood pressure.
Caffeine is also a diuretic, which seems good because excess water would leave the body via urine,but the problem is that even though the body weight is decreasing, the body fat is not.
Also,there are not any studies that show a significant and permanent weight loss from caffeine.
As for ehpedra,FDA advises a person not to consume more than 24 mg a day or more than 8 mg at one time.You can tell me that FDA's principles are garbage but many different side affects can occur from taking these pills:nervousness, headache, insomnia, heart palpitations, and dizziness.Ephedrine and caffeine could also have an effect on blood pressure and blood sugar.People with high blood pressure, a history of cardiovascular or thyroid disease,diabetes,prostate problems or are taking prescription medicine are advised not to take these products.
So,it's up to yourself to consider whether you want to use such a supplement or not.
It is easy to lose weight, but keeping it off is the challenge. How can ephedra and caffeine be a solution for weight loss?
A person’s body gets use to the substances ingested each day, especially something addicting like ehperda and caffeine,so discontinuing the use of the pills could also leave the person feeling weak,tired and fatigued easily.
If a person uses ehpedra and caffeine as a temporary appetite suppressor, the lost weight would be easy to gain back.
Larger doses of ephedrine and caffeine or other stimulants may have slightly enhance weight loss in individuals that exercise and maintain a low fat diet but the adverse effects are far greater than the small enhancement of weight loss.
Caffeine does stimulate the nervous system,which then increases heart rate but it does not increase metabolic rate or the ability for the body to burn more calories than usual.
The dosage in the EC pills is said to be equal to 6 cups of coffee a day.This high level of caffeine will cause “jitters,irritability, insomnia and elevated blood pressure.
Caffeine is also a diuretic, which seems good because excess water would leave the body via urine,but the problem is that even though the body weight is decreasing, the body fat is not.
Also,there are not any studies that show a significant and permanent weight loss from caffeine.
As for ehpedra,FDA advises a person not to consume more than 24 mg a day or more than 8 mg at one time.You can tell me that FDA's principles are garbage but many different side affects can occur from taking these pills:nervousness, headache, insomnia, heart palpitations, and dizziness.Ephedrine and caffeine could also have an effect on blood pressure and blood sugar.People with high blood pressure, a history of cardiovascular or thyroid disease,diabetes,prostate problems or are taking prescription medicine are advised not to take these products.
So,it's up to yourself to consider whether you want to use such a supplement or not.
toga22
SideShow Freak
I am a Xenadrine user and think that the product is wonderful. However, if I have not been drinking enough water or if my body is in ketosis I cannot take the reccommended 2 tablet dosage. I think that when taking all products you have to consider your size and tolerance as compared to the average person.
"I support the idea that EC diet pills can enhance weight loss but I have some proofs that it doesn't worth taking the risk.. eventhough I had used this product quite a few times in the past."
So you are essentially saying "Do as I say, not as I do".
"It is easy to lose weight, but keeping it off is the challenge. How can ephedra and caffeine be a solution for weight loss?
A person’s body gets use to the substances ingested each day, especially something addicting like ehperda and caffeine,so discontinuing the use of the pills could also leave the person feeling weak,tired and fatigued easily."
Medications for weight loss are not the solution, but key factors in the battle. They are simply aids.
"If a person uses ehpedra and caffeine as a temporary appetite suppressor, the lost weight would be easy to gain back."
This is true of all medications, diets or routines. But appetite control is a major advantage for any diet.
"Larger doses of ephedrine and caffeine or other stimulants may have slightly enhance weight loss in individuals that exercise and maintain a low fat diet but the adverse effects are far greater than the small enhancement of weight loss."
They can cause major compositional changes compared to normal dieting:
Astrup A, Buemann B, Christensen NJ, Toubro S, Thorbek G, Victor OJ, Quaade F.
"The effect of ephedrine/caffeine mixture on energy expenditure and body composition in obese women."
Metabolism. 1992 Jul;41(7):686-8.
The above study was one of the first showing a significant effect on body COMPOSITION, not mere weight loss. Later studies have shown improvement in blood lipid levels and very few adverse reactions, in fact a recent study has shown that the EC combination is safe for adolescents, under medical supervision.
"Caffeine does stimulate the nervous system,which then increases heart rate but it does not increase metabolic rate or the ability for the body to burn more calories than usual.
The dosage in the EC pills is said to be equal to 6 cups of coffee a day.This high level of caffeine will cause “jitters,irritability, insomnia and elevated blood pressure."
Incorrect, study after study shows that caffeine alone increases metabolic rate and lipid oxidation.
Bracco D, Ferrarra JM, Arnaud MJ, Jequier E, Schutz Y.
"Effects of caffeine on energy metabolism, heart rate, and methylxanthine metabolism in lean and obese women."
Am J Physiol. 1995 Oct;269(4 Pt 1):E671-8.
Koot P, Deurenberg P.
"Comparison of changes in energy expenditure and body temperatures after caffeine consumption."
Ann Nutr Metab. 1995;39(3):135-42.
"Caffeine is also a diuretic, which seems good because excess water would leave the body via urine,but the problem is that even though the body weight is decreasing, the body fat is not.
Also,there are not any studies that show a significant and permanent weight loss from caffeine."
True, this is the reason for the conbination, which is the only combination to show a true synergistic response.
"As for ehpedra,FDA advises a person not to consume more than 24 mg a day or more than 8 mg at one time.You can tell me that FDA's principles are garbage but many different side affects can occur from taking these pills:nervousness, headache, insomnia, heart palpitations, and dizziness.Ephedrine and caffeine could also have an effect on blood pressure and blood sugar.People with high blood pressure, a history of cardiovascular or thyroid disease,diabetes,prostate problems or are taking prescription medicine are advised not to take these products."
The FDA's advise is not based on science, so I must state that it is garbage. Like all drugs, ephedrine/caffeine can have side effects, and must be used cautiously, but I don't see the FDA attacking the makers of acetaminophen products, which destroys livers by the hundreds every year.
"So,it's up to yourself to consider whether you want to use such a supplement or not."
We agree, and now that I have corrected some of your errors, I believe that people can make a more educated decision.
So you are essentially saying "Do as I say, not as I do".
"It is easy to lose weight, but keeping it off is the challenge. How can ephedra and caffeine be a solution for weight loss?
A person’s body gets use to the substances ingested each day, especially something addicting like ehperda and caffeine,so discontinuing the use of the pills could also leave the person feeling weak,tired and fatigued easily."
Medications for weight loss are not the solution, but key factors in the battle. They are simply aids.
"If a person uses ehpedra and caffeine as a temporary appetite suppressor, the lost weight would be easy to gain back."
This is true of all medications, diets or routines. But appetite control is a major advantage for any diet.
"Larger doses of ephedrine and caffeine or other stimulants may have slightly enhance weight loss in individuals that exercise and maintain a low fat diet but the adverse effects are far greater than the small enhancement of weight loss."
They can cause major compositional changes compared to normal dieting:
Astrup A, Buemann B, Christensen NJ, Toubro S, Thorbek G, Victor OJ, Quaade F.
"The effect of ephedrine/caffeine mixture on energy expenditure and body composition in obese women."
Metabolism. 1992 Jul;41(7):686-8.
The above study was one of the first showing a significant effect on body COMPOSITION, not mere weight loss. Later studies have shown improvement in blood lipid levels and very few adverse reactions, in fact a recent study has shown that the EC combination is safe for adolescents, under medical supervision.
"Caffeine does stimulate the nervous system,which then increases heart rate but it does not increase metabolic rate or the ability for the body to burn more calories than usual.
The dosage in the EC pills is said to be equal to 6 cups of coffee a day.This high level of caffeine will cause “jitters,irritability, insomnia and elevated blood pressure."
Incorrect, study after study shows that caffeine alone increases metabolic rate and lipid oxidation.
Bracco D, Ferrarra JM, Arnaud MJ, Jequier E, Schutz Y.
"Effects of caffeine on energy metabolism, heart rate, and methylxanthine metabolism in lean and obese women."
Am J Physiol. 1995 Oct;269(4 Pt 1):E671-8.
Koot P, Deurenberg P.
"Comparison of changes in energy expenditure and body temperatures after caffeine consumption."
Ann Nutr Metab. 1995;39(3):135-42.
"Caffeine is also a diuretic, which seems good because excess water would leave the body via urine,but the problem is that even though the body weight is decreasing, the body fat is not.
Also,there are not any studies that show a significant and permanent weight loss from caffeine."
True, this is the reason for the conbination, which is the only combination to show a true synergistic response.
"As for ehpedra,FDA advises a person not to consume more than 24 mg a day or more than 8 mg at one time.You can tell me that FDA's principles are garbage but many different side affects can occur from taking these pills:nervousness, headache, insomnia, heart palpitations, and dizziness.Ephedrine and caffeine could also have an effect on blood pressure and blood sugar.People with high blood pressure, a history of cardiovascular or thyroid disease,diabetes,prostate problems or are taking prescription medicine are advised not to take these products."
The FDA's advise is not based on science, so I must state that it is garbage. Like all drugs, ephedrine/caffeine can have side effects, and must be used cautiously, but I don't see the FDA attacking the makers of acetaminophen products, which destroys livers by the hundreds every year.
"So,it's up to yourself to consider whether you want to use such a supplement or not."
We agree, and now that I have corrected some of your errors, I believe that people can make a more educated decision.
F
Frackal
Guest
Cockdezl...
You're the fucking man bro, thanks for putting some sanity and science back into this thread!
You're the fucking man bro, thanks for putting some sanity and science back into this thread!
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