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Squat posts... how far do you REALLY go down????

  • Thread starter Thread starter Citruscide
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Citruscide

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Ok, I've read alot of posts about how people touch "ass to floor" or "hamstring to ankle" -- now, my roommate goes down pretty far... further than I do on front squats... I just showed him how far I go... and he told me I would clear a competition lift (whatever that means) and that my squat goes below parellel.

But for me to think of someone going ASS to FLOOR with 405 for 8 reps is really weird... or even for their 1RM max... I just looked at Loudan Swain's post about a guy who squatted a SHIT load of weight.. he went down far, but not ass to floor...

Can someone explain this to me?? will it kill my workout that I can only go slightly below parellel??

C-ditty
 
Ok, sorry... I didn't mean to make this post sound "offensive" -- I mean it to be 100% inquisitive... Curiosity...

That's all... sometimes i come off like the guy who is shouting from the mountain top ... :)

C-ditty
 
Ok, I saw some pics on Loudan's thread that CoolCol posted... and I've seen my roommates form.

Nate, do you touch your soleus on your 1RM? Or do you do 1RM?

And will it hurt me because I am only going just below parellel on my front squats?

C-ditty
 
I take em' down past parallel. I began going deeper about 2 months ago and every leg workout I feel my hams torn to the absolutel limit. It's definitely the way to go for me.

I go 3/4 inches below 90 degrees.
 
A lot of powerlifters find it very difficult to ONLY hit parallel. I go as deep as I can. I do find that with bigger legs, larger glutes/hams/calves...I can't go as deep as I used to. I can still go way below parallel though.

Box Squats...parallel or a bit below.
Front Squats...as deep as I can...way below parallel.
High Bar Squats...as deep as I can...way below parallel.

B True
 
What about from a BB point of view? I myself break parallel but don't go all the way. Probably a flexibility issue (also harder for tall people).
 
Yes I I agree with all of you Glutes to the Soleus.....after really doing some reading and really reading all points of view I believe this is the best form. I use to be very conscious about "if I was going parallel" or not and this powerlifter at the gym just flat out told me, "If your so fucking worried about it just go to the pocket but don't bounce at the bottom or you will have problems with your knees....and I don't have to hear about it anymore..." I got motivated with this and Gents, "yes to the pocket" even though a certain trainer at the gym stated that I am going to have an ass like Jennifer Lopez.........
 
I go about 2-4 inches below parallel on high bar squats and I touch my calves when doing front squats. Citrus I doubt it will affect you in the long run. The reason I touch is to keep the pressure of my knees, I found once you go past parallel you kness are fine since your hips take the extra slack....
 
I think you guys have all seen this, but it shows how far down I squat. Yes I know I'm leaning a bit but it was the first time I squatted 435 for reps

my squat
 
It depends whether or not I use a box. If I squat below parallel, it is difficult for me to keep my back vertical since I have long legs and a short upper body. Also I use a standard stance about shoulder width.

I usually squat down where the bottom of the ass is in line with the center of the knee meaning that the top of the thigh is inclined about 5 to 10 degrees.

If I am working on overloading the legs, I will sometimes throw in a heavy set of half squats.

Overall I am a bodybuilder and not a powerlifter so squatting below parallel is not essential towards my leg training. I also use heavy leg presses in my training with reps ranging between 8 and 15.

If I do squat below parallel, I typically use 60 percent of my max.
 
Very nice needsize!

My squats to to the damn floor... as low as i can. Pretty much like needsize's squat. I refuse to put on more weight until i can do my current weight to the damn floor. I've been doing them for only 4 weeks now too. :)
 
I get as low as I can, always past parallel. Like Bfold, I'm taller and have naturally big legs and butt, so I don't have a great deal of flexibility. Also, I don't lift near what I used to when I hit parallel or above. But since I've cut the weight and started going low, the difference is considerable. And no knee problems either :)
 
Good shi* needsize. Looks a little good morning like but all else was tremendous.

Just came out of a leg workout. Once again, another visit to the bowl during the workout. Never the less a great workout. Been having a lot of those lately. :D
 
Citruscide said:

Nate, do you touch your soleus on your 1RM? Or do you do 1RM?

And will it hurt me because I am only going just below parellel on my front squats?

C-ditty
Click to expand...

the only way i count it as my 1RM is if i go full ROM.

with front squats it should be easier to go all the way down, since your torso sits much more upright. if you are having trouble getting in the hole, make sure your adductor flexibility is good and also your stretch your soleus. i always sit down at rock bottom position and push my knees out with my elbows as a warmup. i look for any "binding" or things inhibiting a smooth squat and stretch it before i begin.
 
Ok, I've looked at some people who went with Glutes to Soleus... and I have a question, do you keep you feet firmly on the ground? or are you benching off your toes? Meaning, can you touch your glutes to your soleus if your heels are on the ground?

My heels are firmly on the ground, I go down past parellel... I know that much... I agree... I can't stop at parellel... it doesn't seem "natural" -- but I tried to just squat down with no weight, my heels planted firm and touch my ass to my soleus and I fell over backwards... my roommate does it and he is on his toes...

Just curious. :)

C-ditty
 
1" below parallel...everytime. Only way I know this is that I box squat. So I know I hit the same height everytime. Usually on the last set of speed squats I will take a mat out...which puts me 2" below parallel.

Of course I'm not squatting to cause hypertrophy. I do accessory work for that.
 
slightly below parallel for growth purposes is PERFECT in my opinion. Now, that isnt to say that "parallel" doesnt mean different things to different folks. I have seen guys swear that they squat just to parrallel and they turn out to be WAY high. Anyways, here's how deep I go, and when I compete I may bottom it out a bit more, just so there is NO doubt in the judges mind.

555.jpg
 
Citruscide said:
Ok, I've looked at some people who went with Glutes to Soleus... and I have a question, do you keep you feet firmly on the ground? or are you benching off your toes? Meaning, can you touch your glutes to your soleus if your heels are on the ground?

My heels are firmly on the ground, I go down past parellel... I know that much... I agree... I can't stop at parellel... it doesn't seem "natural" -- but I tried to just squat down with no weight, my heels planted firm and touch my ass to my soleus and I fell over backwards... my roommate does it and he is on his toes...

Just curious. :)

C-ditty
Click to expand...

Doing without any weight is harder for me to balance! When I add weight, it seems to provide a lot of stability for me. Especially apparant with front squats. By the way, my knees don't end up directly in front of me (I point my toes out about 45 degrees) and my calves don't touch my ass...but my hamstrings do. Maybe you need to tinker with your stance/foot position?
 
Citruscide said:
Ok, I've looked at some people who went with Glutes to Soleus... and I have a question, do you keep you feet firmly on the ground? or are you benching off your toes? Meaning, can you touch your glutes to your soleus if your heels are on the ground?

My heels are firmly on the ground, I go down past parellel... I know that much... I agree... I can't stop at parellel... it doesn't seem "natural" -- but I tried to just squat down with no weight, my heels planted firm and touch my ass to my soleus and I fell over backwards... my roommate does it and he is on his toes...

Just curious. :)

C-ditty
Click to expand...

feet firmly on the ground, yes. i press off the middle/rear of my foot. if your heels pop up when you are in a full squat, you need to address inflexibilities/structural/stance issues.

granted, your whole ass isnt going to touch your soleus (i use soleus as a reference but im not talking achilles tendon) its individual for everyone. glutes to me means my glute/ham junction, and soleus is probably more gastroc and soleus. all i know is i press flesh to flesh, without bouncing. whatever your body touches at a very low position without your quads somewhat relaxing and putting strain on your knees is "ATF".
 
I guess my legs touch my calf??? but when people say Ass to Floor or Ass to soleus... I'm thinking an actual "TAG! you're it!" :)

I can feel my hamstrings touch my legs... but I don't think my ass comes anywhere NEAR to touching the floor??

C-ditty
 
When I box squat I go wide, so my ass is no where near the floor.

When I deep squat, I go rock bottom. I just measured and it means my ass is about 5" from the ground. I physically cant go down any farther.

Also C, its easier to keep from falling backwards with weight pushing you down :)
 
I go just below parallel because I have a tendency to build quickley in my ass as someone else mentioned. Sir Mix a Lot likes big butts but I don't!
 
Tarheel said:
When I box squat I go wide, so my ass is no where near the floor.
Click to expand...

Am I crazy or doesn't a box squat imply that you are squatting onto a box, therefore if you touched your ass on the floor, you missed the box?!
 
True, I sorta typed that in a hurry though.

Well anytime I squat wide I cant go really low. But the only time I squat wide is when I box squat.
 
sometimes i think i may not be going as far down as i intend to. i don't have a workout partner or anything to watch and ensure i am going as low as i should be and i can't exactly see myself. i usually go to parallel (once in a while full squat) and if i miss it, i do not believe it is by much and only when i start to go heavier.


j2da2
 
needsize said:
I think you guys have all seen this, but it shows how far down I squat. Yes I know I'm leaning a bit but it was the first time I squatted 435 for reps

my squat
Click to expand...

you are sacrificing form for weight and depth.

I admire how low you go....but if it involves your heels raising and you leaning that far forward....i would advise you lower the weight

but i am sure you already know this.
 
Ok, I did my front squats tonight... and it is impossible for me ot touch my hamstrings to my soleus... first off all... my feet are spread out TOO wide... my toes almost touch the inside of the squat rack (it's not a terribly WIDE squat rack, however)... even if I go down and touch my butt to the ground (while holding onto something) I am leaning backward. my ass goes inbetween the calves... and the hamstrings off to the inside... so to say that they TOUCH would be a fable for me....

However, if I would move my feet closer IN, then I'm sure that I could touch them... and would touch them ...

C-ditty
 
endpoint said:


you are sacrificing form for weight and depth.

I admire how low you go....but if it involves your heels raising and you leaning that far forward....i would advise you lower the weight

but i am sure you already know this.
Click to expand...

I noticed his form breakdown too... but your form does that when you are going for the upper weights. I'm sure he had a controlled enough motion to handle any sort of pressure he might be under... hell, when I 1RM my deadlift... my form is REALLY broke. :)

C-ditty
 
Just go down until your can't move anymore. That usually means your hamstrings will touch your calves.

Some people's hams are so big that when they go rock bottom they are still only at parallel :)
ie Shane Hamman
 
needsize said:
I think you guys have all seen this, but it shows how far down I squat. Yes I know I'm leaning a bit but it was the first time I squatted 435 for reps

my squat
Click to expand...

Come to think of it, I go down about THAT low... not much of a bounce for me though... then again, I'm front squatting around 250ish... so I guess no need for it.

Also, I dont think I could lean forward tat much on my FS... LOL ... I'd topple over!

I wouldn't be concerned about form... 435 for reps is impressive... I'd give it up a little for that weight too...

(I didn't notice your heels coming off the ground though... as someone had said)

C-ditty
 
Citruscide said:


I noticed his form breakdown too... but your form does that when you are going for the upper weights. I'm sure he had a controlled enough motion to handle any sort of pressure he might be under... hell, when I 1RM my deadlift... my form is REALLY broke. :)

C-ditty
Click to expand...

he was only losing form due to a weak core and maybe hamstrings.

If you are strong enough in all muscles involved you will have a nice form....at 10% and at 100% all across the board.

how ever weak core will make you flop over and you will have to rescue it.....dont put your self in that situation.

a few good mornings will fix a problem like that.

good mornings are used for a good reason (by top powerlifters)
you are basically training for chaos....any flop forward will be recoverd or STOPED exactly like a good morning.

Needsize i am not saying you have a weak core..,.,just in relation to the prime movers in the squat
 
A couple of inches lower than HeavyWears picture (it looks like parellel to me)

If I go lower than that aprx. 2 inches my knees feel like shit for a week.

I get Squater's Buttt too, but I didn't think that there was a corellation between the depth past parellel. Can't we just utilize a wider stance and allow the hips to do the work?
 
My form is normally a little more "on" than that, hitting a weight that i never squatted for reps really threw off my concentration. That being said, I dont think I have a weak core, especially not my lower back. I've deadlifted 550lbs for a set of 5 with no belt, I even used to do triples on good mornings with 405, so I know my lower back isnt a weak link
 
I have seen videos of your 500lb deadlift i believe...it might have been pictures....i cant remember.

anyway something isnt right. (maybe co-ordination with heavier weights)

have you attempted that weight again since?
 
endpoint said:
I have seen videos of your 500lb deadlift i believe...it might have been pictures....i cant remember.

anyway something isnt right. (maybe co-ordination with heavier weights)

have you attempted that weight again since?
Click to expand...

The 500 deadlift was a video for 9 reps, there is a pic somewhere of a 600lb raw single i did
I havent gone that heavy since, I've been sticking around 405 for sets of 8 as my back has been tender
 
endpoint said:


he was only losing form due to a weak core and maybe hamstrings.

If you are strong enough in all muscles involved you will have a nice form....at 10% and at 100% all across the board.

how ever weak core will make you flop over and you will have to rescue it.....dont put your self in that situation.

a few good mornings will fix a problem like that.

good mornings are used for a good reason (by top powerlifters)
you are basically training for chaos....any flop forward will be recoverd or STOPED exactly like a good morning.

Needsize i am not saying you have a weak core..,.,just in relation to the prime movers in the squat
Click to expand...


WTF are you talking about? Possible weak core and suggesting what Needsize should do?! You must be kidding!!! This guy is squatting 205 percent of his bodyweight for reps!! Bottom line is, I don't agree with anything you said.
 
louden_swain said:



WTF are you talking about? Possible weak core and suggesting what Needsize should do?! You must be kidding!!! This guy is squatting 205 percent of his bodyweight for reps!! Bottom line is, I don't agree with anything you said.
Click to expand...

This is an open disscusion.....i assumed i would be allowed to have an input.

you are a body builder and will always have a different opinion from me.

PS 2 times body weight for reps is nothing special.
 
louden_swain said:



WTF are you talking about? Possible weak core and suggesting what Needsize should do?! You must be kidding!!! This guy is squatting 205 percent of his bodyweight for reps!! Bottom line is, I don't agree with anything you said.
Click to expand...

i thought his response was reasonable. you didn't offer any reason as to why you don't agree. just because needsize is a huge and strong dude doesn't mean he will have perfect muscle balance. maybe if needsize reviewed his training, he might find that certain muscle groups are unbalanced and fixing such will results 10% as far as long term goals are concerned.
 
There is nothing wrong with the debate, but I definitely disagree that my back is weak area, it's actually disproportionally strong compared to the rest of me. Also, this is all based on one video, with a weight I'd never hit for reps before. The guy who taught me to squat has an 850+ competition squat, so I'm pretty confident in my form. And the bottom line is that for me its just about big legs, which these squats have definitely built for me
 
Needsize,

I think you and I have similar physical builds.

Do you have long legs, a short upper body, and long arms?

I tend to lean far forward when I squat especially when going deep. The only way I can keep my back straight is if I go slightly above parallel.
 
Actually I have short legs(30" inseam) with a long upper body and long arms.
Considering i dont use a belt, and I squat rock bottom, there is no way to avoid some lean, you physically cant squat that low without it. But I've tried it both ways over the years and my legs grow much more this way, so I'm fine with a little lean

Endpoint, i agree that a 2x bodyweight squat for reps is nothing special, but remember I dont train for strength at all, but have still done a 3x bodyweight dead, with no belts or straps. That in itself tells me my lower back isnt a weak link
 
needsize said:
There is nothing wrong with the debate, but I definitely disagree that my back is weak area, it's actually disproportionally strong compared to the rest of me. Also, this is all based on one video, with a weight I'd never hit for reps before. The guy who taught me to squat has an 850+ competition squat, so I'm pretty confident in my form. And the bottom line is that for me its just about big legs, which these squats have definitely built for me
Click to expand...

You core may not be weak....but you may not be using the muscles to full effect (due to timing etc).....which could be caused by an un farmiliar environments (ie a heavier weights that you may not be Quite ready for) so there for they are not performing at thier peak and they are "weak"
also the use of you core is different in deadlifts and squats....due to the centre of gravity.

The reason i asked if you have tried again since, was that your next few efforts could be better....and if your core muscles are as strong as you say (judging by your DL...yes they are) your form will pick up...as long as you know that the form in the video was not crash hot. and you make an effort to strengthen the core muscles whilst performing the lift.

I am aware that you are not training for strength (Even though you advocate 5x5 set rep schemes) But if your quads are 30" i am hoping they can shift weight.

once your back is refreshed video tape it again...im sure it will look a lot better
 
I'll throw up another video soon
I've dropped the weight and started doing really low reps, but I'm getting shooting pains in my lower back when I lock out on the squat; a recurring injury from when I was a teenager.
For what its worth, I did get a 550lb squat in competition when I was only 180lbs years ago, but the heavy stuff scares me more than anything else now
 
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