Pendlay Row Non-Question :)

[Kabeetz]

Some guy came up to me todya while I was doing pendlay rows and he's like "I'm not one to give advice but you're gonna destroy your back like that. you're not supposed to do it like that, you're supposed to do it like this (and he goes on to show a standard barbell row). Not supposed to let the weight tough the floor."

So I'm like "well I'm doing Pendlay Rows and you're supposed to bend at 90 degrees deload the weight to the floor with every rep."

And he replies "I've never heard of those but still your back looks like its gonna pop out because you're like bringing the barbell up and around your knees."

So... the possibility exists I am doing some really shitty pendlay rows, or my feet are too close to the barbell, OR he just thinks a row performed a way he hasn't seen before is dangerous and wrong.

I tried to use my cell to video tape myself doing some reps but the recording length on my phone isn't enough to get from it to plant and properly execute. I've been watching youtube clips and I feel like what I am doing is not disimilar from what I see (although I do bend at the knee more than some).

This went from a question to a non-question. I dunno. If you have any thoughts or tips related to improving, or executing correct, pendlay row form I'd be eager to hear them.

 

[Tweakle]

I'm going to go out on a limb here, but there's a strong possibility he's a typical gym-douche who has been training for years and still struggles to bench 2 plates?

tape yourself, you'll get much better feedback here than you'll ever get from some jack-ass in the gym who feels the need to tell people they're 'doing it wrong' to boost their own ego (trust me, no matter how big you get or how much weight is on the bar there is always one jumped up little prick who'll feel the need to correct you)

 

[H_T_]

i've got mixed feelings on these...

 

[Kabeetz]

I'm going to go out on a limb here, but there's a strong possibility he's a typical gym-douche who has been training for years and still struggles to bench 2 plates?

tape yourself, you'll get much better feedback here than you'll ever get from some jack-ass in the gym who feels the need to tell people they're 'doing it wrong' to boost their own ego (trust me, no matter how big you get or how much weight is on the bar there is always one jumped up little prick who'll feel the need to correct you)

That is my inclination too, but I grew up with poor posture and you never know. I'm gonna have to get somebody to tape me when my pink leotard is back from the cleaners.

 

[Cynical Simian]

I'm going to go out on a limb here, but there's a strong possibility he's a typical gym-douche who has been training for years and still struggles to bench 2 plates?

+1

Honestly, you probably don't even need to bother taping it. The guy sounds like a complete fucktard; Pendlay rows are supposed to involve the lumbars for stabilization, unlike your typical polite upright row. Adjust your amount of knee bend and foot placement so you can pull straight up without your knees getting in the way. Beyond that, Pendlay rows are pretty hard to cause an injury with or do "wrong" as long as you make a reasonable effort not to bring your back up too much.

Next time he (or someone other gym asshat) tries to give you advice, throw out a test along the lines of "Gee, thanks a lot, man. I have a question you might be able to help me with: are deep squats bad for your knees/deadlifts bad for your back?" If he answers 'yes' without qualifying it, you know you can safely ignore his advice about anything other than what bandanna would look best with your Under Armour.

 

[H_T_]

are you using too much weight? where are you pulling the bar to?

 

[Kabeetz]

I pull the bar to my upper abs, about an inch below the pectorals...

Am I using too much weight? When I go for a PR set form diminishes slightly, I can't front, but at the point where he interjected I had done 120x5 then 140x5, nothing I can't handle.

On the rare occasion where I jerk up and severely break that 90 degree plane I consider it a fail, I definitely don't cheat to make fake progress.

 

[Kabeetz]

Next time he (or someone other gym asshat) tries to give you advice, throw out a test along the lines of "Gee, thanks a lot, man. I have a question you might be able to help me with: are deep squats bad for your knees/deadlifts bad for your back?" If he answers 'yes' without qualifying it, you know you can safely ignore his advice about anything other than what bandanna would look best with your Under Armour.

He was doing banded box squats earlier and while I was rowing he was doing dead singles for 405, so he is not a clown.. but again he had never heard of or seen pendlay rows, so I took it with a grain of salt but a real big grain.

 

[thesuaveone]

Tell him you read about them in an edition of M&F. He'll back down then.

 

[atp1000]

What you consider cheating, is probably normal. For instance, Madcow posted the following on this subject:

So anyway, you tend to pull back a bit with heavy weight anyway and that is how rows should be done heavy and explosive. You should be accelerating that bar into your body. So someone starting at 90 degrees generally ends up cheating back just a bit and that's okay.

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php?t=366601

 

[H_T_]

He was doing banded box squats earlier and while I was rowing he was doing dead singles for 405, so he is not a clown.. but again he had never heard of or seen pendlay rows, so I took it with a grain of salt but a real big grain.

....for me, it always helped to have a little swing in my rows. i do them on a platform, cuz the weight would bang off of the floor and disrupt my rythym. that being said, once i get near 245-275, i do Starr/Pendlay rows. because there isn't need for rythym when doing 5 very deliberate reps. don't mind what that guy said. you could give him the example of pausing at the bottom of a bench or squat and ask him how bad that is? which it's not, it's the bouncing off of the sternum & dropping down quick and bouncing out of the hole which is bad...

 

[Kabeetz]

You guys rule. Thanks for the great info.

 

[Protobuilder]

People think everything will "ruin" your lower back. No. it won't. Not if you're trained for the movement and not getting completely stupid. You can condition your lower back to take a TON of work. AND it can even take ballistic movement!! Shock. Awe.

I'd be curious to know how much that guy rows. I wouldn't automatically write him off as an idiot, but an explosive bent row is recommended by a lot of S&C guys who know their shit. And we're talking 300, 400 pounds being rowed by these guys. . . .

 

[al420]

I just tell people they are an 'assistance' lift, just like jump shrugs (which I get looks on every single time, and loads of questions). If they ask for what I tell them I am a professional Ping Pong player.

 

[Crox]

Same thing has happened to me twice this month, its starting to piss me off. Its something about Pendlay rows, like moths to a flame.

Should be a big sign on the gym wall saying "Dont give advice to guys lifting alot more than you."

 

[thesuaveone]

It's at this time that I usually turn up my Ipod and ignore them. I am not their trainer, nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

 

[Protobuilder]

Bent rows are right up there w/ deadlifts and anything behind the neck.

"You'll need a wheelchair and/or die immediately if you do that stuff!!! I read that somewhere."

Add in a bit of heft and some heavy weight on rows and people will shit their pants. Same way when BiggT walks out of the rack w/ 275+ on his back like he's squatting, and then locks it out overhead.

People are conditioned to believe their discs will explode with any kind of load applied. I'd say bent rows are one of the RAREST exercises in a gym. But they're in most of the old routines.

 

[H_T_]

and that why 90% of guys are built like a kite.