How the body creates energy?

[trauck1506]

So I did a little reading on this and found that there are 3 ways this happens. I was wondering how these can effect your lifts. For instance shouldn't the most explosive lift possible be kept under 3sec.? From what I understand that is when pure ATP is used and requires no conversion. Also shouldn't all other main lifts be kept under 10sec before the lactic phase kicks in? And how soon does the creatine phosphate get back in your muscles? I figured you could improve lifting results by figuring all this out, but I'm just guessing.

If someone could help that would be awesome, but I don't expect many people to have any clue about this.

 

[desmond]

Exercise and ATP
For your muscles -- in fact, for every cell in your body -- the source of energy that keeps everything going is called ATP. Adenosine triphosphate (ATP) is the biochemical way to store and use energy.

The entire reaction that turns ATP into energy is a bit complicated, but here is a good summary:

* Chemically, ATP is an adenine nucleotide bound to three phosphates.
* There is a lot of energy stored in the bond between the second and third phosphate groups that can be used to fuel chemical reactions.
* When a cell needs energy, it breaks this bond to form adenosine diphosphate (ADP) and a free phosphate molecule.
* In some instances, the second phosphate group can also be broken to form adenosine monophosphate (AMP).
* When the cell has excess energy, it stores this energy by forming ATP from ADP and phosphate.

ATP is required for the biochemical reactions involved in any muscle contraction. As the work of the muscle increases, more and more ATP gets consumed and must be replaced in order for the muscle to keep moving.

Because ATP is so important, the body has several different systems to create ATP. These systems work together in phases. The interesting thing is that different forms of exercise use different systems, so a sprinter is getting ATP in a completely different way from a marathon runner!

ATP comes from three different biochemical systems in the muscle, in this order:

1. phosphagen system
2. glycogen-lactic acid system
3. aerobic respiration

Now, let's look at each one in detail.

Exercise and the Phosphagen System
A muscle cell has some amount of ATP floating around that it can use immediately, but not very much -- only enough to last for about three seconds. To replenish the ATP levels quickly, muscle cells contain a high-energy phosphate compound called creatine phosphate. The phosphate group is removed from creatine phosphate by an enzyme called creatine kinase, and is transferred to ADP to form ATP. The cell turns ATP into ADP, and the phosphagen rapidly turns the ADP back into ATP. As the muscle continues to work, the creatine phosphate levels begin to decrease. Together, the ATP levels and creatine phosphate levels are called the phosphagen system. The phosphagen system can supply the energy needs of working muscle at a high rate, but only for 8 to 10 seconds.

Exercise and the Glycogen-Lactic Acid System
Muscles also have big reserves of a complex carbohydrate called glycogen. Glycogen is a chain of glucose molecules. A cell splits glycogen into glucose. Then the cell uses anaerobic metabolism (anaerobic means "without oxygen") to make ATP and a byproduct called lactic acid from the glucose.

About 12 chemical reactions take place to make ATP under this process, so it supplies ATP at a slower rate than the phosphagen system. The system can still act rapidly and produce enough ATP to last about 90 seconds. This system does not need oxygen, which is handy because it takes the heart and lungs some time to get their act together. It is also handy because the rapidly contracting muscle squeezes off its own blood vessels, depriving itself of oxygen-rich blood.

Exercise and Aerobic Respiration


Photo courtesy National Library of Medicine
Muscles of the human body
By two minutes of exercise, the body responds to supply working muscles with oxygen. When oxygen is present, glucose can be completely broken down into carbon dioxide and water in a process called aerobic respiration. The glucose can come from three different places:

* remaining glycogen supplies in the muscles
* breakdown of the liver's glycogen into glucose, which gets to working muscle through the bloodstream
* absorption of glucose from food in the intestine, which gets to working muscle through the bloodstream

Aerobic respiration can also use fatty acids from fat reserves in muscle and the body to produce ATP. In extreme cases (like starvation), proteins can also be broken down into amino acids and used to make ATP. Aerobic respiration would use carbohydrates first, then fats and finally proteins, if necessary. Aerobic respiration takes even more chemical reactions to produce ATP than either of the above systems. Aerobic respiration produces ATP at the slowest rate of the three systems, but it can continue to supply ATP for several hours or longer, so long as the fuel supply lasts.


What Happens When You Exercise
So imagine that you start running. Here's what happens:

* The muscle cells burn off the ATP they have floating around in about 3 seconds.
* The phosphagen system kicks in and supplies energy for 8 to 10 seconds. This would be the major energy system used by the muscles of a 100-meter sprinter or weight lifter, where rapid acceleration, short-duration exercise occurs.
* If exercise continues longer, then the glycogen-lactic acid system kicks in. This would be true for short-distance exercises such as a 200- or 400-meter dash or 100-meter swim.
* Finally, if exercise continues, then aerobic respiration takes over. This would occur in endurance events such as an 800-meter dash, marathon run, rowing, cross-country skiing and distance skating.

When you start to look closely at how the human body works, it is truly an amazing machine!


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Muscles and Oxygen
If you are going to be exercising for more than a couple of minutes, your body needs to get oxygen to the muscles or the muscles will stop working. Just how much oxygen your muscles will use depends on two processes: getting blood to the muscles and extracting oxygen from the blood into the muscle tissue. Your working muscles can take oxygen out of the blood three times as well as your resting muscles. Your body has several ways to increase the flow of oxygen-rich blood to working muscle:

* increased local blood flow to the working muscle
* diversion of blood flow from nonessential organs to the working muscle
* increased flow of blood from the heart (cardiac output)
* increased rate and depth of breathing
* increased unloading of oxygen from hemoglobin in working muscle

These mechanisms can increase the blood flow to your working muscle by almost five times. That means that the amount of oxygen available to the working muscle can be increased by almost 15 times!

Let's examine more closely how blood flow to working muscle can be increased.


AND IT CONTINUES ON (prob less relevant thereafter): HowStuffWorks "Exercise and Increased Blood Flow"

 

[trauck1506]

That's exactly what I found. After reading it I started wondering about training and if it is done optimally and how to improve it. I figure that the only person that would know a lot about it is someone who has extensively studied it or gone through medical school and actually remembers it. My mom has a bunch of medical books and I'm hoping I can find something in there as soon as I can get them.

Thanks for the post though! If you find anymore about it that would be awesome because it's very intriguing and might help peoples routines if I'm right.

 

[desmond]

I'm not sure how u think it will help people's training sessions.

I mean, it basically says for low reps, creatine supplementation may be useful, for higher reps, some lactic acid buffer may be useful (eg beta alanine)

 

[trauck1506]

Well creatine would be useful regardless if all the studies on it are correct, but would help more during phase 1. Well from what I've read now I'm assuming that if you kept all your reps under 10 sec you would never hit the lactic phase provided you had enough rest time. I'm also assuming you could probably increase this time to maybe 15 sec. Going out on a limb here I would say giving yourself enough rest time between sets you could maintain near 100% throughout a whole workout session which should lead to better gains. The buffer from studies does not always work and leads to stomach discomfort, but does work better for body builders than say sprinters. Maintaining a lower pH should also cut out at least some of the lactic acid, and this could be done by running more often or eating foods that don't lower pH levels. Correct me if I'm wrong on this because it is very possible!

 

[scotty too hotty]

You're actually helping me, because this is what I'm studying in anatomy right now. The more glucose your body uses during exercise, the better it is for your muscle tissue. A workout session is going to last more than three fast reps, meaning that if you've been exercising for fifteen minutes, your body will already be under stress, and seeking to use glucose for energy. Now, glucose is broken down under the following two conditions: in the abscense of oxygen: anaerobic catabolism, and in the prescence of oxygen: aerobic catabolism. In anaerobic, glucose is first broken down into pyruvic acid, and then into lactic acid. This occurs in the cytoplasm, and is called glycolysis. Because the energy(glucose) is locked up in the lactic acid molocule, this process produces little atp(bad, causes "burn"). All that means is the harder you train, you become short of oxygen, so rest more between sets if you choose. If the oxygen is available, the glucose completely breaks down to form co2, water, and atp. The mitochondria of the cell then release huge amounts of atp for the body to use as energy. To sum this up, basically if we're low on oxygen and glucose or food (carbs, lipids, protiens), we won't be able to perform as well. I and every successful weightlifter doesn't rest like this, hence burning and heavy breathing, resting this much isn't efficient training. Sorry to say it, but hormones play the biggest role in becoming stronger or keeping muscle under stress. Remember, Im just a student, so if you can correct me I need to learn too! I'm not sure if this helps you any, sorry I can't tell you when your body will use up all of it's glycogen stores and burn your muscle for energy. The human body is more efficient with higher hormone levels, hence the ability to do more reps/sets while on test! Steroids are illegal, so don't even think about it!

 

[trauck1506]

You're actually helping me, because this is what I'm studying in anatomy right now. The more glucose your body uses during exercise, the better it is for your muscle tissue. A workout session is going to last more than three fast reps, meaning that if you've been exercising for fifteen minutes, your body will already be under stress, and seeking to use glucose for energy. Now, glucose is broken down under the following two conditions: in the abscense of oxygen: anaerobic catabolism, and in the prescence of oxygen: aerobic catabolism. In anaerobic, glucose is first broken down into pyruvic acid, and then into lactic acid. This occurs in the cytoplasm, and is called glycolysis. Because the energy(glucose) is locked up in the lactic acid molocule, this process produces little atp(bad, causes "burn"). All that means is the harder you train, you become short of oxygen, so rest more between sets if you choose. If the oxygen is available, the glucose completely breaks down to form co2, water, and atp. The mitochondria of the cell then release huge amounts of atp for the body to use as energy. To sum this up, basically if we're low on oxygen and glucose or food (carbs, lipids, protiens), we won't be able to perform as well. I and every successful weightlifter doesn't rest like this, hence burning and heavy breathing, resting this much isn't efficient training. Sorry to say it, but hormones play the biggest role in becoming stronger or keeping muscle under stress. Remember, Im just a student, so if you can correct me I need to learn too! I'm not sure if this helps you any, sorry I can't tell you when your body will use up all of it's glycogen stores and burn your muscle for energy. The human body is more efficient with higher hormone levels, hence the ability to do more reps/sets while on test! Steroids are illegal, so don't even think about it!

Nice post man! I'm also sure that you could correct me not the other way around unless I extensively researched it which I will get more into tomorrow. To me it would seem that you then need to train all 3 phases, but in different ways especially if your into power lifting or being well rounded. Also, I'm now sure that you can greatly increase the time that you weight train. Sprinting and circuit training to me would seem to get your muscles used to taking in more oxygen which would lead to longer harder workouts. Do you have any idea how long it takes to make creatine phosphate and redistribute it throughout the body because I think knowing that would help you on your beginning M.E. lifts?

 

[scotty too hotty]

Thanks bro! You're helping me by making this material a lot more interesting, organs and organ systems are my favorite thing to study, not so much cellular metabolism. To make this all relative, the better cardiovascular shape you're in, the longer it takes for your body to recognize the lack of o2, so you're def. right about doing sprints and circuit training. Also before you lift, drink a monster energy drink or some honey, to make sure you have adequate glucose levels. Needto talked about using honey for this in his very informative postworkout carbs post. I started using honey as a supplement after reading that post. I wish I could give you a definite answer on the creatine too, but I can't. Every creatine manufacturer gives different directions on when to take it, since there are different theories on when this process takes place. All of those creatine formulas have different ingredients in them, because the studies often point in different directions, and I believe this is because everyone's cells are different. Hopefully you can find something better than that, because I would like to know too. My guess tells me to have a constant level of creatine in your body, so it is always somewhat there when the cells need it. I found this on creatine. com: Although creatine’s role in the energy production process is its most notable trait, there is evidence that creatine can stimulate muscle growth. It does this in a couple of different ways. By allowing you to perform more work as a result of additional energy, increased protein synthesis is stimulated. Secondly, when an abundance of creatine phosphate is stored n the muscle, the muscle will hold more water in its cells and become what is known as “volumized” or “super-hydrated.” The more volumized a muscle is, it will promote the synthesis of protein as well as deter the breakdown of protein. Volumizing the muscle will also create an environment where an increased level of Glycogen synthesis will take place. Increased protein synthesis along with training will lead to muscle growth. There is also scientific evidence that shows supplementation with creatine causes muscle tears to repair themselves quicker. To me it seems that storage is more important than uptake, hope this helps!scotty

 

[trauck1506]

Thanks bro! You're helping me by making this material a lot more interesting, organs and organ systems are my favorite thing to study, not so much cellular metabolism. To make this all relative, the better cardiovascular shape you're in, the longer it takes for your body to recognize the lack of o2, so you're def. right about doing sprints and circuit training. Also before you lift, drink a monster energy drink or some honey, to make sure you have adequate glucose levels. Needto talked about using honey for this in his very informative postworkout carbs post. I started using honey as a supplement after reading that post. I wish I could give you a definite answer on the creatine too, but I can't. Every creatine manufacturer gives different directions on when to take it, since there are different theories on when this process takes place. All of those creatine formulas have different ingredients in them, because the studies often point in different directions, and I believe this is because everyone's cells are different. Hopefully you can find something better than that, because I would like to know too. My guess tells me to have a constant level of creatine in your body, so it is always somewhat there when the cells need it. I found this on creatine. com: Although creatine’s role in the energy production process is its most notable trait, there is evidence that creatine can stimulate muscle growth. It does this in a couple of different ways. By allowing you to perform more work as a result of additional energy, increased protein synthesis is stimulated. Secondly, when an abundance of creatine phosphate is stored n the muscle, the muscle will hold more water in its cells and become what is known as “volumized” or “super-hydrated.” The more volumized a muscle is, it will promote the synthesis of protein as well as deter the breakdown of protein. Volumizing the muscle will also create an environment where an increased level of Glycogen synthesis will take place. Increased protein synthesis along with training will lead to muscle growth. There is also scientific evidence that shows supplementation with creatine causes muscle tears to repair themselves quicker. To me it seems that storage is more important than uptake, hope this helps!scotty

Most people don't know about any of this and I don't really understand why they don't. However, I know a lot of it is over most peoples heads without dwelling into it. Well creatine phosphate from what I understand is the second quickest way that ATP is made. While not working out your body makes creatine phosphate, but while working out it is not efficient enough so you body goes to stage 2. What I was saying is if you could get back to 1 quick enough that would be the best way to train for powerlifting which is what I'm doing right now. If that is all creatine did though it would not be worth the price especially if it took your body forever to get back to normal levels. I had a bunch of websites bookmarked or so I thought and just realized that I can't have an unlimited amount which blows because I'll have to look everything all back up which took awhile. I'm pretty sure that the "water weight" your talking about does exactly what you said it does or close to it which is why I've heard a lot of people say they can lift more like this including me. I do however think that you can increase the amount of creatine in your muscles without actually taking any. After learning all of this I'm definitely going to go back to my old hard core training I used to do as soon as I get used to working out and sprinting again. I'll try and do some more info searching later and get as deep into this as I can. Also have you heard of myostatin, because if not look it up especially the pictures it's nuts.

 

[scotty too hotty]

If you happen to acquire any myostatin inhibitors, please pm me! Is this considered "open sourcing"?

 

[trauck1506]

If you happen to acquire any myostatin inhibitors, please pm me! Is this considered "open sourcing"?

Lol! I wish man, then id have to eat very little and never work out so I don't look like Coleman. They probably exist and however you take it would probably cost around $1000 a day if you knew the person that could get them for you. There are companies that sell them, but I can tell you they don't work.

 

[scotty too hotty]

There is a pharmaceutical company that did the testing, but those bastards won't release the results yet, wonder why!

 

[trauck1506]

They did it on humans? Which one did they try to do because how I understand it you can block I guess part of the gene which will give you increased speed and muscle gain. They think many top athletes already have this "disease". Did you see that dog that had it? From what I read both its parents had the myostatine 1 deficiency which they are bred for for their speed. If you completely stop it you will get around 40 - 50% muscle growth and that could be horrible for someone that stopped growing. I'm not positive on everything I just said, but I'm pretty sure about it.

 

[scotty too hotty]

I'm not sure if they experimented on humans yet or not, my guess tells me they were animal experiments. The possible human benefits could be cures for muscular distrophy, aids wasting, ect. There have been confirmed cases of humans born with this genetic mutation. If you suddenly grew that much muscle, your tendons and ligaments would probably seperate. I don't know how long it would take to start growing muscle if you weren't born with the mutation, and it was administered later in life. It would be cool if they could cause just enough mutation to augment the natural muscle building process for people like yourself and I. This will never happen, in my opinion. Check this out though, if we could figure out how to destroy the myostatin protein, we could make millions selling our product on elite fitness! I've been experimenting, and these are my results so far: BUILT REPORT - Schwarzenegger Cows Photo Gallery

 

[trauck1506]

This article is about the first kid on the other website:
The German Super Baby, page 1
Yes the dog is real, but everything after the last kid is not. I looked all the info up and every one of them was on a major news station including the dog that I think was on CNBC. I could not find any of the info because it took like 4 hours to find it last time.
Monstrous Myostatin Misfortunes - A Collection of Myostatin Deficiency Pictures : Who Sucks
Here is the trial on humans that the government is doing:
http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct/show/NCT00104078?order=3

 

[gjohnson5]

So I did a little reading on this and found that there are 3 ways this happens. I was wondering how these can effect your lifts. For instance shouldn't the most explosive lift possible be kept under 3sec.? From what I understand that is when pure ATP is used and requires no conversion. Also shouldn't all other main lifts be kept under 10sec before the lactic phase kicks in? And how soon does the creatine phosphate get back in your muscles? I figured you could improve lifting results by figuring all this out, but I'm just guessing.

If someone could help that would be awesome, but I don't expect many people to have any clue about this.

The body does not create energy
1st law of thermodynamics

Energy can neither be created nor destroyed.

 

[trauck1506]

Yes you are right, but it can be changed more efficiently from one form to another. Guess I should have worded it differently.

 

[trauck1506]

lol

 

[WiggyWild]

Stretching removes lactic acid from the muscles. I strech between every set.

 

[trauck1506]

Hmmm..... I never stretch really because I didn't use to feel I needed to because I ran about everyday and got in a good upper body warm up, but guess I should start until I get my endurance up. I can't even run a mile at 7mph and it's pretty sad.

 

[trauck1506]

I thought about this and figured id just bring it up in this thread. Can you feel your body physically going through these phases?

 

[needtogetaas]

If you happen to acquire any myostatin inhibitors, please pm me! Is this considered "open sourcing"?

wtf