Leg Days - is this too much??

[pitbullrocco]

the past 2 leg days, i spent at least 2 hours in the gym, not intentionally though (granted some time spent on abs).....i am working legs pretty hard to catch up with u.b.....i'm not writing down my routine at the gym, so i can't remember the exact weight and reps, but this is pretty darn close:

squats - 4-5 reps
lying leg press - 3-4 reps
stiff legs - 3-5 reps
leg ext - 4-5 reps
lunges - 3-5 reps
leg curls - 4-5 reps
reverse leg ext - 3-4 reps
rotating calf extensors - 5-6 reps
donkey calf - 4-5 reps
standing calf raise - 4-5 reps
lying calf raise (on leg press) - 3-4 reps

i'm pretty well carbed up and some dbol hour or so before workout, so i'm not tiring out at all.....getting good pumps.....after last friday's workout, my legs were bad sore for a good 4 days....today they don't seem as sore as last week.....
fyi, that is 40-53 reps.

does this seem too much? don't want to overtrain....

 

[string_bean00]

do you mean 'sets' instead of 'rep's on there? 3-4 reps on a leg extension etc is pretty heavy...

 

[pitbullrocco]

lol

yep....read "sets" where it says "reps".....guess that clen is working.....typing faster than ever

 

[BiggT]

I find that when conditioned the legs can take a lot of work.....I don't feel that routine itself is so daunting, just that it is 10lbs of shit in a 5lb bag and the only really worthwhile exercises that will contribute to anything more than a small % of your gains are the squats, provided they are full ATF squats and the SLDLs, the rest is expendable fluff, some is totally redundant and pointless (leg curl, then reverse leg curl).

I'll assume your goals are size, being you mentioned that you're D-bol-ed up and carbed up.....my philosophy is that getting better at what counts is the way to grow, drugs just foster faster progress and improve recovery, and of course help the physique......Try squatting 10x10, then when you pick yourself off the floor do 4 sets of 5 SLDL, then some shit for calves, and you should be good to go.....squat ATF and you won't even miss extensions, curls, et all.

 

[pitbullrocco]

aite then. you are correct w/my goal.

yes, i usually go pretty hard w/squats, stiffs, compounds,etc.....i just feel like i have to do every damn machine and not be able to walk before i'm satisfied

oh, i was doing leg curls as my quad contract exercise and reverse LEG EXT (not rev leg curl) as my hammy contracts.....as final exercises for those groups.....to recruit max fibers,etc.....does that make sense? POF training,etc,etc,etc.....??

 

[BiggT]

aite then. you are correct w/my goal.

yes, i usually go pretty hard w/squats, stiffs, compounds,etc.....i just feel like i have to do every damn machine and not be able to walk before i'm satisfied

oh, i was doing leg curls as my quad contract exercise and reverse LEG EXT (not rev leg curl) as my hammy contracts.....as final exercises for those groups.....to recruit max fibers,etc.....does that make sense? POF training,etc,etc,etc.....??

OK, got ya, I know what you're saying, I just have come to find over the years that with myself and others than 99% of this is just getting better at what really counts.....the extra iso stuff tends to be kind of a 'mental fix'....it's not doing much, but getting sore and crippled at the gym becomes a mental thing and you feel insufficiently worked if you don't throw in everything and the kitchen sink......

I still think you'll get the best results hammering the squats and SLDLs over a given set/rep range and piling on the pounds over time....if you need that mental fix, maybe superset leg curls and leg extensions for 2 sets of 20 each, it should be harmless, it shouldn't detract from your compound lifts and clutter up the routine, and it should take care of that mental fix for you.

 

[Tweakle]

I'm assuming those sets are all stopped 3 reps short of failure, otherwise you'd be down for a month after that kind of assualt.

way too much volume imo, and like BT says way too much fuzz in the routine.

5 x 5 squats working up to a single topset to failure followed by a couple of higher rep sets of leg press (not to failure but close) and the same for stiff legs & calfs would be what I'd have you do if you prefer more volume.

 

[pitbullrocco]

i try to stop as close to failure as possible.....its usually close to 1 or 2 short.....i don't have a spotter....i train at gym just on leg days....otherwise at the house so i can blast devourment or dying fetus on 10.
so i'm possibly overtraining with all that fuzz then heh......i therefore will take your advice and strip it down a bit.....

this is what i've read about failure:

There is much discussion about training to failure and whether or not it is imperative to train in this manner to see gains. In our review of the research we see that failure training can lead to neurological increases and possible increases in strength (something we will elaborate upon in future articles) but it can also compromise safety and increase recovery time. There is research looking at elevations of molecular markers and protein synthesis rates with variations in frequency (again something we will elaborate on later) recovery from failure training may compromise this as well. Since most of the research stopped further repetitions when tempo was vastly diminished or when full range of motion was not being achieved it would seem that following these parameters wouldn’t decrease the hypertrophic response of training and therefore training to absolute muscular failure isn’t necessary.

 

[Tweakle]

I agree, although that is taken to extremes.. most people simply don't train hard enough and try to compensate by training too much & too often imo. From looking at that quote their defintion of failure isn't the same as mine, to me 'failure' is when you can't make that final rep by yourself, which is different from 'absolute muscular failure' (the ridiculous crap HIT trainees put themselves through by doing negatives and forced reps on every set)

here's how I see it .. training to failure on multiple sets will stall your progress because your CNS won't recover as quickly as your muscles. Stopping a rep short lets you get the extra work sets in without burnout.

Training to failure on low, low volume is a fantastic way to increase your strength (neural efficiency) but possibly not the best route for size gains cause you know you need some volume in there for muscle growth.. plus there's the chance you might not progress on low low volume if your motor learning isn't up to scratch (not getting enough practice at the lift to get the optimum groove)

 

[pitbullrocco]

good stuff.....

and thats exactly why i stop at least a rep short....so i can get that last set in at the same # reps.....which is usually 5-8.....also i'd rather my technique be spot-on than a cheating ass last rep.

 

[Protobuilder]

I go beyond failure biotches.

 

[H_T_]

awesome.

 

[Cynical Simian]

I go beyond failure biotches.

Damn straight. Sometimes, when I don't think my two dozen leg exercises will make me sore enough, I'll grab an EZ-bar and whack my shins and kneecaps with that bad boy. It hurts to walk for WEEKS!!!

 

[c3bodybuilding]

I'd rather just do squats and straight leg deads twice a week than all that stuff you listed once. As others have put, the bulk of your leg mass will come from the squats and deads.

I used to do legs (and every other part) the way you listed. It was all overkill. I do upper/lower splits now. Everything twice a week. Tuesdays I just build up to some heavy 3-5 rep squats. Then Friday I try to take that same weight I got 5 reps with on Tuesday and go for 8-12reps. Then all over again next week. I've seen better results from squating more and more often than I ever did from doing 3 different leg curls and leg press. Good luck and happy growing.

 

[pitbullrocco]

thinking about trying the split upper/lower 2x / week as well.....c3b, care to share your splits and exercises, etc?

 

[c3bodybuilding]

thinking about trying the split upper/lower 2x / week as well.....c3b, care to share your splits and exercises, etc?

Sure, no problem:

Monday: Bench 5x5, clean and press 4x8-6.
Tuesday: Squat 5x5, deadlift 4x3-5
Wednesday: Off or active recovery.
Thursday: Bench Press 4x8-12, fly* 2x12-14, chins 3x8-12*, one arm db row 4x6-8, HIGH incline press (staying away from regular overhead press for a bit) 3x6-8, lateral raises* 2x12-14, curl* 2x6-8, dips 2x 6-8.
Friday: Squats 4x8-12, straight leg deadlift 4x8-12, super set of leg ext. and leg curl* 2x10-12, seated calf raises 3xmax.
Sat and Sunday are off for heavy eating.

I marked some exercises with a * because I don't recomend iso stuff unless you've really built up a good base and have some weak spots or like the fluff for the fun of it. Whatever weight I get for Mondays bench and Tuesday squat I keep the same on Thurs. and Fri, except I try to get more reps. Then I increase it again the following week. My main focus is adding weight to flat bench, deads, db rows, cleans, squats, dips etc.

Here is a typical daily day of eating for me (It's actually my diet for the other day):

Meal 1: 6 whole eggs, 2 large potatoes, 1/2 cup of oatmeal, one cup of skim milk.

60mins later pre workout, one orange, 10 Amplify02 caps.

Meal 2: Post workout shake 60 grams of whey, 80grams of simple carbs (dextrose), 5grams of Pure MCC.

Meal 3: big Lobster tail, large ny strip steak, cranberry sauce, large greek salad with feta cheese, one and a half yams, left over stuffing from the other day, 2 glasses of skim milk.

Had a bit of a cheat after that last meal: chocolate cake, fried mexican icecream and whip cream.

Meal 4: 2 scoops of whey mixed in skim milk, one thick natural pb sandwich on whole wheat.

Meal 5: Beef Stew (leftovers from yesterday) one LARGE plate, milk.

Meal 6: Turkey lunch meat with fat free mayo and one slice of multi grain bread, large fresh fruit salad (kiwis, strawberry, melons), milk.

Meal 7 (pre bed) Three scoops of whey mixed in skim milk, 7 tablespoons of olive oil. Don't try this! I used to be 144lbs at 6'4. My body can use and burn this all up to the point that I have to wake up 4 hours into my sleep due to starvation. I literally feel like I'm going to throw up if I don't wake up at eat something.

I ended up waking up in the middle of the night and eating a peanut butter sand and a turkey sand with a few glasses of skim milk.

I also drink a gallon of water a day and a little over a gallon of milk daily as well.

I put my diet in because I feel that is more important to progress than any split. I hope this was of some help.

 

[pitbullrocco]

only 2 exercises for mon/tues? nothing specific for tris?

gonna try this starting this week

 

[The Shadow]

imo - if you can do 50 sets for one bodypart - the intensity is about 1/4 what it should be...unless you are training so far below failure thats it is a waste of time.

More is NOT better - better is better

 

[H_T_]

imo - if you can do 50 sets for one bodypart - the intensity is about 1/4 what it should be...unless you are training so far below failure thats it is a waste of time.

More is NOT better - better is better

you can train hard or you can train long, not both.

 

[pitbullrocco]

imo - if you can do 50 sets for one bodypart - the intensity is about 1/4 what it should be...unless you are training so far below failure thats it is a waste of time.

More is NOT better - better is better

its about 25 for quads. 10 for hams. and 20 for calves. and that is the maximums. i don't think that is too bad. especially 6 weeks mid cycle.

but yes, 50 for the entire lower body. that's the whole point behind this thread. appreciate your opinion. i'm upping the intensity this week just for The Shadow.

 

[The Shadow]

good deal....cut those sets in half....go crazy on the reduced volume


gear ramps recovery - true.

adding a lot of sets negates this benefit