Tyler Liver factors CONTINUED........

[Fonz]

I've had enough of you people.
You want to buy them? THEN GO RIGHT AHEAD.

And Ulter, I thought you were more mature than the
way you acted. Me? Fake a test? If you
were any other person I'd fly over and let you know
exactly what i think.

I NEVER attacked anyone, I stated that from a
SCIENTIFIC stand-point the detox factors were
INCOMPLETE.

That bloody simple.

And you people call me dumb....haha If you only knew.....

I have come up with more info than 90% of the board,
and yet I get flamed when I defend someone because its the
right thing to do.

Well, say bye to Fonz, and hello to "I don't like you so you're deleted
I'm sick and tired of people getting kicks by harrassing other
people. GET A LIFE!!

This is WAR, plain and simple.

 

[TxLonghorn]

I think this subject should be left alone for a few days. Tempers are running high, and I skimmed over the original post, and there might have been some legitimate info in between all the personal attacks, but I wasn't sticking around to find out.

This is just one of the reasons that ad hominem attacks should not be tolerated. It turns a potentially educational discussion into a flamefest.

And I personally like all the people involved. E2, ulter, fonz, decem, etc. I just think everybody needs to cool off and then, MAYBE, come back to this subject. But only if it can be discussed without all the attacks.

 

[Bossman]

Great, you don't like someone so you're going to delete them. Way to set an example, you are really improving the quality of this board. WTF?

 

[Fonz]

Great, you don't like someone so you're going to delete them. Way to set an example, you are really improving the quality of this board. WTF?

I'm going to delete PRODUCT ENDORSEMENT
posts and the like. NOT other ones.

Godspeed

 

[Bossman]

My apologies, I misunderstood what you said. No war is necessary, let's all make an effort to clean this board up.

Bossman

 

[e2]

Let me ask you this Fonz, since when are product endorsement posts an illegal thing on this board???

Or perhaps you've taken it upon yourself to set the board rules??

 

[Ulter]

Fonz, fonz fonz, you dear boy. I was accused, assaulted and lied about on that thread. All I did was respond to attacks and lies about my motives for helping people. IF you read the thread you'll see how it all unfolded.
I don't think you read all that was said from the way you're acting and the way you acted last night. But like I said you can have it, I don't care.
You posted phony lab tests and you know it. They were picked apart by the chemists on our board and you had, and still have, no reply. The things you posted in your "lab test" could not physically be done and they explained that to you.

As you've said, you have done a lot of good things for people here. But sometimes you've tried to do more than you really can. Forget about it. It's old news and no one will even remember it in another 3 months anyway. I had forgotten about it myself until I got an email reminding me.

 

[basskiller]

Maybe I'm at the wrong place...... I thought I was at Elitefitness...... Not Elitefonz's

Yes Fonz, Your smarter than all of us put together...... Thank you for posts "that are so far over our heads" as you put it in the other thread!

Why in the hell you didn't just post "just add some ALA into either of these products and you'll have yourself a liver detoxifing cocktail", is beyond me..........

Or is it the fact that you haven't been in a flame war in awhile? And yes we know your talents as a flamer!

Your a Mod. now, So act like one and stop adding to the flames.

Still love ya buddy,
bass

 

[nycdefender]

Fonz, after having read the entire thread over again, I believe that Ulter is correct. Decem said it was possible that E2 and Ulter made money off of the products. Ulter appropriately responded to that speculation. Then Decem blew off Ulter's explanation. That's when tempers flared.
TxLonghorn is correct as usual. Let's come back to this topic in a couple of weeks after tempers have subsided and everyone has had a chance to lick his wounds.

 

[manny78]

Seems like I missed something funny

 

[Fonz]

Let me ask you this Fonz, since when are product endorsement posts an illegal thing on this board???

Or perhaps you've taken it upon yourself to set the board rules??

E2, don't get me started..........

Firstly, if I think a product is good I WILL SAY SO. I DON'T
follow the status quo and I don't endorse things blindly.

The FACT is that the tyler liver factors are left wanting in the ALA
department.

THAT SIMPLE.

Godspeed

 

[Lift or Die]

I just recieved a couple bottles of Tyler liver detox a few days ago.

Thanks AF Store for the quick and excellent service.

 

[DaMan]

This thread is ridiculous, why doesn't another mod delete it?

 

[ironbarbarian]

I'M FUCKIN TIRED OF THIS BULLSHIT.....

YOU GUYS ARE GOD DAMN FUNNY, AND YOU CALL YOURSELFS JUICERS??, C'MMON, YOU SHOULDNT BE FIGHTING FOR THOSE THINGS, LETS GET ALONG. DONT WE GET ENOUGH RANT AND BAD COMMENTS FROM THE GENERAL PUBLIC? LETS SETTLE DOWN BOYS. WE ARE HERE FOR ONE REASON, AND THAT IS TO CHAT ABOUT ANABOLICS, EVERYONE HAS DIFFERENT IDEAS/OPINIONS AND THEY SHOULD BE RESPECTED.

 

[Nathan]

What I read weren't direct accusations. And please, no on take offense to this (E2, Ulter) cause I don't mean in to be offensive. All decem said, and I hope I'm not putting words in anyone's mouth, was that there was a possibility that since you are tied to the product somehow you may have some interest in people purchasing it. I don't think people are too clear on the way things work. Once you establish some sort of reputation in this community, people WILL start to e-mail you for advice. You'll find yourself constantly recommending something that you know to be a good supp or drug. So, eventually, unless you're a bit dumb, it should occur to you that you're sending a lot of business and money someone else's way and why the fuck shouldn't you maybe make a little for your efforts? Why the fuck not just sell the shit yourself, after all, it gets expensive buying gear and everything else and you gotta pay for it somehow, and that would cut down another middle man anyway. Ask your sources sometime if they post on Elite or some other board - betcha they say yes, but that they don't want to tell you their handle (that wouldn't be a good idea if they did). Now, I'm not saying anyone's a source here I'm just saying you never do know how many different names somebody goes buy in internet land. I'm also not saying anyone's being dishonest by doing any of this cause there's really no other way. That's what I think of every time I read someone recommending something to me. For instance, if someone recommended Cell-tech to you, you should probably start wondering if they don't work for the company or if they hit their head repeatedly as a child. Maybe it's time we all went and read some old amaf/uou posts. I think E2, Ulter, Fonz, decem, etc. are all great fellas and I don't really understand all this madness. Here's an uou quotation I particularly like:

"like you didn't even want to talk, now your all over my cock."

Sorry, if I mixed up a word or two in there uou.

 

[decem]

i would like to make an appearance in this thread... in a civil, non-confrontational tone.

you have to admit that i raised valid points that this product does NOT contain enough CDG, Milk Thistle, and Quercetin. you guys do have a valid point in that there is a possibility that they may be even more potent through a synergistic effect, yet you really have shown no evidence of what these work synergistically with.

one more thing is that there were a few people, bossman and the like, that did not even understand what i wrote about the tyler's liver detox, and should go back and read it through a few more times until they get it before wasting their money on it.

i will apologize for the ad hominen comments. i should not have brought my theories about the possibility of your motives into the debate. i thought i was in the right because i never directly said "you are motivated by money" and by keeping my arguments under the presumption of "possibility." i also justified it to myself by saying.."the other people on this board should know your positions on the other board so that they could understand the "possibility" of alterior motives and make a more informed decision."

i should have let them figure it out for themselves and should have kept my debate to the topic at hand.

i was wrong.

peace

 

[Fonz]

Ok, got some things of my chest because some of the
other comments on the posterior thread rattled me.

So, I'll leave this open for anybody else to give their comments.

If a MOD wants to delete this, PM me first.

And I am in NO-WAY anti-AF. In fact, I like the place and
the store, and have endorsed some of their products, but
sometimes people step over the line.

Godspeed

 

[Bulldog_10]

Originally stated by FONZ:

So, enough with the innuendo's, rumours. etc...HARD SCIENTIFIC PROOF IS WHAT COUNTS. Period.

I have yet to see any hard scientific proof that Tyler Liver Detox Factor is not a good liver protector. I believe the law in the U.S. (I don't know where you guys are from, nor do I care) is that if you make comments such as this without this hard scientific proof, then it is considered slander. I also believe that when these statements are put in writing the penalty is more severe.

To all the people that are saying that Tyler liver detox is a bullshit liver protector, I say Prove It. Until you prove it, give us your opinions alone.

Do not state your opinions as fact, that is all I ask.

I hope I haven't offended anyone, as I do not want to be involved in this flame "war" I just wanted to give my thoughts on the matter.

Later bros!
B-10

 

[Fonz]

Originally stated by FONZ:


I have yet to see any hard scientific proof that Tyler Liver Detox Factor is not a good liver protector. I believe the law in the U.S. (I don't know where you guys are from, nor do I care) is that if you make comments such as this without this hard scientific proof, then it is considered slander. I also believe that when these statements are put in writing the penalty is more severe.

To all the people that are saying that Tyler liver detox is a bullshit liver protector, I say Prove It. Until you prove it, give us your opinions alone.

Do not state your opinions as fact, that is all I ask.

I hope I haven't offended anyone, as I do not want to be involved in this flame "war" I just wanted to give my thoughts on the matter.

Later bros!
B-10

Three words: Alpha-Lipoic Acid

it is the ONLY liver detox factor that REVERSES liver damage.

Godspeed

 

[Bulldog_10]

Three words: Alpha-Lipoic Acid

it is the ONLY liver detox factor that REVERSES liver damage.

Godspeed

Honestly...I said it before, but I have not really looked into Tyler. How much, if any, ALA is there in Tyler?

 

[Bossman]

Three words: Alpha-Lipoic Acid it is the ONLY liver detox factor that REVERSES liver damage.

I agree with you on your statement above. But I have read of studies on the New Hope Med site that say Tyler prevents an increase in liver values when on d-bol or halo. Therefore, no reverse of liver damage is necessary, it does not occur in the first place. So I will continue to "waste my money" on the Tyler. And if I do get elevated values I will then use ALA.

 

[Dead Man Inc]

A couple of questions on Alpha-Lipoic Acid: Where can u buy it? Can u get it over the counter at say Holland and Barrett? Also, what is a typical dosage to be taken when on a heavy cycle containing orals?

Thanks!


Dead Man Inc

 

[Fonz]

Ok, I'll try to explain Tyler's fatal flaw:

1. IT ONLY WORKS IF YOU START TAKING IT BEFORE
AN ORAL CYCLE, AND IF THERE WAS NO LIVER DAMAGE
PRESENT AT THE MOMENT.

2. I am probably the expert on oral steroids on this site since I
ran them for 4 years straight.(Only orals) AND, I only used
Milk thistle and HIGH-DOSE ALA.

Now, milk-thistle is crapp. There are far better detoxifiers
nowadays; Calcium D-Glucarate being one of them.

So, what is the moral of this thread?

If you have liver damage from previous oral use(VERY
LIKELY) Liver detox factors by Tyler will ameliorate the problem but
NOT SOLVE IT!!!!

ONLY ALA CAN ACHIEVE THIS by increasing hepatocyte
regeneration..

So, what to do?

RUN LIVER FACTORS WITH 600mg ALA/day(or 1000mgs/day in
EXTREME cases), and you'll see your liver values plummet
drastically.

As a little tid-bit the Liver is able to regenerate itself even after 75%
of it has been destroyed. It is the only organ in the body capable of doing
this.

Godspeed

 

[DaMan]

So Fonz:

Since I'm about to start my first-ever cycle Monday (anavar-only), you ARE recommending I use Tyler to prevent damage, right? (I bought the stuff so I'll use it anyway, but I'd be more comfortable with your blessing so I know I didn't waste my cash )

I plan to run heavier cycles after this one, but I want to do EVERYTHING to possibly protect myself, so I'm gonna add 400mg/ALA to this one and will add some gluth for the next ones...

Anything else I could do?

Thx dude!

 

[basskiller]

Dead Man, here is a direct link to buy ALA
http://www.nutriteam.com/alpha.htm

peace bro
bass

 

[Fonz]

600mgs ALA/day is what I use and recommend.

L-glutathione+ALA is overkill as ALA raises glutathione levels
all by itself.
However, If you're running multiple 17-aa's(3-4) add the
REDUCED l-glutathione at 600mgs/day

That, plus the Tyler liver factors should do the job quite well.

Godspeed

 

[DaMan]

Thx dude!!! So for anyone else planning liver protection, here's what my research concluded:

Anavar-only @ 40mg/ed:

-Tyler @ 4caps/ed (split in two doses)
-ALA @ 600mg/ed
-at least 1.5gal/water/ed

Multiple 17aas (in my case anavar@40, winny@50/day):

-Tyler @ 6caps/ed (in 3 doses)
-ALA @ 600mg/ed
-L-glutathione @ 600mg/day
-more than 1.5gal/water/ed

***FONZ: ONE MORE Q:

How much Calcium D-Glutarate to add to either of these cycles? Unless there are any negative sides, I don't care if it MAY be overkill cuz I care about my liver - better safe than sorry

 

[Fonz]

I don't remember the EXACT dosage for Cal-C-Gluc, but
if you PM Jeff_rys he should be able to enlighten you, because
he has more practical experience than me on this perticular
matter.

Godspeed

 

[barbells79]

I think this subject should be left alone for a few days. Tempers are running high, and I skimmed over the original post, and there might have been some legitimate info in between all the personal attacks, but I wasn't sticking around to find out.

This is just one of the reasons that ad hominem attacks should not be tolerated. It turns a potentially educational discussion into a flamefest.

And I personally like all the people involved. E2, ulter, fonz, decem, etc. I just think everybody needs to cool off and then, MAYBE, come back to this subject. But only if it can be discussed without all the attacks.

this is just another reason you got my vote for moderator status. let cooler heads prevail.


peace bb79

 

[Dead Man Inc]

DaMan, I'm sorry to tell you this, but in my opinion you HAVE wasted your money because anavar at 40mg per day for an average lengthed cycle will not significantly effect your liver values. Take it anyway now u've got it but it was not really necessary. Fonz, be honest, u've gotta agree with me! Anavar only = no need for liver protection.

By the way guys, thanks for the links for ALA!


Dead Man Inc

 

[DaMan]

Hey dude, better safe than sorry But var IS a 17aa, nonetheless...

I'm not really short on cash, but if worse comes to worse I can always save it for heavier 17aa cycles.

Having my bloodwork done in a few, will decide then. Shit, for $30, whatever...

 

[Dead Man Inc]

Yeah I've got to respect the better safe than sorry theory! However, I'd save it for a heavier cycle. I have even read with scientific references that anavar can improve your liver function......now i'm not too sure i believe this since it is a 17AA steroid, but don't expect liver damage at 40mg a day.


Dead Man Inc

 

[ultragainz]

wow "FONZ" you a smart guy...really.....i always have used ALA...good stuff i always take glutmine and take ala on cycles

 

[ultragainz]

hey "FONZ" if i take ALA with glutimine always thats fine right?cuz i always use glutimine...at 5-20 grams a day...and i always take other stuff for the liver too...so taking all that is fine not too much for the liver right?

 

[MUSTANG_18]

hey "FONZ" if i take ALA with glutimine always thats fine right?cuz i always use glutimine...at 5-20 grams a day...and i always take other stuff for the liver too...so taking all that is fine not too much for the liver right?

I am not Fonz but I don't see that being a problem. I take around 900mg/total of ALA per day with 20-30 grams of Glutamin per day and have had no problems.

M18

 

[ultragainz]

thanks "MUS_18" just wanted to make sure if its cool to take a lot of stuff that well help the liver...thanks big guy

 

[MUSTANG_18]

thanks "MUS_18" just wanted to make sure if its cool to take a lot of stuff that well help the liver...thanks big guy

Anytime buddy! Good luck with your current cycle!

M18

 

[panerai]

Fonz, you are stupid!
It still amazes me how you got Mods position, considering all the bs you posted, and how immature you are!

 

[Fonz]

Panerai, no offense but I have the knowledge for'liver detox
factor practical use. YOU, on the other hand DO NOT.

And please keep the flames coming, because i will embarass
you witout impunity.

4-years of practical all-oral cycles + a healthy liver gives me
'the right to say what works and what doesn't.
That simple.

NOBODY HERE CAN SAY THAT.

You don't care? Fine. Run your stupid detox factors w/o ALA
and see what happens.

Lastly, THIS IS NOT A POPULARITY CONTEST, I'm here to
ADVANCE the science of bodybuiding NOT just agree like an automaton
with all the vets.

In fact, I have written NUMEROUS articles on Up-and-coming BB drugs that
will probably be used as a normal drug by most BB'ers in the near future
.
Attack me as much as you want, my intelligence WILL ALLWAYS
PREVAIL.

Godspeed

 

[Bulldog_10]

Hey fonz...Just curious...could you post a few of your all oral cycles? Never heard of anyone doing all-oral cycles, except for first-cyclers, and those afraid of the ol' pins.

 

[ultragainz]

dont let the flames get to you bro..."FONZ" you a good man...

 

[panerai]

Fonz, if I wanted to flame you, I would, unless, Archives are edited....
I meant, that your position about Tyler Detox is very childish, why you didn't start whole campagne against owner of this particular board(Elitefitness), who indorses a way more useless supplements? Or why wouldn't you start campagne againste zillion of other supplement companies?
ALA is great, and if Tyler Detox doesn't include it, then users can simply add it, was is your problem with it?
That's what I call immaturity.
Tyler Detox is completely legal, and doesn't go against "no source posting" rule of the board; lots of people believe it's worth the money; it definately is good for the liver and is not harmfull in any way;
So, what is your interest against it?
......that's why I called you stupid, and your "all oral cycles" reply certainly didn't change my mind.

 

[therealj]

heh heh heh, atta boy panerai

 

[decem]

1. I have yet to see any hard scientific proof that Tyler Liver Detox Factor is not a good liver protector.

2. I believe the law in the U.S. (I don't know where you guys are from, nor do I care) is that if you make comments such as this without this hard scientific proof, then it is considered slander. I also believe that when these statements are put in writing the penalty is more severe.

3. To all the people that are saying that Tyler liver detox is a bullshit liver protector, I say Prove It. Until you prove it, give us your opinions alone.

4. Do not state your opinions as fact, that is all I ask.

5. I hope I haven't offended anyone, as I do not want to be involved in this flame "war" I just wanted to give my thoughts on the matter.

Later bros!
B-10 [/B]

1. i have yet to see any hard scientific proof that it is a good liver protector.

2. for fuck's sake man!! do realize how idiotic you sounded saying that? you're on a board where 90% of the participants are engaging in illegal activity by buying/selling/using steroids.

3. i say prove that it is worth a fuck. i gave evidence through scientific studies that show it isn't worth a fuck because it doesn't contain enough of the right ingredients, and the only argument you made is that "well, there must be a synergistic effect" and then everybody jumped on the fucking synergistice bandwagon but GAVE NO FUCKING EVIDENCE..

it's your turn to put up or shut up on the evidence. i did my part and PROVED my point. now try proving yours.

4. obviously it aint a fact and i said so in most my posts. i even told people to research shit for themselves so they know the real truth instead of going off what some yahoo on this board writes.

5. none taken.. me too.


tyler's liver detox aint worth a shit.

 

[Fonz]

1. i have yet to see any hard scientific proof that it is a good liver protector.

2. for fuck's sake man!! do realize how idiotic you sounded saying that? you're on a board where 90% of the participants are engaging in illegal activity by buying/selling/using steroids.

3. i say prove that it is worth a fuck. i gave evidence through scientific studies that show it isn't worth a fuck because it doesn't contain enough of the right ingredients, and the only argument you made is that "well, there must be a synergistic effect" and then everybody jumped on the fucking synergistice bandwagon but GAVE NO FUCKING EVIDENCE..

it's your turn to put up or shut up on the evidence. i did my part and PROVED my point. now try proving yours.

4. obviously it aint a fact and i said so in most my posts. i even told people to research shit for themselves so they know the real truth instead of going off what some yahoo on this board writes.

5. none taken.. me too.


tyler's liver detox aint worth a shit.

Ditto.

And, I can PROVE ALA is a GREAT detoxifier/liver
regenerator.

SHOW ME THE STUDIES PEOPLE.

This is NOT a flame, just a polite reminder

And, I ran Winstrol-Dball-Anavar-Andriol w/ sometimes Halo
before games.

However, I also run 1000mgs+ALA/day and my liver is fine.

Godspeed

 

[Ulter]

Actually decem and Fonz "crusaders against Tyler"...

Bulldog_10 is absolutely right. Where are your studies showing Tyler doesn't detoxify your liver? I don’t mean your theories. Fonz is at least smart enough to not stick his head out too far and says Tyler’s formula may be of benefit. But decem, where is your proof that this formula doesn't do what they say it does?
I forgive you Fonz because you don't know any better, but I am assuming decem lives in the United States and he knows that Tyler, BY LAW, could not advertise nor claim that it's product detoxifies your liver if it didn't. We have "truth in labeling" and "truth in advertising" laws in the United States to protect consumers from fraud. So in essence what decem is saying is that Tyler is breaking these laws and the doctors that distribute Tyler are facilitating this action. What a conspiracy you two have uncovered here. I will alert the media at once. You two will be national hero's.
Isn’t it time to call this what it is decem YOUR THEORY and stop beating a dead horse?

 

[Nathan]

For the first time in my life, I saw a woman yesterday in downtown Toronto who was so obese that she had to be pushed around in a wheelchair. I almost creamed my pants right then and there.

 

[Fonz]

Actually decem and Fonz "crusaders against Tyler"...

Bulldog_10 is absolutely right. Where are your studies showing Tyler doesn't detoxify your liver? I don’t mean your theories. Fonz is at least smart enough to not stick his head out too far and says Tyler’s formula may be of benefit. But decem, where is your proof that this formula doesn't do what they say it does?
I forgive you Fonz because you don't know any better, but I am assuming decem lives in the United States and he knows that Tyler, BY LAW, could not advertise nor claim that it's product detoxifies your liver if it didn't. We have "truth in labeling" and "truth in advertising" laws in the United States to protect consumers from fraud. So in essence what decem is saying is that Tyler is breaking these laws and the doctors that distribute Tyler are facilitating this action. What a conspiracy you two have uncovered here. I will alert the media at once. You two will be national hero's.
Isn’t it time to call this what it is decem YOUR THEORY and stop beating a dead horse?

Ulter, I know the rules in the US pertaining to
supplement claims. What I'm trying to say(for like 5 posts now)
is that YOU NEED ALA in the Tyler Detox factors!!!!!!

Do that, and THEN I'll endorse it, because it covers all the
detox pathways.

And Ulter, stop patronizing me. I'm 22, but I KNOW A HELL OF
A LOT when it comes to liver protection.

To summarize: Tyler detox factors= Ok.
Add ALA(600mgs/day) to them= KICK ASS.

THAT SIMPLE.

Godspeed

 

[Ulter]

Patronizing you? Boy this mod thing has really gone to your head. 22 and a liver expert. Your family must be so proud.

 

[Fonz]

Patronizing you? Boy this mod thing has really gone to your head. 22 and a liver expert. Your family must be so proud.

You're treating me like a newbie who just started out. Check your
posts and you'll see.Newbie In injectables? Fair enough. In orals? NOT
A CHANCE. And what the hell does my MOD staus have to do with
my comments????? have I EVER EDITED ANY OF YOUR POSTS?
NO, No, and doubly NO. What do you want me to do, call you gramps???
Damn Ulter, I'm trying to explain to you HOW YOU COULD MAKE YOUR
STORE BETTER, yet you still won't listen to me.

Fine. I tried.

Next time I have relevant info on anything I'll just keep it to myself.

Godspeed

 

[macrophage69alpha]

lockdown

if you wish to re open this thread... be my guest.

However.. it seems that little has been accomplished here.

Fonz- I agree that ALA is a great supplement

Decem- good research- lots of good info

Ulter- good efforts to bring a doctor reccomended (member tested )supplement to those who have asked for it.


lets leave it at that.


ALL THESE PERSONAL ATTACKS BENEFIT NO ONE.

peace