Specifics for First Cycle

[revolutionofthemind]

Ok, just looking for a little bit of clarification on some specifics for a first cycle, as there seems to be a lot of contradictory information.

Currently 198 at around 11-12% BF. Plan on reducing this more until I hit the single digits before starting the cycle. I am expecting approximately 4 weeks to the start. Diet is in order. After back surgery I hit 272, and you don't go from 272 to 198 without a diet in order.

31 year old Male, would like to hit about 220 with a bf percentage in the 7% area. At some point I may increase what I'm after, but at 5'11 that would be a damn nice start.

Intended First Cycle

Test P.
Tren A.
Proviron

Questions about this. There is a lot of disagreement about how much to alter the dosages when doing a stack like this. What would the appropriate dosages of each be for a first cycle and how much can taper them up over the course? How is 12 weeks for this first cycle? Should I run the Test P for a week or more before adding the tren and go with a longer cycle? Is the Proviron enough to keep estrogen side effects minimized or does it make sense to add some preventative adex? I've read that you should continue using the Proviron into your PCT, if this is the case, what else would be best for use with PCT? HCG? Nolva? Based on the combo you think is right for PCT how long would you run it?

Thank you in advance for helping with these remaining details that research can confuse more then inform.

 

[Greatercow]

I personally think that tren fo a first cycle is kinda harsh..

id go with test alone for 10 weeks with a nice little pct to see how you react to it as you will make very noticeable gains on test only .. or maybe test and anavar the last 4-5 weeks to give you that hard and ripped look

but hey thats my opinion

 

[sweed]

stick with test for a first cycle. with prop 8 weeks is good since it's a short acting ester. if it were enanthate I would go 12 weeks.
Great job on the weight loss so far! I am in that process right now and it's tough!
GL!

 

[gunnz]

Bro first cycle Test only. 10-12wks. See how your body reacts to it . Maybe throw in some D-Bol first 4wks!!!

 

[revolutionofthemind]

Ok, I am curious why people think tren is kinda harsh for a first cycle? Is this just because you are using two very strong AAS, the test and the tren together? With Test P. being a fast acting ester, what about using the Test P. alone for a few weeks to ensure you aren't getting any sides that are over the top and then adding the Tren in?

Here is why I am interested in the Tren: better nutrient partitioning - I have a very efficient metabolism meaning I can gain weight at 2800 cal/day - its muscle if I am working out hard otherwise I can add body fat easily too so I am hoping the tren would help with increasing appetite while keeping the nutrient partitioning favoring muscle. Also, I can tend to run a little bit high on the cortisol levels, so I was interested in tren from the standpoint of it binding to the glucocorticoid receptors. Tren's fat loss/hardening properties without aromatization. Last, because everyone raves about tren being the best AAS for overall changes in body composition and appearance. So many people say they will never run another cycle without it. So with this being said I curious as to why some think its too harsh for a first cycle?

Oh yeah and the thinking was that by using both Test P, and Tren A, being fast acting esters that either or both could be cut with rapid reduction in symptoms if problems develop which would seem to lessen the dangers of unwanted sides??

 

[sweed]

The reason for doing a test only first cycle is to see what,if any, sides you get. If you run both and get sides it will be hard to deturmine from which compoumd the side effect is coming from.
You have a very good explanation of why to use tren also and it shows you did proper research. I still say just test.

 

[GUARDIAN]

No Tren!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[revolutionofthemind]

Ok, so if the Tren is a bad idea what about the Proviron.? Can this be used effectively to block any estrogen side effects and promote the lipotrophic effects without being too harsh? So if you are going to add something to prevent estrogen related sides are you better off adding the proviron which is synergistic with the testosterone or something like adex which completely blocks estrogen?

 

[GUARDIAN]

Ok, so if the Tren is a bad idea what about the Proviron.? Can this be used effectively to block any estrogen side effects and promote the lipotrophic effects without being too harsh? So if you are going to add something to prevent estrogen related sides are you better off adding the proviron which is synergistic with the testosterone or something like adex which completely blocks estrogen?

nothing wrong with the proviron. u may still need some adex so have it on hand.

 

[revolutionofthemind]

At last I found out how to use the karma system which is way overdue for all those who have helped me out with great advice and information. Thank you to all those that take the time to respond.

 

[revolutionofthemind]

Would you recommend HCG during this cycle or after, or would it be overkill and not needed? Or is this something that is pretty much always a good idea. I know they have had the best luck in PCT with a combo of HCG, Nolva and Clomid; I am just wondering if a simple test/proviron cycle requires this much firepower?

 

[GUARDIAN]

Would you recommend HCG during this cycle or after, or would it be overkill and not needed? Or is this something that is pretty much always a good idea. I know they have had the best luck in PCT with a combo of HCG, Nolva and Clomid; I am just wondering if a simple test/proviron cycle requires this much firepower?

i think it would be an excellent idea. however the proviron may not combat the spikes in estrogen from the hcg. u would really need 2 keep an eye on signs and have the AI's ready.

 

[revolutionofthemind]

Ok so if a person happened to have some test p and some test e on hand what would be the right way to front load with the test p? Also running proviron? Assuming of course that said person has adex and letro on hand in case.

Something along these lines look fine?

12 Week Cycle
50mg Test P ED for the first 20 days
250 mg Test E twice per week
50mg Proviron daily.

Adex for PCT and if needed during cycle. Letro on hand only for emergencies.
Also does it make sense to switch back to the short esters for the last 20 days of the cycle so PCT can start faster after the end of the cycle?

 

[timtim]

Ok so if a person happened to have some test p and some test e on hand what would be the right way to front load with the test p? Also running proviron? Assuming of course that said person has adex and letro on hand in case.

Something along these lines look fine?

12 Week Cycle
50mg Test P ED for the first 20 days
250 mg Test E twice per week
50mg Proviron daily.

Adex for PCT and if needed during cycle. Letro on hand only for emergencies.
Also does it make sense to switch back to the short esters for the last 20 days of the cycle so PCT can start faster after the end of the cycle?

its your first run. no need to front load. see what happens with the test only. you could be heavily prone to sides.

 

[revolutionofthemind]

This essentially is a test only cycle. The Proviron only reduces the chances of sides. I know many people switch to short acting esters as they near the end of the cycle in order to start the PCT sooner. Is there an advantage in using a little of the test p at the beginning of the cycle as well? I know that front loading isn't "necessary", I'm trying to find out, since it would be on hand, if there is a good advantage in using at the start of the cycle as well as the end? I was just hoping that someone would look at the timing and dosage. I've done the research but there is also value in getting the input of experienced users, so I thought I would see what you guys think.

 

[revolutionofthemind]

I guess I should write it out like this? Does anyone start their cycles with botth a fast acting ester and a slow acting ester, test p and test e? How long before the end of the cycle should you switch from test e to test p so as to be able to start the PCT sooner. Would something like this work ok?


Test P 50mg ed for the first 20 days
Test E. 250 mg twice per week from start until 20 days before end of cycle
Proviron 50mg ED
Test P 75mg ED for the last 20 days

PCT 10 days from last inject
Adex
Sustain Alpha

Have letro on hand in case of emergencies. Since these are things that are available and this is intended to be a one cycle thing only I want to use what's available. So I am just asking if this is the best way to use these things. I think it is, but I would like some experienced users to confirm that I am not missing anything. Thank you in advance for your thoughts.

 

[thebadguy54]

I'd go with 500mg Test E EW for 10 weeks.

Get some HCG.

PCT and done.

Try the tren next time... if this one goes well.