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home values will continue to drop? some say yes

Steep Drop Predicted for Home Prices
By Julie Haviv,Reuters
Posted: 2007-12-06 13:51:51
NEW YORK (Dec. 6) - Housing markets from Punta Gorda, Florida, to Stockton, California, will crash and suffer price drops of more than 30 percent before the housing crisis is over, a report from Moody's Economy.com said on Thursday.

On a national level, the housing market recession will continue through early 2009, said the report, co-authored by Mark Zandi, chief economist, and Celia Chen, director of housing economics.

The report paints a worsening picture of the hard-hit housing sector, which is in the midst of its worst downturn since World War II.

While activity will stabilize in 2009, it will not be until 2010 before a measurable improvement in sales, construction and pricing will emerge, the report said.

House prices are forecast to fall 13 percent from their peak through early 2009. After accounting for incentives home sellers are offering buyers, effective declines peak-to-trough will total well over 15 percent, the report said.

Punta Gorda, Florida, and Stockton, California, are the hardest hit markets in the U.S., with price declines from peak-to-trough forecast at 35.3 percent and 31.6 percent, respectively.

"This is the most severe housing recession since the post-World War II period," Zandi told Reuters.

These markets have been hard hit due to several reasons, namely the exiting of investors from the areas, a fair amount of subprime mortgage loans causing an increase in foreclosures and overbuilding by home builders, Zandi told Reuters.

Home sales, however, should hit a bottom in early 2008, which will mark a 40 percent drop from peak-to-trough.

"The housing market's most fundamental problem is it is awash in unsold inventory," the report said.

In addition, the housing downturn will take a large toll on the rest of the economy. During the height of the boom in 2004-05, housing contributed nearly a percentage point to annual real gross domestic product, or GDP, growth.

In the current downturn, housing will subtract more than one percentage point from U.S. economic growth this year, and a percentage point and a half in 2008, with the effect on growth seen most pronounced next spring and early summer.

"The intensifying housing recession is expected to weigh on the broader economy, but not break it," the report said.

The Moody's Economy.com's report, titled "Aftershock: Housing in the Wake of the Mortgage Meltdown," said that when house prices hit their nadir, some 80 of the nation's 381 metropolitan areas will experience a double-digit peak-to-trough price decline.

Price declines, however, will vary in degree throughout the nation, with more than a 15 percent peak-to-trough expected around Washington and Detroit.

Significant declines are also expected throughout most of Arizona, California, Florida and Nevada. During the housing market's heyday, speculative activity was rampant in these areas, causing prices to surge much higher than other regions.

The Northeast corridor, and markets such as Boise, Idaho, along with Denver and Salt Lake City, will experience between 5 percent and 15 percent declines. In the rest of the industrial Midwest and parts of the Mountain and Pacific Northwest, prices will fall more modestly.

While some point to rising default rates in the subprime mortgage market, which caters to borrowers with poor credit histories, as the root cause of the problems plaguing the housing market, Moody's Economy.com said an unwieldy supply of unsold homes is the prime factor.

The U.S. Census Bureau said that, as of the third quarter of 2007, there were close to 2.1 million vacant unsold homes for sale, equal to 2.6 percent of the stock of owner-occupied homes.

A well-functioning housing market has a substantial amount of inventory, but in the quarter century between the early 1980s and mid-2000s, the vacancy rate stayed near 1.7 percent.

The difference between the two vacancy rates provides a good estimate of the amount of excess inventory in the market, which currently totals nearly 750,000 homes and is by far the highest level of excess inventory in the post-World War II period, Moody's Economy.com said.

Moody's Economy.com, which is based in West Chester, Pennsylvania, is an independent subsidiary of Moody's Corp and provides economic research and consulting services to businesses, governments and other institutions.
 
my bother just sold his home here for 25k more than he bought it for 22 months ago.


so much for "expert opinions"..... :rolleyes:
 
Yup. CA and FL are some pretty extreme markets though. It won't be that bad for the rest of the country.
 
rnch said:
my bother just sold his home here for 25k more than he bought it for 22 months ago.


so much for "expert opinions"..... :rolleyes:




there are always exceptions. that is one case. overall home values are lower then whale shit


but home values will continue to drop till 2009 some say.

supply vs demand.

One house that I've had my eye on near the beach in Pt. Hueneme has gone from $551k July 10th to $399k now. Still hasn't sold
 
dead_reggin_storage_fashi said:
there are always exceptions. that is one case. overall home values are lower then whale shit


but home values will continue to drop till 2009 some say.

supply vs demand.

One house that I've had my eye on near the beach in Pt. Hueneme has gone from $551k July 10th to $399k now. Still hasn't sold


A lot of spec homes here are dropping like crazy. Like going from in the $600K range into the low $500's. I'd be pissed as hell if I spent full price on one of those and then had someone buy one with more features for $100K less plus builder incentives.
 
they are projecting better than a 40% drop here, overinflated values post-Ivan due to a housing shortage then.
 
perhaps these houses were way over-priced to begin with?


you can "ask" any figure u want to for a house.............
 
I wish the "spec" builders would have hit the East Coast market as rampant as those listed in the article. ( Well, not really, but kinda.)

I guess our lil beach house will have to wait....
 
i hope so.. my daughter just bought a semi spec for 277,000.. the same house sold last summer for 400k..

she's happy..
 
vixensghost said:
I wish the "spec" builders would have hit the East Coast market as rampant as those listed in the article. ( Well, not really, but kinda.)

I guess our lil beach house will have to wait....


They kind of flooded the market here in some areas. I'm thinking in about a year a few people I know and myself will start picking some of them up.
 
jnevin said:
They kind of flooded the market here in some areas. I'm thinking in about a year a few people I know and myself will start picking some of them up.



Bingo.

I have some cash(left to me from my mom and dad) that I'd love to invest in a home on Cape Cod for our "golden year's". I'm not into the Florida scene!

Oh well, I can dream.
 
i don't know why someone looking to buy a home wouldn't buy now. you can snag some ridiculous deals.

if you have $$, and can get approved...it's a no brain investment.
 
jnevin said:
Says the savvy 30 year old still living with roomies.

LOL-Medeval_Soldiers.jpg
 
redguru said:
they are projecting better than a 40% drop here, overinflated values post-Ivan due to a housing shortage then.




no state income tax is so nice, but you guys get ass raped on property taxes and insurance. I see it quite common to see home owners have a higher escrow payment then there mortgage. :(
 
dead_reggin_storage_fashi said:
no state income tax is so nice, but you guys get ass raped on property taxes and insurance. I see it quite common to see home owners have a higher escrow payment then there mortgage. :(

After the hurricane season of 2005, most Florida properties skyrocketed in value, and municipalities received a property tax windfall. Did we see a milleage decrease? fuck, no. Crist, our new Governor, is trying to revamp the tax code, now.
 
smt said:
Wonder what's in store for Colorado...


CO has been flat for a couple of years now, but I'd think it will recover quicker than a lot of the more inflated parts of the country. I'm in UT and we're getting hit a little, but we're still appreciating. So is ID.
 
jnevin said:
CO has been flat for a couple of years now, but I'd think it will recover quicker than a lot of the more inflated parts of the country. I'm in UT and we're getting hit a little, but we're still appreciating. So is ID.


I sure hope so. I own a condo in a new development here. It's for sale now, but there are tons of brand new vacant units here. Guess I'm going to have to wait it out. Hope to not have to take a loss.
 
smt said:
I sure hope so. I own a condo in a new development here. It's for sale now, but there are tons of brand new vacant units here. Guess I'm going to have to wait it out. Hope to not have to take a loss.


Condos will take a bigger hit than SFR's. Is it a high rise condo? Or is it more like a townhome?
 
jnevin said:
Condos will take a bigger hit than SFR's. Is it a high rise condo? Or is it more like a townhome?

More like a townhome. The building is only 3 stories high. I'm in suburbs of south Denver where there is a lot of growth still and LOTS of new construction. That's really hurting the sales of pre-owned. I built this one a couple of years ago. Upgraded everything. Shows really well, but sales incentives are better for new properties.
 
smt said:
More like a townhome. The building is only 3 stories high. I'm in suburbs of south Denver where there is a lot of growth still and LOTS of new construction. That's really hurting the sales of pre-owned. I built this one a couple of years ago. Upgraded everything. Shows really well, but sales incentives are better for new properties.


I thought you barely got into it, which would suck for you, in the short run at least. You can probably expect to come in less than ones like yours (similar upgrades, sq ft, ammenities, etc). I'd say 3-5% less depending on your area, how quickly they're selling, how saturated the market is.
 
jnevin said:
I thought you barely got into it, which would suck for you, in the short run at least. You can probably expect to come in less than ones like yours (similar upgrades, sq ft, ammenities, etc). I'd say 3-5% less depending on your area, how quickly they're selling, how saturated the market is.

Bought this one in July 2005. new ones similar to mine are selling for 15-20K more than what I paid for this in 05. Developers at this development say that their new home sales are slow. Will see what happens I guess. I'm not in a huge rush to move. Have a home business and need more office space, can still function fine with what I have.
 
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