Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below
napsgear
genezapharmateuticals
domestic-supply
puritysourcelabs
UGL OZ
UGFREAK
napsgeargenezapharmateuticals domestic-supplypuritysourcelabsUGL OZUGFREAK

Trouble Keeping Gains??? Help!!!

WinnyPumps

WinnyPumps

New member
What the fuck!!! I'm now about one month into pct and I have lost about 10 fuckin pounds in the last 2 weeks. My muscles are lookin flat, my pumps in the gym suck! I look a little leaner and I am still working out hard but fuck! That means I am only up 7 pounds from when I started! Now I'm 5'10'', 205lbs, around 12% bf. What am I doing wrong???

My Pct- I did 1000iu eod hcg for about 10 days
Running adex, Sustain, and toco-8.
Didnt think I would lose gains this quick and it's upsetting to say the least. I'm going on forever, LOL!
 
sorry for your loss brother! :p 7 lbs of lean muscle after a cycle is a pretty good job i would say. what did u run
 
Has your training intensity decreased or have you dropped back on your diet, you need to keep both up until your body adjusts then you might be able to keep those gains.


RADAR
 
When i come off a cycle i deflate. Sure proper PCT and diet help but inevitably you're gonna lose 90% of your gains. I know a ton of people will argue with me but i've done probably 20 cycles and that is my experience. My goal is to keep the gains as long as possible but once your frame gets large enough you simply can't hold on to 20 inch arms without staying juiced. Best way to prevent it is to simply inject.
 
RagenMMA said:
When i come off a cycle i deflate. Sure proper PCT and diet help but inevitably you're gonna lose 90% of your gains. I know a ton of people will argue with me but i've done probably 20 cycles and that is my experience. My goal is to keep the gains as long as possible but once your frame gets large enough you simply can't hold on to 20 inch arms without staying juiced. Best way to prevent it is to simply inject.
Click to expand...

sab but true! Gotta keep the cals high too, usually after PCT appetite turns to shit due to low test..FORCE yourself to eat and try and stay in the mind frame of going for those last two reps like when your on
 
RADAR said:
Has your training intensity decreased or have you dropped back on your diet, you need to keep both up until your body adjusts then you might be able to keep those gains.


RADAR
Click to expand...

My instensity has been pretty dam good and I've only lost a little bit of strength. Way stronger than I was prior to my cycle. I have been slackin a little on my diet but really not that much to lose weight so quickly!!!
I believed in all this proper pct stuff but I think you lose at least half your gains no matter what and it sucks. It seems if I would do the time on=time off thing I would alomst be back to sqaure one. I guess 7 pounds ain't that bad but I'm only 205lbs. I figured I could hold onto alot more. It's not like I'm 250 and have to eat a shitload of food day in day out to hold onto every pound. SHIT!
 
RagenMMA said:
When i come off a cycle i deflate. Sure proper PCT and diet help but inevitably you're gonna lose 90% of your gains. I know a ton of people will argue with me but i've done probably 20 cycles and that is my experience. My goal is to keep the gains as long as possible but once your frame gets large enough you simply can't hold on to 20 inch arms without staying juiced. Best way to prevent it is to simply inject.
Click to expand...

I know guys who've kept 90% of their gains from their last cycles over 2 years ago.
I've got a friend who gained about 80 pounds in 15 months, went from 150 to 230 when he was 18, he's 23 now and hasn't juiced since he was 18, he's 235 and 10%
 
SouthPhilly said:
I know guys who've kept 90% of their gains from their last cycles over 2 years ago.
I've got a friend who gained about 80 pounds in 15 months, went from 150 to 230 when he was 18, he's 23 now and hasn't juiced since he was 18, he's 235 and 10%
Click to expand...

I needed to hear that :worried: :mix:
 
Stiofean said:
I needed to hear that :worried: :mix:
Click to expand...

lol. I'd say 25-30% loss, but if anyone could gaurentee a 90% loss or close to it, of AAS gains, I doubt anybody would be on this forum spending paychecks, dealing with acne hairloss and god knows what else lol.

I've kept all of my strength and maybe 85% of muscle from my cycles
 
My first Dbol cycle i gained 25lbs and kept 22.


So There you go.

RADAR
 
I eat a little bit more prot/carbs/cals after cycle than when on. Seems to work well...sorry man, just keep at it. 7 lean lbs is still a big difference
 
I hear ya man,its very frustrating. I gained 23 lbs on my last cycle, had lost just a little size & strength when I came off, I was pleased with it then I got hammered hard when that damn pollen got so bad, then had a family situation @ same time. I missed 2 wks straight in the gym. I peaked out @ 271 lbs while "on" & in no time I was 251 lbs. I struggled hard but finally got back to 260 lbs naturally. Im fixing to get back on after 3 months off. I usually go into pct with a bad attitude dwelling on how much im gonna loose. I kept a positive attitude this time telling myself I was gonna lift hard & fight to keep everything I could. It was working to until the 2 things I mentioned killed me lol. Im 12 lbs heavier than when I started my last cycle so I feel pretty good overall. I think your attitude going into pct is crucial. I'm working on mine.
 
Im currently on my first cycle right now, so i dont know alot. But i have done acouple M1T cycles before this one and got good gains from both of them. First cycle i only lost like 2 pounds after wards cause i was eating just as much. 2nd cycle i made the mistake of triing to get my fat off too early and i started out by barely eating alittle less after 2 weeks of being off M1T. I started to loose muscle and strength incredibly fast. It was the worst feeling. Anyway. Seriously i would try and eat even more than when you were on your cycle for a few months. Thats what im gonna do this time. im keeping every pound i possibly can, even if i gain acouple pounds of fat...... thats what cutting cycles are for.
 
this is where i like the tepered dose. when your test level crashes your body stops putting effort into anything other than figuring out how to fix the problem you caused it. it pulls from all of its resorces and leaves you in a bad situation because what you are trying to keep is excess, and its the latest addition of excess so it is naturally the first place your body will draw from. if you slowly taper off using hcg and pct during the taper you can avoid the crash and prevent a lot of the loss as long as you keep up with diet training and recovery. i actually liked using dbol for the taper when i came off. now i use suspension and ease back into my trt.
 
i watch my diet just as much on than off, i also load up heavy creatine when coming off, well i dont completely come off, 3 letters: HRT :P
 
hsould of used nolva also....

after cycle your always gonna lose the on look,..its sad but your still better and better off every cycle...just cant tell ...always keep photos of your progress
 
You will always deflate after a cycle, especially if you were running drugs like dbol and test. The only way to avoid it is to stay on a low dose of test, end of story.

You don't really think the pros cycle then run PCT do you? lol
 
So much of that deflation is just water volume in the muscle. Yes, you look smaller and weigh less, but the quality "meat" of what you've built is not going to dissapear within 2 weeks unless you are doing something seriously wrong. I always, always without fail, no matter what I'm running, lose 8 lbs of weight as soon as everything clears my system. It's like clockwork and I expect it. I came off my cycle at 225 lbs, my pct kinda sucked and I gained a bit of fat. But now, a few weeks later I'm right in the 210 range on a keto diet looking hard and still up 15 lbs from where I started in Jan. I'm cleaning out and getting ready for round 2!

That's what it's about: PROGRESS! Not perfection the first time out. Keep making quality improvements to your physique slowly over time. I may not weigh 230 after a meal right now, but I look better on my worst day today than on my biggest and juiced a couple years ago! That's about quality, not all about quantity!

p.s. The statement Joe D. made about tapering is a good one. It's a technique that is so overlooked these days and can seriously help if done correctly: After the test/eq or whatever has cleared, do a short acting oral in the morning. It'll clear your system by night giving your nuts a chance to kick in while still getting a little help every morning. Reduce the dose of this over the course of two weeks or so (while getting some of your pct started- then continue with pct after) and then tell me you didn't keep more of your gains!
 
SouthPhilly said:
I know guys who've kept 90% of their gains from their last cycles over 2 years ago.
I've got a friend who gained about 80 pounds in 15 months, went from 150 to 230 when he was 18, he's 23 now and hasn't juiced since he was 18, he's 235 and 10%
Click to expand...

That sounds like a big crock og horseshit! But if that's somewhat true how the fuck did he do it? lol
 
You hrt guys shouldn't be in this thread, it's not fair! lol

On a good note I did get back a couple pounds and still look pretty decent. Stayin positive. Next time I think I might taper off and use more hcg like 1000iu the last 10 days and start doing adex, Sustain, Unleashed, and toco-8 about 1-2 weeks earlier than I did this time.
 
Last edited:
jacshelb said:
So much of that deflation is just water volume in the muscle. Yes, you look smaller and weigh less, but the quality "meat" of what you've built is not going to dissapear within 2 weeks unless you are doing something seriously wrong. I always, always without fail, no matter what I'm running, lose 8 lbs of weight as soon as everything clears my system. It's like clockwork and I expect it. I came off my cycle at 225 lbs, my pct kinda sucked and I gained a bit of fat. But now, a few weeks later I'm right in the 210 range on a keto diet looking hard and still up 15 lbs from where I started in Jan. I'm cleaning out and getting ready for round 2!

That's what it's about: PROGRESS! Not perfection the first time out. Keep making quality improvements to your physique slowly over time. I may not weigh 230 after a meal right now, but I look better on my worst day today than on my biggest and juiced a couple years ago! That's about quality, not all about quantity!

p.s. The statement Joe D. made about tapering is a good one. It's a technique that is so overlooked these days and can seriously help if done correctly: After the test/eq or whatever has cleared, do a short acting oral in the morning. It'll clear your system by night giving your nuts a chance to kick in while still getting a little help every morning. Reduce the dose of this over the course of two weeks or so (while getting some of your pct started- then continue with pct after) and then tell me you didn't keep more of your gains!
Click to expand...


can another oral be used instead of dbol? any of Needto's products?
 
the.gladiator1987 said:
can another oral be used instead of dbol? any of Needto's products?
Click to expand...

I've been a cheap ass and haven't even got around to buying any d-bol (which is still cheap, lol) in years. Most of the time my cycles have been so short and moderate I've gotten away without it. I just tapered down the test. amounts. But, the idea with the orals is that they are in your system only a few hours. Beastdrol/superdrol clears in about 8 hours correct? That's what I used last time, seemed to help some. What I like about d-bol though is its short half life (4 hrs thereabouts) and easy to split up or low dose tabs. If you finish off your cycle and take 10 mg every day of dbol as the test and other injects are clearing and stretch that out a little past when they've cleared then drop it down to 7.5 in the morning for 5 days, then 5mg in the morning for 5-7 days, then 2.5 mg in the morning for 5 days or so. I know it sounds stupid, but the couple times I did this I had the absolute smoothest transition ever: no depression, no drop in sex drive, no crazy fat rebound or any typical pct problems. And, this was without hcg. So, I sometimes wish I had a little d-bol laying around just for this (it makes you feel good too, unlike superdrol). But, I just used my superdrol clone last time and it worked ok.

Another thing that doesn't get talked about much is using DHEA during pct. I had a rough pct this last time around, not horrid, but not great. When I added in DHEA at 100mg in the morning and another 100 post workout, I felt 10 times better. This saw me through while I recovered. I had more energy and sex drive almost immediately. I'm 30 now though, I don't know if I would have noticed as much 5 years ago.

These are just my opinions. I don't want to put anything out there like I'm some expert. I'm just a dude with horrid genetics who has done every stupid wrong thing you can imagine with drugs, training, and diet. But, since I'm willing to try about anything and experiment I get a lot of experiences and different results. I would never rely on d-bol or anything like that for pct. It's just that tapering fell out of favor when pct got more sophisticated and I think it can still have a place. I mean, if it did some good for guys years back, why not incorporate its benefits and combine them with the new protocols?

And, for those who really, really are against tapering. I just want to say that you wouldn't be if you'd ever tried coming off Paxil or something like that cold turkey! Even if there was a "recovery" drug for coming off of anti-depressants/anti-anxiety meds, the docs would still recommend tapering the dose. The feedback loop with seretonin receptors, production ect. is similar to the HPTA in relation to how it basically operates. A lessening dose of the foreign drug signals your body to start producing again naturally in both cases. A sudden and full stop will throw your body into a tailspin. The PCT drugs are there to "restore" the natural flow of things once this has happened. In other words they are there to "clean up" the mess made by making that change. So, why make that change any more drastic than it has to be? Ease your body into PCT next time and I think you'll be thanking the concept of tapering for increased retention of gains, better moods, and an all around better recovery time.
 
jacshelb said:
I've been a cheap ass and haven't even got around to buying any d-bol (which is still cheap, lol) in years. Most of the time my cycles have been so short and moderate I've gotten away without it. I just tapered down the test. amounts. But, the idea with the orals is that they are in your system only a few hours. Beastdrol/superdrol clears in about 8 hours correct? That's what I used last time, seemed to help some. What I like about d-bol though is its short half life (4 hrs thereabouts) and easy to split up or low dose tabs. If you finish off your cycle and take 10 mg every day of dbol as the test and other injects are clearing and stretch that out a little past when they've cleared then drop it down to 7.5 in the morning for 5 days, then 5mg in the morning for 5-7 days, then 2.5 mg in the morning for 5 days or so. I know it sounds stupid, but the couple times I did this I had the absolute smoothest transition ever: no depression, no drop in sex drive, no crazy fat rebound or any typical pct problems. And, this was without hcg. So, I sometimes wish I had a little d-bol laying around just for this (it makes you feel good too, unlike superdrol). But, I just used my superdrol clone last time and it worked ok.

Another thing that doesn't get talked about much is using DHEA during pct. I had a rough pct this last time around, not horrid, but not great. When I added in DHEA at 100mg in the morning and another 100 post workout, I felt 10 times better. This saw me through while I recovered. I had more energy and sex drive almost immediately. I'm 30 now though, I don't know if I would have noticed as much 5 years ago.

These are just my opinions. I don't want to put anything out there like I'm some expert. I'm just a dude with horrid genetics who has done every stupid wrong thing you can imagine with drugs, training, and diet. But, since I'm willing to try about anything and experiment I get a lot of experiences and different results. I would never rely on d-bol or anything like that for pct. It's just that tapering fell out of favor when pct got more sophisticated and I think it can still have a place. I mean, if it did some good for guys years back, why not incorporate its benefits and combine them with the new protocols?

And, for those who really, really are against tapering. I just want to say that you wouldn't be if you'd ever tried coming off Paxil or something like that cold turkey! Even if there was a "recovery" drug for coming off of anti-depressants/anti-anxiety meds, the docs would still recommend tapering the dose. The feedback loop with seretonin receptors, production ect. is similar to the HPTA in relation to how it basically operates. A lessening dose of the foreign drug signals your body to start producing again naturally in both cases. A sudden and full stop will throw your body into a tailspin. The PCT drugs are there to "restore" the natural flow of things once this has happened. In other words they are there to "clean up" the mess made by making that change. So, why make that change any more drastic than it has to be? Ease your body into PCT next time and I think you'll be thanking the concept of tapering for increased retention of gains, better moods, and an all around better recovery time.
Click to expand...


makes perfect sense to me bro, i dont think that low of a dose can keep you shut down. People that stay on 100mg EW HRT still have a chance to recover months later because the HRT dose was low enough to keep producing a little natty test.

I have extra tren, prohormone, lying around. Im wondering if i could use that? Its 30mg a pill, so a pill in the morning for a week, half a pill, for a week, quarter of a pill for 5 days, then just PCT

Not to hijack the thread. Shit winny get some natty supps to help keep the weight/size until your test is back to normal and you can drop that shit. creatine/NO supp. Extra protein, extra food. Cant think of anything else
 
All good info imo. Good to have a few ideas out there to choose from! I don't know much about the tren prohormone- I mean, how suppressive it might be, but it sounds like it's worth a try. I think the main thing is that it is out of your system for most of the day and the dose isn't too high.

All the best,

Jacob
 
I think the newbies get really discouraged when they lose weight after a cycle because they don't realize that most of that weight was water to begin with.

Basically what happens is you take a bunch of steps forward and then a few back every cycle. That is the way it works. Anyone who tells you "diet and proper pct" will make you keep your gains is FoS. The ONLY way to keep ALL of your gains is to stay on.

But if the scale is whats really bothering you then just start a creatine regiment when you come off. That will keep you somewhat bloated, but you'll still lose some weight.
 
EAT EAT EAT....get an NO2 product and keep pushin it! lol but really 7 solid lbs is good...remember its not a sprint bro its a marathon lol
 
Yea I actually hit it pretty hard last week cause I was so pissed about dropping that weight, lol. But obviously that was mostly water just wasn't expecting 8-10 pounds lost in a matter of days. Been a while since my last cycle, didn't realize what was about to happen. I did however manage to gain a couple lbs back last week and took my agression out on the weights. I guess I should be happy, I'm about 8 pounds up from before cycle and my waist went down 1 inch. I want to hover around 205-210lbs until my next blast!
Next cycle I am tapering down for the last few weeks. I don't see how that can't help a little.
1-12 Test Prop 100mg eod
1-4 Beastdrol 30mg ed
8-14 Winny 50mg ed
I will just taper the Prop the last 2-3 wks down to 200mg wk.
I will start hcg mid cycle 500iu wk, then 500iu ed for 10 days prior to pct.
PCT- Adex, Sustain, toco-8, Unleashed, maybe Nolva
Creatine, dhea
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

A
going with equipoise and test for a lean gain stack
Replies
11
Views
903
ceo
ceo
Q
using steroids and want sarms to help keep gains
Replies
16
Views
2K
25homes
25homes
G
adding hcg to pct help
Replies
12
Views
1K
Quadsweep
Quadsweep
S
This will be the 5th cycle I have done.
Replies
23
Views
3K
25homes
25homes
M
muscle wasting issues
Replies
13
Views
1K
RoySimpson
RoySimpson
Top Bottom