stopped nolva and nipps got bad again?

[eh2442]

I was on test for over a year. When I stopped taking gear I took nolva for over a month until my joints started hurting( It did help reduce my nips). My puffy nips came back 4 weeks later after stopping nolva. I am back on nolva again for 3 weeks now....they are getting better but never 100%.

Will I have to go on and off nolva for ever?

What else could I do?

 

[christopher2100]

otayyyyyyyyy I am not one to give you solid advice but i think you need to fill us all in on your stats and all, test for over a year? HRT? whats the deal?

 

[youngbuck22]

Yes, need more info.

PCT?- only novla?

 

[eddymerckx]

Yes, need more info.

PCT?- only novla?

^^^^^^^say it aint so....details please

 

[xrsist]

Ai...

 

[access]

Test for a year and then Nolva for 4 weeks..sounds like big estro rebound.

 

[daveyboy2345]

how about a-dex and nolva for 8 weeks together(.25 mg/10 mgs) followed by nolva (20, 10, 5 mgs) only for 6 weeks as a taper, this is what I would attempt give or take.

 

[Nelson Montana]

NOLVADEX SUCKS ASS!!!

Everybody has got to stop using that shit!

Get some a-dexx, POST CYCLE and Sustain.

 

[GUARDIAN]

use an AI immediately.

 

[njmuscleguy]

NOLVADEX SUCKS ASS!!!
Everybody has got to stop using that shit!

Get some a-dexx, POST CYCLE and Sustain.

Nelson,

I don't dispute your view of Nolvadex...I'm not a fan either... but I'm curious to get your opinion.... no doubt you've seen the gyno treatment regimen of letro (ramping up to 2.5mg ED, then ramping back down)... followed by nolvadex to prevent "estrogen rebound". In this case, what would YOU recommend in place of nolva to prevent estrogen rebound, which is certain to happen after cessation of letro.

 

[Nelson Montana]

Nelson,

I don't dispute your view of Nolvadex...I'm not a fan either... but I'm curious to get your opinion.... no doubt you've seen the gyno treatment regimen of letro (ramping up to 2.5mg ED, then ramping back down)... followed by nolvadex to prevent "estrogen rebound". In this case, what would YOU recommend in place of nolva to prevent estrogen rebound, which is certain to happen after cessation of letro.

Nolva causes rebound as well. Not a fan of letro. So I can't comment of a protocol with which I disagree. The key to preventing gyno is to stop it before it happens. I've said this a million times. Avoid certain compounds, use sane dosages use an AA during and after and follow it with natty anti e's and a SHBG suppresant to get the body to normalize. THIS WORKS. But yet we continue to debate the merits of it.

 

[njmuscleguy]

Nolva causes rebound as well. Not a fan of letro. So I can't comment of a protocol with which I disagree. The key to preventing gyno is to stop it before it happens. I've said this a million times. Avoid certain compounds, use sane dosages use an AA during and after and follow it with natty anti e's and a SHBG suppresant to get the body to normalize. THIS WORKS. But yet we continue to debate the merits of it.

Point(s) taken... and I'm not debating the merits of preventing gyno instead of allowing it to happend and then treat it... so let's just argue for a second that someone's followed those precautions and *still* has developed gyno... let's say for reasons of over-sensitivity, if nothing else... and let's just say that you don't dispute the value of letro to treat it... so in your expertise, what would you suggest to prevent estrogen rebound after letro treatment? I'm guessing your product PCT? Or maybe Sustain? Those both have natural anti-e's. Do you think those are adequate substitutions? Or anything else?

 

[Nelson Montana]

Point(s) taken... and I'm not debating the merits of preventing gyno instead of allowing it to happend and then treat it... so let's just argue for a second that someone's followed those precautions and *still* has developed gyno... let's say for reasons of over-sensitivity, if nothing else... and let's just say that you don't dispute the value of letro to treat it... so in your expertise, what would you suggest to prevent estrogen rebound after letro treatment? I'm guessing your product PCT? Or maybe Sustain? Those both have natural anti-e's. Do you think those are adequate substitutions? Or anything else?

There comes a point where a lot of this is speculation. be that as it may, I've never heard of anyone getting gyno from Primo or Winny so again, I can't buy into the scenario. Of course, if you already have it, I'd recommend using aromasin plus the supps. If that doesn't help, you may need surgery. No one can say for sure. The reality remains -- an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

 

[njmuscleguy]

There comes a point where a lot of this is speculation. be that as it may, I've never heard of anyone getting gyno from Primo or Winny so again, I can't buy into the scenario. Of course, if you already have it, I'd recommend using aromasin plus the supps. If that doesn't help, you may need surgery. No one can say for sure. The reality remains -- an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

Well, it's a valid scenario for many... some people refuse to use winny (I'm one of them)... I've never tried Primo, but I plan on it...for some, it may be cost-prohibitive... I would never consider a primo and winny only cycle...I love test....test is probably the leading cause of many gyno cases, I would NEVER do a cycle without test...of course, I'd use an AI during cycle to minimize chances of gyno, but of course, nothing is fool-proof.

So thanks for your input.

 

[Nelson Montana]

Well, it's a valid scenario for many... some people refuse to use winny (I'm one of them)... I've never tried Primo, but I plan on it...for some, it may be cost-prohibitive... I would never consider a primo and winny only cycle...I love test....test is probably the leading cause of many gyno cases, I would NEVER do a cycle without test...of course, I'd use an AI during cycle to minimize chances of gyno, but of course, nothing is fool-proof.

So thanks for your input.

This is the thing. It's like people who claim they can't gain weight and then when you tell them they need to increase the calories they say they don't have time. You can't make a good conclusion out of a bad plan.

 

[njmuscleguy]

This is the thing. It's like people who claim they can't gain weight and then when you tell them they need to increase the calories they say they don't have time. You can't make a good conclusion out of a bad plan.

Well, I think I have a pretty good grasp on my personal plan... I make decisions as intelligently as possible, always try to be well-informed... I'm fully aware of whatever consequences my actions could bring.... the whole point was not to get into a debate over what you should do to prevent gyno... I don't disagree with your points on that... just looking for an opinion "after the fact"... you've answered the question, so we're good

 

[Nelson Montana]

Well, I think I have a pretty good grasp on my personal plan... I make decisions as intelligently as possible, always try to be well-informed... I'm fully aware of whatever consequences my actions could bring.... the whole point was not to get into a debate over what you should do to prevent gyno... I don't disagree with your points on that... just looking for an opinion "after the fact"... you've answered the question, so we're good

No prob bro. After all NJ -- we're practically neighbors.

 

[njmuscleguy]

No prob bro. After all NJ -- we're practically neighbors.

Even more reason to go easy on ya

 

[eh2442]

ok i will buy a-dexx, POST CYCLE and Sustain. How much should I buy and take what dose for how long?

 

[njmuscleguy]

Other than the puffy nips, do you feel that you're recovered? Not sure that you'd need all three of those products...if it's just the puffy nips, you can probably just do with the adex.... sustain will give you added anti-estrogen support, also kick up your libido a bit....post-cycle is good for libido and as a mild anti-estrogen, as well as liver support.

 

[eh2442]

Other than the puffy nips, do you feel that you're recovered? Not sure that you'd need all three of those products...if it's just the puffy nips, you can probably just do with the adex.... sustain will give you added anti-estrogen support, also kick up your libido a bit....post-cycle is good for libido and as a mild anti-estrogen, as well as liver support.

I feel I recovered pretty well now, my sex drive is back. Its just the puffy nipps and i am still taking nolva.

Adex is found at what store?

should I taper the nolva down?

How much adex should I take and for how long?

 

[njmuscleguy]

nolva always killed my libido....not sure that you'd have to taper it.... you can get "research" adex at ag-guys... just take it until the puffiness subsides...if it doesn't, you might need something stronger like aromasin or letro.

 

[Harleymarleybone]

I was on test for over a year. When I stopped taking gear I took nolva for over a month until my joints started hurting( It did help reduce my nips). My puffy nips came back 4 weeks later after stopping nolva. I am back on nolva again for 3 weeks now....they are getting better but never 100%.

Will I have to go on and off nolva for ever?

What else could I do?

I would do a round of Letro.

 

[eh2442]

i got some adex/ anastrozole and started taking 1mg a day for a month didn't notice much change so i went up to 2 mg adex per day for another month and added back the nolva/tamoxifen 10 mg a day for a month with adex.

Now my joints and back have major pain and nipps look ok....not 100% but maybe 90% better.

Will they rebound and get puffy again? its been 10 days now off bothe adex and nolva and joint pain is better.

What should i do?

 

[timtim]

i got some adex/ anastrozole and started taking 1mg a day for a month didn't notice much change so i went up to 2 mg adex per day for another month and added back the nolva/tamoxifen 10 mg a day for a month with adex.

Now my joints and back have major pain and nipps look ok....not 100% but maybe 90% better.

Will they rebound and get puffy again? its been 10 days now off bothe adex and nolva and joint pain is better.

What should i do?

did you research these compounds at all? fucking 2mg of adex a day is a boatload. fucking research what your doing before you really fuck yourself up. i bet your cholesterol is negative hdl and a through the roof ldl. the joint pain is because your estrogen is too low. seriously, fucking stupid decision making. you have 1 body, go to a doctor next time before you hurt yourself.

 

[eh2442]

did you research these compounds at all? fucking 2mg of adex a day is a boatload. fucking research what your doing before you really fuck yourself up. i bet your cholesterol is negative hdl and a through the roof ldl. the joint pain is because your estrogen is too low. seriously, fucking stupid decision making. you have 1 body, go to a doctor next time before you hurt yourself.

I have had a bad back my entire life......but now my one arm keeps getting numb and tingles. i guess its from low estro magnifying my back probs or the ldl hdl is causing the arm probs? Now you got me thinking it could be signs of a stroke ? my arm has been doing this for a month.

 

[timtim]

I have had a bad back my entire life......but now my one arm keeps getting numb and tingles. i guess its from low estro magnifying my back probs or the ldl hdl is causing the arm probs? Now you got me thinking it could be signs of a stroke ? my arm has been doing this for a month.

your dosage was way high and extreme. i would hit a doctor this week and blood done. policosanol is great for cholesterol. get that, green tea, and tons of omega essential fatty acids. start it all tomorrow. get to a doc fast.

 

[eh2442]

will my nipps get bad again....from what I was taking and now stopped?

 

[Harleymarleybone]

Nelson,

I don't dispute your view of Nolvadex...I'm not a fan either... but I'm curious to get your opinion.... no doubt you've seen the gyno treatment regimen of letro (ramping up to 2.5mg ED, then ramping back down)... followed by nolvadex to prevent "estrogen rebound". In this case, what would YOU recommend in place of nolva to prevent estrogen rebound, which is certain to happen after cessation of letro.

His supps. What else? ;-)

 

[eh2442]

its been 14 days off adex and nolva.....i think i feel my one nipp getting tingles again.....it looks a bit puffy too. i was on adex for about 3 months and nolva off and on....?

 

[thebadguy54]

NOLVADEX SUCKS ASS!!!

Everybody has got to stop using that shit!

Get some a-dexx, POST CYCLE and Sustain.

Nolva works for me.

... although adex is probably better

 

[thebadguy54]

There comes a point where a lot of this is speculation. be that as it may, I've never heard of anyone getting gyno from Primo or Winny so again, I can't buy into the scenario. Of course, if you already have it, I'd recommend using aromasin plus the supps. If that doesn't help, you may need surgery. No one can say for sure. The reality remains -- an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

That is so true.

where were you when guys on this board were saying "don't use an AI until it's needed" ? What kind of advice is that? AND guys are still saying that shit!

 

[timtim]

its been 14 days off adex and nolva.....i think i feel my one nipp getting tingles again.....it looks a bit puffy too. i was on adex for about 3 months and nolva off and on....?

take my advice, go to doc. have bloodwork done and tell him about your nips. your past the point of self medicating. 3 months on adex at that dosage is scary.

 

[eh2442]

take my advice, go to doc. have bloodwork done and tell him about your nips. your past the point of self medicating. 3 months on adex at that dosage is scary.

i got some adex/ anastrozole and started taking 1mg a day for a month didn't notice much change so i went up to 2 mg adex per day for another month then dropped back down to 1mg a day of adex and added back the nolva/tamoxifen 10 mg a day for a month with adex.

so out of the three months it was only the middle month I was up to 2mg aday of adex.....i think it was uderdosed also.

 

[timtim]

i got some adex/ anastrozole and started taking 1mg a day for a month didn't notice much change so i went up to 2 mg adex per day for another month then dropped back down to 1mg a day of adex and added back the nolva/tamoxifen 10 mg a day for a month with adex.

so out of the three months it was only the middle month I was up to 2mg aday of adex.....i think it was uderdosed also.

your nips hurt when you stop taking this stuff? go to a doctor.

 

[nickster#1]

Nolva causes rebound as well. Not a fan of letro. So I can't comment of a protocol with which I disagree. The key to preventing gyno is to stop it before it happens. I've said this a million times. Avoid certain compounds, use sane dosages use an AA during and after and follow it with natty anti e's and a SHBG suppresant to get the body to normalize. THIS WORKS. But yet we continue to debate the merits of it.

I believe that nolva serves a purpose and is nesasary in some instances, but as nelson said, and I ALWAYS say, prevention is better than cure. Dont run a cycle without something to prevent the estrogen rebound. Depending on the compounds your running, there are alot of options that will keep you from having gyno. Running test for a year and then nolva 4 weeks,,,,?????? Ouch. Sorry man......Go on an anti-e, A-dex, .5mg ED, let go of the nolva for awhile as it is used to block the receptors, and in your case, receptors are compromised. after you feel like your nips are in good shape, and I dont mean supple shape, couldnt help it, when they dont itch and are not puffy, and who knows how long it will be, then go back on the nolva for awhile after to keep those receptors blocked, 25mg a day. You may need to consult with a doctor.

 

[AAP]

Nolva blocks estrogen from binding.. it doesn't eliminate estrogen. So once you stop taking nolva, you still have all these little estrogen terrorists floating around like sleeper cells.. hence the rebound.

 

[Mavafanculo]

That is so true.

where were you when guys on this board were saying "don't use an AI until it's needed" ? What kind of advice is that? AND guys are still saying that shit!

Not everyone is gyno-prone. lowering estrogen via an AI reduces your strength gains and muscle size leverage. Using an Anti-E like nolva lowers igf-1. Neither is a good result for your cycle. So the idea is only use ai/ae if you actually need it.

I can do ridiculous doses of test / dbol and never need an ai/ae because i just have low levels of aromatase -- its an individual thing. People get paranoid and just assume they need all these ancillaries and hurt their cycle for no reason.

1) Theres plenty of time between the initial sensitivity/itchiness and GYNO. adex or letro at that time is sufficient to stop any progression. You dont just wake up one day and have a golfball under yor nip lol. relax.

2) You are better off using proviron with your aromatizing cycle, since it will not only act as a mild anti-e and anti-a, but also competes with test for SHBG binding to help make more of your injected test usable. In other words it gives you gyno protection AND helps your cycle. using masteron is similar.

 

[thebadguy54]

Not everyone is gyno-prone. lowering estrogen via an AI reduces your strength gains and muscle size leverage. Using an Anti-E like nolva lowers igf-1. Neither is a good result for your cycle. So the idea is only use ai/ae if you actually need it.

I can do ridiculous doses of test / dbol and never need an ai/ae because i just have low levels of aromatase -- its an individual thing. People get paranoid and just assume they need all these ancillaries and hurt their cycle for no reason.

1) Theres plenty of time between the initial sensitivity/itchiness and GYNO. adex or letro at that time is sufficient to stop any progression. You dont just wake up one day and have a golfball under yor nip lol. relax.

2) You are better off using proviron with your aromatizing cycle, since it will not only act as a mild anti-e and anti-a, but also competes with test for SHBG binding to help make more of your injected test usable. In other words it gives you gyno protection AND helps your cycle. using masteron is similar.

It may be hard for a newb to recognize the initial sensitivity IMO.

I realize you wont just wake up with a golf ball sized lump, but you can suddenly get a microscopic, tiny, little lump, that nobody except you will notice.

As tiny as that lump is, it's still gyno and most guys wouldn't want it.

I guess my point is that sometimes an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. I'd rather have 80% of the results from a cycle and no gyno than 100% of the results and itchy nips or a tiny lump.