Steroid Sting Fallout: 40,000+ users

[Tatyana]

Well, you said you would love to see the stats, so I provided them. The issue of proving or disproving how dangerous other drugs are, was in response to your statement that bodies were piling up from steroid use. I just find this sort of language to be the same sort of hyperbole you find in the sensationalized media. I don't see any bodies, and if there are, one has to put it into the proper perspective, since bodies can pile up from all sorts of things humans do, including bicycling, rock climbing and taking prescription drugs, like aspirin or antibiotics. Hence my comparison. You say that steroids are "giants" compared to these other drugs I mentioned which are "toddlers," but the stats show that these other "toddler" drugs end up directly killing thousands and thousands of people every year while there are very few if any cases where you can say steroids (the "giant" drugs) directly kill anybody (and I don't see any stats showing numbers who were indirectly killed by steroids either). So, what is your basis for calling steroids "giant" drugs and these other "toddlers"? Further, let's assume, as you say, that the stats for illegal drugs are not accurate. If that is true, then you really don't know if steroids are "giants" in terms of their effects and the others are toddlers. Also, steroids were legal in this country for a long period and still are in many countries, and there still are no stats that show any especially significant dangers (in the sense of bodies piling up) to steroid use. So, while I understand your concerns, I merely take issue with some of your descriptions which I don't think have much basis. According to the body of knowledge we presently have (future knowledge is mere speculation), steroids seem to be some of the safest drugs out there.[/QUOTE]


See above post.

I would also like to remind you that these are drugs, that if given to a women, starts to transform into a man, and similarily, given to men who would like a sex change, start changing into women.

I have read a few case studies of people dieing due to drug interactions, physician error etc. In the majority of them, there are also other factors, and the incorrect drug, or too much of the drug is just one of the factors.

What I am asserting is that this is the same case for steroids.

Since I have started bodybuilding, I have had to go to a funeral every year, or I have heard of the death of a bodybuilder, all of them under the age of 50.

I am advocating caution, I really don't want to have to keep seeing people I care for die.

My statement may have been strong, and partially emotive due to the number of people I have known that have died (mostly of cardiovascular events), however, I do want to state this again.

It is difficult to PROVE causes of death from a drug, even when the substance is found in the body. And there are often cocktails of drugs, more than one steroid used.

I don't want to go to any more funerals for young people.

I also just found a citation from a book that show links to deaths of 29 athletes.

I will also see if I can find a list posted on another forum of all of the bodybuilders and wrestlers who have died young where steroid use was implicated.

I also think looking at the life and death of Andrea Munzer is also needed, post mortum it was found that his liver had dissolved.

These are just the publised cases as these people were in the public eye.


I can really understand that you are angry about this. I am annoyed that a lot of herbal supplements have been regulated, as they are in the US.

There are also people who have done damage to themselves with adverse drug reactions from pharmaceuticals and herbal supplements.

People seriously underestimate the risks, not only of anabolic steroids, but of all sorts of drugs, herbs and supplements.

This is what I really want to stress:

THE POISON IS ALL IN THE DOSAGE

Here are just a few bits and bobs I have found on other websites, parts of news reports etc.

Again I will say that I think that steroids can be used safely, however there are obviously a lot of people that are NOT using them responsibly, this has created the situation that is currently happening with the DEA. And all the other political, economic and social/educational issues that go along with 'drug use'.


The long-term effects of anabolic steroid use on the development of atherosclerotic coronary artery disease have not been determined. The literature contains reports of competitive athletes who have died suddenly as a result of coronary artery disease, but the possibility of anabolic steroid use as a contributing factor is not addressed specifically



'96 MVP admitted steroid use, fought drug problem
ESPN.com news services

NEW YORK -- On the field, Ken Caminiti's all-out style served him well. Off the field is where it got him in trouble.

The 1996 National League MVP, who later admitted using steroids during his major league career and for years battled a drug problem, died at the age of 41.







Then there is the story of Lyle Alzado, an All-Pro defensive lineman who played with the Denver Broncos, Cleveland Browns and the LA Raiders. Alzado was extremely versatile, playing both end and tackle in the front four, beginning his career with the Broncos in 1971. Like many other professional football players, to enhance his performance and increase his body mass he took steroids. The chemicals caused him to develop brain cancer, and he died in 1992.

Shortly before his death, Alzado commented, “I started taking anabolic steroids in 1969 and never stopped. It was addicting, mentally addicting. Now I’m sick, and I’m scared. Ninety percent of the athletes I know are on the stuff. We’re not born to be 300 pounds or jump 30 feet. But all the time I was taking steroids, I knew they were making me play better.







So far in 2007, Bam Bam Bigelow, Mike Awesome and Sensational Sherri have died. None was even 50. If you think back to the wrestlers from your childhood Saturday mornings, you'll be chilled at the list of the dead: Crash Holly, Kerry Von Erich, Owen Hart, Adrian Adonis, Yokozuna, Brian Pillman, Davey Boy Smith, André the Giant, Rick Rude, Bruiser Brody, Miss Elizabeth, Big Boss Man, Earthquake, Curt Hennig, Junkyard Dog, Hercules, Big John Studd, Road Warrior Hawk.

And here's the scary part: None of those wrestlers lived past 46.

The causes of death vary widely, of course. André the Giant, for instance, had acromegaly. (As he once touchingly remarked to Billy Crystal, "We do not live long, the big and the small.") But a striking number of the deaths were related to steroid or drug use.

Three years ago, USA Today did a study on the death rates of professional wrestlers. It found that between 1997 and 2004, about 1,000 people under the age of 45 had worked in professional wrestling (this included not just the WWE, but many minor circuits). During that time, 65 of them died. Keith Pinckard, a medical examiner who follows pro wrestling deaths, said wrestlers have death rates roughly seven times higher than the general population.

It's a hard life. Many wrestlers work three to five events a week. The lifestyle is part carny, part rock star, with all the attendant risky behaviors - including heavy drinking and recreational drug use.




I’ve used the headline “people are dying to get fit” in descriptive articles and releases related to weight loss surgeries and weight loss drugs, but we’re at a point in time that the same headline might be used to describe bodybuilding.

In 1999 Sonny Schmidt, at 46 years old, placed 3rd in the Masters Olympia. On January 25, 2004, Sonny Schmidt died.
In 2003, 285-pound 30-year-old bodybuilder Scott Klein died of heart failure.
Remember that picture of Ron Teufel I told you about at Champions Gym? He died in 2002 at the age of 45.*
These are just a few of the premature deaths related to users of anabolic steroids at relatively high dosages. There are also the stories of pros at the highest levels suddenly dropping out of competition . . . permanently . . . due to liver failure.

I’ll never forget retired pro bodybuilder, Steve Brisbois, telling me first hand about the death of Mohammed Benaziza seven hours after winning the Dutch Grand Prix. The interview I did with steroid guru Dan Duchaine from his prison cell has been one of my most publicized radio shows to date. Dan has since died . . . at the age of 48. Liver failure. I remember interviewing Scandinavian bodybuilding giant Viggo Snowhill about his drug use less than 24 hours after leaving the hospital where he was near death from a GHB overdose. Bill Pearl, who has been retired from competition for decades but is without question a bodybuilding legend made the following comment on my show, “Phil, the guy left standing on the stage today at the end of a bodybuilding show is probably the guy in the arena who is closest to death.”




Nevertheless, people and athletes have short memories. Remember when former NFL star John Matuszak died in 1989? Before he died, "Tooz" talked of his excessive lifestyle and pointedly said that steroids were a major part of his undoing

 

[Harleymarleybone]

Here are just a few bits and bobs I have found on other websites, parts of news reports etc.

QUOTE]

Tatyana, dear, I was suggesting you were buying into the media hype by mentioning piles of bodies, and what do you do? - you list many of the hyped media reports to help make your case. How convincing do you think that will be? ;-) There is no evidence steroids caused Lyle Alzado's cancer - even his doctor said so. Pro-wrestlers live a high risk lifestyle, as you mentioned. Your list includes Owen Hart who died of a fall, not steroids. You mention athletes who drop dead young, where steroids were suggested. Where is yourevidence that steroid taking athletes drop dead young, more than any other professional populations that are not associated with steroids?- from plumbers to teachers? I have gone to many funerals for people in my working profession who have died young - from heart attacks to suicide- things where steroids would be erroneously and automatically suspected if the victim were an athlete. And people who take steroids are people who are more inclined to take other risks, and drugs, which could be the cause of their demise. Moreover, bodybuilding, even natural, is an extreme sport that is taxing on the body and heart - the bulking and dieting, and non-steroidal supplementation. Regarding liver toxicity, 7,600 people die every year, and 76,000 are hospitalized, from simple non-interaction related NSAIDs complications (simple things like aspirin, ibuprofen, and naproxen), many of these deaths and complications from liver toxicity. 500 mg of test every week for ten weeks is a hell of a lot safer for your liver than Ibuprofen for 10 weeks. So why are these toddler drugs and steroids "giants"? Again, I do not see any evidence that "bodies are piling up" any more with steroids than any other drugs. Nobody is arguing people should not be responsible, but they should be responsible and careful with all drugs, even over the counter ones. Responsibility is a given with everything we do.

 

[Pat_McCrotch]

I see you have not shown steroids are more dangerous than these other things I mentioned. I was not addressing the question of the purpose of these drugs. Lots of people do not need to take aspirin and many other medications they are prescribed and sometimes die from. Bicycling and rock climbing have risks, too, but they are not made illegal, punishable activities. As far as the stats take a gander:

# (1996): "Each year, use of NSAIDs (Non-Steroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drugs) accounts for an estimated 7,600 deaths and 76,000 hospitalizations in the United States." (NSAIDs include aspirin, ibuprofen, naproxen, diclofenac, ketoprofen, and tiaprofenic acid.)

Source: Robyn Tamblyn, PhD; Laeora Berkson, MD, MHPE, FRCPC; W. Dale Jauphinee, MD, FRCPC; David Gayton, MD, PhD, FRCPC; Roland Grad, MD, MSc; Allen Huang, MD, FRCPC; Lisa Isaac, PhD; Peter McLeod, MD, FRCPC; and Linda Snell, MD, MHPE, FRCPC, "Unnecessary Prescribing of NSAIDs and the Management of NSAID-Related Gastropathy in Medical Practice," Annals of Internal Medicine (Washington, DC: American College of Physicians, 1997), September 15, 1997, 127:429-438, from the web at http://www.acponline.org/journals/annals/15sep97/nsaid.htm, last accessed Feb. 14, 2001, citing Fries, JF, "Assessing and understanding patient risk," Scandinavian Journal of Rheumatology Supplement, 1992;92:21-4.

# (Average 1982-1998): According to Canadian researchers, approximately 32,000 hospitalized patients (and possibly as many as 106,000) in the USA die each year because of adverse reactions to their prescribed medications.

Source: Lazarou, J, Pomeranz, BH, Corey, PN, "Incidence of adverse drug reactions in hospitalized patients: a meta-analysis of prospective studies," Journal of the American Medical Association (Chicago, IL: American Medical Association, 1998), 1998;279:1200-1205, also letters column, "Adverse Drug Reactions in Hospitalized Patients," JAMA (Chicago, IL: AMA, 1998), Nov. 25, 1998, Vol. 280, No. 20, from the web at http://jama.ama-assn.org/issues/v280n20/ffull/jlt1125-1.html, last accessed Feb. 12, 2001.

Incidence

In the United States, approximately 550,000 serious allergic reactions to medications occur in a given year in hospitals.1 While it is unclear how prevalent drug allergies are among the general population, allergic reactions to medications cause the highest number of documented deaths from anaphylaxis each year. Penicillin alone accounts for an estimated 75% of the known annual U.S. anaphylaxis deaths.2,3 Most deaths occur in people who have had no medical history of allergic reactions.4

Common Culprits

The most common medications that cause allergic reactions (called allergenic medications) are:

* Penicillin
* Sulfa antibiotics
* Allopurinol
* Seizure and anti-arrhythmia medications
* Nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDS, such as aspirin and ibuprofen)
* Muscle relaxants
* Certain post-surgery fluids

Other medications known to cause severe allergic reactions include vaccines, radiocontrast media, antihypertensives, insulin, and blood products.

For example, radiocontrast media (which are so-called "dyes" that are administered before radiologic procedures) are estimated to cause as many as 900 deaths per year from anaphylactoid reactions.5 Anaphylactoid reactions are nearly identical to anaphylaxis but are not triggered by IgE mediation. Anaphylactoid reactions are treated in the same manner as anaphylaxis.

http://www.epipen.com/causes_medications.aspx

Good info. I have heard numbers like these before. How many deaths are caused by roids?

I think the point we are all making is that roids are not the cause of these deaths. Like I have said before if they can show me the bodies of roid related deaths then I will stop

 

[Tweakle]

did you get that list of A A S fatalities from Mark Mero?

Precontest drugs used to kill bbers, not A AS.. anti-cortisol medication for cushings syndrome, a 'safe doctor prescribed medication' is what killed munzer and diuretics (popular with holier than thou naturals the world over) took momo and caused many others to get horribly sick.

Baseball players hooked on speed, Wrestlers doing massive amounts of painkillers mixed with alcohol, cocaine and all kinds of uppers and downers - but the A A S is what took them. Lyle having AIDS and being in denial but again, it was the A A S that did him in. Please.

Doing 5 grams a week and a bunch of orals for years on end isn't the safest lifestyle choice but who does that outside of a tiny handful of pros?

Obviously the DEA doesnt give a flying fuck about anyones health, they are run by political appointees and have to show results for pissing away trillions of dollars on 'the war on drugs'.

 

[holy ghost]

MUNZER WAS BAD ASS!!! nelson interviewed him i think

ps, i guess im living like a wrestler!

 

[sweatandscience]

The war on drugs can be won, if we (the government) really wanted to win.

I say this because just a few short years back a very threatening drug called ecstasy posed a unique challenge for the DEA, the law enforcement community, and some large corporations.

This drug threatened to erode the market for traditional drugs such as cocaine, and at the same time was projected to cut the profits of alcohol sales by a large percentage, particularly in bars. The drug, while dangerous, had few of the potentials for abuse and destruction that the traditional street drugs had, and was viewed by many to be a relatively safe drug when used responsibly.

The incentive was there and it was clear that the popularity of this drug had to be squashed, and quick. So not unlike we see here, the propaganda and scare campaign began - with the familiar over-exposed examples of the substances use by normal, average intelligent users "gone horribly wrong".

The campaign was so intense that at one point legislation was introduced that would have made it possible to charge a clubgoer with possesion of drug paraphernalia for holding a botted water in some surroundings.

Well, here we are a few years later, and there is little real ectasy to be found. What can be found are terrible concoctions of various drugs stamped to look like the ectasy pills of old. Ask most young people today, and they'd tell you ectasy is not that great....likely because they've only taken the garbage pills that suddenly mysteriously flodded the market.


The DEA has won this battle on drugs, clearly. The war on drugs machine can go on now, endlessly, with the heavy spending on the profitable war on cocaine. Local agencies still get their huge grants, foreign governments still get their millions, and those who have the power in this "war" continue to have it.

But most grateful are the liquor and beer lobby who spent millions on lobbying against ecstasy and now have the threat to profits successfully managed for several years to come.

If government wants to stamp out testosterone because no one company holds the patent and no one industry can profit, then it will be done to a great degree.

 

[Tweakle]

The difference being big Pharm actually makes a killing from A AS, which is why I'm suprised they let a few lunatics in congress upset the boat by starting the first witch-hunt back in the 90's.

Walgreens will sell you a bottle of nice, legal ana dro l for about $2000, good for small children with anemia but DEADLY POISON to grown adults who want to jack their bench press up a few lbs.

While Big Pharm was probably involved in the chinese busts, using the government agents as their enforcers to shake down the competition, it's a double edged sword.. tell a lie often enough, and as can be seen on this thread people will start to genuinely believe the anti AA S / g H propaganda

While it means they can sell at 10000% markups compared to 'filthy' homebrewers, in the long run it's bad karma to push the lie that something is deadly and dangerous when you're the ones trying to sell it to kids and AIDS patients.

I remember the first government war on ecstasy back in the 90's in the UK, laws passed regulating from the BPM of music that could be played in public and a huge media campaign over one stupid fat girl who took too much and didn't drink any water. Pills went to shit in the years after that, I can only imagine what todays mystery pills are actually made of when the originals cost many times more.