Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below How much better is human grade gear then vet grade? Is there less sides and less infections less test flu etc. etc.???? Or is it just not as effective???? I mean if the price is a shit load lower would you go for QV over something like GTP??? Or would it depend on the steroid maybe?
Human grade versus vet grade?
- Thread starter tommboy
- Start date
Nothing compares to Human Grade, end of story. Im just waiting now for some QV guy to give me his 2 cents, on how much more better QV is. Cmon, Im waiting..lmao!
Basically if Human then Human Grade has got to be your first choice. Unfortunately some products are just not available (Tren etc) so then you have to look at next best case scenario.
Financial constrains are always an issue for everything but when injecting oils into my body then they are not primary IMHO
Wrongun!
Financial constrains are always an issue for everything but when injecting oils into my body then they are not primary IMHO
Wrongun!
ruggermu
New member
Alright Human grade is stuff like Norma and Organon, companies that are subject to goverment rules and tax. The reason everyone considers this best there is set standards these labs must live up to to stay in business. UG labs are just as they sound under the Gov's radar, so there are no set rules they must follow to stay in business, hell their not supposed to be in business. This doesn't mean that it's two guys in a kitchen either though. I have used both and honestly think UG is the way to go as long as you can find some you can trust.
I haven't had a problem with any Mexi-Gear (eq), ever. But I use Euro-Gear as a rule. Some things I've used like Tren, NPP and Para are only available by UG so I have no choice. If you're talking about test/deca or most orals then Euro-Gear is my choice.
I've used vet grade and human grade and had excellent results from both. After my next cycle I plan on using pretty much nothing but QV gear. They are always up to par on their lab tests and are less than half the cost of their human grade counterparts. I've never used UG lab stuff but will be running some syrus d-bol and eq along with karachi sust my next cycle. If you've got the money then go human grade, if not don't sweat it...you'll get the same results off of vet grade. Just make sure you stick with products made by Quality Vet, Denkall, Jurox and Animal Power.
sprinter86
New member
Ive had better results from UG gear as some of the human grade I have gotten (even from reliable sources) is fakes.
Steve The Bluesman
New member
What? Wesson oil isn't sterile?
Bluesman
Bluesman
I think Dialtone's pics sum it up for me...
Remember Zencall WAS a 'well respected' UG lab
Doesnt look to be the clenest place for making gear
Remember Zencall WAS a 'well respected' UG lab
Doesnt look to be the clenest place for making gear
Slyder190
New member
Dial tone got a point, but I've used all 3 and Human Gear is always best as far as quality, but I still had quality results with UG and Vet labs. Syrus and BL were both great. GTP was good for the most part (Prop hurt like a bitch) and Brovel and QV were pretty much on target with GTP, however the Brovel bottles were underfilled, that wasn't cool. Testex, Viromone and Organon were on the money.
Zencall is much more sanitary than any mexican lab..
Güclü_oglan
New member
it's not by a coinsidence that the "human grade" stuff is made in countries where sanitary conditions isn't a part of the license (or where the authorities don't give a shit) , you just pay for a certain ammount of products and you can call your stuff human grade
Of course the licensed labs probadly makes gear under better sanitary conditions, but i wouldn't take it for granted
Of course the licensed labs probadly makes gear under better sanitary conditions, but i wouldn't take it for granted
ItalianMuscle27 said:
LOL, did you even look at those pics from Dialtone?
More Vet gear bashing again huh?
Who's alter ego are you?
For Real IM27, your crazy!
go back and look at the pics of Zencall. I would rather have QV then that shit.
I think QV is great, mex-gear is fine, Euro gear is fine, and a few UG labs are fine, but if you want a real answer....Make your own, it's your best bet when it comes to knowing exactly what your getting.
go back and look at the pics of Zencall. I would rather have QV then that shit.
I think QV is great, mex-gear is fine, Euro gear is fine, and a few UG labs are fine, but if you want a real answer....Make your own, it's your best bet when it comes to knowing exactly what your getting.
Tux
Well-known member
I've used QV, Ttokkyo, Brovel, which were mex... human-grade like sust, testolent, genepharm winny tabs, iranian enanthate. And I've used homebrew, which I certainly consider UG. Discounting my homebrew, which is pretty much always the best, certainly for the cost, the ONLY time human-grade was better for me was the genepharm 5mg winny tabs. I've yet to get such great results from ANY winny tabs, especially at only 30mg/day. The best test cycle I did was actually 4cc's a week of Brovel T200... so probably 700mg/week or so of test enth. That was better than 750/week of sust250 or omnadren for me... take that as you will. I always try different brands, especially human-grade brands I've not yet tried, b/c as we all know, just b/c a bottle says it contains the same amount of the same active ingredient DOESN'T mean you'll get the same results lol! Like people saying the old... german?... dbol, the blue ones, kicked incredible ass at 15-20mg/day. People today are taking 50mg/day of pink thais and not getting better results. Somethings different, so I say just try different brands till you find what works best for your body. Everyone is different, so everyone will have different favorites. In general though, human-grade is of course, cleaner and more accurately dosed.
Tux
Well-known member
Tommboy, I'll assume you're referring to me about homebrewing. I buy the raw hormone powders from china, vials, solvents, oils and different carriers, crimpers, caps, etc, and convert it. From powder to oil in a few( sometimes more than a few, depending on the formulation) simple steps. Bulk powder is pretty cheap, so just make a 50ml or 100ml jug of your favorite test and a jug of eq or deca and you're set on those for the year!
trying2grow101
New member
i want to chime in here and ask if anybody know why it takes so much more organon juice to equal the same amount of qv juice in miligrams 2 1/2 cc'c of qv equals the same potency as 6 cc's of organon
The Terminator said:LOL, did you even look at those pics from Dialtone?
More Vet gear bashing again huh?
Who's alter ego are you?
I use human grade exclusively. Very very litttle UG, if any. Its obvious by those comments, you are a QV user. I wish you luck my friend..
Guvna said:
Ive been to mexico plenty of times, and no where there is there anyting sanitary. Go an hour or so out of TJ, and see for yourself. Would you drink their water? Absolutely not. If you ever did, youll know..Youd be shittin all day! If they cant do something simple like purify water, how much santiary do you think their drugs are?
ItalianMuscle27 said:
I mainly use Omnadren and EQ (so you are half right)
But no way am I going to be using some UG lab that has conditions that resemble those pics of "Zencall"...No thanks
Guvna
New member
ItalianMuscle27 said:
they make nile sust in egypt.
they make iranians in iran.
I have no plans to visit either places, and consider them both to be shitty shit holes. Does that mean that their human grade gear is shitty? No.
mexico is also a dirty place. I sure wouldnt drink their water. But their labs look like they are producing human stuff.
Guvna said:
You say you have seen a mexican lab, great! Have you seen a human grade lab like schering or organon? How would you know they are producing human grade stuff? You said so yourself its looks that way. Looking likes it being produced that way, doesnt mean its sanitary. Please post some pics or explain the standards set to insure low impurities, and the best possible product. What about the advanced filtration and air sanitation system please explain what you saw with this as well?
Mexican labs like QV, Denakall, Syd, are not producing human grade gear. I have used that stuff in the past, and wouldnt use it again. Strange how I can feel within a few days a shot of Delatestryl, but when using a mexican brand it takes weeks or if at all.
fbodyguy02
New member
I've had much better gains with Human grade vs. Vet.
If you have access to both and funds aren't an issue, then I suggest Human grade.
If you have access to both and funds aren't an issue, then I suggest Human grade.
nishnish said:
Not completely right, it also has to do with the conditions the drugs are being made, air/filtration process, & powders and their impurites. Most of their powders are coming from china mixed with fillers, and whatever else. Their standards do not have to be high as other companies like your organon, schering, lilly, norma etc. They are more concerened on pumping out quanity rather than quality!
nishnish
New member
ItalianMuscle27 said:
absolutely right. i would never dispute that the quality control standards of pharmaceutical companies who manufacture drugs designed for human consumption are higher than those of companies who make veterinary products in mexico...
however, as an experienced user of both veterinary and human drugs, i am hard pressed to tell the difference, excluding total shit like brovel and the like.
i have just finished up an 8 week cycle of QV deca 300 and winstrol (tabs). at most, i took 1.5ml a week of the deca (and QV claims that this particular batch tested out at 328mg/ml) and 25mg of winstrol a day. i only ran the winny for the first six weeks...
i gained 18 pounds and while reducing my bodyfat by a good 4-5%; on a very strict diet.
i know deca, i know what it feels like. i know what it makes me look like. i know what it does for my joints as well. by all accounts this particular vial worked extremely well. and if it doesn't prove to be 328mg/ml as QV claims, then this supports my viewpoint even more, as it would mean that i took a lower dose and got the same results.
and, if anything, the winstrol, especially at such a low dose would have kept the weight off of me rather than put it on me, especially in conjunction with deca, as it would limit water retention.
believe me bro i would rather have organon or norma if i could get it for the same price; but as long as this stuff keeps working i'm going with it as i can get twice the amount for half the price.
big_boy_1
New member
There is a difference between vet grad and REPUTABLE human grade gear.
By reputable I mean Schering-AG, Organon, this companies have decades in business and their business isnt the anabolic market, so they are very stringent.
Quality in stuff like QV, British-Dragon isnt much better than vet gear, their business is the anabolic market.
I have used both human and vet without problems, so I think stuff quality isnt the real problem FAKES ARE THE PROBLEM.
By reputable I mean Schering-AG, Organon, this companies have decades in business and their business isnt the anabolic market, so they are very stringent.
Quality in stuff like QV, British-Dragon isnt much better than vet gear, their business is the anabolic market.
I have used both human and vet without problems, so I think stuff quality isnt the real problem FAKES ARE THE PROBLEM.
Tux
Well-known member
Big Boy, you realize QV IS vet gear, and British Dragon is UG gear right? Obviously you need to do more research if you're trying to say that Vet quality doesn't equal Vet quality, for the same exact brand. And btw, except for a few people saying some products like Andropen are painful, I don't believe I've ever heard a complaint about BD? They may technically be UG but they produce more gear than most US companies ever will, I think they know what they're doing.
nishnish said:
Well Im glad were starting to get along and agree on somethings. Ive used all QV, UG, and human grade and from my experience Ill stick with human grade. I can totally notice a significant difference. I pay a little more for some things, but its well worth it. If you only have access to certain products, well thats a different story. Get what you can get, and if it works for ya, use it up...no hard feelins!
Tux
Well-known member
Guvna, agree on all but the last point. 250mg of test should equal 250mg of test.... but as well all know, some brands work better than others b/c they have better delivery systems. Take andriol vs methyltest. Both deliver test to the system via ingestion, but methyltest works a HELL of a lot better. Injectables are likely nowhere near this amount of difference, but who's to say that the patents most legit pharm companies have on their hormone products don't include a good delivery system? Explains why Ciba dbol, which was US pharm grade back in the day, worked at 5-10mg/day. Or why Radar and other older guys say the german "Ludwigs" I think worked superbly at 15-20mg/day and they got better gains than today at 50mg/day of thai pinks. All about delivery system. So, pharm companies, legit ones, probably have a better delivery system. Maybe they don't, but that would explain the frequent discrepancies even when the products test out to have very close to the same amount of active ingredient. Just my .02, i'm going to bed now, 5am cardio starts tomorrow
I dont have the time nor the energy to do this. If you believe me, fine. If not, fine. Doesnt matter to me one way or the other.Guvna said:
But you do have the time to break up my post and give me some answers to my questions..whatever! What mexican lab did you see? You may have seen some pictures of a lab, but i highly doubt you were inside. Unless of course the mexican public school system has field trips for kids and teachers to visit the QV Headquarters!
Guvna
New member
Tux said:
while i agree with you somewhat, this is not a fair comparison. MT and andriol are not the same drug. Dbol is methylated boldenone, and we all know how different they are.
I also believe that arguing delivery systems is confined to oral methods. I just cant see arguing that 250mgs of test enathate, BA, and oil (human) is any different that 250mgs of test E, BA, and oil (vet). It just doesnt make any sense.
I also think that part (not all) of the reason that some of the vets got better gains of ludwigs, is because they were tried FIRST. I suspect that is pinks were tried first, the gains would have been more similar.
Tux
Well-known member
I'd give ya K for that Guvna but I can't till I spread it around. I definitely agree that the difference in potency is much more noticeable with oral delivery systems. However, your comparison of boldenone and dbol isn't a good one. It may be "basically" methylated EQ, but it's not the same chemical. Methyltest and andriol are both test, just different delivery systems. I also agree though, that I don't think the delivery systems matter as much with oil-based gear. And water-based, like micronized vs non-micronized, somewhere in the middle. If human-grade oils have NOTHING going for them though, why do people continue to use them? Are they truly that paranoid and that prone to the placebo effect? Eh who knows, but nice response
Guvna
New member
Tux said:
in theory it is, but the methylation causes the drug to be nothing like its parent compund. andriol is just test undeconate in oil, but the METHYL part of methyltest changes test into methyltest, which completely changes its characteristics. It IS a DIFFERENT drug altogether.
"you must sread karma before giving it to tux again"
Tux
Well-known member
Hmm... but methyltest RAISES test levels... just like andriol. No other compound and it's methylated version exert ANY effects in common at the same level that I'm aware of. Granted, methyltest will raise test levels much faster and higher than andriol, but that's really all the either will do. They both raise test levels, and that's it as far as my research can determine. They raise test levels, and nothing else. Dbol gives mad water retention, huge back pumps, aromatizes alot. EQ, the non-methylated "dbol", does not give much water retention at all, very few low-back pumps if any, and yields substantial increases in erythropoeisis, which dbol does not as far as I know. So, methylating MOST compounds changes them a lot, methylating testosterone however, only makes it work faster and stronger, raising test levels higher and faster for aggression and being far worse on the liver. This is an interesting convo Guvna, you're one smart-ass guy... i'm gonna PM you to talk about stuff like this later
Guvna said:
you have never seen a mex lab. I have. the one i saw looked like it was making human stuff. Post number 30, this is what you said!
What lab did you see? You made it sound like you were inside. Did you only see a pic? How could you tell they were making human stuff? Please explain..
IM
Guvna
New member
Tux said:
since when?
Sebum production and plasma testosterone levels in man after high-dose medroxyprogesterone acetate treatment and androgen administration.
Novak E, Hendrix JW, Chen TT, Seckman CE, Royer GL, Pochi PE.
PIP: In 47 healthy male volunteers, the administration of 100 mg of oral (MPA) medroxyprogesterone acetate daily for 42 consecutive days caused a modest 16.7% decrease in sebum production from a baseline mean of 2.28 mg to a posttreatment mean of 1.90 mg. This represented a considerably smaller decrement than had been reported in the literature. Immediately following the period of MPA administration, the addition of daily oral doses of either 50 mg of fluoxymesterone, methyltestosterone, or calusterone to the 100 mg daily dose of MPA for 42 additional days resulted in the return of sebum production to essentially presuppression values. A statistically significant decrease in serum testosterone levels from a pretreatment mean of 862 ng/100 ml to a posttreatment mean of 251 ng/100 ml, was seen in all groups treated during the first 42 days with 100 mg of MPA daily (P0.05). The addition of 50 mg of fluoxymesterone, methyltestosterone, or calusterone to the 100 mg of MPA for another 42 day period caused a further decrease in serum testosterone levels (P0.001); the fluoxymesterone-MPA combination produced the greatest decrease of serum testosterone levels, from a pretreatment mean value of 932.8 ng/100 ml (Day 1), to a posttreatment mean value of 70.6 ng/100 ml (Day 85). The daily dose of 20 mg of MPA for 42 consecutive days caused less suppression of serum testosterone levels (from 831 ng/100 ml to a mean of 585 ng/100 ml) than 100 mg of MPA from 831 ng/100 ml to a more than that of placebo (pretreatment mean of 886 ng/100 ml to a posttreatment mean of 871 ng/100 ml). Except for changes in hemoglobin, hematocrit, and haptoglobin values, no other medically significant changes were seen in the routine screening chemistries and urine analyses for any of the drug groups. These changes were not unexpected, as they are known to occur with androgen therapy. Of potentially clinical importance was the absence of any effect of antithrombin-3 levels during the study period. No major side effects were reported other than in 1 patient who developed gynecomastia of his right breast on Day 42 of MPA therapy. After his being removed from the study, the gynecomastia disappeared rapidly.
PMID: 6449127 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
Guvna
New member
ItalianMuscle27 said:
I am sorry, but for now I am ignoring all of your other questions. Why? Because you are ignoring all my answers. When and where did I EVER say they were making human stuff? And, since we both know I said that the facilities i saw LOOKED like the COULD be producing human stuff, it was BETTER than UG labs that are made in someones HOME or OFFICE. The ONLY referrence to human stuff that I EVER made was how "good" the lab "looked" COMPARED (inferred) to UG stuff. that is ALL. you then start on a tirade about how human is better than vet, etc. etc.
Why do you still think that I believe these vet labs to be making human products? I don't understand.
Guvna said:
READ POST #30, THIS IS YOUR POST! THIS IS A QUOTE FROM YOU..
you have never seen a mex lab. I have. the one i saw looked like it was making human stuff.
NOW, WHAT MEXICAN LAB HAVE YOU SEEN, THAT LOOKED LIKE IT WAS MAKING HUMAN STUFF?
ANSWER THE QUESTION PLEEEZE!
IM..
ItalianMuscle27 said:
Maybe he wasnt sure which one of your multiple identities to reply to?
italianmuscle27, or Psychobolan?
hawaii50
New member
i think homebrewing is the way to go.. i've used human grade, ug, and vet gear.. btw qv test e. feels like glass going in after this cycle, i'm homebrewing
seriously though, you KNOW what sanitary measures are being taken, and i think its safer to order a years supply of powder, then to order many times during the year and its cheap 
after this cycle, i'm homebrewingseriously though, you KNOW what sanitary measures are being taken, and i think its safer to order a years supply of powder, then to order many times during the year
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