ok guys need some help!

[raze]

need some help guys any input would be GREATLY appreciated, this is for a friend of mine who wishes to cut up (lucky me i have really only done research on bulking ), his natural metabolism is average and as a result is carrying a lill extra flab around his body. he wishes only to tone up and loose the fat around the guts, would someone be so kind as to post a sample 6 meals a day diet. i was thinking meals consisting of around 40% protein 30% carbs 30% fat.

from what i have read cardio in the morning is the best for removing that flab from around your body but my friend starts work too early, would it be ok to do cardio in the evening around 2 hours after your last meal so your body is burning the fat and not the food?

he is currently doing a weights only program how should he work in a cardio sessions?

mon - cardio
tue - weights
wed - cardio
thurs - weights
fri- cardio

or

mon - weights/cardio
tue - weights/cardio
wed - weights/cardio
thurs - weights/cardio
fri- weights/cardio

so in dot form heres what im asking guys

- sample diet
- how to work the cardio into his usual routine to cut up
- general advice on cutting fat (maybe some good fat loss supplements?)
- a nice range of reps for more strength training


haha i have even got a pic of him http://www.teamizm.net/jim/Pics/kskinheadliketrav.JPG

thanks guys really appreciate any advice!

 

[Madcow2]

Training itself can be the same regardless of goal. You cutting or bulking is all diet for the most part.

Why not check out these pictures and read through his posts over the next couple of pages to see how he worked these things. To be honest though this is probably more of a diet forum thing but that stuff tends to be pretty basic IMO. http://www.midwestbarbell.com/totalelite/index.php?showtopic=1110

 

[Jim Ouini]

Training itself can be the same regardless of goal. You cutting or bulking is all diet for the most part.

Actually I've been wondering about this for awhile now. Let's say diet is the same and I'm in caloric deficit (for cutting) and I have 3 different training methods. For this discussion, assume the methods are all progressive using compound movements

Method 1 - low intensity/high rep (60%/15-20)
Method 2 - moderate intensity/moderate rep (80%/8-12)
Method 3 - high intensity/low rep (90%/1-5)

After, say, 8 weeks of training, what kind of adapation would I incur? The 'books' would say Method 1 is endurance, Method 2 is hypertrophy, Method 3 is strength, generally speaking (although I know from personal experience with 5 x 5 that I can grow in 5 rep range. Siff also mentions this in his Facts and Fallicies book).

So I won't be growing per se, due to diet. But would I 'look' any different, between the 3 methods i.e, you can cut as long as you're in deficit, but is there no 'optimal' training method for cutting? Is it as simple as determining which one burns the most calories per workout?

Addendum: now that it got me thinking, I looked up what Bompa says in 'Serious Strength' in his 'Muscle Defiinition' phase (with the caloric deficit) that

to eliminate fat....the number of repetitions per muscle group and per workout must be drastically but progressively increased. It is equally important to perform the program in a non-stop fashion - to perform hundreds of reps per muscle group per workout

So this is basically high rep/low intensity circuit training (sounds like something I'd read in Shape magazine )

 

[tay1506]

He really doesent even have to do cardio just has to make sure he keeps his bpm high. Cut calories by about 500 from what he regularly eats. Dont eat sweets. Do high reps with low resting period.

 

[Madcow2]

Actually I've been wondering about this for awhile now. Let's say diet is the same and I'm in caloric deficit (for cutting) and I have 3 different training methods. For this discussion, assume the methods are all progressive using compound movements

Simple answer is this - if you are looking to use your resistance training sessions in order to burn more calories and give you a psuedo-cardio effect, that's a serious dumbass way of doing things .

The stimuli are almost polar opposites (i.e. look at the marathon runner vs. weightlifter) and you will compromise your results on both ends. Manage caloric balance by controlling the amount of calories you take in.

If you are looking to do cardio, this is why HIIT or a decent sprinting program makes a good fit for the weightlifter. The cardio stimulus is a lot closer to the realm of weight training (higher intensity bursts over a period). But consider, sprinting is not a heavy set of 5 or 8 steps - you might lose some speed the further you run but you can keep running for quite a while. So it is infinitely closer to weightlifting than 30 minutes at low intensity plodding constant pace but still not in the same ballpark.

As to how different you will look doing each of those perscriptions - it depends on your past experience and goals. Look is muscle and caloric intake balance and your genetics (whether that be structure or base metabolism). Which is the better fit for you at the time. I think higher rep training is pretty shoddy, can't remember the last time I went to 10 and doubt I can count that high. That said, you take someone who has been doing a lot of work in the 5 rep range down into singles, they are probably going to get a lot more out of 10 reps than the guy who has been training in 8-12rep ranges for 4 years straight. Granted if you are losing weight, you are going to have to factor that into your programming and not set yourself up to try to press a big PR bench after you just dropped 20lbs but some taking your current status and experience into account it's pretty easy to figure on a decent resistence program, deal with your food intake, and manage cardio as needed.

 

[tay1506]

theres my post and then there madcow2 post lol uve always got the answers good job!

 

[TheOak84]

dude.. that pic is amazing...

 

[Jim Ouini]

Simple answer is this - if you are looking to use your resistance training sessions in order to burn more calories and give you a psuedo-cardio effect, that's a serious dumbass way of doing things

The stimuli are almost polar opposites (i.e. look at the marathon runner vs. weightlifter) and you will compromise your results on both ends. Manage caloric balance by controlling the amount of calories you take in.

Well I guess what I was asking was that if training method is irrelvant to cutting and I have 2 weight training methods that are 'polar opposites' - high rep/low intensity (like a marathon runner) and high intensity/low rep (like a weightlifter), if given the exact same diet, the results would be any different for a given person. I guess you're answer is a resounding 'no' (I mean Bompa's cutting program really looks like a marathon-esque, glorified cardio session to me at 30-50% intensity and 50 reps for crissakes )

As to how different you will look doing each of those perscriptions - it depends on your past experience and goals. Look is muscle and caloric intake balance and your genetics (whether that be structure or base metabolism). Which is the better fit for you at the time. I think higher rep training is pretty shoddy, can't remember the last time I went to 10 and doubt I can count that high

Can't say I'm fond of high reps myself - but you don't see any purpose or benefit for someone to cycle through some high rep/low intensity training somewhere amonst strength cycles like 5 x 5 and Korte, for example? Maybe I'm just old, but my joints were feeling beat up after back to back 5 x 5's.

 

[thelion2005]

need some help guys any input would be GREATLY appreciated, this is for a friend of mine who wishes to cut up (lucky me i have really only done research on bulking ), his natural metabolism is average and as a result is carrying a lill extra flab around his body. he wishes only to tone up and loose the fat around the guts, would someone be so kind as to post a sample 6 meals a day diet. i was thinking meals consisting of around 40% protein 30% carbs 30% fat.

from what i have read cardio in the morning is the best for removing that flab from around your body but my friend starts work too early, would it be ok to do cardio in the evening around 2 hours after your last meal so your body is burning the fat and not the food?

he is currently doing a weights only program how should he work in a cardio sessions?

mon - cardio
tue - weights
wed - cardio
thurs - weights
fri- cardio

or

mon - weights/cardio
tue - weights/cardio
wed - weights/cardio
thurs - weights/cardio
fri- weights/cardio

so in dot form heres what im asking guys

- sample diet
- how to work the cardio into his usual routine to cut up
- general advice on cutting fat (maybe some good fat loss supplements?)
- a nice range of reps for more strength training


haha i have even got a pic of him http://www.teamizm.net/jim/Pics/kskinheadliketrav.JPG

thanks guys really appreciate any advice!

This is very, very easy.

Eat: eggs, meat/fish/fowl, colorful veggies, bit of cheese, few nuts, real yogurt, water and decaf. 5 times a day.

Do not eat anything else. No fast carbs (sugars): flours, grains, fruits, sugar

He'll lose fat and stored water within 48 hours. Each week he'll lose more until he wants to stop. I once lost 35 lbs this way. 10 lbs is easy. And it comes off your waist and face first for that lean, trim look.

 

[raze]

thanks for the reply, once again you have ALL been most helpfull! much appreciated!

 

[Madcow2]

Well I guess what I was asking was that if training method is irrelvant to cutting and I have 2 weight training methods that are 'polar opposites' - high rep/low intensity (like a marathon runner) and high intensity/low rep (like a weightlifter), if given the exact same diet, the results would be any different for a given person. I guess you're answer is a resounding 'no' (I mean Bompa's cutting program really looks like a marathon-esque, glorified cardio session to me at 30-50% intensity and 50 reps for crissakes )

Yeah - you'd see a difference but largely that difference would be the result of excess calories used working out with weights and the inefficiency of such a program with regard to goals of resistance exercise. So yeah, there absolutely will be a difference - you could train ultra light for 4 1hr sessions a day and make it a huge difference. I'm just saying this isn't the best way to go about accomplishing the goal.

Can't say I'm fond of high reps myself - but you don't see any purpose or benefit for someone to cycle through some high rep/low intensity training somewhere amonst strength cycles like 5 x 5 and Korte, for example? Maybe I'm just old, but my joints were feeling beat up after back to back 5 x 5's.

I absolutely do, specifically if you are interested in hypertrophy - I've said that a lot before - and even for pure strength you need to change things around once in a while. Training strategically in different rep ranges over different periods is going to be significantly better than staying in a single one all the time. Although certainly you might establish a default or a preference for where you like to train and where you feel the core benefit accrues best and just cycle above or below as warranted. It comes down to goal and purpose.