Question about exercise selection on Matt Reynolds DFHT

[SDHW]

I have really looking into the loading and unloading weeks of this program, just to get a good understanding, and so I can implement it right.

I have been reading example of, 3wks loading/overreaching, and 1 wk unloading (where volume and intensity is cut). Then you repeat.

but then i was reading that if you go 3wks loading, and 1wk unloading, the following 3 wks, should be less volume, and high intensity, and this is the time to make new PR's???

I thought it just went balls to the wall for 3 wks, take a break for a wk, and repeat.

am I missing something?

if anyone can explain that would help

 

[Madcow2]

The problem is that if you have shitty recovery (relative to the poundages you lift) and can't progress without taking extra days off here & there, or have to deload every few weeks to keep things rolling, then you end up with pretty much the same total number of workouts in a set time period that someone doing a m/w/f split would get in.

Although that seems to happen a good bit, it honestly should not be true. If, and this is a big IF, people dial in the workload to their tolerances correctly they shouldn't be bombing or struggling left and right trying to get enough recovery to make it through a program that is simply too much for them. The difference in the recovery/decay rate should be more than enough for someone at any level regardless of ability to recover to wind up with significantly higher average workload than a linear program. Now the required disclaimer to avoid the 14 year old kid with bowflex stepping in shit, work is a means to an end and not an end in itself so if people can keep fatigue low enough to run linearly for long periods and make constant gains, they should.

But most of the people blowing this or struggling are simply saddled with an inappropriate program that they are trying to make it though (probably a cookie cutter) and generally seem to be new to this type of organization in general - I'd imagine it's uncoached rec lifters much like this board who are just trying this stuff out and trying to get a feel. Hopefully they learn and scale accordingly. But really, someone experienced or under good coaching will get this dialed in very quickly - there's still some art and judgement to it but it's not hard. Actually some of Glenn Pendlay's research is specificly tied to hormonal fluctuations in training. I haven't read it but there is more out there (I think his friend Mike Hartman presented some info on the same topic a while back) and the jist of it is to arrive at a more accurate appraisal of the condition of the athlete in this circumstance than just pure judgement and feel. Pretty cool stuff actually and those involved seem to believe it is very promising and works well.

 

[Protobuilder]

I thought it just went balls to the wall for 3 wks, take a break for a wk, and repeat.

am I missing something?

Yes. It's called DUAL FACTOR hypertrophy training for a reason. I'd suggest reading up on "dual factor" theory. There should be some writing on Madcow's site (check the training vault sticky). Long story short, the dual factor approach looks at fitness and fatigue as two separate elements. You build fitness and fatigue at the same time through the first 4 weeks of the program (or however long it designates). Then, you back off and go into a "peaking" or "intensity" phase, where you cut volume and allow the fatigue to dissipate. This allows you to 'express' or demonstrate the newfound strength you've built during the build-up/volume phase. IOW, while you're pushing yourself really hard for several weeks, you're building fitness but you're fatigued as well so you can't really "demonstrate" your new strength. Then, you take it easy, go into a peaking phase, and the fatigue goes away and boom, your strength goes up. It's a pretty basic peaking strategy that many athletic training programs seem to use (e.g., S&C, oly trainers).

In sum: work hard, get tired, take a break, show off your new strength.

 

[SDHW]

Yes. It's called DUAL FACTOR hypertrophy training for a reason. I'd suggest reading up on "dual factor" theory. There should be some writing on Madcow's site (check the training vault sticky). Long story short, the dual factor approach looks at fitness and fatigue as two separate elements. You build fitness and fatigue at the same time through the first 4 weeks of the program (or however long it designates). Then, you back off and go into a "peaking" or "intensity" phase, where you cut volume and allow the fatigue to dissipate. This allows you to 'express' or demonstrate the newfound strength you've built during the build-up/volume phase. IOW, while you're pushing yourself really hard for several weeks, you're building fitness but you're fatigued as well so you can't really "demonstrate" your new strength. Then, you take it easy, go into a peaking phase, and the fatigue goes away and boom, your strength goes up. It's a pretty basic peaking strategy that many athletic training programs seem to use (e.g., S&C, oly trainers). In sum: work hard, get tired, take a break, show off your new strength.

I understand the DUAL FACTOR part, if you re read what you wrote, and read my question, you are re-stating what i was saying....

Its kinda what I said right... "balls to the wall" aka loading, then cut volume ie: break/unloading. and the repeat.

BUT...I have read, that some people load for x weeks, then unload for x wks, and then for the next x weeks, they use high intensity, but keep volume still low. to set new PR's. then you can start back over again.

so let me give some examples just to make sure its clear.

Example 1
Load for 3 weeks, unload for 1 week, and repeat
here we load or build up for 3 weeks, volume and intensity is high, then we back off both intensity and volume for a week to allow recovery.

Example 2
Load for 3 weeks; unload for 1 week, high intensity, low volume for 3 weeks, repeat
here we load up for 3 weeks, volume and intensity is high, then we back off both intensity and volume to allow recovery, then we go into a high intensity, low volume to set net PR's where you can demonstrate your new strength.

So which one is correct, i have read both....

 

[Madcow2]

There are multiple applications. It also needn't be 3 weeks. This comes mainly from the difference in decay factors between fitness and fatigue being 3:1. Shit, if you raise the volume enough even 1 week will drop you, lower it down and maybe you last for 6 weeks. It's not set in stone, the idea is just that workload is higher than would be tolerable infinitely (i.e. fatigue accrual) and then obviously followed by some period of lower work (fatigue disipation). Now maybe this is for enough recovery to get back and pound again ASAP, maybe it's for a big peak and a competition further out. Maybe intensity would be high and scaling while workload was low, or maybe everything would drop. Depends on what you need and what the goal is. This is a pretty good read to get the mind going on the possibilities: http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/48-post3.html

Generally when you talk about heavy loading or peak loading - most people won't be handling 3 weeks of it. The way I generally tell people to set up the 5x5 entails maybe 1 week of heavier loading with most being more moderate but still somewhat fatiguing.

Also, if you are using the DFHT word doc from my site - there's a scaled down version floating around somewhere. Just do a search. The one in the word doc is really quite a bit of volume especially if you don't know what you are doing and have never done anything like this before.

 

[BiggT]

They're both correct.....it depends on the trainee and what they are trying to accomplish....the first doesn't allow much time to peak and show off the new strength, but it good for building more strength by going into another volume phase....the second allows a time for hitting big PRs and really peaking strength.

You can load for 2 weeks, unload for 1, load again for 2......it is kind of like a set, you define how long a set is b yhow many reps you choose to do.

 

[BiggT]

I didnt see madcows post, or I wouldn't have bothered.....his is the more detailed post.....but basically there is no right "way" to do this

 

[fortunatesun]

The advantage of lowering volume and upping weight lies in it's effect on the central nervous system- CNS. Asking it to handle a heavier workload shocks it into an acclimation process: it learns what must be done in order to facilitate the lifting of poundage heavier than you have been using, setting the stage for further increases in strength. This idea is more popular with powerlifters as they are primarily interested in increasing their maximum lift.
For bodybuilders it lacks some of the immediate feedback of repetition training which is intended to induce hypertrophy. On the plus side, being able to lift heavier will in turn make you larger, not to mention it's just more fun to be able to put more plates on the bar. So the overall idea then is one serves as a synergist to the other.
As madcow pointed out, this isn't to be looked at as some sort of directive from on high. Your goals and individual physiological response need to be factored in. The more gradual increase of your first example might prove more useful. You can also run a program that cycles 2:1 or one that goes 4-5 months one way then a solid run at the other for 4-8 weeks before returning to the first way.

 

[blut wump]

The dual factor part is simply the loading and deloading.

If you move onto higher intensity / lower-volume workouts after your deload then you can think of it as dual-factor-dual-phase. The dual factor part being loading and deloading. The dual phase being low intensity with high volume then low volume with high intensity. You can get loaded on high intensity low volume workouts.

As BiggT mentioned, there's nothing wrong with sticking with high volume phases and just running load-deload-load-deload. Eventually, you'll likely need to take a break and have an extended deload which is usually a good time to move over to high intensity for a while.

Note that the deloading phases typically don't deload you fully, just enough to dive back in again. Most functioning athletes carry fatigue around with them most of the time. To make a full deload can take around a month from what I've read.

 

[SDHW]

Thanks for all the advice, I have a better under standing, I think im gonna sitck with 3 weeks load, and 1 week unload, just to make it nice 4 week/month blocks, I will adjust as needed. I like the idea of the planned unloading, as I tend to just go balls to the wall all the time. And I think it can be counter productive at times.

I think im gonna stick with Matt’s DFHT 4 day program for a 6months or so, and maybe change up to the 5x5, I do like how the Matt’s program includes some of the 5x5. so it should be a good run. And his new version has a good amount of volume

Just to give a heads up on my goals, and i might start a journal, Im 25, 6ft tall, and looking to get back on the football field. I play at the semi-pro level, and have been out for 2 yrs, due to knee injures. etc. I still have the itch to play, and im sure i always will. so I have from now to June of 07, I have been lifting since I was 12yrs, old, and started out as a powerlifter, and then due to injures, I slowly maid my way to somewhat bodybuilding, I figured if I couldn’t play, I should at least look good, but its time to step away from all that fluff stuff, and go back to the basics. I was 275 at my highest point, and I feel that was just too heavy, and im sure I wouldn’t be an effective linebacker at 275lbs..lol.
im 255lbs now, im about 18% bf, so I would like to get around the 240-250lbs at 10%, but also make sure my 40yrd speed is back to 4.6..
so I want to add some strength, and lean muscle, but also make the transition in the explosive/ power work.