Need help on my first cycle and doubt about HCG

[neo3187]

I've been lifting for past 4.5 years. Iam 22 yrs old, weigh 165 lbs with 14% bodyfat, height is 5'9. I am planning to go for a sustanon only cycle for 10 weeks.

Week 1-10 --> Sustanon 250 x EW

14 days after last shot i'll start my PCT with Nolvadex in the following manner

40/40/20/20/10
From third week onwards of my PCT i'll also be starting Tribulus and ZMA.

Ok now my question on HCG:- I know it helps our balls recover faster but as per my knowledge, it mimics the LH, so doesnt it mean that true it will recover my balls but will also make the body shut the natural LH ( feedback mechanism). Wouldnt it be better to rather just depend on Nolvadex cz of the following points:-

1.) Nolva is good and tested by many pro users
2) I am 22 so my body will bounce back
3) Nolva also helps in bringing back the natural test production
4) I'll also be taking Tribulus+ZMA ( not counting much on em but still)

PS: Please dun suggest me Arimidex, i know its awesome but its too damn expensive in india :-(. Also please dont suggest me to bump up the dosage, because it's my first cycle so iam just hesitating to go beyond 250, maybe being a pussy but just dont wanna jump straightaway.

Please share your opinions guys.

 

[sweed]

I think 250mgs ew for a guy your size is great. more guys should try a first cycle at that dose.
you should do hcg starting midcycle to help recover in pct. maybe look into a different pct route like the TRS from PP.

 

[Barch]

I've been lifting for past 4.5 years. Iam 22 yrs old, weigh 165 lbs with 14% bodyfat, height is 5'9. I am planning to go for a sustanon only cycle for 10 weeks.

Week 1-10 --> Sustanon 250 x EW

14 days after last shot i'll start my PCT with Nolvadex in the following manner

40/40/20/20/10
From third week onwards of my PCT i'll also be starting Tribulus and ZMA.

Ok now my question on HCG:- I know it helps our balls recover faster but as per my knowledge, it mimics the LH, so doesnt it mean that true it will recover my balls but will also make the body shut the natural LH ( feedback mechanism). Wouldnt it be better to rather just depend on Nolvadex cz of the following points:-

1.) Nolva is good and tested by many pro users
2) I am 22 so my body will bounce back
3) Nolva also helps in bringing back the natural test production
4) I'll also be taking Tribulus+ZMA ( not counting much on em but still)

PS: Please dun suggest me Arimidex, i know its awesome but its too damn expensive in india :-(. Also please dont suggest me to bump up the dosage, because it's my first cycle so iam just hesitating to go beyond 250, maybe being a pussy but just dont wanna jump straightaway.

Please share your opinions guys.

I think at your age and your size, you can probably grow quite a bit more naturally with the right diet, workouts and rest! If you are hell bent on doing a cycle, I think that going with a mild one (like the one you suggested) is a good idea. Again, I would hold off, if I were you!

 

[neo3187]

I think at your age and your size, you can probably grow quite a bit more naturally with the right diet, workouts and rest! If you are hell bent on doing a cycle, I think that going with a mild one (like the one you suggested) is a good idea. Again, I would hold off, if I were you!

I agree with you, thats why i worked hard for 4.5 years naturally. Now i'll tell you why i decided to go for roids,

Recently i met an accident in the gym due to which i suffered a partial tear in my supraspinatus tendon. Its recovered a lot but ive lost some mass that i had gained naturally and as its known, construction takes years and destruction takes minutes (months in my case) , despite my efforts i couldnt do anythin else but to sit like a helpless person and watch my gains fly away, and so i decided to get it back and/or even more with sustanon.

As per the diet, I am from india and i have a job ( Web Developer) in which i have to work for 9.5 hours, i try my best to eat as much as i can , but our diet limits our growth a lot , had i been in the states i could have got tuna,turkey and beef much more easily but thats not the case. Ive seen guys goin for roids in their first month of bodybuilding ( thats stupid IMO). I am also preparing for ACE Fitness Trainer Exam so i just wanna gain ( Trainers = Huge ) thats a common perception (Atleast here).

IAM SORRY FOR TELLING THIS LONG STORY BUT MAYBE THIS WOULD HELP YOU GUYS TO KNOW A BIT ABOUT ME.

Now on HCG: I am not in favour of HCG because, as it is taking Test will stop the natural Test production, now taking a LH mimic will stop the LH production so i would rather have something that would stimulate the HPTA rather than stimulate my balls, cz once LH production starts, my balls will be back to normal , just my opinion.

Please guys leave more comments, u all say do ur homework before goin 4 gear, this is my homework n i need ur help

 

[neo3187]

Just to show u my current progress without roids.

 

[MSA122]

You're actually pretty good sized vs. most of the guys I saw in India, your BF looks below 14 to me as well...

It's always best to prevent testicular atrophy to ensure a full recovery, you are right that you will *probably* fully recover after this cycle, but why risk it?
Your LH production will be shut down, so taking HCG won't cause it to further shut down, it's just one side of the HPTA, but will stimulate your testicles to make testosterone and prevent atrophy. HMG is a lot more expensive but simulates both LH and FSH.
One 5,000 IU HCG vial; take two 250 IU shots a week is what I'd recommend.

 

[neo3187]

You're actually pretty good sized vs. most of the guys I saw in India, your BF looks below 14 to me as well...

It's always best to prevent testicular atrophy to ensure a full recovery, you are right that you will *probably* fully recover after this cycle, but why risk it?
Your LH production will be shut down, so taking HCG won't cause it to further shut down, it's just one side of the HPTA, but will stimulate your testicles to make testosterone and prevent atrophy. HMG is a lot more expensive but simulates both LH and FSH.
One 5,000 IU HCG vial; take two 250 IU shots a week is what I'd recommend.

Thanks dude... can u or anyone please tell me how m i suppose 2 take HCG and is Pregnyl an HCG?? i know its injectable but is there a specific time or smthing?? These forums is the only source i can rely upon cz u'l be shocked if i tell u what kinda guidance m getting over here, just a glimpse:-

1)u dun need pct
2) take tribulus for pct
3) what is pct?
4) start pct from the next day of last SUSTANON shot ( amazing isnt it?)

So i would love to have more help and i am really grateful to everyone whos replying to my thread

 

[DJ_UFO]

You have done a very good job naturally man. And with 250mg sust you'll have amazing results if you focus on your diet, training and rest. As for PCT, it is always better to include HCG. Tribulus and ZMA will do nothing for a system that is shut down already. The same logic you use with HCG shutting down your LH production, was the perception I had years ago. However, is not the case. With the exogenous hormones, your whole HPTA shuts down. One bad side effect of steroids, is of course testicular atrophy. They can recover, but in theory it is believe they never fully recover to the way they were before. One of the best ways to avoid that atrophy is running HCG throughout the cycle, or start at least at around week 3-4 when your balls should start shutting down completely. By using HCG during cycle, your ball will detect the LH in the system and they will stay poducing test anyways without shrinking. Your body won't be producing LH anyways because of the sust. Stop using HCG with the last sust shot. If you can't use HCG during cycle, then what has worked for me in the past and for other people, start HCG with the last sust shot. Run it for 10 days at 500IU a day.

If you add on top of that sustain and unleashed, you're good to go.

 

[neo3187]

You have done a very good job naturally man. And with 250mg sust you'll have amazing results if you focus on your diet, training and rest. As for PCT, it is always better to include HCG. Tribulus and ZMA will do nothing for a system that is shut down already. The same logic you use with HCG shutting down your LH production, was the perception I had years ago. However, is not the case. With the exogenous hormones, your whole HPTA shuts down. One bad side effect of steroids, is of course testicular atrophy. They can recover, but in theory it is believe they never fully recover to the way they were before. One of the best ways to avoid that atrophy is running HCG throughout the cycle, or start at least at around week 3-4 when your balls should start shutting down completely. By using HCG during cycle, your ball will detect the LH in the system and they will stay poducing test anyways without shrinking. Your body won't be producing LH anyways because of the sust. Stop using HCG with the last sust shot. If you can't use HCG during cycle, then what has worked for me in the past and for other people, start HCG with the last sust shot. Run it for 10 days at 500IU a day.

If you add on top of that sustain and unleashed, you're good to go.

Thanks for appreciating the hard work bro, what you said was pretty much convincing. Can you please guide me with the dosage of HCG also?? and if possible also let me know a few good HCG brands ( dont tell the brands which come in powder+liquid form). And is Clomid necessary?? I'll take HCG during my cycle but dont know how i should take it, as in EW/ED/EOD??

Thanks in advance

 

[DJ_UFO]

If used during cycle, what has been recommended before, and has worked for me perfectly, is running 250IU E4D (every 4 days) That means, 250IU on monday, then again friday, then tuesday, and so on every four days.

As far as brands, I've always used generic HCG from China without any problem. I haven't done juice in a long time, so I don't know about the quality of generic HCG these days. Pregnyl is a common good quality HCG.

For clomid, there has been big debates about weather it works, or is it neccessary, etc...or most people has bad emotional side effects, for me has been wonderful. If you decide to include clomid, a good dose would be 50mg ed for 20-30 days. But these days, clomid can be replaced by good natural supplemets like those I mentioned before. Sustain and Unleashed.

 

[neo3187]

Thank you so much man !!

 

[DJ_UFO]

You're welcome. If you have some spare minutes, read this interesting article on HCG by Eric Potratz from primordial performace.

Articles about nutrition, supplements, drugs, health, training, ect

Clomid and Nolvadex, also by Eric Potratz from primordial Performance:

Articles about nutrition, supplements, drugs, health, training, ect

Have fun!

 

[neo3187]

cool... u guys have solid info... m at the right place... thnx a lot

 

[neo3187]

the articles were awesome man!!.. just one more doubt, when exactly does sustanon clears from our system, as per my knowledge , 15-18 days... but iam planning to start my pct ( Nolvadex 40/40/20/20/10) from 14th day. And when should be the last shot of HCG in case of Sustanon. in case of test enth the article says "For example, you would drop hCG about the same time as your last Testosterone Enanthate shot."

 

[neo3187]

Ok now my next question might sound very dumb... I just checked out wid a local pharmacy here. They have Sustanon 250, Nolvadex and HCG. HCG is cheap and available in a bottle( or vial whatever its called) of 5000 iu. Now how m i supposed to draw 250 iu from that? How to Measure??

 

[neo3187]

As iam recovering from a partially torn supraspinatus tendon:-

Have 100% shoulder movement, Can lift weights(light) , Still cant do chinups .... Will 250mg dose of Sustanon help my tendons? Make them Worse? or Have no effect on them? Just asking cz of the Collagen Synthasis thing....

 

[MSA122]

the articles were awesome man!!.. just one more doubt, when exactly does sustanon clears from our system, as per my knowledge , 15-18 days... but iam planning to start my pct ( Nolvadex 40/40/20/20/10) from 14th day. And when should be the last shot of HCG in case of Sustanon. in case of test enth the article says "For example, you would drop hCG about the same time as your last Testosterone Enanthate shot."

Just take your last HCG on the same day as your last shot of Sust. Since a 5,000 IU vial will last all cycle (unless you're shutdown harder and need more than 250 IU), I'd do 250 IU 2x a week instead of keeping track of every 4 days; just do it on the same days each week.

The HCG will come with a dilutent to mix it with; but you don't want to use that; since your's will be mixed for over 60 days you'll want to get Bacteriostatic Water (BW) to mix it with (that's just sterile water with 0.9% benzyl alcohol). Ideally you'd mix 5,000 IU with 5 CCs of BW, then 1 CC (100 IUs on an insulyn syringe) = 1,000 IU; or 1/4 CC (25 IU on a an insulyn syringe) will be 250 IUs. You may either need a sterile vial to mix it with or if it's a vial not amp for the HCG you can inject the BW into that (it will probably just hold 3CCs of dilutent so you'll need to adjust the math). Keep it in the fridge after mixing; (you could also get 2 of the 2500 IU vials so you can dilute more if it's in an amp and don't have to store as long). Inject anywhere with an insulyn syringe.

 

[DJ_UFO]

It is not recommended to use the same HCG after 30 days. It is believed that afer 30 days of reconstitution, it starts loosing effectiveness. So use what you need, and at the fourth week throw away whatever is left and use a new vial.

 

[-SD-]

As iam recovering from a partially torn supraspinatus tendon:-

Have 100% shoulder movement, Can lift weights(light) , Still cant do chinups .... Will 250mg dose of Sustanon help my tendons? Make them Worse? or Have no effect on them? Just asking cz of the Collagen Synthasis thing....

sustanon will not help your tendons/joints at all and in fact if you are trying to recover from an injury you do not want to take any steroids.
best to wait until you are recovered from the injury before taking sustanon.

 

[MSA122]

It is not recommended to use the same HCG after 30 days. It is believed that afer 30 days of reconstitution, it starts loosing effectiveness. So use what you need, and at the fourth week throw away whatever is left and use a new vial.

60 days is fine with BW, shorter would be better, but I don't notice a reduction in potency even if it isn't refrigerated the entire time.

Also, my package insert even says it good for 60 days, and they tend to be on the conservative side.

 

[neo3187]

Where can i get BW?