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Please help a noob - How often to lift?

Nice link guinness!!

I agree that controled overtraining is great sometimes. My only problem is that for a person new to lifting, its not good to get into an overtraining routine right from the start. They won't know when to back off/rest and overtraining is not a fun thing to go through.
 
I agree. I was responding specifically to your comments. There's a thread started by Steve the Bluesman that has some good beginner info in it that the original poster may find valuable. Worth looking for...
 
I'll chime in to by saying that you can train muscles 3x per week without AAS and without undue doms. If you are new to lifting then capacity for gym work will be very low. Not only can muscles be worked 3x per week but I think that they should.

If you're new to lifting then you doesn't have the conditioning or work capacity to benefit from split training unless you spend a lot of time working little muscles which would, of course, be pointless for a newbie to do.

When I started and whenever I've come back to the gym from a long layoff I always start again with a full-body 3x per week regimen. Depending on the length of the layoff, I've run this anywhere from one month to three months. I wouldn't put someone onto splits until after their first three months. There's just no point.

Just keep it simple: two sets per exercise at around six reps. After a month or two switch up the reps for some high and low reps, maybe a set at five and another at 9. Keep the rest time between sets and exercises reasonably low to help with conditioning and the whole workout should be made to fit into 45-60 minutes.

I usually placed a little more emphasis on chest and triceps on Monday, legs on Wednesday and back on Friday. I also used to switch up grip for bench. Use the compound movements since they give best bang for the buck. Bench, rowing, OHP, squats. Use DB and barbell variants and you can make the three days sufficiently different that you don't even think about the workouts getting stale.

I've run it for more than a couple of decades and it piles the muscle back onto me just as it piled the muscle on when I started. No drugs required just food and rest. Thankfully I've not needed it for the last two and half years.

You could also take a look at the single-factor version of the madcow 5x5
 
Micker said:
There is no way in hell you can train a muscle hard 3x a week and not overtrain. A muscle should be trained HARD no more then once per week. Now don't listen to the people who are on more drugs then Jimi Hendrix, like the ones you see in the magazines.

It pisses me off when they show the split routine, 6 day a week workouts that these pro freaks do. New people to the sport of bodybuilding/powerlifting read these routines and think they are the way to go. Without drugs, your body just can't rebuild fast enough. Overtraining is VERY real and it can wreck havoc on your body AND mind. Depression, fatigue, weakness, trouble sleeping etc.. Don't go that route. I suffered from overtraining and I really thought I was sick. Once I cut way back working out, everything got much better and my gains started coming back.

If you are new to lifting, I would say 3x a week, for no more then 1 1/2 hour, working different muscles each time is the most you should do. You can do Biceps/Triceps day one, Chest/Shoulders day two, Legs/Back day 3 for instance. Take a day off in between each workout, and 2 days after the 3rd. You can tell if you can do more or less then that, but you will need to fine tune it by the way you feel. If start feeling tired and your gains start DEcreasing, take more time in between workouts. I personally take 2 days in between my workouts and have made better gains then with 1 day.

I also am WAY against doing a full body workout each time. There is no way you can workout everybody part properly without running out of gas and training too long. Studies have shown that after 50 mins into a workout, your test production hits a peak and starts to fall dramatically after that. So one hour or a bit more is all you should do per workout.

The BIG KEY to success is 4 things.
1. Consistancy- Stick with it, don't look at lifting like another hobby, look at it like a job.

2. Intensity- Ever see a guy who works out all the time, but still looks like a stick or just the oppisite?? They train with low intensity for too long. They don't challenge themselves with heavier weights. They quit a set when they reach some number like 10, when they still have 2 good reps they could churn out. They sit in the gym doing a full body workout for 2+ hours. You have seen these people, and they always wonder why they don't get bigger.

3., Rest- Remember you don't build muscle while working out, you build it in the rest period between workouts. The pump you get working out makes you feel like you are building muscle right then and there, but thats just blood filling up your muscles. Your body needs a break to repair itself.

4.Proper Nutrition- This is the brick used to build the muscles. You can't build a house without enough bricks and you can't build muscle without enough protein/carbs/fat. You would be suprised how little protein some people take in who workout. Make eating a priority, its just as important as your workout.


you are clueless
 
you are clueless

What is clueless about what I said?? I know my body and I know what works for ME. I know what worked for me when I started and I pass that on to others. I have helped many others start good workout routines and they fine tune them once they learn their bodies. I have yet to see a full body workout(arms/legs/back/tirs/chest etc.) work for anyone. It will get you in shape, but you aren't going to get huge with that. I was replying to a NEW bodybuilder who has no base of muscle, no idea what to expect from his body and no feeling for when he is overtraining. I assume you are clueless or you would have backed up your insult with some facts.

The thing with bodybuilding is that EVERY person responds differently to different routines. I don't think I know 2 people who do the same routine. Another problem is that peoples bodies recover quicker between sets and between workouts. Some people can do a set and start a new set one minute later with little loss in performance, others need 3+mins or they can't perform the next set. Some people can train everyday and be fine, others need a couple days between workouts to avoid overtraining. Some people need to do cardio, others will never see a pound of muscle if they do any cardio. Then of course you have people who use steroids and their workouts should not even be seen by others who try to copy them without the use of AS.
 
AlwaysOn said:
you are clueless

dude, I used to be like you

If you think someone is wrong, explain yourself. Or are you not smart enough to use your words? Maybe you are just a troll.

Anyway, I just wanted to let y'all know, I have been pleasantly surprised that we HAVE been making progress, even though we have only been lifting 1 time a week, fully body.

My lifting partner and I have been using protein shakes (about 4 scoops a day), creatine monohydrate, and multi-vitamins. I also just started about a week ago using White Blood, BCAA, and ZMA.

So far in the 5 weeks we have been lifting, my 1 rep bench max has gone from 225 (first time we lifted together) to 275 (just yesterday). My partner's max went from 115 to 135.

So we ARE making progress, I just don't know if it is as fast as it should be. I am making faster progress than my partner but he is a skinny type guy while I am pretty thick and I was strong back in high school (7 years ago). He is in high school right now and is 17, lol.

So, I am wondering, if we are making progress now, would we make faster progress if we hit each group 2x a week instead of 1x?
 
Newbies or people fresh off of layoffs will grow and improve from damn near anything. You will almost certainly improve at a faster pace with another workout thrown in.

Could you list your current workout? That would be a helpful tidbit of info :)
 
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Today I gave my friend who'd been asking me for a good routine a copy of the beginner 5 x 5. He currently does a pretty typical 1 bodypart/week workout...he's about my height and weighs 160 or so.

For example he has a shoulder day where he does seated behind the neck press, arnold presses, side raises and front raises. And I think he'll do seated db press sometimes too.

So anyway you should've seen his face when he saw squat 3 x week. I know where he's coming from, I had to do a serious about face to break away from the routines you see in the magazines.

So we'll see if he does it or not; I told him to tuck it away and when he feels like he's plateaued or dissatisifed with his current split to give it a try.
 
Micker said:
What is clueless about what I said?? I know my body and I know what works for ME. I know what worked for me when I started and I pass that on to others. I have helped many others start good workout routines and they fine tune them once they learn their bodies. I have yet to see a full body workout(arms/legs/back/tirs/chest etc.) work for anyone. It will get you in shape, but you aren't going to get huge with that. I was replying to a NEW bodybuilder who has no base of muscle, no idea what to expect from his body and no feeling for when he is overtraining. I assume you are clueless or you would have backed up your insult with some facts.

The thing with bodybuilding is that EVERY person responds differently to different routines. I don't think I know 2 people who do the same routine. Another problem is that peoples bodies recover quicker between sets and between workouts. Some people can do a set and start a new set one minute later with little loss in performance, others need 3+mins or they can't perform the next set. Some people can train everyday and be fine, others need a couple days between workouts to avoid overtraining. Some people need to do cardio, others will never see a pound of muscle if they do any cardio. Then of course you have people who use steroids and their workouts should not even be seen by others who try to copy them without the use of AS.

Read this:

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4627437&postcount=133
 
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