My Short-cycle experiment...

[Juice Authority]

Started yesterday. Much has been stated pro and con about this approach and I felt it was time to stop arguing about it's preceived ineffectiveness and give it whirl. The plan here is to go 3 weeks on, 6 weeks off. My concern here, which has been my concern all along, is that the gains made during the time you're on will quickly dissipate post-cycle. We shall see. I will be most focused on the delta between the gains "kept" on the short cycle approach as opposed to the gains kept on my standard 8-12 week cycles. I will post my results each week and throughout the post cycle. My stats as of yesterday were:

225LBS
13% BF
5:11"

The cycle looks like this:

BDL Testo 500 (200mg's of Enan, 200mg's of Cyp, 100mg's of Prop)/ml - 2x per week (1gm of test per week)

BD D-bol - 50mg's ED

Proviron - 25mg's ED starting week 2 and 1 week into the post-cycle.

Post-cycle - nothing...

Proviron question:

I've been hearing that it's best to not start Proviron until the second week of your cycle due to the time it takes testosterone to convert to estrogen. Is there any validity to this?

 

[Nelson Montana]

Well, that's not exactly what I suggest for a short cycle so if it doesn't wotk out, don't blame me!

Seriously, I think it's too much androgen. I also think you'll need to continue the proviron afterward as well as using the necessary herbal ingredients.

Good luck though. Hope it works out for you.

 

[Juice Authority]

Well, that's not exactly what I suggest for a short cycle so if it doesn't wotk out, don't blame me!

Seriously, I think it's too much androgen. I also think you'll need to continue the proviron afterward as well as using the necessary herbal ingredients.

Good luck though. Hope it works out for you.

Weren't you the one who suggested frontloading long-acting esters during this process because it will act like a taper post-cycle?? I am continuing with the proviron one week into the post-cycle. Anything longer than that might have a negative effect on hpta recovery.

 

[Johnny Cut]

what about 4 week cycles of Primo and anavar

50mg Var
400mg primo?



Nelson?

 

[drveejay11]

I thought SHORT acting esters were the only way to go with this style of cycling......?

 

[Juice Authority]

I thought SHORT acting esters were the only way to go with this style of cycling......?

So did I until Nelson suggested using long-acting esters as a frontload.

 

[Juice Authority]

what about 4 week cycles of Primo and anavar

50mg Var
400mg primo?
Nelson?

That's exactly what I was going to do for the second short-cycle after the 6 weeks of recovery. Nothing blows you up like D-bol and Test. That's why I chose those two compounds for the first short-cycle. I might switch the Primo out for Masteron though. We'll see. Primo's very expensive and it's a risky buy.

 

[manny78]

So did I until Nelson suggested using long-acting esters as a frontload.

still, too much androgen for my taste. I would have used Anavar and/or Primobolan. And personally, Prop is the only test I would use for a short cycle.

 

[Juice Authority]

still, too much androgen for my taste. I would have used Anavar and/or Primobolan. And personally, Prop is the only test I would use for a short cycle.

Great, now my short-cycle just turned into a 10 week cycle.

 

[manny78]

Great, now my short-cycle just turned into a 10 week cycle.

with the stuff you're using, yes it would make a lot more sense to do 8 weeks instead of 3 weeks.

 

[dinoallbino]

what about a 6 week Sust250/dbol winny cycle?

I'm dunno much about this topic so if this looks totally retarded, pardon m'ignorance.

1-5 Sust250 @ 500mg/wk with wk1@1000mg
1-3 Russn Ddol @ 25mgED
3-6 Winny Depot @ 100mgEOD
HCG/nolva/clomid post cycle
R-ala/Green Tea/Milk Thistle Throughout.

This was gonna be a 10 weeker, but if this is a workable option, I might save the extra Sust for later on. jUST CURIOUS

 

[Nelson Montana]

Juice. maybe you misunderstood me. i said it's okay to frontload a little long lasting test up front to add aome androgen to what should be a mostly anabolic cycle. But you're doing a gram of test and 350 mgs of D-bol a week! There's a middle ground bro!

The primo/var cycle is great. You can even through in a sht of sus 250 up front for a kicker. That's all you need.

And just a reminder. This is a plan for slow steady permanent gains. It's not for competitors. And you can't expect to use the same tactics that don't work on long cycles for a short one and expect better gains.

 

[Dial_tone]

I would frontload 250-500mg Sust on the first day then do Primo or Fina ED along w/Dbol for the next 3 weeks. Probably more than Nelson suggests but a decent intro to the idea.

 

[Juice Authority]

Juice. maybe you misunderstood me. i said it's okay to frontload a little long lasting test up front to add aome androgen to what should be a mostly anabolic cycle. But you're doing a gram of test and 350 mgs of D-bol a week! There's a middle ground bro!

The primo/var cycle is great. You can even through in a sht of sus 250 up front for a kicker. That's all you need.

And just a reminder. This is a plan for slow steady permanent gains. It's not for competitors. And you can't expect to use the same tactics that don't work on long cycles for a short one and expect better gains.

The only anabolics I have are Winstrol, Anavar and some Masteron on the way. I also have a 20ml vial of Prop/Fina. what to do, what to do....?

 

[Juice Authority]

Ok, I just placed an order for Primos. I should have it in a few days. So Nelson, for the first week would it be ok to froatload the Test at a 1gm and switch to Primo and D-bol for weeks 2-3 or should I drop the D-bol and go with Anavar instead?

 

[Nelson Montana]

Ok, I just placed an order for Primos. I should have it in a few days. So Nelson, for the first week would it be ok to froatload the Test at a 1gm and switch to Primo and D-bol for weeks 2-3 or should I drop the D-bol and go with Anavar instead?

Ideally, I'd do it this way, if you want to avoid sides.

25mgs of d-bol and 25mgs of var ED.

Igm of T is too much. If you do that, you're going to be supressed and need an anti e.

I'll keep it simple. Alternate days of 100mgs of test and 100mgs of primo fo two weeks, then drop the test.

On the third week, alternate the winny with the primo.

After the third week, do the proviron for another week along with the PF "Post-Cycle" (or comparable ingredients) and some avena for another 2 weeks.

Dude, if you eat enough protein and train like an animal, you're going to be hard as nails with no crash. Trust me.

 

[DeepZenPill]

The only anabolics I have are Winstrol, Anavar and some Masteron on the way. I also have a 20ml vial of Prop/Fina. what to do, what to do....?

Just a side note, Masteron is a very strong androgen, not really an anabolic.

 

[Nelson Montana]

Just a side note, Masteron is a very strong androgen, not really an anabolic.

Yeah, but it's DHT and won't aromatize.

 

[Goldprospector]

Now this is a good thread!
I was always under the assumption (and clarified by NM) that the short cycles were a way to gain a few maintainable pounds per cycle with little to no sides or suppression. I would think that the first cycle that was mentioned by JA would pack on quite a few pounds but would be hard to maintain.
I guess the whole short cycle theory is totally dependant on what the individuals goals are. My next will be primo/Var...and short just to give it a try.

 

[bigerisbetter]

I just started my first short cycle a few days ago. I will be doing

100mg ed of test prop
75mg ed of fina
30 mg ed d-bol

I will run this for three weeks. I will take 5 weeks off and start again. What would be the ideal post cycle plan for my cycle. I was thinking clomid and nolva for three weeks, starting 2 days after last shot.

 

[manny78]

I just started my first short cycle a few days ago. I will be doing

100mg ed of test prop
75mg ed of fina
30 mg ed d-bol

I will run this for three weeks. I will take 5 weeks off and start again. What would be the ideal post cycle plan for my cycle. I was thinking clomid and nolva for three weeks, starting 2 days after last shot.

well the whole idea behind a short cycle is to avoid clomids. Try some Maca, proviron, Avena sativa, tribulus....

BTW I like this one. I know Nelson will disagree since you included Fina but anyway, I believe that Fina used smartly is a good choice.

 

[Juice Authority]

Just a side note, Masteron is a very strong androgen, not really an anabolic.

Thanks for the clarification but your statement is not totally accurate although has merit. Masteron is a DHT, which is very androgenic. However, it does not form estrogen so the same androgenic side effects that would apply to test, D-bol and EQ do not necessarily apply to Masteron. Let's highlight some characteristics:

Androgenic Effects of Steroids:

Acne
Voice Deepening
Increased Body Hair
Increased Facial Hair

Anabolic Effects:

Virility, Vitality
Increased Strength
Increasing Muscle Size
Enhanced Muscle Recovery

Ok, now let's take a look at Masteron.

1) cannot form estrogen
2) reduction of estrogenic capacity makes it ill-suited for use as a mass-builder
3) increases strength while keeping body-fat the same or even lowering it
4) increase muscle hardness and density
5)

Side effects:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/catmast.htm

When discussing the side-effects, for once I'm going to go easy. This is because most people are well aware of the side-effects of DHT compounds and scared to death of them because androgenic side-effects caused by mass compounds like testosterone are largely attributed to the formation of DHT at the 5AR receptor enzyme. This may be a time to step back and look what sort of damage DHT can realistically do. An increase in acne is almost always noted, but if that doesn't seem to bother you with other steroids, then why with a short-acting androgen like drostanolone ? Hair loss seems to be the major concern, but if you've dealt with the use of steroids before or are educated to their effects you are aware that it merely speeds up a genetically pre-existing condition of male pattern hair loss (androgenetic alopecia). This condition only occurs in 30% of men and can easily be detected by examining the men on your mother's side of the family. Androgenetic alopecia is passed on through the X chromosome and thus in matri-linear fashion (mothers side). The rule of thumb being quite simple : if you have it, don't touch this compound, if you don't, then you don't have to worry. Yes, it really can be that simple.

That only leaves benign prostate hypertrophy (enlarged prostate) and the related conditions such as prostate cancer. Recent evidence shows that estrogen too is a mediator in the development of this condition, which would lead us to draw the conclusion that a purely androgenic compound, lest taken with a highly aromatizing substance, has considerably less risk for aggravating such a condition than DHT formed by testosterone. These last two paragraphs to show that perhaps the side-effects of DHT are largely exaggerated. But that doesn't mean they just went away because I said so, extreme caution needs to be exercised by individuals at risk for hair loss and prostate problems. But to add one last bit of perspective, keep in mind that this compound is injected and spread across the body evenly. When DHT is formed by testosterone, its formed in androgen specific tissues, meaning its mostly concentrated in scalp, skin and prostate, which isn't the case here.

 

[Juice Authority]

Ideally, I'd do it this way, if you want to avoid sides.

25mgs of d-bol and 25mgs of var ED.

Igm of T is too much. If you do that, you're going to be supressed and need an anti e.

I'll keep it simple. Alternate days of 100mgs of test and 100mgs of primo fo two weeks, then drop the test.

On the third week, alternate the winny with the primo.

After the third week, do the proviron for another week along with the PF "Post-Cycle" (or comparable ingredients) and some avena for another 2 weeks.

Dude, if you eat enough protein and train like an animal, you're going to be hard as nails with no crash. Trust me.

Ok, now I'm confused. Here's what I have:

1 - 50ml jug of BDL Testo 500
800 - 5mg D-bol
1 - 20ml vial of Anavar - 50mg's/ml
1 - 20ml vial of Profina - 75mg's of fina, 100mg's opf Prop/ml
1 - 20ml vial of Winstrol 50mg's/ml
24 - 100mg's Primo amps
1 - 20ml vial of Masteron 100mg's/ml

I'm on day three of this three week cycle, which is now looking more and more like an 8-10 cycle. So far, I've done 1 injection of Testo 500 and 50mg's ed of D-bol. What now?

 

[Juice Authority]

^^^

 

[CPH]

Simple, I would run the prop/fina for 3 weeks.

 

[Dial_tone]

Frontload of 250mg Sust then Primo/Winny for 3 weeks. If you won't do it gimme that stuff and I'll do it myself.
LOL

 

[Juice Authority]

Frontload of 250mg Sust then Primo/Winny for 3 weeks. If you won't do it gimme that stuff and I'll do it myself.
LOL

Sure thing. I don't have Sust though nor am I going to order it. I have more than enough gear to complete this little experiment. Primo is on the way. I'll frontload the Testo 500 (1gm), which besides the Prop, is a long acting ester and will replace it with Primo starting next week. I might swap out the D-bol for Anavar after this first week is over. The D-bol is giving me the shits anyway.