noahs flood

[Lao Tzu]

I just happened on the theory of William Ryan and Walter Pitman that the flood of Genesis was actually caused by the Mediterranean flooding into the black sea about 7500 years ago, and that this massive flood (which would have covered an area the size of Texas) gave birth to the noahs ark myths that are present in sumerian, Hebrew & babylonian texts.

Supposedly, a bunch of people lived in modern turkey/iraq/romania etc 7500 years ago, and the mediterranean flooded this area, causing widespread death & destruction. This event was passed down in legend & folklore (i don't know how the ark got involved with it, if it was real or a moral fable) to the predecessors of this event, who became the Hebrews, the sumerians & the babylonians (all 3 make reference to a worldwide flood & an ark).

Anyone heard of it? it isn't impossible. To people living 7000 years ago, a flood that extends as far as the eye can see would probably appear to cover the entire earth, even though it only covers about 80,000 sq. miles.

 

[buddy28]

My dad told me several years ago archologists and climatologists beleive a catastrophic flood occured in the holy land which could possibly validate the Hebrew flood story.

thats about all i know dough., theres probably a shite load on Christian sites. Although youve got take every thing with a grain of salt from the self proclaimed Christian 'scientists'. Sometimes their work can be less than objective.

But nonetheless, a good resource to check out.

 

[decem]

hey nordstrom.. did you watch that show on christianity the other day... it was on TLC..?? anywho.. it was good shit.. went over such things as...

1. the fact that jesus christ did not die.. and it was just a big plot
a. he was crucified in a private garden.. unheard of in that day
b. he "died" in 3 hours whereas that usually took 3 days to die from being crucified
c. a priest in france in the late 1800s found parchments hidden in his church.. the parchments are said to be written accts explaining the plot and the fact that jesus was now living in france with mary magdalin
d. the french term meaning holy grail.. may have been misinterpreted.. as if you move one letter over.. it means holy blood.. which refers to the bloodline of jesus in france.. (there's a book on this..the author spoke.. the book is "holy blood, holy grail" and is written by mark something or other..

2. erasthmus or whatever his name was had written accts of a spaceship.. not of angels

3. sodom and gamora.. and the holy city burning thing.. was actually probably more the result of a weapon of mass destruction than an act of god..



anywho.. it was good shit man.

 

[havoc]

Epic of Gilgamesh

Do a search, there is your answer on the flood. peace

 

[JohnnyO]

I've heard of the Black Sea flood theory. Apparantly the Black Sea was an inland fresh water lake, and the sea level was rising. The sea level rose to the extent that the natural damn separating the Black Sea from the Mediterraean broke, filling the Black Sea with salt water, causing a massive wave and flooding everything around it.

 

[normstar]

Moses parting the sea

Have you guys seen the Discovery Channel special on Moses's parting of the Red Sea? It has a very logical explanation for it.

Apparently the Red Sea is a misinterpretation, in actuality they meant the "Reed Sea" which is some shallow marshland type of place out there. Anyway, back when Moses was rollin around chased by whoever was chasing him, a huge volcano erupted over by Greece. This caused a tremendous tidal wave, the tidal surge sucked all of the water out of the Reed See (it was only like 3 feet deep), Moses rolled through with his homies, then the tital wave came and destroyed his pursuers.

There is a ton of geological evidence that proves the volcanic eruption at that time, pretty nifty stuff eh...

n*

 

[the nature boy]

Re: Moses parting the sea

Have you guys seen the Discovery Channel special on Moses's parting of the Red Sea? It has a very logical explanation for it.

Apparently the Red Sea is a misinterpretation, in actuality they meant the "Reed Sea" which is some shallow marshland type of place out there. Anyway, back when Moses was rollin around chased by whoever was chasing him, a huge volcano erupted over by Greece. This caused a tremendous tidal wave, the tidal surge sucked all of the water out of the Reed See (it was only like 3 feet deep), Moses rolled through with his homies, then the tital wave came and destroyed his pursuers.

There is a ton of geological evidence that proves the volcanic eruption at that time, pretty nifty stuff eh...

n*

I don't know if you're trying to be funny but this is a hilarious post.

 

[curling]

[

3. sodom and gamora.. and the holy city burning thing.. was actually probably more the result of a weapon of mass destruction than an act of god..



anywho.. it was good shit man. [/B]

Oh yea they had alot nukes back then. They usually carried them along with their swords and shields.

 

[JohnnyO]

I could spend a lifetime trying to understand God and reconciling His sensationalistic Old Testament and His less flamboyant, but better edited, New Testament. I'm faced with the seemingly impossible task of reconciling the jealous, crafty, vengeful God of the Old Testament (who dogged Job just to win a machismo bet with Satan and asked Abraham to roast his son Isaac as a burnt offering simply to see the look on Abraham's face) with His more mellow, centered incarnation in the Sequel (who, while not above cursing a fig tree for not bearing fruit out of season, doesn't turn people like Moses' sister into lepers simply because they ask questions that rub the wrong way). Is God wildly Bipolar? Or is there some twisted Good-Cop/Bad-Cop/Enabler thing going on in that Holy Trinity? Or are we simply faced with codependent split personalities?

 

[havoc]

I could spend a lifetime trying to understand God and reconciling His sensationalistic Old Testament and His less flamboyant, but better edited, New Testament. I'm faced with the seemingly impossible task of reconciling the jealous, crafty, vengeful God of the Old Testament (who dogged Job just to win a machismo bet with Satan and asked Abraham to roast his son Isaac as a burnt offering simply to see the look on Abraham's face) with His more mellow, centered incarnation in the Sequel (who, while not above cursing a fig tree for not bearing fruit out of season, doesn't turn people like Moses' sister into lepers simply because they ask questions that rub the wrong way). Is God wildly Bipolar? Or is there some twisted Good-Cop/Bad-Cop/Enabler thing going on in that Holy Trinity? Or are we simply faced with codependent split personalities?

Good stuff, maybe its incorrect documentation along with far fetched versions of real occurences that have nothing to do with mysticism and such. peace

 

[curling]

I could spend a lifetime trying to understand God and reconciling His sensationalistic Old Testament and His less flamboyant, but better edited, New Testament. I'm faced with the seemingly impossible task of reconciling the jealous, crafty, vengeful God of the Old Testament (who dogged Job just to win a machismo bet with Satan

Listen God is hard to understand because we are mortal. God didn't dog Job Satan did. I too have wondered about the story of Job. I think God used Job as and example for us to have faith in all adversity. And Job did. And God amply rewarded him for that. I mean Job was blessed before that happen and then he was massively blessed afterwards.

and asked Abraham to roast his son Isaac as a burnt offering simply to see the look on Abraham's face)

Another good question JohnnyO. This was to test Abrahams faith and to give an example what he had to do with his son to save the world. Not an easy thing sacrificing your son for the sins of the world now it it? Oh btw
Abraham was very blessed for having the faith he did. I mean look at the Jews they are still around even though the Devil has tried to kill them off several times.

 

[decem]

Is God wildly Bipolar? Or is there some twisted Good-Cop/Bad-Cop/Enabler thing going on in that Holy Trinity? Or are we simply faced with codependent split personalities?

that's what i've been trying to tell everyone..

everyone talks about ONE god.. well.. why can't there be a team of gods that created the universe?

perhaps on created the planets.. one created suns.. one created humans.. one's the disciplinarian and one's the reward giver..

i have more questions too....

is there a head god.. like a manager? does he micro-manage or is he pretty adept at managing? do the gods all get together for company picnics? do they play kickball with meteors? does the manager god ever make the other gods do groupthink projects.. is the platypus a result of this?

 

[havoc]

that's what i've been trying to tell everyone..

everyone talks about ONE god.. well.. why can't there be a team of gods that created the universe?

perhaps on created the planets.. one created suns.. one created humans.. one's the disciplinarian and one's the reward giver..

i have more questions too....

is there a head god.. like a manager? does he micro-manage or is he pretty adept at managing? do the gods all get together for company picnics? do they play kickball with meteors? does the manager god ever make the other gods do groupthink projects.. is the platypus a result of this?

If there were many gods, they would of most likely come from a single entity, so no, there is only 1 God, 1 Force, 1 supreme Hand, 1 Allah
Arm
Leg
Leg
Arm
Head

Peace

 

[Kahn]

hey nordstrom.. did you watch that show on christianity the other day... it was on TLC..?? anywho.. it was good shit.. went over such things as...
1. the fact that jesus christ did not die.. and it was just a big plot
a. he was crucified in a private garden.. unheard of in that day
b. he "died" in 3 hours whereas that usually took 3 days to die from being crucified
c. a priest in france in the late 1800s found parchments hidden in his church.. the parchments are said to be written accts explaining the plot and the fact that jesus was now living in france with mary magdalin
d. the french term meaning holy grail.. may have been misinterpreted.. as if you move one letter over.. it means holy blood.. which refers to the bloodline of jesus in france.. (there's a book on this..the author spoke.. the book is "holy blood, holy grail" and is written by mark something or other..
2. erasthmus or whatever his name was had written accts of a spaceship.. not of angels
3. sodom and gamora.. and the holy city burning thing.. was actually probably more the result of a weapon of mass destruction than an act of god..
anywho.. it was good shit man.

Great, now Elite will be responsible for the takedown of Christianity. Uh-Oh

 

[Kahn]

How about the idea that we are damn lucky to be here because this planet is in a position to afford us life. No other reason than that. How about God is a man made idea because it is too hard for some people to accept that they really are responsible for what they do and sometimes bad shit happens to us/them? Finding all this stuff out could be the most imspirational thing to ever happen to man, then he will most likely realize he can do anything he wants. By himself.

 

[havoc]

How about the idea that we are damn lucky to be here because this planet is in a position to afford us life. No other reason than that. How about God is a man made idea because it is too hard for some people to accept that they really are responsible for what they do and sometimes bad shit happens to us/them? Finding all this stuff out could be the most imspirational thing to ever happen to man, then he will most likely realize he can do anything he wants. By himself.

What if one does not use God in such a fashion, doesnt use God as a crutch or a blaming type figure, what if one recognizes that us humans are just marbles in a huge bag. I agree in regards to us being blessed to live, to breathe, alot of different elements had to come together in a perfect fashion for us to have life, the earth, the sun, everything, all of this came together because of a force. peace

 

[decem]

Amorality is extremely dangerous to the human race. The source of truth must come from outside of us, from God Himself, for the heart is very deceptive.

don't most christians believe that we were made in god's likeness? and if god made us.. then wouldn't any behaviors, mannerisms, mindsets, emotions, etc he intended for us already be innate.. even if this presents itself as good in some and evil in others?

 

[the nature boy]

don't most christians believe that we were made in god's likeness? and if god made us.. then wouldn't any behaviors, mannerisms, mindsets, emotions, etc he intended for us already be innate.. even if this presents itself as good in some and evil in others?

athough I hate biblical discussions because I don't beleive.... this is a good question.

 

[Lao Tzu]

hey nordstrom.. did you watch that show on christianity the other day... it was on TLC..?? anywho.. it was good shit.. went over such things as...

1. the fact that jesus christ did not die.. and it was just a big plot
a. he was crucified in a private garden.. unheard of in that day
b. he "died" in 3 hours whereas that usually took 3 days to die from being crucified
c. a priest in france in the late 1800s found parchments hidden in his church.. the parchments are said to be written accts explaining the plot and the fact that jesus was now living in france with mary magdalin
d. the french term meaning holy grail.. may have been misinterpreted.. as if you move one letter over.. it means holy blood.. which refers to the bloodline of jesus in france.. (there's a book on this..the author spoke.. the book is "holy blood, holy grail" and is written by mark something or other..

2. erasthmus or whatever his name was had written accts of a spaceship.. not of angels

3. sodom and gamora.. and the holy city burning thing.. was actually probably more the result of a weapon of mass destruction than an act of god..



anywho.. it was good shit man.

Yup i saw that one. The episode about noahs flood was on right after it.

As far as sodom & gomorrah, i've heard in books by frank edwards (a parascientist) that India had knowledge of weapons of mass destruction thousands of years ago. But i have no idea how true that is.

 

[decem]

But when we are born onto the physical plane we forget who we trully are, and we begin to attach ourselves to the earth and its desires.

good words.. similar to buddhism.. people get caught up in the size and shape of their wave.. and lose touch with the water (for anyone not understanding that.. read my other buddhist thread.. about life and death and relative and absolute truths)...

but again.. the argument can continue to circle back on itself.. if people were made in god's likeness spiritually.. yet get distracted by relative (earthly) pleasures, possessions, etc.. could it not be argued that perhaps god also would get caught up in such things.. and that to do so.. is to live as he would have us live.. perhaps we ARE on heaven.. perhaps.. this earth.. with ALL its pleasures.. is where your god sends you to take a break.. a vacation.. almost as if to say.. "here is earth.. go down and have fun"..

 

[JohnnyO]

I don't know about weapons of mass destruction, but the shores of the Dead Sea must be a volitile area. I could imagine flammable gas coming up from the ground and igniting.

But the pillar of salt deal and the screwing of the daughters afterwards .. hmm..

 

[the nature boy]

Its hard for me to believe that you have not already thought about this yourself.

Most of these questions have already been answered in one form or another...

Its quite amusing how you and Decem think that you have came up with these as some sort of Earth shattering revalation.


Its also quite sad that you would think that Decem would know how "most" Christians think as well..But that is completly your limitation now isn't it.

dude what's your problem? I merely stated that was a good question? Was decems question incorrect?

It is possible for you to have a religious debate without being so judgemental or get worked up? That seems to be your thing. Too bad. Just trying to have a conversation here.

 

[Lao Tzu]

However to answer you question from my belief system we are made in Gods image spirtitually. But when we are born onto the physical plane we forget who we trully are, and we begin to attach ourselves to the earth and its desires.

Desires must be evaluated as good or evil.

Desires must be discerned as good or evil. One might desire his neighbor’s possessions or wife. To act upon those desires would be evil. To use base desires as a way of learning to desire higher things is a deception. To fulfill desires will never satisfy those desires, but will create a larger hunger for more. The wise man discerns between destructive and good desires.

Are we having an intellectual debate over god again? can i join? I actually just have one question this time, something that has been bugging me.

Whenever people tell me it is wrong to worship science over God I think of the 2 and what they have done. In theory god is responsible for evolution, but i have no idea.

Anyway, it has taken 3.8 billion years for life to evolve to this level of complexity. However, in a couple hundred years of science man has created machines that can do anything/everything better than any organic life form on earth. Cars run faster than cheetahs, boats swim faster than swordfish, planes fly faster than hawks, computers caluclate faster than humans, etc. 3.8 billion years vs. 400 years, and we are neck and neck. Evolving eukaryotes from prokaryotes took 1-2 billion years. 10 scientists in a lab could do the same thing in one lifetime.

Also, the question of torture. Torture is a way of life for organic existence, it is used to keep us in line by punishing deviance. However, a large percent of the time the torture is ineffective because someone has no control over the situation anyway. When 'mans' machines fail, we take responsibility for them and repair them, then make them better so they won't fail. when 'gods' machines fail, they get tortured mercilessly irregardless of whether the torture is fair or useful.

Anyway, i'm just looking for a minor debate if anyone wants. Why is god better than science? name one of man's machine that gets tortured for failing to work properly, or name one of man's creation that we don't take responsibility for when it fails, or one thing that evolution can do faster than we can. We are smarter and more humane.

 

[decem]

I don't know about weapons of mass destruction, but the shores of the Dead Sea must be a volitile area. I could imagine flammable gas coming up from the ground and igniting.

But the pillar of salt deal and the screwing of the daughters afterwards .. hmm..

they didn't even mention that.. good idea.. they covered volcanoes and shit.. oh yeah.. and they actually found what they think to be that city.. and people were buried in like 3 ft of ash..

but the one main problem with it was this.. the dude that the two angels went to see.. wisped them off right before all this happened.. as if he had prior knowledge of it..

could it be that maybe he was a scientist that knew the gas was escaping.. and when it reached an open flame in the city would blow up? or perhaps he was a traveller from time that went.. in the name of christianity.. trying to make somethng happen that would prove god existed.. back in time.. planted the bomb.. and the seeds for the story... so as to make christianity that much more believable in the future.. and so that it would have that much more power..

but uh oh.. people are catching on.. maybe someone from the future will come back and blow up the elite boards before the secret gets out..

 

[JohnnyO]

First of all, God gave man "FREE WILL." Once Man was given Free Will, God could rest assured that man would do lots of things that would justify God gleefully killing everyone in sight. And really, God shouldn't be surprised with what happened with Adam and Eve - even if He were not incapable of being surprised (except by what the Catholic Church as done with Mary). I mean, when one says, "You can do anything, absolutely anything -- but don't eat that absolutely yummy-delicious fruit," and then give the tree an inticing name like the "Tree of Knowledge" instead of the more accurate "Tree of Eviction and Endless Suffering" -- any child psychologist will tell you that you are practically begging for that one fruit to be eaten.

But it was part of God's plan to have us Fallen and Wretched with Sin so that he might create His most enduring creation - Guilt. And guilt only comes from sin and sin comes from the fall. And in order for us to Fall, He had to trip us! So He gave us "Free Will." And the wonderful thing about Free Will I that it made it so we couldn't blame him for all the things he created us to do!

 

[the nature boy]

Now-If I was worked up grasshopper would I still be cracking jokes on you.

Geez-your the one getting uptight.

I always keep my composure..I am not addict here for criing out loud.

I don't have a problem with you guys following Buddhism at all. I do have a problem with the slandering of Christianity though.

Correct me if I am wrong Nature Boy..but is calling people of another faith names and closeminged..a intelligent level of discourse..comeon now...having a converstaion...Of course its not. Hurling insults is immaturity at its best. Kinda like you telling smalls to "blow you"..right.

you calling me immature? ha. I insult those who need to be insulted.

I'm going to bookmark this thread. And when you're holier than thou self starts freaking out, which you have done in the past, I'll be sure to post a link to it. I can't wait.

As for talking down of christianity, I don't believe in it is all. I don't mock others for following it, that's their business. I could care less.

 

[Lao Tzu]

First of all, God gave man "FREE WILL." Once Man was given Free Will, God could rest assured that man would do lots of things that would justify God gleefully killing everyone in sight. And really, God shouldn't be surprised with what happened with Adam and Eve - even if He were not incapable of being surprised (except by what the Catholic Church as done with Mary). I mean, when one says, "You can do anything, absolutely anything -- but don't eat that absolutely yummy-delicious fruit," and then give the tree an inticing name like the "Tree of Knowledge" instead of the more accurate "Tree of Eviction and Endless Suffering" -- any child psychologist will tell you that you are practically begging for that one fruit to be eaten.

But it was part of God's plan to have us Fallen and Wretched with Sin so that he might create His most enduring creation - Guilt. And guilt only comes from sin and sin comes from the fall. And in order for us to Fall, He had to trip us! So He gave us "Free Will." And the wonderful thing about Free Will I that it made it so we couldn't blame him for all the things he created us to do!

But, and this is a big but, if man had invented adam & eve, there would have been no torture. and if adam & eve had fucked up, we would take responsibility for them and fix them. When your car doesn't start on a cold morning, you don't torture it, irregardless of whether the torture actually makes it work again or not. You take responsibility for it, and have someone competent repair it until it works again. Yay us.

 

[Lao Tzu]

Even if there is design man does a better designing job IMO. the universe is 14 billion years old. Science has technically only existed for about 500 years. As we speak, artificial intelligence that is on par with our own is being invented. 500 yrs. vs 14 billion years, and, as i said, we take responsibility for our creations. We are tangible, and our creations know (if they could know) that we will repair them when they fail, rather than torture them until they work again. We are far faster at creation, more tangible, more responsible & more humane than god, so i worship science. Thats all i gotz to say.

Nordstom:

Mankind has never created anything as perfect as the universe..
Or for the humanbrain. When science does-I know you will get back to me.

I believe in intelligent design of natural axiom..Why?


Science has reached a point where it can analyze the information in DNA and show that natural selection and chance do not explain the origin of complexity. Scientists who accept the naturalistic axiom are stuck with a mystery. On the other hand, those who accept intelligent design have a viable and plausible solution.


Evidence for design is found in the DNA of all animals and plants. This DNA contains the information which makes life what it is. Evolution does not explain this information, because natural selection does not create information. It only modifies existing information.