Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below ive been working my shoulders once a week, but they just dont seem to grow. they arent sore the next day. i train with pretty hard intensity but i can only get the 65lbs dumbbells up by myself and i ttrain alone. i start with a warm up set, then off to 55,60, and last set is 65 @ 8 reps. then ill hit them witrh 3 sets of db lateral raises, then reverse flys, then 3 sets of behind the back smith machine shrugs, then upright rows, i even threw in 3 heavy sets of hammer strength shoulder press because i felt like i had alot more left in me. and sometimes arnold presses but again, the dumbbells get hard to clean and press up. i do shoulder press seated. that sounds like a lot of volume but i know i can hit up more weights. any suggestions? seated barbell instead of dmbbells?
Shoulder needs help
- Thread starter Nomak666
- Start date
Standing overhead BB presses FTW!!!
I never see anyone putting much effort into progressing with this tried and true lift. Maybe it is just my weak ass gym, but I think the problem might be bigger than that lol. Most guys bomb their shoulders with set after set of isolation lifts for shoulders. This has never worked for me.
I never see anyone putting much effort into progressing with this tried and true lift. Maybe it is just my weak ass gym, but I think the problem might be bigger than that lol. Most guys bomb their shoulders with set after set of isolation lifts for shoulders. This has never worked for me.
Delt are very small, especially when shoulders are usually considered a major bodypart, your delts are much smaller than your chest so I can never understand why people do the same amound of shit for their shoulders as for their chest and then expect them to grow? 
Delt are very small, especially when shoulders are usually considered a major bodypart, your delts are much smaller than your chest so I can never understand why people do the same amound of shit for their shoulders as for their chest and then expect them to grow?
well the chest is 1 big muscle correct? but i think the shoulder is in fact 3 muscles, so many people want to make sure they hit all 3 heads during a workout. so when working shoulders, i would give 3 working sets for rear delts but when i do chest, i do 4 exercises with 3 sets each, so that being said, am i really doing the same amount of shit for my shoulders that i do for chest?
seems like a standing over head barbell press with a little boost. i bet it works the core muscles awesome, i will try both the standing barbell press as well as the push press in 2 different workout, thanks guys.
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Big_BK
Guest
Bro to be honest 65's are not heavy. Jack the weight up and lower the reps. My shoulders grow pretty easy i don't do as much work for them as i should but shoulder press and lateral raises work wonders.
i agree, i dont think theyre too heavy but its hard swinging the weight up into position, for me it is. what do you think about the hammer strength shoulder press on bulking up the shoulders? i like free weights but its an option.
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Big_BK
Guest
I like the hammer strength machines the best. Get a spotter to help you get the weights up. I agree its not that easy to swing up. Try just cleaning them up and get them in position then sit in the seat. What i usually do is sit down with the DBs on both sides on me, bend over and just swing them up and blast them straight up, don't try to just get them up to your shoulders just sling them right up like your doing a rep right off the floor.
You have to learn to use your legs to raise the weight up to do it. I can get 110's up by myself by having them on my knees and lifting one leg at a time to get each one in position.
Hammer strength is a good machine for shoulders. I have switched over to that quite abit since both rotator cuffs are pretty blown out. I do about 6 sets of those and them hit the rear delt fly machine for light high rep 3-4 sets. Your shoulders more than likely will never get sore. Mine never have.
Make sure and stretch your shoulders and rotator cuffs before every workout. I never did for years and although I have got alot of size on me it restricted movement and finally injured them both and I am trying to lightly work through that now and its hell.
Yeah, i try my best to position myself a little in front of the seat and clean them up, then slowly sit, and push right up. ill try your way, seems like using that slight swing up for the first rep would hhelp instead of stopping, trhen pushing up. thanks bro. the hammer strengths are awesome. i love stacking plates!
You have to learn to use your legs to raise the weight up to do it. I can get 110's up by myself by having them on my knees and lifting one leg at a time to get each one in position.
Hammer strength is a good machine for shoulders. I have switched over to that quite abit since both rotator cuffs are pretty blown out. I do about 6 sets of those and them hit the rear delt fly machine for light high rep 3-4 sets. Your shoulders more than likely will never get sore. Mine never have.
Make sure and stretch your shoulders and rotator cuffs before every workout. I never did for years and although I have got alot of size on me it restricted movement and finally injured them both and I am trying to lightly work through that now and its hell.
i dont know if its my rotator cuff or not, but when i bring my arm back to do an arm circle, it feels like my shoulders grinding. i warm up the shoulders with arm circles and then 3 sets of lateral raises before hitting the shoulder press. Also seems like you got the genetics bro, lol. your traps got quite some size to them dude.
viciousness
New member
so true, standing, power lifting style with a barbell 135 is some shit u will be so sore. even if you have to kinda of jerk or clean it up that wil have your delts feeling like a hibachi grill, bet
wills_got_rythm
Banned
Thats what I was gonna say. Try heavier weight and lower reps with fewer moves. I have always done at the most 3 moves: military press with barbell, lateral raisis and front raises and shoulders grow pretty good.
There is nothing wrong what so ever with seated presses. Its kinda hard to cheat a seated shoulder press unless they are not doing using full motion.
Blane
New member
yes. i see people doing seated. but their buts are off the seat. lol///their backs are pressing against the backrest...lol...they arent sitting......
Why not strenghten the stabalizers as well? why not work core? standing is the way to go. oh the bullshit of "my lower back hurts when doing standing" ...Or "i dont want to injure my back"..
Please explain how it is a good idea to have weight over your head, with your spine being pressed against a hard surface?
its simply another excuse to load up weight for ego.
artificialaspirations
New member
seated is much easier because it often turns into an extreme incline press = more chest involvement.
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Big_BK
Guest
I have a new saying i thought of the other day: There is no such thing as a "bad" back, Just a weak one.
Im sick and tired of hearing oh i have a bad back, i have a bad shoulder, boo hoo cry me a river. I workout with a guy who has 8 titanium anchors in his arm because he completely tore his RC. He still does shoulders as heavy as he possibly can. He also broke his back years ago and had to have surgery on that. Still trains back and has one of the best backs i've seen.
Im sick and tired of hearing oh i have a bad back, i have a bad shoulder, boo hoo cry me a river. I workout with a guy who has 8 titanium anchors in his arm because he completely tore his RC. He still does shoulders as heavy as he possibly can. He also broke his back years ago and had to have surgery on that. Still trains back and has one of the best backs i've seen.
I dont know about you but I think that involving the shoulders less and putting the effort on the chest instead is not a good thing for my main mass builder on shoulder day...
Blane
New member
I think he was adding to the idea that the reason peeps use the seated press is to go heavier but use the chest more instead of the shoulders.
Lets assume its better to lift heavier. i would rather bump a little with the legs and press with shoulders(standing barbell press). instead of pressing press against a backrest, shooting the hips away from the movement and turn it into a chest exercise.
IMO
artificialaspirations
New member
precisely. Seated is good for egos. Standing military or push-press is good for everything else.
herniated disks are real.
herniated disks are real. My brother does a lot of surgeries to insert a spinal cord stimulator. Those ppl's backs are messed up.
cobracock1979
Member
Push press - its kinda like havin a spotter so you can use ure legs when failing at the end and work to comlete faliur
OneBreath
Elite Mentor
I'll take this the pussy route.
I used to have your same problem. I would destroy my shoulders with volume hitting them from every direction (stimulating all 3 heads just like in Mens Health) and while i would feel exhausted leaving the gym, my delts would not be sore the next day and they would not grow.
I fixed this by using only 1 movement and doing it 2 times per week. Get ready, the movement is the seated military in the smythe machine. Yes, feel the power!
Ok, for real. Get in there, put on a weight you can "normally" do for 10 reps. Then grab the bar WIDE. I'm 6'4" and my hands are actually pressing against the sides of the bar, the widest i can get them. Then do SLOW reps. Don't lock out at the top and don't go below your mouth at that bottom. Mentally feel the delts working as you slowly let down that negative then slowly squeeze those delts to push the bar back up (don't lock out! constant tension)
If you picked the right weight you will hit failure at about 8 reps. Rest only 30 seconds, do another set to failure, rest only 30 seconds, do another set to failure. And i mean FAILURE.
Record the weight and # of reps you got on all 3 sets. Once you can get 12 reps on the first set, 8 on the second, and 5 on the third, (with the correct form!) up the weight by 10 lbs.
Again, do this twice a week and keep trying to beat your numbers from the previous time. I would be SHOCKED if you didn't start seeing those delts sprout, and all 3 heads at that!
After 6 weeks of this you can then move on to the push press like these guys are talking about (i actually like a hang clean and press). You will by then have learned to use those delts properly and be ready to take on this big movement.
I used to have your same problem. I would destroy my shoulders with volume hitting them from every direction (stimulating all 3 heads just like in Mens Health) and while i would feel exhausted leaving the gym, my delts would not be sore the next day and they would not grow.
I fixed this by using only 1 movement and doing it 2 times per week. Get ready, the movement is the seated military in the smythe machine. Yes, feel the power!
Ok, for real. Get in there, put on a weight you can "normally" do for 10 reps. Then grab the bar WIDE. I'm 6'4" and my hands are actually pressing against the sides of the bar, the widest i can get them. Then do SLOW reps. Don't lock out at the top and don't go below your mouth at that bottom. Mentally feel the delts working as you slowly let down that negative then slowly squeeze those delts to push the bar back up (don't lock out! constant tension)
If you picked the right weight you will hit failure at about 8 reps. Rest only 30 seconds, do another set to failure, rest only 30 seconds, do another set to failure. And i mean FAILURE.
Record the weight and # of reps you got on all 3 sets. Once you can get 12 reps on the first set, 8 on the second, and 5 on the third, (with the correct form!) up the weight by 10 lbs.
Again, do this twice a week and keep trying to beat your numbers from the previous time. I would be SHOCKED if you didn't start seeing those delts sprout, and all 3 heads at that!
After 6 weeks of this you can then move on to the push press like these guys are talking about (i actually like a hang clean and press). You will by then have learned to use those delts properly and be ready to take on this big movement.
cobracock1979
Member
Good work OB, so you think just the one movement will stimulate all 3 heads? its my desire to do only upright rows and push press twice a week to faliur.
I have not tried this yet as I have doubted this would give me the growth I want...
I have not tried this yet as I have doubted this would give me the growth I want...
Then you dont know what a bad back is. I have what they call a bad back. Do I still train heavy? Yes. I deadlift heavy, squat heavy and all. But its not really those that will hurt my back. I may reach down for my coffee or gym bag the wrong way and be out for weeks. Pinched nerves in the back are no joke and will make the biggest and strongest mofos lay down. Until you experience something like that you can say much. Shoulders as well, I have bad shoulders and rubbing rotator cuffs. Are my shoulders weak? I dont think so, the last set of DB shoulder presses I did were with 130's. And these are slow deep controlled reps, not some half ass monkey reps. I havent been able to do shoulders in weeks because they have been acting up.
Its easy to sit and laugh at someones injuries until you get a good dose of it yourself.
OneBreath
Elite Mentor
I was kind of joking on the all 3 heads thing (since you see that in muscle mags). If there is constant tension and he's using slow controlled negatives and goes to failure 3 times in about 3 minutes, then every fiber up in that region is going to get recruited lol.
Its definitely not a long term deal but rather a "get to know my delts" period.
In my DC training i started with just 3 movements and now am back to 2 (upright row and press). I think that essentially its all about giving max effort but in a way that the delts are taking the brunt. Thus the slow controlled movements facilitating the mind muscle connection.
Isee so many people neglect their rear delts...it's one third of the shoulder lol
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