Why are people still using tren ace/prop cycles?

[Deleted member 33117]

So now that I am back in the game I have noticed that tren enanthate is very common from UGL's.... why is anyone still bothering with prop/tren ace ed and eod the annoyance of frequent injections, the sting of prop (having been a former homebrewer I know how hard it is to suspend without a lot of alcohol)?

I still see a lot of prop/tren ace cycles. Why isn't everyone just running longer esters for less hassle? The same results could be achieved with less hassle on the injection side.

I've always been baffled by people who think prop produces less water retention than ena or cyp (never found this benefit myself and I've tried every ester there is). Anyone have an explination?

 

[Mad_Max21]

If u don't mind....What would do??? Insight makes the world go round!

 

[Deleted member 33117]

If u don't mind....What would do??? Insight makes the world go round!

I would just run test cyp/ena with tren ena once a week at whatever doses one would run. That is an easy 1-2 injections once a week (with the enanthate ester your blood levels will stabilize by week 3 even on once a week shots although it can be a little spikey towards the end of week one), unless you are running very high doses. With the current market the prices per mg are pretty well the same, and on top of it no pip from the prop. The only downside comes in if you want to add something like injectable winny... but if you are doing all long chain ester injectables with it like eq or primo this there is zero need to even bother with short chain esters.

If you are doing test/tren only, now the tren enanthate is very easy to get, there is just no reason to bother with acetate... and quite frankly prop is more hassle than it is worth even though the powder usually costs a little less per gram for the homebrewer. Harder to suspend. If you are buying a finished product, it costs more for pure prop half the time due to the extra work in making it, and it burns more when injected with frequent soreness for days at the injection site depending on how it was mixed... for no benefit. Honestly even using mixed esters like sust or the UGL tri trens, unless they are cheaper per mg, ofter no advantages other than a slightly faster front load in week one.

 

[Drewb]

Because ace is easy to make at home. Becuse if you are lean Ed intermuscle injections with a 1/2" backloaded slin pin is not a hassle and is pain free. Tren A is a great addition at high dose of 500mg wk for 6-10wks to say a TRT type of test c or e dose. In and out of system quick, great gains.

I don't like prop, agree on that.

For a tren noob, always run tren a the 1st time just in case the metal or physical sides are too much.

 

[Mad_Max21]

Lets throw in an oddball! Beastdrol with Tren ace and test.....Ur thoughts....for contradicting one and one is a no no....just like deca and tren.....which I love together!!! AT THE RIGHT DOSE!

 

[Deleted member 33117]

Because ace is easy to make at home. Becuse you are lean Ed injections with a 1/2" backloaded slin pin is not a hassle and is pain free. Tren A is a great addition at high dose of 500mg wk for 6-10wks to say a TRT type of test c or e dose. In and out of system quick, great gains.

I don't like prop.

I used to do 1/2cc prop/tren shots ed with insulin pins so I get that... but other than the fact I was already doing frequent injections I cannot say that prop yields better gains than longer esters... and again when it comes to ease of making it, tren ena powders are probably a lot cheaper than tren ace cartridges and you don't have to bother disolving the pellets and all that. I still found the prop painful though even with the slin pens because if I used any less BA, my entire bottle would recrystalize even with 100mg/ml.

 

[Drewb]

For my even with support my kidney/liver functions jump enough with the tren I would NEVER run an oral with it, I'd rather have the higher dose tren. Others will have a different willingness to risk or different goals might. Me no.

 

[Deleted member 33117]

Lets throw in an oddball! Beastdrol with Tren ace and test.....Ur thoughts....for contradicting one and one is a no no....just like deca and tren.....which I love together!!! AT THE RIGHT DOSE!

I don't use supps like that... assuming they even work, they tend to cost a lot more than gear. If you really want to throw in an oral you can get winny or dbol powder for pennies and dissolve it in 80 proof whiskey and measure with a dropper/syringe every day for about 5% of the cost of some PH.

Also perhaps I am wrong but I seriously doubt any OTC PH or supp (I don't keep up with the suppliment industry mind you... I use vitamins and fish oil) is going to add benefits to a test/tren stack. Even for me the only oral I even bothered with was winny and not very frequently.

 

[Drewb]

I used to do 1/2cc prop/tren shots ed with insulin pins so I get that... but other than the fact I was already doing frequent injections I cannot say that prop yields better gains than longer esters... and again when it comes to ease of making it, tren ena powders are probably a lot cheaper than tren ace cartridges and you don't have to bother disolving the pellets and all that. I still found the prop painful though even with the slin pens because if I used any less BA, my entire bottle would recrystalize even with 100mg/ml.

I have tried both and for some reason with Ed ace I get near zero sides (less blood level flux?), I do get them (more moody, night sweats, etc) with e. So for me personally and based on my experience I'll never run tren e of ace is available. Others will react differently. I also like pinning my test c once every 4 days to maintain stable blood levels, based on tests it works and is worth the extra pins.

I hate prop thou, stuff just knots up in me and since I'm on TRT year round why bother.

 

[Drewb]

I don't use supps like that... assuming they even work, they tend to cost a lot more than gear. If you really want to throw in an oral you can get winny or dbol powder for pennies and dissolve it in 80 proof whiskey and measure with a dropper/syringe every day for about 5% of the cost of some PH.

Also perhaps I am wrong but I seriously doubt any OTC PH or supp (I don't keep up with the suppliment industry mind you... I use vitamins and fish oil) is going to add benefits to a test/tren stack. Even for me the only oral I even bothered with was winny and not very frequently.

I'm not a big fan of any methl oral, never will be. They have thier place just not in my body.

 

[Drewb]

If u don't mind....What would do??? Insight makes the world go round!

I always run low dose deca (100-150mg e6d) with tren. With tren I lift heavy an I want that joint support.

 

[Deleted member 33117]

I always run low dose deca (100-150mg e6d) with tren. With tren I lift heavy an I want that joint support.

I've always had a love-hate relationship with tren... the sides and the impact on my lipid profile aren't really worth it to me, considering my mother died of a heart attack in 2005 (2 pack a day smoker though).

I'm probably going to stick with test + ancillaries from now on and may just go on my own trt year round now that I am 35. It is mild, my body handles it well, and I can completely control everything from water retention to HDL changes with ancillaries as needed, without the harsh sides of tren. The same benefits can be gleaned, they just take longer. One can get the dense hard look, with tons of strength on test + letro without the need for tren really. If I toss something else in ever it would be a low dose of eq or deca... or 20mg of winny a day for a short period.

 

[Drewb]

Test + stane is better IMO, letro is overkill for TRT. Don't forget DHEA and hcg for the HRT. I also run 2iu hgh year round

TNT current dr trt:
150mg e5d testc
100mg e6d deca
2iu hgh Ed 5on/2off
Adex as needed
250iu hcg e5d

I blast tren or deca when I want. I get no sides with Ed tren pins and a ramped up dose of 1mg Ed (at night) of prami. Next time you run tren pre load prami to 1mg Ed it takes weeks to ramp up. Start at .1mg Ed and increae .1mg every 5 days until you hit 1mg at night. You will sleep like a baby, no prolactin sides, no sweats. Ed tren will eliminat (for many people) the mood swings.

Blood tests ever 2 months and yes the tren shoots up liver/kidney functions even with supplements. Not that high though.

 

[Deleted member 33117]

Test + stane is better IMO, letro is overkill for TRT. Don't forget DHEA and hcg for the HRT. I also run 2iu hgh year round

TNT current dr trt:
150mg e5d testc
100mg e6d deca
2iu hgh Ed 5on/2off
Adex as needed
250iu hcg e5d

I blast tren or deca when I want. I get no sides with Ed tren pins and a tamped up dose of 1mg Ed (at night) of prami.

Blood tests ever 2 months and yes the tren shoots up liver/kidney functions even with supplements. Not that high though.

Letro is overkill because guys dose the shit way to high. Bang for your buck it is amazing. You need a good pill spliter and you can take it every 3-4 days and get amazing results. You can cut a $1 pill into 4 pieces and take one every 3 days... which will give you around .6 mg every 3 days (equal to .2mg a day). Guys do things such take half a pill a day or even eod then think it is way too powerful, which it is. The trick to letro is getting the dose low enough that you get the benefits without the sides in my experience. You can control all of your test bloat for pennies due to the strength/cost of it once you work out the dose that gives you no sides, doesn't impact your sex drive or HDL etc. Less is more.

 

[Drewb]

Letro is overkill because guys dose the shit way to high. Bang for your buck it is amazing. You need a good pill spliter and you can take it every 3-4 days and get amazing results. You can cut a $1 pill into 4 pieces and take one every 3 days... which will give you around .6 mg every 3 days (equal to .2mg a day). Guys do things such take half a pill a day or even eod then think it is way too powerful, which it is. The trick to letro is getting the dose low enough that you get the benefits without the sides in my experience. You can control all of your test bloat for pennies due to the strength/cost of it once you work out the dose that gives you no sides, doesn't impact your sex drive or HDL etc. Less is more.

I've head this from a few experanced guys, I just don't like it (I don't react well). I currently don't run an AI, last blood test with over 1100 total test had an e2 of 26 so I'm blessed with low conversion to estrogen. I have Adex and stane on hand. I prefer the stane, price is not an issue.

Great info, I don't use it and always forget about cutting it up / price etc. Thanks for correcting me bro.

 

[Deleted member 33117]

I've head this from a few experanced guys, I just don't like it (I don't react well). I currently don't run an AI, last blood test with over 1100 total test had an e2 of 26 so I'm blessed with low conversion to estrogen. I have Adex and stane on hand. I prefer the stane, price is not an issue.

Lucky you. For me running 50mg of prop/25mg of tren ed through a slin pin without an AI would put 10-12 lbs of water on me by day 10, with a puffy face to match. Fortunately I also respond very well to low doses of gear in the gains/strength department also. Surplus ARs... but also too much aromatase to go with it.

 

[Drewb]

I know you are experanced. Since test an tren use the same receptor have you thought about running an low dose of yes like 200mg wk with a higher dose of tren 400mg wk? I'm sure you have. It won't cause bloat or convert to e2 and no need for test for anything but a base and dick function. I always run this way and love it. Lean hard recomp gains.

 

[Deleted member 33117]

I know you are experanced. Since test an tren use the same receptor have you thought about running an low dose of yes like 200mg wk with a higher dose of tren 400mg wk? I'm sure you have. It won't cause bloat or convert to e2 and no need for test for anything but a base and dick function. I always run this way and love it. Lean hard recomp gains.

Yes I have, but the night sweats and tren flu were excessive... along with the inability to cum on a high dose of tren (keep in mind last time I used tren was 2004 so acetate was what we had). When trying it years ago I fucked a girl on our second date, fucked her for an hour and could not get off... she then gave me head to exhaustion and nothing... she then thought I did not find her attractive, and that ended that. Others tolerate tren better and this type of stack is really ideal if they can. I always founds 200mg or so was my limit on tren witout side effects.

On the other hand I have always found stacks like test/deca, test/eq and even test/winny to be very tolerable, side effects easy to control etc. They do not carry the kick that tren does, but ultimately the gains do happen and can be as high quality if water is kept in check. I think doing the same thing you did with 200mg of cyp a week with a high dose of EQ and low dose letro yielded the best high quality gains I recall without any signifigant sides.

 

[Drewb]

Yes I have, but the night sweats and tren flu were excessive... along with the inability to cum on a high dose of tren (keep in mind last time I used tren was 2004 so acetate was what we had). When trying it years ago I fucked a girl on our second date, fucked her for an hour and could not get off... she then gave me head to exhaustion and nothing... she then thought I did not find her attractive, and that ended that. Others tolerate tren better and this type of stack is really ideal if they can. I always founds 200mg or so was my limit on tren witout side effects.

On the other hand I have always found stacks like test/deca, test/eq and even test/winny to be very tolerable, side effects easy to control etc. They do not carry the kick that tren does, but ultimately the gains do happen and can be as high quality if water is kept in check. I think doing the same thing you did with 200mg of cyp a week with a high dose of EQ and low dose letro yielded the best high quality gains I recall without any signifigant sides.

Bodyby: thanks for sharing. The only time I have a problem getting off is when my prolactin is way way low.

So in your opinion is the risky toxicity of tren worth the type of gains even if one doesn't have the sides? I'm at a point in my life (have kids etc) were a few extra lb/ the recomp doesn't seem as important anymore. I love the recomp / feeling and in fact ran 3 cycles of 8wks this year of tren without any adverse (permanent) damage (that I know of). On the other hand kidney functions always shoot up to high normal and given they dont regenerate like your liver I wonder how much someone can do this before it bites them in the ass. Ad you say something like EQ or deca or other have great gains without the same level of sides or risk. One thing i know for sure if I got the sides you get or the mental sides others get I'd never run it. Those type of sides + the increased toxicity over other opinions would make the cons greater then the pros.

 

[Deleted member 33117]

Bodyby: thanks for sharing. The only time I have a problem getting off is when my prolactin is way way low.

So in your opinion is the risky toxicity of tren worth the type of gains even if one doesn't have the sides? I'm at a point in my life (have kids etc) were a few extra lb/ the recomp doesn't seem as important anymore. I love the recomp / feeling and in fact ran 3 cycles of 8wks this year of tren without any adverse (permanent) damage (that I know of). On the other hand kidney functions always shoot up to high normal and given they dont regenerate like your liver I wonder how much someone can do this before it bites them in the ass. Ad you say something like EQ or deca or other have great gains without the same level of sides or risk. One thing i know for sure if I got the sides you get or the mental sides others get I'd never run it. Those type of sides + the increased toxicity over other opinions would make the cons greater then the pros.

I would say tren is a harsh drug with no human testing so we don't know what those risks are really. At this point in my life I would rather stick with drugs I know and tolerate well like test mostly and maybe eq and very sparingly maybe winny. I may not use anything but test again honestly.

 

[stevesmi]

i hate prop, i get injection pain with almost every AAS as it is.

but tren ace I like cause I want it out of my system quickly and not sticking around.. makes for easier recovery and i honestly cannot wait to finish tren cycles.. i get so sick of the de-hydration and pumps. the old cliche with tren is you cannot wait to get on, and you cannot wait to get off. its so true

 

[stevesmi]

I would say tren is a harsh drug with no human testing so we don't know what those risks are really. At this point in my life I would rather stick with drugs I know and tolerate well like test mostly and maybe eq and very sparingly maybe winny. I may not use anything but test again honestly.

its important to remember tren was originally made for humans, not animals. then it was banned, then brung back for use in livestock. but originally it was for humans and not animals.. most people do not know this little fact and most sites that talk about tren do not mention this.

i see vets on here even say "its an animal steroid" .. just not true, atleast originally

 

[Drewb]

What was it oringinaly used for? Link?

Good info btw

 

[-SD-]

What was it oringinaly used for? Link?

Good info btw

originally manufactured in France under brand name Parabolan. Discontinued in the 1980's i think, then bodybuilders discovered they could get finaplix pellets from farm supply stores and found a way to strip the binders and filler away leaving just tren for injection.

 

[Drewb]

Ever FDA approved? Why discontinued? I'm just curious. Never seen this info before I don't think, I always thought it was orig made for cows before slaughter.

 

[Deleted member 33117]

originally manufactured in France under brand name Parabolan. Discontinued in the 1980's i think, then bodybuilders discovered they could get finaplix pellets from farm supply stores and found a way to strip the binders and filler away leaving just tren for injection.

I was unaware of this... that parabolan (which I have heard of in passing) was actually tren, and I converted many finaplix-h kits for myself and friends back in the day.

 

[-SD-]

I was unaware of this... that parabolan (which I have heard of in passing) was actually tren, and I converted many finaplix-h kits for myself and friends back in the day.

Sure was, and it was counterfeited to all hell also as you can imagine. If you remember the World Anabolic Review 1996 book it was mentioned as one of the most counterfeited products ever. If you think youve got access to parabolan, forget it bor.

 

[CSB]

I remember parabolan, it's the tren hex if I am not mistaken , I use tritren and one 3rd is parabolan tren hex

 

[stevesmi]

^^^
before I ran tren for the first time i researched the shit out of it and discovered it was originally used for humans in the US. why was it banned? cause the govt didn't want people using it just like any other AAS. later on the govt continued banning AAS, and then even went after pro hormones like andro after mark mcgwire made it popular.

I don't have a link but if you google tren and read about its history its all there... I can understand why tren has a bad reputation, its strong and fast to work which is amazing for an injectable. but if you use it smartly it really isn't that bad, atleast in my experience .. if you stay on long periods of time you are playing with your health and HPTA. keep it at 6 weeks. cycle off.. then go back on for 6 weeks if that is what you choose to do. no reason to run it long periods of time and take unnecessary risk

 

[Deleted member 33117]

i hate prop, i get injection pain with almost every AAS as it is.

but tren ace I like cause I want it out of my system quickly and not sticking around.. makes for easier recovery and i honestly cannot wait to finish tren cycles.. i get so sick of the de-hydration and pumps. the old cliche with tren is you cannot wait to get on, and you cannot wait to get off. its so true

I know that feel... the effects are so pronounced that I am always temped to get back on some tren... you know 150 mg a week... but then I remember the side effects and realize I can get the same benefits a bit slower just with test and ai's...

 

[-SD-]

I know that feel... the effects are so pronounced that I am always temped to get back on some tren... you know 150 mg a week... but then I remember the side effects and realize I can get the same benefits a bit slower just with test and ai's...

Its like dating a hot stripper or something hahaha

sex is awesome then you remember how crazy she really was hahaha

 

[Deleted member 33117]

Its like dating a hot stripper or something hahaha

sex is awesome then you remember how crazy she really was hahaha

Nice comparison. LoL

 

[Wrongun]

Hey BBF - Thats a name from the past. Good to see you and seems us old timers are all getting back in the game. There are so many weird and wonderful blends produced but the many available UG labs these days its hard to see the wood from the trees so to speak. Long gone are the days of simple pharma or IP

Wrongun!

 

[ledhead]

I was unaware of this... that parabolan (which I have heard of in passing) was actually tren, and I converted many finaplix-h kits for myself and friends back in the day.

Parabolan is tren-hex.

 

[ledhead]

Sure was, and it was counterfeited to all hell also as you can imagine. If you remember the World Anabolic Review 1996 book it was mentioned as one of the most counterfeited products ever. If you think youve got access to parabolan, forget it bor.

Negative, I got my hands on some QV 80 2 yrs ago, it was the best tren I have ever ran, and I have taken them all..

 

[-SD-]

Negative, I got my hands on some QV 80 2 yrs ago, it was the best tren I have ever ran, and I have taken them all..

QV 80 is not the trademarked brand name "Parabolan" even though its the same compound. Just like Organon has trademarked "Deca-Durabolin" even though its nandrolone decanoate, any lab can make tren hex and call it whatever but cant call it parabolan.

 

[-SD-]

Hey BBF - Thats a name from the past. Good to see you and seems us old timers are all getting back in the game. There are so many weird and wonderful blends produced but the many available UG labs these days its hard to see the wood from the trees so to speak. Long gone are the days of simple pharma or IP

Wrongun!

You got that right rob. I miss the (relatively) simple days of the 1990's and the only guide you needed was the WAR 1996 lol
But the upside is PCT has advanced light years since then. Guess we gotta learn or burn

 

[brainacid]

Ive learned from this thread to: 1- Start with Prami at .1 mg at night and increase .1 e5d before beginning tren ace.
2- Start with a low dose until the effect begins in order to minimize sides i.e Letro, etc.
3- ED injections are best with tren ace. Also start with a low dose to see how I react to sides.

Doing my homework so I can recover right and healthy. Will have all my stuff soon and will begin a log.

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