Need first cycle advice

[scottbux]

Height: 5'8
Weight:140
Age: 23
Years training: 5
Body fat: 6 maybe 7%
Diet: Eat as much as I can
Goal: 170-180, 6-7% bf

Planned cycle:

test prop Wk 1-3 100mg eod ( maybe at the end too)
test e Wk 1-12 400mg once a week

PCT: hcgen, n2guard, formastanazol, Unleashed, post cycle, bridge

Hey guys this will be my first cycle, let me know what you think and what you would change based on my stats. I've got a couple questions also.

- will test boost your appetite? Eating a lot has always been really hard (and gaining weight in general) for me so I'm hoping it will. And if not is there anything that will?

- I heard from the "Drugs don't work!!!" sticky that the PCT I wrote is the best. But that seems like a lot of stuff, is all of that really necessary? Also based on my stats how much would I take, when and for how long? I've heard A LOT of different doses and time frames.

- I'm currently training with the max-ot system. I'm thinking that since test decreases recovery time I could double up and work two muscle groups a day six days a week. Am I right?

I'm looking for constructive criticism so if you don't like something that I've said please please please give a reason and a SOLUTION.
Thanks in advance for your help.
Scott

 

[Will_I_am156]

There are a whole bunch of more experienced members than me and I'll go out on a limb to say that at 140lbs most would agree that you should be looking at gaining natty before jumping on aas.

At 5'8 diet and training alone should see you easily get up to the 170-180lb goal you've set. It may be worthwhile posting up your diet and training programme and look to see how some of the guys could tweak that and start putting on some mass, check out the stickies in the weight training and diet forums there is some great info in there.

 

[Judo Tom]

you gotta learn to eat more calories.. 99% probability that if you jump on a cycle now you will lose all your gains after the cycle because you do not know how to eat enough calories to hold onto the muscle.

try liquid calories like the GOMAD strategy. Drink a gallon of milk a day.
add olive oil, nuts, olives, avacado and dense carbs to your meals.

 

[squatzilla]

Steroids will not work for you @ this stage. At 23, your body is still producing substantial amounts of natural testosterone & growth hormone.

140 lbs @ 5'8. You have a very fast metabolism. That same metabolism will burn off most of any weight you gain from a cycle.

I suggest a 5x5 program, focus on strength.

Lift, eat, rest, repeat........................................

 

[scottbux]

There are a whole bunch of more experienced members than me and I'll go out on a limb to say that at 140lbs most would agree that you should be looking at gaining natty before jumping on aas.

At 5'8 diet and training alone should see you easily get up to the 170-180lb goal you've set. It may be worthwhile posting up your diet and training programme and look to see how some of the guys could tweak that and start putting on some mass, check out the stickies in the weight training and diet forums there is some great info in there.

I agree that for most people getting to 170 would be a piece of cake. but i used to be the kid you see at the pool and think, wtf is that kid anorexic? skin and bones. when i started working out i weighed about 105-110 at 18!
like i said i use the max-ot program. so i work one muscle group a day with 4 or 5 different exercises, 4 sets of 3-6 reps per exercise. on a good day i manage to eat 2200 calories with a 50/40/10 partition of protein, carbs and fat.

you gotta learn to eat more calories.. 99% probability that if you jump on a cycle now you will lose all your gains after the cycle because you do not know how to eat enough calories to hold onto the muscle.

try liquid calories like the GOMAD strategy. Drink a gallon of milk a day.
add olive oil, nuts, olives, avacado and dense carbs to your meals.

what is the gomad strategy?

 

[Judo Tom]

drink a gallon of milk a day

2200 calories is NOTHING double that.. but work up slowly.

you cant eat 2200 cals and weigh 170lbs

your answer is diet not roids

 

[sbs40]

2200 calories..that's your problem.

Learning to eat: as metioned above you REALLY do need to LEARN to eat. The summer I learned how to eat(age 21) i went from 200 to 215 naturally..

What is learning to eat: Its making eating your JOB... its ALWAYS feeling FULL.. and at your age and bodyfat you can afford to eat a little dirty..

Seriously though i wish i would have learned to eat earlier in life. i was that skinny kid too...

 

[scottbux]

wow you guys must be really fat. i've done a lot of research on this subject (as it is my weakest area) and from what i've read if you're a moderately active person that weighs 170 lbs you should be eating 2700 calories.

 

[EZ_E]

wow you guys must be really fat. i've done a lot of research on this subject (as it is my weakest area) and from what i've read if you're a moderately active person that weighs 170 lbs you should be eating 2700 calories.

No we're not fat.

Simple logic would say that if you're eating 2200 calories per day and you can't gain weight, you need to eat more....yes it's dificult, and no one is saying to quadruple your daily caloric intake in one day, but you need to gradually work up to more cals/day...

A "moderately active person" in 2011 society is someone who eats 3 meals a day and sits behind a desk all day & on a couch @ night....so that theory will hold no water here....

And let's all play nice now...


~EZ

 

[jonnman]

wow you guys must be really fat. i've done a lot of research on this subject (as it is my weakest area) and from what i've read if you're a moderately active person that weighs 170 lbs you should be eating 2700 calories.

I think most of them are big muscle dudes up in here!

 

[scottbux]

anyone interested in answering my questions? I've got three specific questions and haven't got one answer. i'm going to take steroids either way so with some help would be nice.

 

[Faststangxxx]

The answer to all of your questions is that you are too young and your diet sux! So you are gonna do this cycle that you would see gains if you were older and had reached your natural potential, but you will just come back and say "that didn't work for me, so let me up the dose and throw some tren in" like some other idiot said. Grow naturally to maximize your gains on cycle...it's very simple.

 

[WillKill]

body weight x 20=cals needed to gain.
60%carb/30%pro/10%fat
+ 5x5 is what i have been doing and im blowing up!
started about 8-9 months ago at 155,now 178 and btw i learned this here.
these guys know what they are talking about! if you will listen it will work BETTER THEN AAS!

 

[EZ_E]

anyone interested in answering my questions? I've got three specific questions and haven't got one answer. i'm going to take steroids either way so with some help would be nice.

Those are the answers, you don't have to like them but the truth is what it is....

You can do one of 2 things:

A) listen to the wealth of knowledge on EF & learn the right way to do things...

B) or we can close this thread and you can go do whatever irreversible damange to you body that you choose to do...

~EZ

 

[scottbux]

all this "wealth" of knowledge and no one recommends ghbp-6? i had to hear about it from someone else on a different site. thanks for nothing

 

[jester72]

You didn't want to listen to any advice people tried to give you to begin with, called some of the most knowledgeable members here "fat", and then you get sarcastic and smart ass in your last post. Plain and simple, AAS is not your answer, diet and training are.

If you can't get to 170-180 naturally with training and diet, especially at 23 years old, there is NO WAY IN HELL you'll be able to maintain ANY gains from AAS! You don't know how to eat, and 30-40lbs is going to require a TON of new calories daily just to maintain. You don't think your gains just magically stay on your frame do you?

Obviously, you wanted nothing to do with the veteran advice in the first place. No matter what you were told, you were going ahead with your proposed cycle. Why, if no one thought you should be cycling in the first place, would you even begin to think we'd recommend something advanced like peptides????

Not for nothing, but feel free to take that attitude of yours BACK to that "other site"! Around here, we're respectful to one another, and debate/converse like adults.

And it's GHRP-6!

 

[scottbux]

jester gave you excellent advice, you need to cut out the poor attitude.. we are trying to help you my friend.

 

[jester72]

jester you really are a clown. i'm the one with the bad attitude? maybe all that fat is effecting your brain, fatty. i came hear wanting answers to THREE QUESTIONS, and didn't get an answer to a single one of them. if you don't think i should use steroids that's fine, but at least answer my questions. i thought the only thing you could take to increase your appetite was black hole which sucks balls. so if you knew about ghrp6 why didn't you tell me about it? maybe you should have said something like, "take ghrp6 till you can manage to eat enough then consider using steroids". and since when is g6 advanced? old people and insomniacs take it, maybe you're not as "wealthy" as you thought. and do you really think it would be a good idea to get your research from one website? wow, conceited.

Real mature, name calling and personally trying to attack sound advice. Funny, but it's not just me saying it. EVERYONE is telling you the same thing, but you just don't want to hear it.

Also, didn't you say in you original post (and I quote):
"I'm looking for constructive criticism so if you don't like something that I've said please please please give a reason and a SOLUTION."
All we've done is follow YOUR instructions as you've directed us to, yet you insist on attacking us and calling us names!

 

[phenom16]

23 yrs. Old, 5'8", 140 lbs. 140? 140? Holy shit kid. 23 and all that natty test and you still can't gain? Doesn't take a genius to figure out you don't eat enough. And any research you do on calorie consumption they never take bodybuilders into consideration. According to bmi Ronnie Coleman and jay cutler would be morbidly obese and they carry 5% bf. And your attitude will get you nowhere. Can't wait till you come back here saying " help my dick doesn't work and I have moobies!" cuz you didn't cycle and pct properly. Oh and everyone's a fatty? Bro I weigh 100 lbs. More than you and benching 465 3x? How's your max bench?

 

[gymjunkie09]

anyone interested in answering my questions? I've got three specific questions and haven't got one answer. i'm going to take steroids either way so with some help would be nice.

Lmao...another person that thinks they can pin a few hundred mg if test and turn into captain america


Posted with my Droid EO Forum App

 

[stevesmi]

140 pounds you need to eat more. yes 2200 calories might be good for a normal person, i have no idea... but we are bodybuilders, we overeat.

we need way more cals, carbs, and protein than the normal couch potato american that watches tv all evening and sits in an office all day. my upping your cals and carbs especially in the morning, you can easily gain 15 pounds very quickly... also if you are doing a lot of cardio you need to cut back on that. bodybuilding is a totally different sport and you need to forget about what you are doing as a runner/swimmer

and the name calling will not be tolerated on this board, so take a timeout.. maybe, just maybe if you can fix your attitude you will be allowed back

 

[Judo Tom]

wow that stinks.. I feel bad for him.

Anyway it is rough dealing w/ people like that but that is what makes elitefitness great. We dont sugar coat, we try to help everyone the best way we can and if we cant.. oh well.. lets move on and help the next person who is ready to be helped.

 

[scottbx]

daddy put me in timeout, but im a smart one. if they hadn't deleted my last post you would have seen that i agree that i need to eat more and that im ordering some ghrp6.

Also, didn't you say in you original post (and I quote):
"I'm looking for constructive criticism so if you don't like something that I've said please please please give a reason and a SOLUTION."
All we've done is follow YOUR instructions as you've directed us to, yet you insist on attacking us and calling us names!

if your solution to my problem is "just eat more" then you need to think harder. you really think i didnt know that? i put in my first post that that was my problem. imagine you train hard for five years and stuff your face every three hours till you feel sick, and plateau at 140 lbs. saying "just eat more" is like saying "just dont breath for ten minutes". thats why i asked if test boosts your appetite and if there is anything that would. so how about instead of insulting my intelligence by saying "just eat more" you recommend something like g6 to help my appetite.

23 yrs. Old, 5'8", 140 lbs. 140? 140? Holy shit kid. 23 and all that natty test and you still can't gain? Doesn't take a genius to figure out you don't eat enough. And any research you do on calorie consumption they never take bodybuilders into consideration. Bro I weigh 100 lbs. More than you and benching 465 3x? How's your max bench?

you obviously arent an ectomorph. good for you. you really wanna compare someone who takes steroids with someone who doesnt? really? ok, you win you're stronger, do you feel better? and you really dont think there is anyone in the world who's maximum natural potential is 140? dont act like you know me and my situation, not everyone is a mesomorph and can just walk into a gym and gain weight. and i obviously didnt get my dieting info from a website for couch potatoes. ive gotten my info from other bb sites. you guys eat what seems to me impossible amounts of calories. you have to remember that im a buck forty and that my needs are going to be different. if the answer to gaining weight was "just eat more" then whats the point of steroids at all? all you would have to do is eat more.

it wasn't my intention to offend anyone by saying "you must be fat", i was joking and thought it was obvious. but i dont know why you would get offended unless you really were fat.

 

[EZ_E]

What do 1,000 banned EF member have in common?

NO OF 'EM listen...

~EZ

 

[scottbx]

What do 1,000 banned EF member have in common?

NO OF 'EM listen...

~EZ

Since I am already on thin ice I will stop using font in bold with all caps....and thank you EZ for closing this thread for my own good

 

[jester72]

scottbux,

I'd love to tell you that there's an easy solution, but there isn't. If you're eating 2200 cals. a day, you more than likely will need to double that to show gains (just a rough guess). What about a tiered plan? Say adding 100-200 calories a week to your diet for 10 weeks or so? This way you'd be able to notice if you are gaining or not, and what calorie range works for you.

Sure I could tell you to go and pin 500mg, 600mg, 1g of test a week, and mark my words, you WILL see gains! That'd be horribly irresponsible of me though. Unless you can consistently eat big, you will almost assuredly lose every bit you gained, and I don't want to see that happen to anyone. Any veteran will tell you, you grow in the kitchen, and in bed. Food and rest are the keys to growth and development.

If you went the GHRP-6 route, I hope that helps the appetite. But, until you have a diet dialed in that you know is working, hold off on the AAS. I just don't want you to be disappointed not being able to maintain your gains, and end up having a negative opinion of AAS, because it didn't work for you.

 

[phenom16]

I may have been a bit juvenile in my post pal and for that I apologize. I just didn't like the name calling and tone of your answers to very knowledgeable veterans on this site. Btw, i got to 257 lbs and a 465 bench before I touched aas. No idea what my max is now weighing 240 and on cycle cuz I haven't maxed out in a long time. I have no idea if it works cuz a lot of supps are junk but there is one out there called engorge that is supposed to help your appetite. If I was in your shoes I would at least research any and all avenues to help with eating more if I was stuck at 140. Good luck.