Is Being OFF all that bad????????? The mindset behind running LOOOOONNNNGGG "cycles"

[Dr.Equinstein]

After reading your posts I would like to say my thinking behind why running long cycles doesn't apply to any of you. I think another reason why someone would want to run along cycle is the fact that this usually translates into less time they are OFF. I see this all the time and I even fall into the trap every once in awhile. You are off, you have your new body and then you start slacking, diet starts to slad, the gym becomes less of a priority. Its like giving someone a placebo (spelling?) they start crankin it out come game time when they should of had everything in check from the beginning.

Oh and by the way muscleup I am thinking of extending my cycle to 20 weeks muahaha.

 

[bigAragorn]

Excellent replies so far. It seems only from people who advocate long use but thats okay as you all refrained from flaming me for my opinion. I must admit that i take my training very seriously and understand that many people just arent as intense when off--> i used to look at that as a weakness but it is just a fact.
Although i know most of you do not need gear to stay intense in the gym (latamier and mike pt especially)

Silent Method--> You seem to have the same mindset as myself....training should be fulfilling regardless of gear use

Mike P.T.--> I knew i would here from you on this one. I respect you as a trainer as i know you are a strong lifter and take bodybuilding seriously. Interesting take on why long use isnt all that bad.

Latamier--> You also are a very accomplished bodybuilder and i have never thought of a 60 year old being that healthy after steady gear use. I am of the opinion that my approach will let that happen for me. Here's hoping that yours will too.

Any more thoughts....those who advocate short use chime in please. More fuel to the fire as well--> Do those who cycle longer take in to account any health issues or the idea of body adaptation to gear use over longer periods? What are your takes on it?

 

[bigAragorn]

Well I'm up for a good discussion....I like to saty on for 16-20 weeks at a time as I feel it helps me stabilize my Bodyweight...Your body gets more used to holding that Much Body Mass Index and so therefore when you come off your body tends to hold it better

Sure but dont you think an effective post cycle regimen would allow your body to adapt similarily?
Using myself as an example--> bear in mind i am probably healthiest and most athletic at about 210 even though im hovering at 270 right now......i had gained nearly 30 pounds on my first cycle....kept it all.

 

[Mike P.T.]

Sure but dont you think an effective post cycle regimen would allow your body to adapt similarily?

Well let me reanswer what I wrote a bit. I do agree with this up to a certain point. As long as you use moderate doseages. Much higher doses are harder to keep no matter what but I still feel that the body can maintain more of it if you allow it to adapt to the extra weight.(even in higher doseages - just my opinion though) I see guys though doing over 2 grams for 10 weeks and these types of cycles I don't like since the body gains so fast and readily but just when it starts getting used to the added bodyweight and strength you come off the drugs. Bad idea.

Keep in mind my doseages personally never exceed 1 gram either. Only time was for 3 weeks at one point and that was at 1050mg. Another thing is that I like to juice during spring and summer anyway. I want to be at my best during my best seasons. I hate fall and winter and don't really mind being all bulked up during this time. I get strong as hell naturally during the winter anyway since excess calories are of no concern at this point.

btw - Thx for the kind words the feeling is mutual as well

 

[Nutrient-Nut]

Short Cycles

I prefer short cycles of the 8 week duration. I don't like to be on less than 6 weeks but I never go on longer than 8 weeks. I always run one C17AA oral along with 1-2 injectables. I always stay clean for twice the amount of time that I'm on. So, if my cycle was 8 weeks long, then I'm off for 16 weeks. I believe that one should try to get as much muscle built b/w cycles as possible. I think that it is crazy how some people do such long cycles. Long cycles are not for me, even if I didn't have an oral in my cycle. The body needs time off, and more time off than on, that is if you truly care about your health!

NN

 

[Festo]

I would like to know what was your post cycle therapy for those doing cycle around 20 weeks long?

I was thinking of something like this:

Week 1 to 16 500mg. Test enanthate
Week 16 to 18 250mg. week of test
Week 18 to 20 125mg. test+HCG 500 iu/day

Then week 22 a normal clomid therapy for 3 weeks.

And hcg for a week at 500iu at week 10

Any comments?

 

[gtaman]

The biggest problem with long cycles is knocking your libido out of commission. Basically I think people on longer cycles are saying they will someday just be on "full time." A 20-25 week cycle might take over a year for recovery. Most won't wait that long, so they become less and less able to get by without gear. Or so I've heard.

 

[me2dammit]

LOL

actually it has been proven in many studies that 6 motnhs straight use of gear gets the same "recovery phase" as a 12 week cycle.

Once you pass that 8-12 week period, you might as well stay on longer.

And your body will change its weight set point easier this way to. Look at some people that juice for along time then come off for a few years. They probaly still hold at least 10 more lbs than they would have ever held without juice, some more than that.

Alot of us go buy the guy who is 40 and has been juicing for 20 years and says he comes off and is fucked or recovery is bad. But by that age your hormonal production is fucked anyway, and even a regular joe is losing what little muscle mass he has.

 

[bigAragorn]

Re: LOL

actually it has been proven in many studies that 6 motnhs straight use of gear gets the same "recovery phase" as a 12 week cycle.

Once you pass that 8-12 week period, you might as well stay on longer.

And your body will change its weight set point easier this way to. Look at some people that juice for along time then come off for a few years. They probaly still hold at least 10 more lbs than they would have ever held without juice, some more than that.

Alot of us go buy the guy who is 40 and has been juicing for 20 years and says he comes off and is fucked or recovery is bad. But by that age your hormonal production is fucked anyway, and even a regular joe is losing what little muscle mass he has.

what are the specifics......the problem with posting "its been proven in many studies" is that many of the studies are not specific to what we as "juicers" are doing. I would like to know which study you are referring to.

Again in regard to weight issue....i am of the opinion that gear should not be used solely to "maintain" a weight--> eating accordingly and training can help maintain the weight you gained on a 12 weeker. Those guys that do a cycle and then look like shit 3 weeks afterwards should be a thing of the past with the knowledge we have now of post cycle recovery.

 

[BigAndy69]

I usually stay on for less than half the year..a bulk cycle...12 weeks, and 2 smaller cut cycles.