Steroids and atherosclerosis

[Harleymarleybone]

This can't be good



http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/do...4564.2006.05210.x?cookieSet=1&journalCode=prc

CLINICAL STUDY
Coronary Calcification in Body Builders Using Anabolic Steroids

* Lawrence J. Santora, MD;1From the Orange County Heart Institute and Research Center1
* Jairo Marin, MD;1From the Orange County Heart Institute and Research Center1
* Jack Vangrow, MD 1From the Orange County Heart Institute and Research Center1
* Craig Minegar, RDCS 1From the Orange County Heart Institute and Research Center1
* Mary Robinson, NP 2OC Vital Imaging2
* Janet Mora, RT 2OC Vital Imaging2
* Gerald Frieds, MS 2OC Vital Imaging2

*
From the Orange County Heart Institute and Research Center1 and OC Vital Imaging2 Orange, CA

Lawrence J. Santora, MD, Orange County Heart Institute and Research Center, 1140 West La Veta Avenue, Suite 640, Orange, CA 92668 E-mail: [email protected]

(Prev Cardiol. 2006;9:198–201)
Abstract

The authors measured coronary artery calcification as a means of examining the impact of anabolic steroids on the development of atherosclerotic disease in body builders using anabolic steroids over an extended period of time. Fourteen male professional body builders with no history of cardiovascular disease were evaluated for coronary artery calcium, serum lipids, left ventricular function, and exercise-induced myocardial ischemia. Seven subjects had coronary artery calcium, with a much higher than expected mean score of 98. Six of the 7 calcium scores were>90th percentile. Mean total cholesterol was 192 mg/dL, while mean high-density lipoprotein was 23 mg/dL and the mean ratio of total cholesterol to high-density lipoprotein was 8.3. Left ventricular ejection fraction ranged between 49$ and 68$, with a mean of 59$. No subject had evidence of myocardial ischemia. This small group of professional body builders with a long history of steroid abuse had high levels of coronary artery calcium for age. The authors conclude that in this small pilot study there is an association between early coronary artery calcium and long-term steroid abuse. Large-scale studies are warranted to further explore this association.

http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/do...4564.2006.05210.x?cookieSet=1&journalCode=prc

 

[Tatyana]

Similar things have been shown with HRT in women.

There is an increased risk factor for some women. The operative word being some.

This study was small, 14, and the groups was very specific, professional bodybuilders.

Only 7 demonstrated higher levels of coronary artery calcium.

I will see if I can read the full paper later.

 

[Tatyana]

My library status where I work does not subscribe to that journal, so you have to pay to read it, sorry.

A couple of points lads for scientific literacy.

The abstract is only a SHORT summary of what happened in the research, and some are great and give you loads of info, others are just brief.

If I was critically reviewing this paper, there are a couple of things I would want to see before I would consider it legitmate

1. Preventivitive cardiology, the journal, I have never heard about. The really hardcore full on valid science papers get published in major journals, more kudos for the scientists, it is sort of like having amateur ranks and pro ranks, different divisions in sports leagues.

2. The age range of the participants, and the mean average age

3. The range for the time using steroid, and the mean time.

4. The average amount of steroids the participants were using

5. The type of steroids the participants were using

6. When they did their measurements, over what time frame, and how many times, and the analyser they used, the standard error, coefficient of error for the analysers (some people use new technology that has not proven the test of time for example)

7. What level of significance they used and what statistics they performed

I think I may be missing something, but that is all I can think of now.

That being said, all of you know that you need to get your bloods done, and that responsible use is far different from abuse.

 

[njmuscleguy]

CLA is supposed to help prevent atherosclerosis, right?

 

[jagerbombme]

CLA is supposed to help prevent atherosclerosis, right?

what's cla bro? also, wouldn't just using injectables and fish oil to keep your cholesterol good prevent this? these guys are popping orals like candy and cholesterol and lipids stay fuckd for long periods. where someone just using injects where his cholesterol stays perfect 120-150, shouldn't have a problem with this i would imagine.

 

[Harleymarleybone]

Similar things have been shown with HRT in women.

There is an increased risk factor for some women. The operative word being some.

This study was small, 14, and the groups was very specific, professional bodybuilders.

Only 7 demonstrated higher levels of coronary artery calcium.

I will see if I can read the full paper later.

Your thoughts are not very comforting. 7 is 50%. Also, we know for certain that many steroids cause a dramatic drop in HDL and other preconditions for artery issues. The study is certainly suggestive and something for long term users to consider. The 90th percentile in calcification for many of them screams out for an explanation. The more interesting question is what the study considers long term. Too bad you can't access the full study.

 

[njmuscleguy]

what's cla bro? also, wouldn't just using injectables and fish oil to keep your cholesterol good prevent this? these guys are popping orals like candy and cholesterol and lipids stay fuckd for long periods. where someone just using injects where his cholesterol stays perfect 120-150, shouldn't have a problem with this i would imagine.

Conjugated Linoleic Acid - lots of buzz on this these days - do a search online. Primordial Products has it in liquid form now. Has a host of benefits including reducing body fat (abdominal fat), cancer protection, guarding against atherosclerosis, etc. There's some decent studies on it too (tonalin)

Regarding injectables and cholesterol, your cholesterol WILL go up from using injectables... even HRT levels of injectable test will elevate cholesterol to an extent (speaking from personal experience as well).... the debate is more so with injectables and liver enzymes. Orals will of course elevate them greatly, they *say* that injectables won't...but I still think they do to a small extent.

Always good to take fish oil... I also take a CoQ10 / Policosinol complex for cholesterol...I've also been taking endoamp and now CLA. My cholesterol levels always shoot up, so I'm taking all-out precautions.

 

[Harleymarleybone]

Conjugated Linoleic Acid - lots of buzz on this these days - do a search online. Primordial Products has it in liquid form now. Has a host of benefits including reducing body fat (abdominal fat), cancer protection, guarding against atherosclerosis, etc. There's some decent studies on it too (tonalin)

Regarding injectables and cholesterol, your cholesterol WILL go up from using injectables... even HRT levels of injectable test will elevate cholesterol to an extent (speaking from personal experience as well).... the debate is more so with injectables and liver enzymes. Orals will of course elevate them greatly, they *say* that injectables won't...but I still think they do to a small extent.

Always good to take fish oil... I also take a CoQ10 / Policosinol complex for cholesterol...I've also been taking endoamp and now CLA. My cholesterol levels always shoot up, so I'm taking all-out precautions.

I just read a study that said you need about 600 mg's a week of Test to have a statistically significant effect on cholesterol, so that's good. I think you are right that injectables have some effect, but not nearly the effect of orals. Yet another reason to use orals sparingly. I am glad I don't mind needles

 

[get456]

The authors conclude that in this small pilot study there is an association between early coronary artery calcium and long-term steroid abuse. Large-scale studies are warranted to further explore this association.

http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/do...4564.2006.05210.x?cookieSet=1&journalCode=prc

50% of a group of 14, whose abuse (operative word here) would surprise most of us here Im sure (as we always speculate about "their" dosages)

IMO, if that is the case, It actually makes me feel better, if the worst abusers in the world can be ok 50% of the time... shit, I'll take my chances

 

[Harleymarleybone]

50% of a group of 14, whose abuse (operative word here) would surprise most of us here Im sure (as we always speculate about "their" dosages)

IMO, if that is the case, It actually makes me feel better, if the worst abusers in the world can be ok 50% of the time... shit, I'll take my chances

The word "abuse" is often used in the medical and legal community in sense of using without a medically legitimate purpose. That means use for bodybuilding purposes is "abuse." So the mere use of that word says nothing informative.

All we know from the abstract is that they are long term users, which says nothing about dosages or whether they were the "worst abusers" in the world as you say. So you are speculating.

I would guess there are a lot of long term users on this board, and others - like the clueless aging addicts over at AFboard.

 

[Tatyana]

The word "abuse" is often used in the medical and legal community in sense of using without a medically legitimate purpose. That means use for bodybuilding purposes is "abuse." So the mere use of that word says nothing informative.

All we know from the abstract is that they are long term users, which says nothing about dosages or whether they were the "worst abusers" in the world as you say. So you are speculating.

I would guess there are a lot of long term users on this board, and others - like the clueless aging addicts over at AFboard.

So true, we would need to see the study to see if they did list what the cycles were.

I will ask another one of my scientific buddies to see if they get free access to this journal.

 

[LoneTree]

Coronary artery disease (CAD) is a complex disease.
Inflammation plays a big role in its pathogenesis.
Majority of the people who get heart attacks have 50% or less blockage of coronry arteries.
Baloon or stent angioplasty does NOT increase survival; it only relieves symptoms.
Bypass surgery does not increase survival unless the disease is severe (triple-vessel disease or left-main/LAD involvement).

Test and anti-estrogens do have adverse effects on lipid fractions. That is an establishyed fact. In the long run, it would have adverse effects on arteries.

What can you do about it?
Quit smoking.
Control your blood pressure well. This may have more beneficial effect than previously thought.
DON'T DO ORALS. You need your liver if you are ever going to need statins (one of the most beneficial medicines in CAD).
Take 1-2 baby aspirin every day for anti-inflammatory effect. Anabolics may cause excess blood formation that may incerease viscosity that may lead to clots. This will help there too.
Take Lipitor 10 mg, or another statin, every day. It is not more toxic than oral anabolics. In some countries, some statins are available over the counter. Statins are also good for bones (prevent osteoprosis)

 

[halfcenturian]

Lone-Tree nailed it.
Statin drugs: Lipitor, Zocor, Vytorin, etc. These drugs were made to prevent high cholesterol. Take your fish oil and watch your diet, but if you want to lower your LDL and Trigs in record time, go on statin drugs.