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Farm Bill Passes Senate...

simply dave

simply dave

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While still a HUGE money pit IMHO, some progress is being made to unravel the gov't/corporate control of price control. For anybody who's interested, it costs the typical American corn farmer more per bushel than what he/she sells it for. The difference of course is made up in the form of subsidies. There are also subsidies for "mono-cropping" (growing just one type of crop) and having fields lie dormant/unproductive in an effort to control the market. Companies such as Cargill pay big dollars in political contributions and such to help form farm policies. Cargill happens to be one of the biggest purchasers of American corn. See where this is going?

Farm Bill Passes Senate

For anyone who would like to learn more about America's food programs, check out "The Omnivore's Dilemma" by Michael Pollan.
 
simply dave said:
While still a HUGE money pit IMHO, some progress is being made to unravel the gov't/corporate control of price control. For anybody who's interested, it costs the typical American corn farmer more per bushel than what he/she sells it for. The difference of course is made up in the form of subsidies. There are also subsidies for "mono-cropping" (growing just one type of crop) and having fields lie dormant/unproductive in an effort to control the market. Companies such as Cargill pay big dollars in political contributions and such to help form farm policies. Cargill happens to be one of the biggest purchasers of American corn. See where this is going?

Farm Bill Passes Senate

For anyone who would like to learn more about America's food programs, check out "The Omnivore's Dilemma" by Michael Pollan.
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When the farm bill was originally passed it was a great problem and indeed corn and wheat farmers were losing money or really just break even.

That was when wheat was $2 bushel and Corrn was about $2.5. Now both trade above $6 and farmers have been raking it in for some time.

The original program was a product of the Reagan administration and was a brilliant program. If they would have left it un-altered, it would have phased out on its own.

As is typical, they kept changing the terms and never phased out the subsidies.
 
billfred said:
When the farm bill was originally passed it was a great problem and indeed corn and wheat farmers were losing money or really just break even.

That was when wheat was $2 bushel and Corrn was about $2.5. Now both trade above $6 and farmers have been raking it in for some time.

The original program was a product of the Reagan administration and was a brilliant program. If they would have left it un-altered, it would have phased out on its own.

As is typical, they kept changing the terms and never phased out the subsidies.
Click to expand...

Interestingly enough, it appears as if the northern farmers of corn and soybeans are embracing the idea of reducing/eliminating the subsidies and the southern soybean and peanut growers are against it. That is something I did not know.
 
simply dave said:
Interestingly enough, it appears as if the northern farmers of corn and soybeans are embracing the idea of reducing/eliminating the subsidies and the southern soybean and peanut growers are against it. That is something I did not know.
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It is because in order to receive the subsidy, you have to set aside a certain portion of your crop land - like 20%.

Northern farmers receive enough rain naturally that they do not have to irrigate. Southern farmers do and it is the majority of their crop expense. So the margins and profits are much higher on northern farms so they will make more money on planting 100% of their crop land than they will receive from the subsidy.
 
Watched the movie Food Inc. It touched on some of this. Said it was the cause for the fluctuations of migrant workers because we put lots of Mexican farmers out of business. Then because of this businesses advertising in Mexico busses illegals here and employed them. Also used largely in humanitarian aid, yet has little nutritional value.
 
themondtster said:
Watched the movie Food Inc. It touched on some of this. Said it was the cause for the fluctuations of migrant workers because we put lots of Mexican farmers out of business. Then because of this businesses advertising in Mexico busses illegals here and employed them. Also used largely in humanitarian aid, yet has little nutritional value.
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Excellent documentary. I would encourage everyone to take the time to watch this documentary. What I found particularly damning was the history of "appointed" officials in the FDA and USDA that are former executives of the industries they've been appointed to oversee!!!
 
billfred said:
When the farm bill was originally passed it was a great problem and indeed corn and wheat farmers were losing money or really just break even.

That was when wheat was $2 bushel and Corrn was about $2.5. Now both trade above $6 and farmers have been raking it in for some time.

The original program was a product of the Reagan administration and was a brilliant program. If they would have left it un-altered, it would have phased out on its own.

As is typical, they kept changing the terms and never phased out the subsidies.
Click to expand...

when fuel costs were $.72 a gal corn was 2.20... 3 yrs ago when fuel was $3.75 corn was still 2.10 .... it's only been in a couple yrs that corn has gone up..

the death of the family farm is the end product of price fixing...

My opinion, Is its still 1/2 the price that it should be, foreign countries need to feed them self.. but many are now so us producing our own fuel is a great thing sand oil is good..
 
simply dave said:
Excellent documentary. I would encourage everyone to take the time to watch this documentary. What I found particularly damning was the history of "appointed" officials in the FDA and USDA that are former executives of the industries they've been appointed to oversee!!!
Click to expand...

It irks me that those types of appointments happen so often.
 
SpyWizard said:
foreign countries need to feed them self.. ..
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a thousand yes's to this statement. We have overfarmed the shit out of our land, you can't grow anything on traditional farmland here without putting down layers of chemicals first. The fuck with that. People around the world need to start figuring out how to cultivate their own land and not be reliant on the U.S and our GMO's we're trying to peddle everywhere.
 
redsamurai said:
a thousand yes's to this statement. We have overfarmed the shit out of our land, you can't grow anything on traditional farmland here without putting down layers of chemicals first. The fuck with that. People around the world need to start figuring out how to cultivate their own land and not be reliant on the U.S and our GMO's we're trying to peddle everywhere.
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Mostly it makes politicians look to be humane. Other nations allow us to drill, mine, etc. whatever we want in return. Appeases the masses of poor in that country.

If you think about it we do the same here. We present barriers then enable certain behaviors. Education is the first thing to be cut, our social medias promotes illiteracy and just plain retarded behavior, and half the parents are fucktards themselves, then when kids grow up and can't read or have any worth wild skills for employment they just give them food and money and the next generation just does the same thing. And so on.
 
simply dave said:
Interestingly enough, it appears as if the northern farmers of corn and soybeans are embracing the idea of reducing/eliminating the subsidies and the southern soybean and peanut growers are against it. That is something I did not know.
Click to expand...
They might be okay if they weren't being extorted my GMO
 
brownbrown said:
They might be okay if they weren't being extorted my GMO
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Indeed. And of course let's not forget the ruling set forth by the SCOTUS in favor of Monsanto and GMO's. And what was Supreme Court Justice Thomas' previous job before his appointment? Why, he was a corporate attorney for...


wait for it...

Monsanto!

Doesn't take a Rocket Scientist to connect those dots, yeah?
 
simply dave said:
Indeed. And of course let's not forget the ruling set forth by the SCOTUS in favor of Monsanto and GMO's. And what was Supreme Court Justice Thomas' previous job before his appointment? Why, he was a corporate attorney for...


wait for it...

Monsanto!

Doesn't take a Rocket Scientist to connect those dots, yeah?
Click to expand...



you just have to laugh about it at this point and hope aliens with really big guns come down here and say that's enough.
 
simply dave said:
Kinda like the premise upon which "The Day The Earth Stood Still" was based upon, yeah?
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hopefully without the giant robot that tries to kill everything. But something tells me this universe doesn't operate like that. We lose this place oh well sucks to be you.

I wanted to legitimately strangle to death or near death the head of Exxon who I guess earlier in the week admitted that global warming was occuring but that it would simply be another "engineering problem" that humans would figure out and adapt to. That ivory tower arrogance seethes me....because while engineers are trying to figure out "the math", there will be untold misery for most of the civilized world "if" all that goes down. Now mind you he was acknowledging that these disasters could happen....he was just saying it's another engineering problem, nothing to worry about. Galling doesn't do justice.
 
I farm, we don't get paid to not plant acres, that happendyears ago when the demand for corn wasn't there from the grain embargo. 80% of the farm bill goes for Welfare n school lunch programs. We get about 20$ an acre so we have to report planted acres of each crop whether it be soybeans or corn. I believe that direct payment is ending now which is fine, but they will not be getting anymore info about my farm for free. Another thing most don't realize is we can receive 1.78 for our corn in the form of a cheap loan, we pay it back but the govt puts it in the general fund so its always an expense for the govt even though we pay it back with interest.
 
Oh and the land does not require layers of chemical to raise a crop, that is a completely incorrect statement. We spray our corn crop twice to spread the risk, but could do it once if we choose to
 
orange2 said:
Oh and the land does not require layers of chemical to raise a crop, that is a completely incorrect statement. We spray our corn crop twice to spread the risk, but could do it once if we choose to
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what part of the country are you farming in? and you don't use any kind of manure laden with any chemicals whatsoever?

If this is all true you are in possession of something that's becoming rarer and rare in this country.....clean land. The farmer in Indiana where I interned, this was prime Indiana farm country in around Muncie not far from Ball St., he told me why it was hard for them to be organic and not use GMO's was that it was getting harder and harder to grow anything out of this land. They had certain tracts where they were experimenting with different organic techiniques but for the most part the farm used chemical fertilizers.
 
oh and he said this is pretty much how it is in most of the commercial farmland in the states. Why fertilzier is such a huge business.
 
orange2 said:
I farm, we don't get paid to not plant acres, that happendyears ago when the demand for corn wasn't there from the grain embargo. 80% of the farm bill goes for Welfare n school lunch programs. We get about 20$ an acre so we have to report planted acres of each crop whether it be soybeans or corn. I believe that direct payment is ending now which is fine, but they will not be getting anymore info about my farm for free. Another thing most don't realize is we can receive 1.78 for our corn in the form of a cheap loan, we pay it back but the govt puts it in the general fund so its always an expense for the govt even though we pay it back with interest.
Click to expand...

Without direct payments (subsidies), how much does it cost you to grow a bushel of corn (out of pocket) and how much does the grain elevator pay you for said bushel?
 
This was the first year e have used atrazine in many years and it was a very small rate. We grow a lot of gmo corn and 100% of it goes to an ethanol plant. We don't use manure, we use commercial fertilizer for consistency. Well this year with rent and crop inputs it cost about 750$ per acre to raise a corn crop. We generally ave over 170 bu per acre. While the 20$ isn't needed at all, I spend it which is does help local business. You gotta realize up until ethanol production that 20-25$ an acre was all I ever made. Right now prices are going up, can get 6.8$ per bu at local ethanol plant, but I sold my crop already. We are in a drought and it could hurt a lot of businesses associated with ag.
 
I farm in Iowa, do most of u know the box that corn flakes comes in costs more to make than the corn that's in it? Ag is subsidized and I am not denying that at all. It used to be needed but not anymore, but take all the subsidies away from big oil also as they make billions a quarter
 
Oh I'll agree with you on that one...why oil is subsidized in this country is pure unadulterated corruption to the tune of billions while we bicker about a healthcare program that could better the lives of a hundred or so million people.

Now you said you use fertilizer....is that not chemicals?
 
Chemicals kill weeds and grass, fertilizer is phosphorus n potassium, sulfur and nitrogen, those are key for growing corn. Most use round up, which u could drink if u wanted to. We take care of the land, if we don't yields go down and u don't make money
 
orange2 said:
Chemicals kill weeds and grass, fertilizer is phosphorus n potassium, sulfur and nitrogen, those are key for growing corn. Most use round up, which u could drink if u wanted to. We take care of the land, if we don't yields go down and u don't make money
Click to expand...

Many fertilizers are inorganic/chemical based though. You're not suggesting that commercial fertilizers are just as safe for the environment/soil health than organic composts/manures/fertilizers, yes? What about trace mineral depletion through the continued use of commercial fertilizers? Commercial fertilizers don't "put back" everything that plants take out. Organics (compost/manure) does.

Addressing your Roundup...Drink it? Umm...no thanks. I was once an avid user of Roundup until a few things occurred. First, Monsanto forcing farmers to use their GMO "Roundup Ready" seed and getting patents on their seed (in the old days universities released strains to the public domain....for free). Secondly, a study in Argentina that has been successfully quelled linking Roundup to some pretty severe birth defects...
Monsanto's herbicide Roundup linked to birth defects in Argentina's agricultural areas?

Monsanto has done well at covering this up and dismissing it, but all things being equal, I distrust a corporation who has dep pockets and is entrenched in government (USDA and FDA) and contributes heavily to lawmakers in return for legislative favors.

You can drink your Roundup, but hopefully you've already had your children.
 
I just mean that round up isn't nearly as dangerous as other chemicals, I used to haul for Monsanto, I just mean its not a chemical that will kill u if u get it in your mouth like some others we use. Some of the grass killers u can taste if u get a drop on your skin. Lots of manure these days is not nearly ask potent as it used to be because the pigs n cows are so efficient in digestion u have to use 8000 gallons per acre to get replacement value out of it. I don't like to type so I apologize for the generalizations.
 
brownbrown said:
So you DO grow GMO!
did you fold to them, or go down fighting?
Click to expand...

We grow a lot of gmo for one reason, most of the best genetics are in those corns for the highest possible yields and most profit. Does it suck ass bending over for Monsanto, yes it does but we don't own a lot of land and cash rent so we need the most profit possible. So yes, I am just a bitch like most other people lol
 
orange2 said:
Yes we use those product, we also soil test so we know what the soil needs
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MAP and DAP are chemical salt fertilizers. Are you simply testing for NPK? What are you doing to replenish the trace minerals? I'm sure you'll disagree with my my friend, but...IMHO...you are killing your soil and perpetuating a cycle where you are bound to constantly adding chemical to get the yields you "need"...which are propped up by gov't control of the market.
 
orange2 said:
We grow a lot of gmo for one reason, most of the best genetics are in those corns for the highest possible yields and most profit. Does it suck ass bending over for Monsanto, yes it does but we don't own a lot of land and cash rent so we need the most profit possible. So yes, I am just a bitch like most other people lol
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I dont hold you responsible for being Monsantos bitch bro. Its just the cost of farming in the Midwest. NO ONE can fully beat them legally.

Now advocating thar GMO is better because of genetics.... Bullshit.

Farmers used to get good genetics from knowledge and smart seed sorting and planting for years.

So you gonna drink roundup or what?

DrOiD BioNiC EF App!
 
orange2 said:
Chemicals kill weeds and grass, fertilizer is phosphorus n potassium, sulfur and nitrogen, those are key for growing corn. Most use round up, which u could drink if u wanted to. We take care of the land, if we don't yields go down and u don't make money
Click to expand...


there's alot of synthetic chemicals in most of the standard non organic fertilizers being produced, and that's excluding the massive toxic metal contamination found in most of em. I have zero idea what you use, maybe your stuff is clean...but that's the general problem with the mass produced fertizrs being marketed to farmers. That stuff kills off the natural organisms in soil which create an environment for plant growth.....that's wehre these GMO companies steop in and provide seeds that can still grow in those environments. It's a bit too cozy of relationship for my taste.
 
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