Ericpad: Starr 5x5 int - log

[ericpad]

Hey All -

I just started my Starr program today. A little background on me first before my results though. I'm 32 years old. I'm 6'0" - 179 lbs. I'd like to get to 190 in the near future (2 - 3 months)

I'm pretty athletic and have been playing sports most of my life (football, hockey, and lacrosse). This is the first time I've ever gotten serious about weight training though. Instead of weight training I've relied on running and sports to keep me in decent shape through the years. I recently got back into football (competitive mens flag football) and I realized quickly that I need more strength . .in addition . .I've always wanted a stronger body and better physique.

Starting in January I did p90x. It worked well as I went from 186 to 174 and had a decent ripped kind of look. After 8 weeks I realized that although I was fit I wasn't getting any stronger so I started going to the gym.

My first 4 weeks in was a program called the asteroid freak program that was developed by USP Labs to go along with one of their supplement stacks. It was a pretty lame program but it got me into the rhythm of going to the gym 4 - 6 times per week which was good.

My next 3 weeks was doing a 4 day push pull routine from the Men's Health Power Training book. It was a good program but It seemed like I was doing so many different exercises that I wasn't making progress (I know 3 weeks is too short to determine that).

So I decided last week to stick with the basics for a couple months and increase my base level of strength and hopefully add some pounds of lean muscle mass. I looked at Rippetoe and I looked at Starr . . .I'm still unsure of which I should be doing and maybe some of you can help me out. I ended up picking starr because I really like the Madcow write-up and spreadsheet to help determine weights.

I began today . .here were my results:
Squat:
5 x 110
5 x 125
5 x 145
5 x 165
5 x 180

Bench
5 x 75
5 x 90
5 x 100
5 x 115
5 x 125

Row
5 x 70
5 x 80
5 x 95
5 x 105
5 x 115

2 sets of weighted hypers (10 lbs - 20 reps)
4 sets of weighted situps (decline 10 lbs - 15 reps)

I felt like I could do more weight on most exercises and I wasn't completely spent at the end of my workout. I'm wondering if maybe I should re-adjust my weights for my next workout or if I should just keep going with these weights for now. I know my numbers are low . . .I do expect them to increase rapidly though.

 

[NBAfan#21]

If you made sure to get your 5 rep max and put it in the 5x5 calculator then there is no need to add weight. The 1st week of workout isnt supposed to be a killer. Just go with the weight the calculator it gives you and you should already feel it working around the end of 2nd week and start of the 3rd. If you have enough experience with deadlifts, squats, bench press, etc. then you should keep following Bill Starr's. If you havent squatted or deadlifted before and its your first time doing it then you should go with Mark Rippetoe

 

[ericpad]

I had 10 rep maxes for my lifts that were pretty accurate since I had just done them last week. Also, I have about 2 months experience with squats and deads.

Maybe it's just the smaller rep count with this program as opposed to my previous program. Or maybe it's the fact that my 5RM is based off of 10RM using that calculator. Either way I'm sure it will end up syncing up within a couple weeks.

 

[NBAfan#21]

Yea it might be because you put in 10 reps. The higher the reps are the less accurate the calculator will be. I would suggest you to take a week or so to work on your 5RM and find your real numbers. 2 months training with deads and squats seems good to me. I think you are good to start the Bill Starr's program. Dont give up on the program even if it seems easy at 1st. the first 4 weeks you will work your way to your 5 rep maxes and the weeks following that you will try to make personnal records

 

[ericpad]

Yeah . .I'm definitely sticking with the program. There are so many people who have posted on various forums that have had great success with it that it absolutely seems to be the perfect program for me. I really like the frequency, use of heavy compounds, and ability to add accessories.

 

[jesse_01]

I'm doing the same program. I felt the same way after the first few work outs. It does not feel like you really working that hard. But as the weeks go on it starts to get a little tougher. The first few weeks is to break you in a bit, get your body use to the routine.

 

[SouthernLord]

Good luck in your journey bro. I am currently doing the intermediate 5x5 myself. Stick with it and you will be rewarded for all the hard work ahead.

 

[brad34]

I am on my 12th week and every workout kicks my butt! I have made excellent progress! I ran programs similiar to what you described in Men's Health book and my progress nearly dead ended. I kick myself for not doing to Int 5X5 sooner.

Good luck, looking forward to reading your results.

 

[Hellawulf]

Hey All -

I just started my Starr program today. A little background on me first before my results though. I'm 32 years old. I'm 6'0" - 179 lbs. I'd like to get to 190 in the near future (2 - 3 months)

I'm pretty athletic and have been playing sports most of my life (football, hockey, and lacrosse). This is the first time I've ever gotten serious about weight training though. Instead of weight training I've relied on running and sports to keep me in decent shape through the years. I recently got back into football (competitive mens flag football) and I realized quickly that I need more strength . .in addition . .I've always wanted a stronger body and better physique.

Starting in January I did p90x. It worked well as I went from 186 to 174 and had a decent ripped kind of look. After 8 weeks I realized that although I was fit I wasn't getting any stronger so I started going to the gym.

My first 4 weeks in was a program called the asteroid freak program that was developed by USP Labs to go along with one of their supplement stacks. It was a pretty lame program but it got me into the rhythm of going to the gym 4 - 6 times per week which was good.

My next 3 weeks was doing a 4 day push pull routine from the Men's Health Power Training book. It was a good program but It seemed like I was doing so many different exercises that I wasn't making progress (I know 3 weeks is too short to determine that).

So I decided last week to stick with the basics for a couple months and increase my base level of strength and hopefully add some pounds of lean muscle mass. I looked at Rippetoe and I looked at Starr . . .I'm still unsure of which I should be doing and maybe some of you can help me out. I ended up picking starr because I really like the Madcow write-up and spreadsheet to help determine weights.

I began today . .here were my results:
Squat:
5 x 110
5 x 125
5 x 145
5 x 165
5 x 180

Bench
5 x 75
5 x 90
5 x 100
5 x 115
5 x 125

Row
5 x 70
5 x 80
5 x 95
5 x 105
5 x 115

2 sets of weighted hypers (10 lbs - 20 reps)
4 sets of weighted situps (decline 10 lbs - 15 reps)

I felt like I could do more weight on most exercises and I wasn't completely spent at the end of my workout. I'm wondering if maybe I should re-adjust my weights for my next workout or if I should just keep going with these weights for now. I know my numbers are low . . .I do expect them to increase rapidly though.

Whoa, whoa, hold up now tiger, I did the exact same thing (you can check my log for proof), do not jump, trust me it will be a mistake. The first four weeks are meant to be a little easy, it should def get harder by week 3 or 4, but then you will start hitting PRs each week, which is super fun.

Did you do your maxs before starting this workout? For example, the week before I started I did my rep maxes for each workout, like on bench I did 185 8 times, then I inserted it into the excel spreedsheet. If you didn't it might be a good idea for you to do that then start over again. But take it slow, for someone who hasn't really worked out seriously it can be fun at the beginning, especially if your diet is straight and your seeing big gains quick on the weights, but remember its better to be in it for the long haul over the next year or two than push it all now, get four weeks in, with decent results, but then blow it all away with an injury. IMHO, do not reset your weights unless you are starting over!

Actually after reading down you said you did do your maxs, for someone who is just starting off 10 rep max is fine, do the workout all the way through to the nine weeks, max out again this time trying to aim for 4-6 reps (you will have a better feel for what your body can handle after this workout too), and start over again. This cycle will be great for breaking down your body since you might not be used to such a powerlifting routine, then the next cycle will be where you see a lot of mass gains (you should see major mass gains during your first cycle too.)

 

[ericpad]

Hey Guys -

Thanks for the replies. I appreciate the advice and tips. I'll keep this log updated regularly and probably throw some questions out there too. This is a great forum. I spent too much time reading bb.com and only recently stumbled across this site. Glad I did!

I definitely wish I started this program a couple of months ago rather than starting and stopping those other couple of programs. The good news is that I have some perspective now from having tried those other ones.

My diet is definitely in good order. I think my challenge may be eating enough. But I'm working on that too. Since the beginning of the year I've been very concerned with eating super clean (zen ultra pure as Madcow calls it in his write up) . .at this point though I've learned quite a bit about what are good sources of complex carbs and eating frequently and supplementing (protein, creatine, pre-workout, post workout, etc).

I'm shooting for around 3500 calories on workout days and around 2800 on non-workout days. My diet consists of lots of protein (chicken, turkey, beef, powder to supplement), complex carbs (oats, waxy maize, sweet potatoes, brown rice, wheat bread), vegetables, fruits, dairy (cottage cheese, milk), all natural PB.

And I definitely recognize that this is a marathon and not a sprint.

Eric

 

[djeclipse]

Hey All -

I just started my Starr program today. A little background on me first before my results though. I'm 32 years old. I'm 6'0" - 179 lbs. I'd like to get to 190 in the near future (2 - 3 months)

I'm pretty athletic and have been playing sports most of my life (football, hockey, and lacrosse). This is the first time I've ever gotten serious about weight training though. Instead of weight training I've relied on running and sports to keep me in decent shape through the years. I recently got back into football (competitive mens flag football) and I realized quickly that I need more strength . .in addition . .I've always wanted a stronger body and better physique.

Starting in January I did p90x. It worked well as I went from 186 to 174 and had a decent ripped kind of look. After 8 weeks I realized that although I was fit I wasn't getting any stronger so I started going to the gym.

My first 4 weeks in was a program called the asteroid freak program that was developed by USP Labs to go along with one of their supplement stacks. It was a pretty lame program but it got me into the rhythm of going to the gym 4 - 6 times per week which was good.

My next 3 weeks was doing a 4 day push pull routine from the Men's Health Power Training book. It was a good program but It seemed like I was doing so many different exercises that I wasn't making progress (I know 3 weeks is too short to determine that).

So I decided last week to stick with the basics for a couple months and increase my base level of strength and hopefully add some pounds of lean muscle mass. I looked at Rippetoe and I looked at Starr . . .I'm still unsure of which I should be doing and maybe some of you can help me out. I ended up picking starr because I really like the Madcow write-up and spreadsheet to help determine weights.

I began today . .here were my results:
Squat:
5 x 110
5 x 125
5 x 145
5 x 165
5 x 180

Bench
5 x 75
5 x 90
5 x 100
5 x 115
5 x 125

Row
5 x 70
5 x 80
5 x 95
5 x 105
5 x 115

2 sets of weighted hypers (10 lbs - 20 reps)
4 sets of weighted situps (decline 10 lbs - 15 reps)

I felt like I could do more weight on most exercises and I wasn't completely spent at the end of my workout. I'm wondering if maybe I should re-adjust my weights for my next workout or if I should just keep going with these weights for now. I know my numbers are low . . .I do expect them to increase rapidly though.

Go back and read madcow's site again, read the part about progression which is the foundation of this program (well I guess the core lifts are the foundation, the progression is the brick and motrot ).

It is supposed to be easy your first day, if you are failing, or near failure on your first day starting this program you screwed up when picking your starting weight's pretty bad.

What are your current 5 rep maxes?


On a side note, it is good to see this board getting back to good training, it was getting pretty bad with all the crappy BB type splits I saw here when I came back not too long ago.

 

[ericpad]

Go abck and read madcow's site again, read the part about progression which is the foundation of this program (well I guess the core lifts are the foundation, the progression is the brick and motrot ).

It is supposed to be easy your first day, if you are failing, or near failure on your first day starting this program you screwed up when picking your starting weight's pretty bad.

What are your current 5 rep maxes?


On a side note, it is good to see this board getting back to good training, it was getting pretty bad with all the crappy BB type splits I saw here when I came back not too long ago.

Some of my 5RMs are calculated by my 10rm since that is what I had done most recently as follows:
Bench actual 10rm: 115 - calculated 5rm: 136
Squat actual 10rm: 165 - calculated 5rm: 196
Dead actual 5rm: 185
Incline actual 10rm: 105 - calculated 5rm 124

The spreadsheet in the madcow writeup calculated those 5rms for me.

I understand that first few workouts will feel easier. Also, the routine I was doing previously had me doing 4 sets of 10 so the volume in this program in the initial workouts is lighter and that is what my comparison was based on.

 

[djeclipse]

Some of my 5RMs are calculated by my 10rm since that is what I had done most recently as follows:
Bench actual 10rm: 115 - calculated 5rm: 136
Squat actual 10rm: 165 - calculated 5rm: 196
Dead actual 5rm: 185
Incline actual 10rm: 105 - calculated 5rm 124

The spreadsheet in the madcow writeup calculated those 5rms for me.

I understand that first few workouts will feel easier. Also, the routine I was doing previously had me doing 4 sets of 10 so the volume in this program in the initial workouts is lighter and that is what my comparison was based on.

I would suggest getting your actual 5 rep maxes, why would you use some stupid spreadsheet and literally guess your 5 rep maxes when you can spend a day and get your real 5 rep maxes?

you need a starting point, guessing at them is not the way to go.

 

[ericpad]

I would suggest getting your actual 5 rep maxes, why would you use some stupid spreadsheet and literally guess your 5 rep maxes when you can spend a day and get your real 5 rep maxes?

you need a starting point, guessing at them is not the way to go.

Few reasons . .I've read that many people have used those numbers and had good success. Also, the numbers that came up seemed to be pretty reasonable to me based upon what I've been lifting for the past several weeks. Finally, I thought there was little risk in starting a little low and working my way up as opposed to starting too high.

That said, I may actually test them for real on Friday (workout day 3 for me) this week and adjust my numbers accordingly for next week.

I'm motivated to do this and committed to building this the right way. I'm relatively new and still reading and learning as much as I possibly can. I'm not on this board looking for quick answers to things I should have already researched, rather I'm interested in opinions from those far more experienced than me. Best way for someone like me to learn and grow in my opinion.

 

[djeclipse]

Starting conservative is the way to go, it will give you better momentum and help make those PR runs even longer.

I am simply saying it is nice to have a real/ legit base starting point to base your work and improvements on, instead of guessing at them.

 

[ericpad]

Workout 2 - 5/20/09

5 minute warmup run on the treadmill, some stretching, body weight squats, 5 squats with bar only.

workout:

Squat
5 x 115
5 x 135
5 x 150
5 x 150

Incline Bench
5 x 85
5 x 95
5 x 105
5 x 115

Deadlift
5 x 120
5 x 135
5 x 155
5 x 175

Chinups / pullups:
9 - chins
6 - pull
5 - chins
5 - pulls

decline situps
12 / 20 / 16 / 14

The workout felt good today. My abs and stomach area were still a little sore from the weighted decline situps I did on monday but I had no DOMS from any of the lifts I did on Monday so that was good (though my legs were a little sore from playing lacrosse for 2 hours last night).

 

[djeclipse]

Workout 2 - 5/20/09

5 minute warmup run on the treadmill, some stretching, body weight squats, 5 squats with bar only.

workout:

Squat
5 x 115
5 x 135
5 x 150
5 x 150

Incline Bench
5 x 85
5 x 95
5 x 105
5 x 115

Deadlift
5 x 120
5 x 135
5 x 155
5 x 175

Chinups / pullups:
9 - chins
6 - pull
5 - chins
5 - pulls

decline situps
12 / 20 / 16 / 14

The workout felt good today. My abs and stomach area were still a little sore from the weighted decline situps I did on monday but I had no DOMS from any of the lifts I did on Monday so that was good (though my legs were a little sore from playing lacrosse for 2 hours last night).

Your abs will be conditioned to the work and you probably won't be sore after next week.

How often do you play lacrosse? Is it a rec league, or an actual league? Every tuesday, or all throughout the week?

 

[ericpad]

Your abs will be conditioned to the work and you probably won't be sore after next week.

How often do you play lacrosse? Is it a rec league, or an actual league? Every tuesday, or all throughout the week?

During the last several weeks (prior to starting starr) i've been doing core work (cable wood chops, core rows, planks) but not any situps or hanging leg raises so I kind of expected to have some soreness in that area. It's all good though. Makes me feel as if I put some solid work in.

Lacrosse - I just started back into last night after being off for a few months. Presently it is every tuesday night. It is called the "pre-mohawk" league and is pretty competitive. Many excellent D1 college players and former college players. This current session is in preparation for the summer league we have here in Albany, NY called "The Mohawk Lacrosse Club". Once that starts I'll be playing about twice per week.

Do you play? I love it . .can't get enough of lacrosse. Best sport in the world in my opinion.

 

[djeclipse]

During the last several weeks (prior to starting starr) i've been doing core work (cable wood chops, core rows, planks) but not any situps or hanging leg raises so I kind of expected to have some soreness in that area. It's all good though. Makes me feel as if I put some solid work in.

Lacrosse - I just started back into last night after being off for a few months. Presently it is every tuesday night. It is called the "pre-mohawk" league and is pretty competitive. Many excellent D1 college players and former college players. This current session is in preparation for the summer league we have here in Albany, NY called "The Mohawk Lacrosse Club". Once that starts I'll be playing about twice per week.

Do you play? I love it . .can't get enough of lacrosse. Best sport in the world in my opinion.

I don't play Lacrosse, tried a few times, never really got into it. It is a great sport, tough players, lots of running, but just not for me. I played rugby and soccer, now that I am older, I just play soccer.

I asked because of leg recovery. If you are squatting 3x per week as well as playing lacrosse 2x per week for 2hrs each time, you may find your squats are lagging, and your legs are on fire/ sore when playing lacrosse due to lack of recovery (pretty much over training).

I kind of got talked into playing for a few teams this summer and I am finding that 2-3 full soccer games per week while squatting 3x per week was too much for me. My legs couldn't fully recover and my squatting as well as ability to actually run was suffering. Because of this I dropped the light squat on wed to give my legs some rest.

If you are feeling the squatting x3 per week and lacrosse 2x per week is too much you may want to do the same. Hopefully you won't have to, if you are younger your body may be able to handle it, but it can be an option in the future if it ends up being too much and you don't want to give up lacrosse (which I am sure you won't).

 

[ericpad]

Workout 3 - 5/22/2009
Great workout today!

Main Exercises
Squat
5 x 115
5 x 125
5 x 145
5 x 165
3 x 185
8 x 145

Bench
5 x 75
5 x 90
5 x 100
5 x 115
3 x 130
8 x 100

Row
5 x 75
5 x 85
5 x 95
5 x 105
3 x 120
8 x 95

Accessory Exercises
Dips
3 sets x 8 reps

Situps
20/20/15

Barbell curls
8 x 70
8 x 70
8 x 70

Standing tricep rope pull down
8 x 80
8 x 90
8 x 90

 

[ericpad]

Week 2 - Day 1 (completed 5/25)

Squat
5 x 115
5 x 135
5 x 155
5 x 170
5 x 190

Bench
5 x 80
5 x 90
5 x 105
5 x 115
5 x 130

Row
5 x 75
5 x 85
5 x 95
5 x 105
5 x 120

Hanging leg raise
10 / 12

Back Hypers
10 lbs @ 20 / 25 lbs @ 20

decline situps
10 lbs @ 20 / 10 lbs @15 / 10 lbs @ 15 / 10 lbs @ 15