Could someone please clarify the circa-maximal phase?

[BigArnie]

I'm currently 7 weeks out from our nationals and have got a good Westside base to peak from. In fact, I'm probably stronger than ever at the moment. I'm planning on starting a circa-maximal phase today for five weeks and then do a two week deloading phase to get my speed up to max. I've read Louie's article on the circa-maximal phase at Deepsquatter

http://www.deepsquatter.com/strength/archives/ls23.htm

but I'm still confused:

* How exactly do you wave your weights and band tension? Does the tension go up for 3 weeks and then cycle down and up again for weeks 4 and 5 and then deload for weeks 7 and 8?

* What percentage of max should you use for bar weight as a starting point? And what percentage should you end on?

* Am I correct in saying that you don't do "openers" in the gym a week before the comp? If not, then how do you calculate your opening weight?

* What ME exercises should I do for the 7 week period as I read that the Westsiders change their ME lift every week during this phase? Do I need to do any pulls like full deadlifts with chains?

Sorry for all the questions but I know you are the most knowledgeable bunch of guys to ask.

BigArnie

 

[Hannibal]

That is a VERY old article that you have there. The circa max phase has been revised several times.

The Circa Max is 4 weeks...followed by the 2 week deload.

Week1: 47% 5 sets of 2
Week2: 51% 5 sets of 2
Week3: 53% 5 sets of 2
Week4: 47% 5 sets of 2
Deload
Week1: 53% 5 sets of 2
Week2: 47% 5 sets of 2

Circa Max Band:
Squat 300-500: Green (Medium)
Squat 501-750: Blue + Pink (Strong + Light)
Squat 751-1000: Blue + Green (Strong + Medium)

Deload Band:
Squat 300-500: Pink (Light)
Squat 501-750: Green (Medium)
Squat 751-1000: Blue (Strong)

 

[spatts]

Oh gosh....it's painful just to READ it!

I just came off a circa max phase...OUCH.

 

[BigArnie]

Hannibal, thanks a lot for the info. I'm still not fully clear on this, though. What are the numbers under your band listing? Are these the top and bottom band tension or what? I can squat 700lb but are you saying that my band tension should go as high as 1000lb?

Spatterson, it'll be interesting to know what happened to your strength during this phase. Are you pushing PRs?

Lastly, can someone please clear out for me wether I should do openers in the gym the week before the contest or not. Or should I just come straight out of the circa-maximal phase and into the competition?

Thanks for the replies!

 

[BigArnie]

Hannibal, sorry but one more thing: This might sound stupid but the fact that you guys do 5 sets of 2 sounds like DE day to me. Are you doing this on ME or DE day?

 

[benchmonster]

Circa maximal is definately done on Dynamic Day.

As for finding an opener in the gym the week before, Louie does not recommend it, nor does Dave, but I have to find an opener. I went without doing this once and the results were not what I was looking for. I will never make that mistake again. Dave and Louie say that having to find an opener just shows a lack of confidence. I think it shows good sense.

Maybe after I have been lifting competitively for 10 or 20 or 30 years like the WSB guys I can just show up knowing in my head what my opener is, but in the meantime, I will continue to find openers 6 or 7 days before the meet.

B.

 

[BigArnie]

Thanks, benchmonster. I figured so myself as I'm not yet confident enough just to walk in and take my first attempt without knowing what weight I should take.

 

[Hannibal]

Hannibal, thanks a lot for the info. I'm still not fully clear on this, though. What are the numbers under your band listing? Are these the top and bottom band tension or what? I can squat 700lb but are you saying that my band tension should go as high as 1000lb?

The numbers under the band listings are 1RM. And you say that your Squat it 7 Bills. So that would put you between 501 and 750. For your circa max work use a blue and pink. For the deload use a green.

 

[b fold the truth]

When I finish a Circa Max phase...I always feel slightly beat up but strong as an ox after my deloading phase!!!!

B True

 

[BigArnie]

Thanks, you're all very helpful.

BFold, I don't know if this is detrimental but I'm still doing some event work three times a week. Mostly light (260lb) stones, 270lb * 2 suitcases, car pull, various tires, log and some hand-over-hand.

I know Louie says sled dragging is important so I guess this will sufficeas a good alternative. I'll definitely drop most of my strongman training 'till after the powerlifting nationals as soon as I feel it starting to intrude on my gym lifts. I guess I've become used to events training as I've been doing 2 events workouts a week for about a year now. At the moment it feels like the events days are actually helping me recover quicker.

 

[GRIMMER]

circa max phase is the absolute hardest thing i have done in the gym to date and i even went lighter thatn i thought my max was.
The most important thing is you MUST have that deload phase to bring your speed back up because these will go up real slow compared to normal.

I believe i read in Daves article or at his seminar that you only have to do the full four week circa phase the first time ever doing it and then on you just do the 51% and 53% along with the deload the next time that you would be doing the circa max phase but somebody back me up on this.

 

[IrishPower]

yeah... that circa maximal stuff is over my head for the moment.

right now, i just throw bands and/or chains on with different tension types each week and only work my speed up to where my partners tell me i am moving fast enough. it made a big difference backing down when my partners told me i was slow. all of a sudden, max effort days started going up and the singles i took after speed work were better. also, i learned to take a week off every 4 weeks or so after reading an article by louie. doing this seemed to allow my knees to recover and me to get some of my speed back after beating myself down for 4 weeks.

eventually, i think i will learn the more advanced techniques, but i think everything is working so i wont fuck with it.

regarding finding an opener: dave does say they use a canvas every once in awhile to test the fit. they do this on a DE day when they have no bands on, after about 5 sets or so. I did this, and it built my confidence up to where i am only going to take one more canvas day, and that is to test out wraps which i haven't used in 4 years.

if you have been going heavy on ME days such as high boxes or heavy good mornings, your body should be used to the weight. also, if you are using bands with enough tension, chances are the weight at the top of the squat position is going to be what your opener is anyway.

good luck. please report your progress.

/irish

 

[b fold the truth]

Thanks, you're all very helpful.

BFold, I don't know if this is detrimental but I'm still doing some event work three times a week. Mostly light (260lb) stones, 270lb * 2 suitcases, car pull, various tires, log and some hand-over-hand.

I know Louie says sled dragging is important so I guess this will sufficeas a good alternative. I'll definitely drop most of my strongman training 'till after the powerlifting nationals as soon as I feel it starting to intrude on my gym lifts. I guess I've become used to events training as I've been doing 2 events workouts a week for about a year now. At the moment it feels like the events days are actually helping me recover quicker.

My body will NOT take large amounts of event training and hard gym lifting too. I must back off a bit on one or the other. I incorporate lots of events though (yoke, stones, farmers, sled drag, tire flip, conan's walk, log press, harness pull, etc...) so my body takes a while to recover from them.

Remember what is important to YOU. My gym training is auxillary to my event training. Yours is just the opposite.

B True

 

[BigArnie]

Irish, you're worrying me, bro. If you say that circa-maxima is over your head then where does that leave me because you're stronger than I am. Are you saying that I should increase my band tension up to a point where I start slowing down and then back of a bit?

 

[IrishPower]

haha.

I didn't mean it was too complicated or that I was too stupid to use it

I just meant that I was making gains with what I was doing so I wasn't going to worry about that at the moment. I am just now learning the bands. For instance, did you ever try squatting with bands truly doubled. Crazy.....

Everyone has to remember that there are more ways to get strong than following westside to the letter. I squatted 832 before I ever even heard of westside training.

I switched to it after getting enough injuries and never making the 600 bench i shot for for 7 years.

BUT, if something is working for you, don't go fucking it up.

That being said, you should also feel free to try it and post your experience to others. I'd be curious to know exactly how that works so when I peak again in the squat, I can try it.

Take care.
/irish

 

[BigArnie]

I'll give it a shot and will keep you guys posted. Irish, that's one truly massive squat you've got there!

 

[Deciever]

could a circa max phase possibly be used for the bench press too??

 

[GRIMMER]

I don't believe that they use it for bench due to the incredible stress the shoulders and elbows would have to be put under. The resullts wuld not be worth the risk.

 

[Deciever]

damn..i figured if you could, i may t ry it... but i dont want to injure myself.

 

[p03t1c]

you'd have to be damn strong and have some "special" recovery methods to last though a bench circamax. that is even if you elbows and shoulders can get through it. i use the bands on all my DE work for squat but i have to cycle for bench. this last week was my second consecutive week to use the bands this 3 week cycle and already i'm feeling the pain. i guess the core is just so much stronger and that's why it can take the band abuse with killing you.

 

[Deciever]

i use mini's choked for bench and i've done 3 week cycles easily... maybe its cause i dont double the bands or something, but the dont seem to irratate me

 

[p03t1c]

double up the band and try it out. i remember the first time i ever used bands. i unracked the bar and it took me a bit before i could get the bar still. on my 3 week cycles i'm double a band on each side. i have horrible elbows though. after workouts i sometimes wrap mine with ice and alcohol.

 

[Deciever]

the thing is, im only benching 200, so doubling the mini's adds a shit load of tension at the top, w/ with some weights w/ make it ridiculously hard to lockout