First Cycle.

[ghettostudmuffin]

Well I'm going to start my first cycle in 2-3 weeks.

I've trained on and off for about 13 years and I'm in my late 20's. I've got about 9 years of actual lifting experience out of the last 13 and the longest I've lifted consistently in the past was 4.5 years. At around 20 I got out of the military(kicked out for some dumb shit) and weighed 156lbs due to lots of running and calisthenics. Decided to start lifting again and built up to 194 in 6 months with no supps, just lots of food and hard work. I've thickened up over the years from manual labor and am currently 5'8.5" 220lbs.
Don't know my bodyfat %, but it's relatively high probably. I look husky. But, my BF% is not a concern atm.

Tried 1-Ad once for 6 weeks and loved it. Stuff got banned shortly after using it.

I'm ready to go and this is what I have come up with:

Test E 250mg every 4th day. weeks 1-10
dbol 25mg ed weeks 1-4
aromasin 10mg ed


Pct-I will have plenty of hcg and nolva lined up. I'm torn between the 2 main approaches I've read of on the board. One being hcg throughout cycle at 250iu twice a week and then 1 week after last stick 250iu ed for 7-10 days with 20mg nolva during and an additional 2-3 weeks after.

Or drjmw's weeks 1-3 1000iu 3x week and 20 mg nolva ed and then 20mg ed for another 3 weeks.

I feel I should take the aromasin to control water bloating and excess estro. If anyone has tips for controlling bloat I'd appreciate it. Whether or not I should use this or something else I don't know, but I hear alot of people don't like arimidex and femara seems like it would be overkill.

I know eliminating too much estrogen and water can potentially dampen gains, but I'm honestly not worried about that as getting all bloated up is just not gonna fly. Some minor bloat is no prob, but although I know it will be obvious I'm juicing to those that know the signs, the people I work closely with can't be aware of it other than the response that I'm training my ass off and just hopped onto some creatine and no2. They've seen me drop 50lbs in 6 months all natural and put on +20lbs in 8 weeks the same, so that is why I don't want to get abnormally water bloated.

Additional supps I will be taking are whey, quality multi-vitamin/mineral, creatine, glutamine, cod liver oil, and some type of liver care product.

I'll be aiming for about 350-400 grams protein a day.

Let me know your thoughts. Any suggestions or advice is appreciated.

 

[solidspine]

Your first cycle you will gain a lot,

Eating, training, resting, is all equal or more important than the gear,

But I recommend

500mg Test E weeks 1-12
500mg Deca weeks 1-12


Anti E

PCT

Don’t mess with d-bol just yet, you want real gains, also if in week 5 or 6 you want bump the test to 750mg per week.

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

Isn't that abit much though for my first cycle? I kinda want to stick with just test to see how I respond. Then would like to run a test/deca sometime after.

I got fantastic results off 1-AD so I think I will respond very well to the dosage I have listed though I appreciate your advice.

I honestly do not want to go overkill this cycle because based off my past experiences with eating like a mofo and 1-AD I will gain easily +30lbs in 10 weeks off a cycle like that and I'd be 250lbs. Too much too fast.

If I didn't do the work I do and work side by side with the people I do I might consider it, but I'd rather start low and slow and build up.

I could see that potentially being a second or third cycle though.

Thanks for the response amigo. Hope your cycle goes great!

 

[blut wump]

Good choice for a first cycle.

If you've never run Dbol before, there's a chance you'll find that you don't like the sides. Back pumps and shin pumps can be almost crippling and bloat is common. Personally, I'd do without the dbol but if you take to it then you'll really enjoy it, by all acounts.

Your 10mg aromasin might be just right for you and it might not. Be prepared to go as high as 25mg ED, entirely depending on your own body's response and aromatase activity. Aching joints would be a good sign of over-dosing. Bloating etc would be a sign of under-dosing.

With that cycle, there's no real need to run HCG throughout. You'll get some shrinkage but nothing remarkable. The HCG protocol I'd use for that is either 1000iu EOD for 10 days or 500iu ED for 10 days, starting the day of your final shot. Either will work just fine.

There's no telling what you'll gain from a cycle. You've been at this long enough to know what you're doing with diet and training. You'll grow in line with surplus calories.

In general, controlling bloat comes down to reducing sodium, increasing potassium and drinking lots of water. A guideline for water is 1 liter per 30lbs of bodyweight.

Enjoy your cycle and remember to train like you're on steroids, because you will be.

 

[pentatonic]

Cycle looks good. Follow what Blut Wump wrote above and you'll be just fine.

 

[BigCracker]

I can't believe someone is suggesting 1000 mgs/wk for your 1st run. 1000 mgs/wk is plenty -even for an experienced juicer. I rarely go over 1000 mgs/wk and I've used AS for about 17 years. I got up to 327 lbs on that dosage and won a state championship on 50 mgs of Winstrol EOD for 6 weeks. I'm getting really annoyed seeing so many guys that have minimal dieting/training experience slamming these massive dosages. I swear, the generation before mine all must have brain damage.

 

[xrsist]

I can't believe someone is suggesting 1000 mgs/wk for your 1st run. 1000 mgs/wk is plenty -even for an experienced juicer. I rarely go over 1000 mgs/wk and I've used AS for about 17 years. I got up to 327 lbs on that dosage and won a state championship on 50 mgs of Winstrol EOD for 6 weeks. I'm getting really annoyed seeing so many guys that have minimal dieting/training experience slamming these massive dosages. I swear, the generation before mine all must have brain damage.

agreed

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

Great stuff guys.

Blut wump, the tips on sides from aromasin will help alot.

The only reason I'm taking dbol is to kickstart.

I'm still not 100% on half-lifes. Test E has a half-life of like 10 days.

What exactly does that mean? I keep hearing from people saying you can't feel test E until like weeks 4 or 5.

But when does it actually start releasing into the blood stream and binding to AR receptors after the shot? Minutes? Hours? If so, why would it take 4-5 weeks to feel it?

I'm very sensitive as to what's going on with my body. When I was on the 1-AD I had a constant moderate arm and lat pump and they actually tingled. I told someone and they said that was bullshit, that your muscles can't tingle, but they did. Felt strangely good.

As for training like being on them, definitely. I train hard as it is. I am gonna kick it up to the next level while on. All aspects like sleep, diet, supps, will be totally on point. Where I might normally slack a little on something, not while on.

I'm curious as to what frequency of training I should use? While on 1-AD I trained 3 days a week on the DF 5x5 and got kickass results. But, I'm sure I'll get better results with the test. I trained 6 days a week Arnold style in high school with no probs, but after a certain point I couldn't grow off that much.

Because of my job(yesterday I had to shovel about 4 yards of heavy gloppy dirt in about an hour from the back of a truck) I seem to handle training 3 days a week very well. I train Hard in the gym and my sessions are about 1.5 hours long. Bodyparts get split every other session.


IF the test hits me hard and I get some serious urge to train train train, I'm assuming because of how it changes the bodies chemistry that I may be able to tolerate 5-6 days a week hard training which I will do.

 

[Wulfgar]

I want to make a sticky for first cycle advice

Ill say it again. Ive never met ANYONE who has not realized tremendous progress on a very basic 8 week cycle of 200 mg Deca every 8 days
no PCT, Alot of food, alot of rest and alot of correct training. take some OTC supps starting week 6 like creatine, glutamine and Arginine.

save the money,. save the growth threshold and give yourself some room for long term progress

 

[BigCracker]

I want to make a sticky for first cycle advice

Ill say it again. Ive never met ANYONE who has not realized tremendous progress on a very basic 8 week cycle of 200 mg Deca every 8 days
no PCT, Alot of food, alot of rest and alot of correct training. take some OTC supps starting week 6 like creatine, glutamine and Arginine.

save the money,. save the growth threshold and give yourself some room for long term progress

You've gotta be over age 30 to have any kind of rationale these days. lol

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

Can anyone help with the clarification on Test E half-life?

Scenario: Test E is injected. How long after injection before it enters blood stream? If it's half-life is 10 days than by day 10 it's at half it's original strength having slowly decreased over those 10 days?

Since it's in oil does it take the body a month or so to actually get it into the blood stream hence the I don't feel it until week 4-5 responses?

Thanks.

 

[digit0x]

Can anyone help with the clarification on Test E half-life?

Scenario: Test E is injected. How long after injection before it enters blood stream? If it's half-life is 10 days than by day 10 it's at half it's original strength having slowly decreased over those 10 days?

Since it's in oil does it take the body a month or so to actually get it into the blood stream hence the I don't feel it until week 4-5 responses?

Thanks.

its in your blood almost immediately. Half-life is exactly what it sounds like (in a non-radioactive sense). It is in that amount of time that half of the dose will be gone. And from there, it halves again, and again till there is not enough to detect. This is why frequency of dosing is important, and very different for every compound. prop ED and test e E5D's, for example.

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

Cool. Thanks for info.

So then why all the I don't feel it until week 4-5 replies?

That doesn't make sense?

 

[blut wump]

The drug is being released almost from the moment that you inject it. I don't know what mechanisms are involved in "feeling" it, though. Half-life of enan is 4.5 days, despite that one table that gets requoted everywhere showing 1.5 days per carbon atom of the ester.

My impression is that it simply takes time for the physiological response to be significant enough to have an effect of a magnitude that you feel enhanced. With enan, I have an inkling of a feeling in the gym by the end of the second week that something's different. During the third week it's a stronger feeling and by the fourth week the PR train is leaving the station. On prop, it takes about a week to a week and a half.

Equally, though, I've felt libido increases on the same day that I've taken a first injection. You'll also find posts of guys by the end of their first week saying that they don't feel anything yet stating that their weight has gone up. Of course, early weight is typically mostly water weight from increased oestrogen from aromatization of the increased testosterone.

That waiting period is why many guys like to start out with orals so that they can feel like they're on gear from the start.

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

Now I get it.

Thanks guys.